Travel with Children - child seat questions

we're going AA in F for an xmass trip. one kid is/will be 5 months. so she's going lap (yes, i know she should be in a child seat for safety). second kid will be 2 years/8 months. so he's getting a seat. Should we be doing a child seat strapped into the airline seat? The seat belt situation work for kids that small? In advance, thanks.

Thanks for asking the question shadabing.

We are going to forward this to the Traveling with Children forum located in a different FlyerTalk section that discusses general travel topics for specific groups

~magic111

thanks!

No, the seat belt alone is not safe; bring the car seat, just make sure it's approved for airline use.

How many adults? What aircraft?
Having a carseat will pretty much eliminate any extra space you can use for both kids and you don't want to hold the infant the whole way.
If you have 3 seats and one lap child you may be better off in coach with 3 in a row (we turned down upgrades under similar circumstances)

it's american on 757 domestic. so it's two class. we're in F. I think we will skip the car seat on the flight. First off, the baby is way more "unsafe" as a lap kid. No of it, practically speaking, is "safe". God forbid there is some situation... the car seat doesn't matter.

Our 2 year 8 month old will just have a seat with a belt. The baby is lap and us adults are the usual. I don't think there is a win/win scenario.

Having the car seat is safer than just the lap belt, which doesn't hold toddlers very well. Using the car seat on board is a much wiser, as well as safer, option.

The important question is, do you need a car seat at your destination? Never check a car seat as luggage. They often get lost and broken in transit (and sometimes the damage isn't obvious so later you're using a compromised car seat and don't know it!)

If you need the lap baby's car seat at your destination, try to use it on board, if there's an empty seat. If not, try to stow it on board. They should try to accommodate this if it's an infant bucket-style seat. Otherwise, gate-check the seat at the door of the plane with any strollers. Gate-checking is no guarantee but there's less chance of the seat being "rerouted". If you need the car seat right away when you arrive, that's important as lost luggage can take days to be returned (and in what shape??)

As both a Flight Attendant and as a mom, I noticed that children in car seats where much more settled and slept better. They're used to the car seat and understand the "rules". At his age, he can easily undo the adult seat belt and go running (if you have a "bolter" especially!)

If you don't need the car seat at your destination, find out if you can use a CARES harness. Ebay and Craigslist has them for rent so you don't need to buy one (or buy one second hand).

I'd second the recommendation for CARES, but would never rent a safety device. In any case, they are $20-25 to rent and $65 to buy on Amazon. If you travel much, which seems likely given the forum, it will pay for itself.

Until our twins reached the magical age of FF-ability, we traveled with them as lap children and probably 75% of the time were able to seat them for free using the CARES harness. Plus, the FAs love them, so far. ;)

Now, at age 2 they are not loving the CARES so much, and DD has figured out how to unbuckle her seat belt (which makes the CARES more of a hazard than a safety device.) Love em' and learn.... :rolleyes:

If you need the lap baby's car seat at your destination, try to use it on board, if there's an empty seat.


I have been wondering how the logistics of this work, practically speaking. So, I have a lap child. I know I can use an empty seat if available. But what is the procedure for procuring said empty seat, since chances are it won't be anywhere near my assigned seat? Is this handled at check-in, the gate, or on board? I don't want it to turn into a big fuss so just wondered about how this actually works. Thanks.

it's american on 757 domestic. so it's two class. we're in F. I think we will skip the car seat on the flight. First off, the baby is way more "unsafe" as a lap kid. No of it, practically speaking, is "safe". God forbid there is some situation... the car seat doesn't matter.

Our 2 year 8 month old will just have a seat with a belt. The baby is lap and us adults are the usual. I don't think there is a win/win scenario.

I vote for the car seat---not just for the safety factor, but because it allows you to keep the 2-year old strapped in! Since you're in F, only one adult will be in arm's reach of the kid, and the other one will be busy with a baby in their lap, so it's nice to be able to, say, eat a quick bite of your meal without your kid lunging at your tray table.

