JetBlue TrueBlue - JetBlue @ LGA + DCA

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-11-23/laguardia-reagan-flight-slots-fetch-100-million-in-bids.html

Looks like JetBlue won the slots at LaGuardia and Reagan National. JetBlue only had a scant number of LGA flights before to Florida if I recall. I wonder where the new routes to LGA will go.

Is JetBlue going to do the LGA to DCA now I presume along with other routes?

I doubt they're going to try to run up against the US and DL shuttles.

I doubt they're going to try to run up against the US and DL shuttles.

We don't know yet. We will find out their new routes as they announce it I guess.

We don't know yet. We will find out their new routes as they announce it I guess.

I think you have wait for a real official release from B6. We will find out soon enough. Try to be more patiently.

We don't know yet. We will find out their new routes as they announce it I guess.

Indeed, we will. But since you asked if that was going to be one of the routes I figured I'd chime in with my opinion. ;)

Only 8x daily isn't enough to be a true Shuttle service. And as the fourth entrant in the market (I'm pretty sure AA still runs it, too) it would be mighty hard to keep up the numbers on that route. I'm betting they've got their eyes on other markets from each of LGA and DCA rather than just connecting the two.

Indeed, we will. But since you asked if that was going to be one of the routes I figured I'd chime in with my opinion. ;)

Only 8x daily isn't enough to be a true Shuttle service. And as the fourth entrant in the market (I'm pretty sure AA still runs it, too) it would be mighty hard to keep up the numbers on that route. I'm betting they've got their eyes on other markets from each of LGA and DCA rather than just connecting the two.

Yup. Not sure what they will do but I guess there is demand out of LGA.

Makes a more competitive market. But prices out of LGA will always be higher than JFK. I guess some people don't mind paying a price premium on the routes or they will just add some capacity to existing routes.

Yup. Not sure what they will do but I guess there is demand out of LGA.

Makes a more competitive market. But prices out of LGA will always be higher than JFK. I guess some people don't mind paying a price premium on the routes or they will just add some capacity to existing routes.

WestJet and JetBlue both won slots and both run on the same business model and had some of the same players involved with founding the company.

WestJet was based on an all boeing fleet then JetBlue wound up getting cheaper pricing from the subsidized Airbus fleet.

So essentially since JetBlue doesn't fly to Canada, it was as if JetBlue won all the slots from the auction in essense.

Just interesting there. Both excellent business models so the deal improves LGA with stronger carriers allowing JetBlue + WestJet access to more slots rather than having USAirways having them.

Southwest + AirTran together have a lot of slots at LGA now I presume.

So essentially since JetBlue doesn't fly to Canada, it was as if JetBlue won all the slots from the auction in essense. :confused:
Um....no. WestJet won the 8 slot pairs available to new entrants. JetBlue won the 8 pair for existing carriers. There is nothing at all about it that suggests JetBlue won all the slots.

Both excellent business models so the deal improves LGA with stronger carriers allowing JetBlue + WestJet access to more slots rather than having USAirways having them.Well, it was DL who got them from the US/DL slot swap and it was a requirement of the deal that they be divested to new entrants.

Southwest + AirTran together have a lot of slots at LGA now I presume.They have 28 pairs at LGA and 12 at DCA.

:confused:
Um....no. WestJet won the 8 slot pairs available to new entrants. JetBlue won the 8 pair for existing carriers. There is nothing at all about it that suggests JetBlue won all the slots.

Well, it was DL who got them from the US/DL slot swap and it was a requirement of the deal that they be divested to new entrants.

They have 28 pairs at LGA and 12 at DCA.

I never said JetBlue got all the slots. Read what I said carefully:

JetBlue and WestJet are essentially the same type of carrier even though they are two seperate companies which had some of the same players involved as well as many of the same business concepts.

So while yes it was Westjet and Jetblue, it was both low fare carriers with very similar parallels which received the LGA slots. Southwest still has the 28 pairs (I presume that is combined with the AirTran slots) for travel.

I never said JetBlue got all the slots. Read what I said carefully:I did. I even quoted it. You stated that since JetBlue doesn't fly to Canada that it is like they won all the slots. I think that's a rather crazy statement and without factual basis. So I replied as such.

JetBlue and WestJet are essentially the same type of carrier No, they aren't.

So while yes it was Westjet and Jetblue, it was both low fare carriers with very similar parallels which received the LGA slots. I only agree with the part where you have accurately named both carriers which won slots. The way WS and B6 behave is hardly "essentially the same".

Southwest still has the 28 pairs (I presume that is combined with the AirTran slots) for travel.
Correct.

While also competition with existing shuttle service, would it not make more sense to serve BOS, with its available B6 connections?

If not, increased traffic to FL would be a likely answer. I do not see DCA as an option...

While also competition with existing shuttle service, would it not make more sense to serve BOS, with its available B6 connections?

If not, increased traffic to FL would be a likely answer. I do not see DCA as an option...

Right. It's gonna to get more tougher competition against DL, US, AA and etc. That's will kept in advance.

My predictions for routes:

DCA-BOS
DCA-JFK
LGA-BOS
DCA/LGA-Florida
LGA-LGB on Saturdays

My predictions for routes:

DCA-BOS
DCA-JFK
LGA-BOS
DCA/LGA-Florida
LGA-LGB on Saturdays

LGA just got the parking lot construction finished finally. As to where they will fly, I guess where there is demand from LGA.


1

Chicago, Illinois (ORD)

1,292,000

American, Delta, United



2

Atlanta, Georgia

1,143,000

AirTran, American, Delta



3

Fort Lauderdale, Florida

737,000

Delta, JetBlue, Spirit



4

Charlotte, North Carolina

534,000

American, US Airways



5

Dallas/Fort Worth, Texas (DFW)

550,000

American



6

Miami, Florida

548,000

American



7

Boston, Massachusetts

466,000

American, Delta, US Airways



8

Detroit, Michigan

452,000

American, Delta, Spirit



9

Washington, DC (DCA)

386,000

Delta, US Airways



10

Orlando, Florida

351,000

AirTran, Delta, JetBlue


If you take the top 10, they will likely just add the more popular routes from LGA which will likely be from this top 10 list.

I see Boston as one of the likely contenders. I agree with that. Perhaps Chicago or other routes as well.

As far as DC to compete with Delta and USAirways shuttles, there has been people mentioning flights have been more crowded and prices going up on those routes so its possible JetBlue could add more competition there. But if someone guessed from these top 10 routes, they most likely would be right.

Chicago would be interesting. There is already shuttle-like service from UA and AA and actual shuttle service from DL. Similar to DCA I'm not sure it makes sense to enter the rather saturated market, even with the high number of passengers. Oh, and I'm not so sure about the B6 gate situation at ORD.

The slot swap between US and DL will also shake things up. But I wouldn't necessarily only expect to see them go after top 10 markets.

My predictions for routes:

DCA-BOS
DCA-JFK
LGA-BOS
DCA/LGA-Florida
LGA-LGB on Saturdays

How about more nonstop DCA-TPA/RSW/PBI/ORD/LAX/SFO/JAX/SJU/NAS/RDU/CLT/RIC.

How about more nonstop DCA-TPA/RSW/PBI/ORD/LAX/SFO/JAX/SJU/NAS/RDU/CLT/RIC.

It will just be a combination of highly travelled routes and possibly connections from LGA to another hub airport for JetBlue like DCA or whatnot.

The swaps should happen soon so JetBlue should have the new routes on its website along with WestJet in the near future.

But this whole slot swap deal improves air travel across the board with phaseout of smaller jets, and the addition of more Delta flights and JetBlue and Westjet. After its completed, LaGuardia will be getting even better. Parking lot was redone as well for those who drive to the airport. One of the parking lots was a true mess which has been redone.

Little by little, airports are getting better as well as the routes after each and every deal made.

How about more nonstop DCA-TPA/RSW/PBI/ORD/LAX/SFO/JAX/SJU/NAS/RDU/CLT/RIC.