FWIW, my 2 year-old will nap in his car seat, but refuses to nap in a regular seat (unless it's a lie-flat), so we bring the car-seat for all domestic flights that occur during nap and meal times, and gate-check it for the others.

- Alex

I have been wondering how the logistics of this work, practically speaking. So, I have a lap child. I know I can use an empty seat if available. But what is the procedure for procuring said empty seat, since chances are it won't be anywhere near my assigned seat? Is this handled at check-in, the gate, or on board? I don't want it to turn into a big fuss so just wondered about how this actually works. Thanks.

Yes, this is a good question. There is no flat, universal answer.

The point is that other passengers aren't thrilled to be seated near a baby so the idea that the one empty seat would be next to a family is not that "out there".

I've heard that they sometimes "block" the seat next to a family on request, using it only if they absolutely need it. No way to confirm that this is actually done. I will confirm that I, as an airline employee, sat next to way more babies than it would be random to assume. Airline employees, flying standby, are so happy to just have their rear end on board that they are not likely to complain when your child throws up on them!

Obviously, if there are multiple empty seats throughout the cabin, this request is easier to fill.

A parent who read my article asked me to help her complain to the airline about an incident regarding this. The airline said that they will not reseat any confirmed passengers to accommodate a lap baby whose family are hoping for an empty seat. Her complaint was that there were empty seats on the plane and she didn't get one for her lap baby. While having the baby in his or her own seat is safer and using an empty seat is allowed by the FAA (on U.S. companies), it's still not a parents' right to get one.

The classic tip is to book the A and C (or cooresponding) seats, hoping the B seat is not booked. Reports here are that some airlines are not allowing one party to do this anymore. Again, depends on the airline...

The request should be made at check-in and then perhaps at the gate (they'll let you know). Be very diplomatic about asking anyone to switch since, keep in mind, you're basically asking for something for free.

Thanks! That's helpful...even though there is no definite answer. :)

..

The classic tip is to book the A and C (or cooresponding) seats, hoping the B seat is not booked. ...

I would actually suggest C and D as you double your chances for empty middle.

Offering a few drink chits or $10 starbucks card may help to persuade others to switch or soften the blow of sitting next to you kid.

I would actually suggest C and D as you double your chances for empty middle.

Just be sure that "D" isn't on the other side of the aisle lol!

Just be sure that "D" isn't on the other side of the aisle lol!

That's the point - you can potentially claim either B or E

That's the point - you can potentially claim either B or E

Not so. I know that would work for a toddler, but a 5 month old will have to be in a car seat, which has to go in the window seat, so no dice on B. E works if it's a 2-aisle plane, but not if it isn't.

Duplicate.

Book toddler in A, mom in C, Dad in D.

If B is open, put infant in A, mom in B, toddler in C Dad in D

If E is open but B is full Mom switch with B (trust me whoever is in B will be happy to swtich to C) Infant in A, mom in B, Dad in D, Toddler in E.

Not so. I know that would work for a toddler, but a 5 month old will have to be in a car seat, which has to go in the window seat, so no dice on B. E works if it's a 2-aisle plane, but not if it isn't.

What do you mean by "have to be in car seat"? I believe the example brought up by Eclipsepearl was for two adults traveling with one lap infant so there shouldn't be any car seats planned to begin with.

If one wants to try this with car seat then i would book A and F (and not A and C) again doubling your chances for empty middle. At least one parent would have to board at the very end with that plan after confirming with GA that there is an open seat for carseat.

With 3 seats and 2 kids of different ages i in general agree with VickiSoCal strategy but we still prefer to get a row of three with twins - easier to share stuff.

What do you mean by "have to be in car seat"? I believe the example brought up by Eclipsepearl was for two adults traveling with one lap infant so there shouldn't be any car seats planned to begin with.



I got criss-crossed in my own mind. I thought I was answering the OP who has four people, three tickets (One toddler, two adults, one lap infant).

I thought it was the OP asking how to go about procuring an empty seat for the infant, but it was actually someone else. I was answering with the OP's situation (lap infant = 5 months old) when I said "has to be" in a car seat since most kids that age cannot sit independently.