DCA-RIC I doubt there is much demand for

LAX/SFO are out of the question because there is a 1500 mile perimeter out of DCA except for specifically authorized slots which are already held

My predictions for routes:

DCA-BOS
DCA-JFK
LGA-BOS
DCA/LGA-Florida
LGA-LGB on Saturdays

+1

What about DCA - HOU? I realize there's not even a HOU - BOS route yet, but it seems like an attractive route to me--top 10 ex-DCA route to a top business center that on a route served by only one other carrier who flies to a different airport.

Of course, there's a good chance Southwest may be jumping on the route once the AirTran merger is complete.

My prediction is that, since they so overpaid for these slots, they now have to make money on them. Don't look for them to be in routes to Florida or any destination that is a low yield route. They need to make a lot of money on the routes.

i could see DCA-JFK to feed into that hub...no way they go to LGA. i'd be shocked if they did with all of the competition. ORD would be interesting. one route i'd take a stab at is AUS. they could make that a connection point to get to the west coast if it's timed properly.

i could see DCA-JFK to feed into that hub...no way they go to LGA. i'd be shocked if they did with all of the competition. ORD would be interesting. one route i'd take a stab at is AUS. they could make that a connection point to get to the west coast if it's timed properly.

DCA - AUS is unfortunately 60 miles outside of the DCA perimeter.

I think there is a slight chance of DCA-LGA, particularly if the relationship with AA is expanded. But I hope they use the slots to go elsewhere. My preference DCA-LGA is Amtrak.

B6 is currently in Terminal A with Airtran, Spirit, Frontier and Air Canada. Any others? Will they be able to use all those slots at their one gate?

Between the CO/UA merger and transfer of slots from DL to US in combination with the new slots for B6, there will be lots of gate shuffling at DCA in the near future.

B6 is currently in Terminal A with Airtran, Spirit, Frontier and Air Canada. Any others? Will they be able to use all those slots at their one gate?

They currently already have 2 gates (1 & 9) in Terminal A. They should be fine gate capacity with the slots they have for a while.

DCA - AUS is unfortunately 60 miles outside of the DCA perimeter.

I think there is a slight chance of DCA-LGA, particularly if the relationship with AA is expanded. But I hope they use the slots to go elsewhere. My preference DCA-LGA is Amtrak.

that's right...for some reason i thought it was 1,500 not 1,250. 1,500 is LGA.

man they need to lift those dumb perimeter restrictions.

I doubt they're going to try to run up against the US and DL shuttles.

The new lots will likely be targeted to business travelers, a JetBlue spokesperson told the Journal, especially since the key New York-to-Washington route represents a common shuttle line for corporate and political travelers.

DCA makes sense for JetBlue out of LaGuardia. Considering JetBlue got slots out of DCA + LGA, they can increase traffic loads and provide better connectivity at these two airports.

The USAirways divestiture essentially making LaGuardia airport that much better with better carriers across the board.

USAirways could merge with American Airlines as speculated upon after American Airlines bankruptcy.

Hopefully this leads to improvements at LaGuardia airport in the future. Right away it means more larger jets from JetBlue + Westjet and Delta at LaGuardia and less regional USAirways service.

DCA makes sense for JetBlue out of LaGuardia. Considering JetBlue got slots out of DCA + LGA, they can increase traffic loads and provide better connectivity at these two airports.

I wouldn't completely rule out JetBlue competing with DL and US for the shuttle routes, but I don't think its a great idea. Even if you take all of their slots and devote them to DCA-LGA, DCA-BOS, LGA-BOS shuttle routes, JetBlue will still have only about 2/3 of the flight frequencies that US does. If they want to compete on the shuttle route, I would just compete ex-BOS and fully match the shuttle schedules (assuming their slots permit it). Besides not having enought slots, the DCA-LGA route has the added Amtrak competition that isn't anywhere near as strong LGA-BOS.

I agree with PVDtoDEL.
7 daily LaGuardia-Boston E190
+2 daily LaGuardia-Fort Lauderdale A320

+5 daily National-Boston E190
+2 daily National-Fort Lauderdale A320/E190
+2 daily National-Orlando A320/E190

Note I used nine slots for each airport instead of the eight B6 actually won because B6 began service to National with only eight slot pairs but scheduled a ninth flight outside of the slot restriction times, just like Southwest at LaGuardia.

Looks like B6 is well on their way to acquiring the 30 or so slots Barger said they would over the next few years when they entered National last year, especially if they can buy some Frontier/Republic slots, at least three slots but no more than five slots are more or less redundant.

DCA makes sense for JetBlue out of LaGuardia. Considering JetBlue got slots out of DCA + LGA, they can increase traffic loads and provide better connectivity at these two airports.


what connectivity? both LGA and DCA have the same destinations save for BOS (DCA) and PBI (LGA). your not getting any connections on a DCA-LGA flight.

DCA-JFK would be great for connections, but i doubt B6 would make enough $ on that route.

The DCA slots just became more valuable as DL is exiting the DCA-BOS market in April going from 7 flights per day down to 0.

The DCA slots just became more valuable as DL is exiting the DCA-BOS market in April going from 7 flights per day down to 0.

Really? Where'd you hear that? Expertflyer is showing availability on DL btw BOS-DCA well into June and July....

Today's OAG schedule change report. If you go to www.delta.com, you will see connections through Detroit and JFK to go from BOS to DCA.

DL DCA-ATL MAY 16>15 JUN 16>15 JUL 16>15
DL DCA-BDL APR 3>1.7 MAY 3>1.7 JUN 3>1.7 JUL 3>0.5 AUG 3>0
As predicted, they actually added frequency in last week's load. Weird
**DL DCA-BOS MAR 8>7 APR 7>0 MAY 7>0 JUN 7>0 JUL 7>0 AUG 7>0
DL DCA-CHS APR 1.9>0.8 MAY 1.9>0.9 JUN 1.8>0.8 JUL 1.9>0.3 AUG 1.9>0
*DL DCA-CMH APR 3>0 MAY 3>0 JUN 3>0 JUL 3>0 AUG 3>0
*DL DCA-DSM JUL 0.9>0.3 AUG 0.9>0
*DL DCA-GRR JUL 0.9>0.3 AUG 0.9>0
*DL DCA-IND JUL 3>0.8 AUG 3>0
*DL DCA-JAN MAR 0.8>0 APR 0.9>0 MAY 0.9>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 0.9>0 AUG 0.9>0
*DL DCA-MSN FEB 0.8>0 MAR 0.8>0 APR 0.9>0 MAY 0.9>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 0.9>0 AUG 0.9>0
*DL DCA-MSY FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0
*DL DCA-PVD APR 3>0 MAY 3>0 JUN 3>0 JUL 3>0 AUG 3>0

Today's OAG schedule change report. If you go to www.delta.com, you will see connections through Detroit and JFK to go from BOS to DCA.

DL DCA-ATL MAY 16>15 JUN 16>15 JUL 16>15
DL DCA-BDL APR 3>1.7 MAY 3>1.7 JUN 3>1.7 JUL 3>0.5 AUG 3>0
As predicted, they actually added frequency in last week's load. Weird
**DL DCA-BOS MAR 8>7 APR 7>0 MAY 7>0 JUN 7>0 JUL 7>0 AUG 7>0
DL DCA-CHS APR 1.9>0.8 MAY 1.9>0.9 JUN 1.8>0.8 JUL 1.9>0.3 AUG 1.9>0
*DL DCA-CMH APR 3>0 MAY 3>0 JUN 3>0 JUL 3>0 AUG 3>0
*DL DCA-DSM JUL 0.9>0.3 AUG 0.9>0
*DL DCA-GRR JUL 0.9>0.3 AUG 0.9>0
*DL DCA-IND JUL 3>0.8 AUG 3>0
*DL DCA-JAN MAR 0.8>0 APR 0.9>0 MAY 0.9>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 0.9>0 AUG 0.9>0
*DL DCA-MSN FEB 0.8>0 MAR 0.8>0 APR 0.9>0 MAY 0.9>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 0.9>0 AUG 0.9>0
*DL DCA-MSY FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0
*DL DCA-PVD APR 3>0 MAY 3>0 JUN 3>0 JUL 3>0 AUG 3>0


I guess the changes haven't made it to Expertflyer or DL.com yet. DL.com is still showing nonstops for ex June 12-19 albeit at over $1000 r/t! How long does it normally take for these changes to filter through the system? The OAG schedule change report is available only as a paid service huh?