I mean yes, I guess you could lay the infant down in the empty seat, but I guess I didn't consider that only because I'd never do it myself. So yeah, if that's what you want to do, then I guess the middle seat strategy could work, but yuck.

Anyway, that's where the "has to be" part came from

Yes, on flights with a lot of open seats, we'd arrange that parents with babies had an extra seat and/or whole row to themselves. They were still lap babies without car seats, held in the lap for take-off and landing. It was just giving them more space, and avoiding the grumpies who hate sitting next to small ones.

We were told older toddlers who could occupy a seat were allowed to. We could use pillows (wonder if the rules have changed but doubt it).

We're taking our currently 8 month old with us to Hawaii in 2 weeks. Her first time on a flight. We booked on UAL, direct to LIH, but we only got two seats of course. We figured our girl would lap it and if there was a seat open, we could use her carseat since we need it in HI. But, the row of 3 had someone on the aisle booked already. There aren't many seats open either.

So the question we have is, do we bring the car seat, attached to our City Mini stroller, and gate check both items? Or, do we bring both items and hope that we can use the car seat onboard? Or do I just goto the counter and say hey, I got my kid, move people around for us please? I don't have 1K anymore so no leverage and not going to pay the $60/person for Econ+...

Suggestions welcome please.

We're taking our currently 8 month old with us to Hawaii in 2 weeks. Her first time on a flight. We booked on UAL, direct to LIH, but we only got two seats of course. We figured our girl would lap it and if there was a seat open, we could use her carseat since we need it in HI. But, the row of 3 had someone on the aisle booked already. There aren't many seats open either.

So the question we have is, do we bring the car seat, attached to our City Mini stroller, and gate check both items? Or, do we bring both items and hope that we can use the car seat onboard? Or do I just goto the counter and say hey, I got my kid, move people around for us please? I don't have 1K anymore so no leverage and not going to pay the $60/person for Econ+...

Suggestions welcome please.

Umm, no. You absolutely do NOT do that. You have no entitlement to a seat whatsoever. You got to pay to play. Enjoy your flight with your child on your lap, and hope to god your gate-checked car seat and stroller don't get damaged.

Your entire post is about wanting something for nothing. You won't buy a seat for your child nor will you pay the pittance for the econ+ seats so that you and your lap child (AND the people in front of you) can have a little comfort, yet you want people to move to other seats and so on and so on to accommodate you? This is the kind of thing that causes many a passenger to resent and refuse requests from families for seating switcheroos.
My advice: suck it up and deal. The situation is the end result of your own choices.

We're taking our currently 8 month old with us to Hawaii in 2 weeks. Her first time on a flight. We booked on UAL, direct to LIH, but we only got two seats of course. We figured our girl would lap it and if there was a seat open, we could use her carseat since we need it in HI. But, the row of 3 had someone on the aisle booked already. There aren't many seats open either.

So the question we have is, do we bring the car seat, attached to our City Mini stroller, and gate check both items? Or, do we bring both items and hope that we can use the car seat onboard? Or do I just goto the counter and say hey, I got my kid, move people around for us please? I don't have 1K anymore so no leverage and not going to pay the $60/person for Econ+...

Suggestions welcome please.

What's the "of course" for? Many of us paid for seats for infants. Lap babies aren't obligatory on U.S. companies and many of us want our children to fly safely.

BUT the FAA says that you can use your FAA approved car seat (or really any approval) in an empty place. The airlines are not obligated to do this and probably wont reseat anyone (one airline says so outright).

BUT there are always no show's, upgrades, misconnects, etc. so you never really know when you'll be lucky. I came in this morning and we had plenty of empty seats, smack in the middle of the holiday season. You just never know (even on a Hawaii flight!) So it's worth it to bring the car seat and the stroller to the gate.

In any case, never check a car seat as luggage. They get beaten up and/or lost and you're out of luck if your car seat decided to go to another city. At least with gate-checking, the stuff is loaded directly below so taking it to the gate is a good idea.