A person posts the changes every week on:

www.airliners.net//aviation-forums/general_aviation

This weeks is at:

http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/5345454/

Schedule changes usually go through over the weekend so the flights should be removed by Monday.

A person posts the changes every week on:

www.airliners.net//aviation-forums/general_aviation

This weeks is at:

http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/5345454/

Schedule changes usually go through over the weekend so the flights should be removed by Monday.

This guys who post on entire a.net for every week. His username is enilria. He know what exactly he is doing. If the schedule is subject to change without notice. He has responsible to posted the OAG schedule for every week.

First clues about new routes from LGA/DCA were just posted on the B6 website:

# La Guardia, NY (LGA) and Fort Myers, FL (RSW) starts June 11, 2012
# La Guardia, NY (LGA) and Sarasota Bradenton, FL (SRQ) starts June 11, 2012
# La Guardia, NY (LGA) and Tampa, FL (TPA) starts June 11, 2012
# Washington DCA, DC (DCA) and Tampa, FL (TPA) starts June 11, 2012

First clues about new routes from LGA/DCA were just posted on the B6 website:

# La Guardia, NY (LGA) and Fort Myers, FL (RSW) starts June 11, 2012
# La Guardia, NY (LGA) and Sarasota Bradenton, FL (SRQ) starts June 11, 2012
# La Guardia, NY (LGA) and Tampa, FL (TPA) starts June 11, 2012
# Washington DCA, DC (DCA) and Tampa, FL (TPA) starts June 11, 2012

Very interesting, especially SRQ. I would expect this one in particular to be a winner, Airtran is pulling out of SRQ completely so they might see a nice pickup there. Staying away from the LGA-BOS shuttle is a good move in my opinion.

So looking at the frequencies:
LGA-FLL 6X Daily (Stays the same)
LGA-MCO 4X Daily (Up 3)
LGA-SRQ 1X Daily (New)
LGA-RSW 1X Daily (New)
LGA-TPA 2X Daily (New)

DCA-BOS 10X Daily (Up 3)
DCA-FLL 3X Daily (Up 2)
DCA-MCO 3X Daily (Up 2)
DCA-TPA 1X Daily (New)

I thought for sure they would offer something from LGA-BOS but it is nice to see the Florida expansion to these new cities along with the extra flights to MCO.

B6 paid an awful lot of money for those slots; odd that many of them are planned for leisure destinations in Florida.

Official release out now: http://investor.jetblue.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=131045&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1660476&highlight=

Official release out now: http://investor.jetblue.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=131045&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1660476&highlight=

Well, isn't enough more slots from LGA/DCA? Why they can't have more new route LGA-BOS? Oh well! :(

B6 paid an awful lot of money for those slots; odd that many of them are planned for leisure destinations in Florida.

They will fill those planes, better than the money-losing shuttle.

They will fill those planes, better than the money-losing shuttle.

I have no doubt they'll fill the planes, but at what price? B6 paid $5 million each for the DCA slot pairs and $4 million each for the LGA slot pairs. Unless B6 can significantly increase its margins on these flights, the $4.5 million average investment per flight will eat into the profits from these flights in a big way.

Well, isn't enough more slots from LGA/DCA? Why they can't have more new route LGA-BOS? Oh well! :(

too much competition

B6's two stated growth markets are BOS business markets and the Caribbean/Latin America. From DCA, BOS fits the bill as frequent service at a premium price with only US to compete against works well. As Latin America/Caribbean routes are beyond perimeter, that traffic can go through Florida. In addition, B6 is already well known in Florida markets. They are relatively new to DCA. To introduce the maximum amount of people to their product, serving high density flights to strong markets makes a lot of sense. As more people learn about their DCA service, they can always move those slots around to other destinations. It is not in the airline's financial interest to start experimental flights from an airport which they are spending millions to gain greater access.