Some airlines will "block" a seat for an infant, only using it if necessary. I can't and wont confirm this but it still might be happening. Let's face it, you know the look when you get on board with a baby... Giving a family with a baby a bit of extra space usually means a happier flight for everyone around them.

Like the pp so bluntly put it, you're basically asking for something for free. I have paid big money to put my child in his or her car seat on board so be sensitive to that. Be really nice with the agents and keep expectations reasonable.

Umm, no. You absolutely do NOT do that. You have no entitlement to a seat whatsoever. You got to pay to play. Enjoy your flight with your child on your lap, and hope to god your gate-checked car seat and stroller don't get damaged.

Your entire post is about wanting something for nothing. You won't buy a seat for your child nor will you pay the pittance for the econ+ seats so that you and your lap child (AND the people in front of you) can have a little comfort, yet you want people to move to other seats and so on and so on to accommodate you? This is the kind of thing that causes many a passenger to resent and refuse requests from families for seating switcheroos.
My advice: suck it up and deal. The situation is the end result of your own choices.

What's the "of course" for? Many of us paid for seats for infants. Lap babies aren't obligatory on U.S. companies and many of us want our children to fly safely.

BUT the FAA says that you can use your FAA approved car seat (or really any approval) in an empty place. The airlines are not obligated to do this and probably wont reseat anyone (one airline says so outright).

BUT there are always no show's, upgrades, misconnects, etc. so you never really know when you'll be lucky. I came in this morning and we had plenty of empty seats, smack in the middle of the holiday season. You just never know (even on a Hawaii flight!) So it's worth it to bring the car seat and the stroller to the gate.

In any case, never check a car seat as luggage. They get beaten up and/or lost and you're out of luck if your car seat decided to go to another city. At least with gate-checking, the stuff is loaded directly below so taking it to the gate is a good idea.

Some airlines will "block" a seat for an infant, only using it if necessary. I can't and wont confirm this but it still might be happening. Let's face it, you know the look when you get on board with a baby... Giving a family with a baby a bit of extra space usually means a happier flight for everyone around them.

Like the pp so bluntly put it, you're basically asking for something for free. I have paid big money to put my child in his or her car seat on board so be sensitive to that. Be really nice with the agents and keep expectations reasonable.

Wow, I haven't been on this forum for quite some time and thought it was a great resource for all travelers, regardless if you're a first timer or vet. Although I do appreciate vicarious_MR'er's direct response to my post, I believe you read my post entirely in a different tone. I don't expect anything for free on our flights at all, just asking a general question here and asked for suggestions and experiences. If you want to get really stuffy, that's fine, but maybe being more constructive than negative could be added to your daily routine and other people's questions.

Eclipsepearl thanks for the tips.

Since I asked up thread about how to actually go about possibly obtaining a seat for a lapchild, I thought I would update with my actual experiences on Delta.

Flying at Christmastime with my DH & DS, we did not have success. There was one flight where there were two seats together open, but the gate agent said that he couldn't move myself and DS up there while leaving DH in his original seat because we were all on one PNR. Sounded kind of bogus, since they split parties up all the time, but didn't push it.

On travel last weekend, just myself & DS, was able to obtain a seat for DS on all but one segment. I never tried asking at the ticket counter as we were already checked in, but would go up and see the gate agent. I'd say something like, "Hi, I'm traveling with a lap infant, and I just wondered if there were any seats open that he could use."

The results:
1st time- I didn't even get that far, the GA said, "Oh, are you...(looking at boarding passes)...Mrs. AsiaTraveler?" She had already moved me into a row with an open seat next to me.

2nd time- When I first went up to the counter, the GA said that I had the whole row to myself. Then, she came and found me, giving me a new boarding pass where I'd "have more room for the baby." However, when I went to board, the boarding agent pink tagged (for gate checking) my son's carseat. When I said that the other GA told me that there was room for me to use it onboard, she told me that the flight was 100% full and I'd have to gate check it. Fortunately I double checked with the other GA before leaving the car seat- there was at least one open seat in every row on that flight.