There are also beyond perimeter slots coming up soon from DCA. They could apply for west coast or SJU service. Thus cutting a frequency from a Florida market early on would not have as great an impact as starting a new city pair and yanking it a couple months later.

too much competition

Darn! I didn't even know that. It's getting more tougher competition against DL, US, B6 and others, too.

They will fill those planes, better than the money-losing shuttle.

too much competition

I say: Bullsht. BOS-LGA fares run around $200 while BOS-JFK fares run around half that. If B6 can make money on BOS-JFK, surely BOS-LGA must make even more money.

There are also beyond perimeter slots coming up soon from DCA. They could apply for west coast or SJU service. Thus cutting a frequency from a Florida market early on would not have as great an impact as starting a new city pair and yanking it a couple months later.

I hadn't thought of the "parking" theory - that makes some sense, especially if B6 wins a beyond-perimeter slot or two.

Today, Ted Reed examines B6's decision to use most of its new expensive slots for Florida flights:

http://www.thestreet.com/_yahoo/story/11418091/1/jetblues-surprise-florida-florida-florida.html?cm_ven=YAHOO&cm_cat=FREE&cm_ite=NA

I say: Bullsht. BOS-LGA fares run around $200 while BOS-JFK fares run around half that. If B6 can make money on BOS-JFK, surely BOS-LGA must make even more money.

Because it's too extremely overcrowded who flew from BOS-NYC everyday. Way too much competition! It's will get more tougher competition. That's why they won't start a direct flight BOS-LGA.

Because it's too extremely overcrowded who flew from BOS-NYC everyday. Way too much competition! It's will get more tougher competition. That's why they won't start a direct flight BOS-LGA.

You mean they rather would make $100 than $200? Makes no sense.

Very happy to see the addition of LGA - SRQ. Fly JFK SRQ frequently, but LGA is a bit more convenient. And the added capacity is great sinice the JFK flights are almost always booked. Went to the JB site to book flights out of LGA during summer & noted the fares are much LOWER from LGA (and flight time much better too). Do they do some sort of Intro fare, and then raise them later, or are the fares out of LGA really going to stay lower than JFK?

You mean they rather would make $100 than $200? Makes no sense.

airfare quotes are hardly an indicator of whether an airline makes money on a route

the president just signed the new FAA bill yesterday, and in that, DCA will get 8 round trip beyond perimeter slots. wonder if B6 will file for DCA-LGB.

airfare quotes are hardly an indicator of whether an airline makes money on a route

You think that the cost of operating BOS-JFK is much different from BOS-LGA?

the president just signed the new FAA bill yesterday, and in that, DCA will get 8 round trip beyond perimeter slots. wonder if B6 will file for DCA-LGB.

Who decides which airline will get those slots?

Only 8 slots would require B6 to use every slot for BOS/LGA to be even remotely competitive. The whole selling point of the shuttle operations is that they are at least hourly so that you never have to wait around. If there are large gaps in the schedule, the business goes right to US/DL. This route is no longer the money maker it once was.

As for the beyond perimeter slots at DCA, 4 will be awarded to large incumbent carriers (US/DL/UA/AA). The other 4 will be for carriers with limited or no service--which includes jetBlue. I would say SJU or LAX would be the two most likely choices for jetBlue. For one of the few flights non-stop from the West Coast to DCA, choosing a business airport or an access point to the Caribbean would make the most sense.

As there is no service from SFO to DCA non-stop it would make sense for UA and VX to request that.

Don't forget too that B6 is accounting for both slot purchases as assets. The long term value may be higher than the present value and thus make money on what you can now and seize opportunities that arise in the near and/or distant future.

You think that the cost of operating BOS-JFK is much different from BOS-LGA?



Who decides which airline will get those slots?

i don't know the facts, but i bet slots at LGA are much more expensive than JFK.

the DOT determines who gets the slots. and i would say B6 would do LGB, since AS already has an LAX flight. plus, better connections to SFO/OAK/SMF/LAS for LGB.