3rd time- I actually phrased my request as, "The seat next to me was open when I checked in and I just wanted to see if that was still the case." It wasn't, but the GA moved me to a new seat that did have a seat open next to it- but she still made sure to tell me that it wasn't guaranteed. The FA on that flight also was the only one who asked me if the car seat was approved and checked to make sure it was strapped in properly on board.

Overall, I discovered that it varies a lot based on who is working that flight. However being polite but also proactive in asking for a seat can help you out. I was very grateful to be able to use open seats but never felt that we were entitled or otherwise upset the one segment it didn't work out.

Good to hear stories "from the trenches". You asked at the check-in counter and again at the gate all times?

Grrrr they tried to gate-check your seat on a flight that had so many empty seats!!

As a F/A, I didn't check that the car seat was approved on principal and once told a FAA inspector so. If the parents were safety-consciencious enough to bring a car seat, I didn't hassle them any more about it. I feel this is the parents' responsibilities and if the airlines want to check, have the ground agents do it!

Good to hear stories "from the trenches". You asked at the check-in counter and again at the gate all times?

Grrrr they tried to gate-check your seat on a flight that had so many empty seats!!


Nope, I never asked at the check-in counter. Just at the gate.

I know- I would be more upset about that if it had actually succeeded. I complained to Delta and they promised to "look into it" (and threw a few miles my way) so I'm not as upset as I would otherwise be.

I have had good luck asking at the gate for my group to be moved to open row, if there is one. I have never asked them to move someone else. I have had luck this way 3/4 times, on the flights I took they ended up putting us in the last row, but I am happy with that if it means more space for a lap baby.

If you are nice it certainly cant hurt to ask.

Good to hear stories "from the trenches". You asked at the check-in counter and again at the gate all times?

Grrrr they tried to gate-check your seat on a flight that had so many empty seats!!

As a F/A, I didn't check that the car seat was approved on principal and once told a FAA inspector so. If the parents were safety-consciencious enough to bring a car seat, I didn't hassle them any more about it. I feel this is the parents' responsibilities and if the airlines want to check, have the ground agents do it!


unfortunately my experience has been that travelling from the UK and then transferring to a US domestic flight I am NEVER allowed by a F/A to use my airplane approved carseat simply because it doesnt have the recognized FAA approved sticker...which is only available on carseats sold in the US. Epic fail on the safety front as holding an unsecured baby in your lap SURELY cannot be more safe then putting them in a major brand carseat from the UK which clearly states in the manual that is approved for airplane use.

Of course the flip side is that on BA you arent even allowed to use a carseat and instead must use the ridiculously unsafe lap baby belt.

Ahhh the catch-22s of flying.

unfortunately my experience has been that travelling from the UK and then transferring to a US domestic flight I am NEVER allowed by a F/A to use my airplane approved carseat simply because it doesnt have the recognized FAA approved sticker...which is only available on carseats sold in the US. Epic fail on the safety front as holding an unsecured baby in your lap SURELY cannot be more safe then putting them in a major brand carseat from the UK which clearly states in the manual that is approved for airplane use.

Of course the flip side is that on BA you arent even allowed to use a carseat and instead must use the ridiculously unsafe lap baby belt.

Ahhh the catch-22s of flying.

Not true. Car seats with foreign approve ARE allowed on U.S. companies. Those F/A's were in the wrong.

This is the FAA document. Look on page 5;

http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC%20120-87B.pdf

In Europe, it's hard to find air travel-approved car seats because many require the use of a shoulder strap to install. It has to have a lap belt only installation option.

Write the airline and let them know that they broke a major FAR (not letting a parent use an approved car seat when a ticket for the child had been purchased).

On BA as well its only the rear racing bucket seats that aren't allowed, the forward facing car seats are fine, or they have their own seats which we used once

She's talking about connecting in the U.S. after arrival. U.S. companies wont let her use her air travel approved U.K. car seats.

Just for the record, you can get approval for non-FAA approved seats in special circumstances, such as for special-needs seats, if anyone ever needs to know that! Same document as I linked.

Of course the flip side is that on BA you arent even allowed to use a carseat and instead must use the ridiculously unsafe lap baby belt.

Ahhh the catch-22s of flying.