UA will probably get SFO.

looks like UA applied for DCA-SFO...i wonder if B6 goes for AUS and LGB. apparently bids have to be submitted by march 12.

looks like UA applied for DCA-SFO...i wonder if B6 goes for AUS and LGB. apparently bids have to be submitted by march 12.

Let's keep finger crossed. Whosever will win the bids. They will announced it. DOT will choose for which airlines will be.

AUS and LGB don't really fit into B6's strategy. LGB is nearly all short haul now. I can't imagine the O and D traffic between AUS and DCA would be worth it.

LAX would make more sense as long haul from the LAX basin is now focused there. SJU still makes the most sense though as they would get a premium for that.

AUS and LGB don't really fit into B6's strategy. LGB is nearly all short haul now. I can't imagine the O and D traffic between AUS and DCA would be worth it.

LAX would make more sense as long haul from the LAX basin is now focused there. SJU still makes the most sense though as they would get a premium for that.

:confused: LGB is their west coast hub, and B6 has a pretty decent presence in AUS. so either of those for the beyond perimeter slots would make the most sense. i would be willing to bet DL/AA will get LAX so it wouldn't make much sense to try and compete with AS and DL/AA.

AUS and LGB don't really fit into B6's strategy. LGB is nearly all short haul now. I can't imagine the O and D traffic between AUS and DCA would be worth it.

LAX would make more sense as long haul from the LAX basin is now focused there. SJU still makes the most sense though as they would get a premium for that.
Why wouldn't JB fly DCA-LGB when they flew IAD-LGB?

Why wouldn't JB fly DCA-LGB when they flew IAD-LGB?

No, only IAD-LGB is not a slots restrictions. DCA is a perimeter rule. Because this is slot controlled.

No, only IAD-LGB is not a slots restrictions. DCA is a perimeter rule. Because this is slot controlled.

Understood, I just took the previous post to imply JB wouldn't want those routes, which I would think the opposite, if they could get clearance.

Understood, I just took the previous post to imply JB wouldn't want those routes, which I would think the opposite, if they could get clearance.

i believe B6 will go for AUS...big tech presence in AUS.

i believe B6 will go for AUS...big tech presence in AUS.

Perhaps you're right, but DC-Austin is a relatively small domestic market. Only about 876 daily passengers between the Capital and AUS; that's about 438 each way each day, and those 438 are spread out between BWI, IAD and DCA. Is there a market for 100 to 150 daily nonstop seats each direction between DCA and AUS? AUS-DCA is 215 passengers per day, or 108 each way.

For some perspective, daily traffic between the DC area (BWI/IAD/DCA) and greater Los Angeles (all airports) is about 5,000, or 2,500 each way. That's about 23 times the size of the DCA-AUS market.

Perhaps you're right, but DC-Austin is a relatively small domestic market. Only about 876 daily passengers between the Capital and AUS; that's about 438 each way each day, and those 438 are spread out between BWI, IAD and DCA. Is there a market for 100 to 150 daily nonstop seats each direction between DCA and AUS? AUS-DCA is 215 passengers per day, or 108 each way.

For some perspective, daily traffic between the DC area (BWI/IAD/DCA) and greater Los Angeles (all airports) is about 5,000, or 2,500 each way. That's about 23 times the size of the DCA-AUS market.

while that may be true...having the only DCA-AUS flight could be attractive instead of a highly competitive route such as LAX.

also, you could have some connection possibilities beyond AUS, say, DCA-AUS-LGB/SFO instead of going up to BOS.

Looks like B6 will apply for AUS-DCA and SJU-DCA.

DCA-SJU 1000-1355 A320
SJU-DCA 1105 1505 A320

DCA-AUS 1340-1600 E190
AUS-DCA 0830-1255 E190

Looks like B6 will apply for AUS-DCA and SJU-DCA.

DCA-SJU 1000-1355 A320
SJU-DCA 1105 1505 A320

DCA-AUS 1340-1600 E190
AUS-DCA 0830-1255 E190

Here we go yet again. I'm pretty confident about this one. Didn't B6 has already existed service IAD-SJU before? I wasn't sure if B6 will shifted from IAD to DCA. I didn't see it happen anytime soon. It will get more tougher competition against UA. On whether if they decide to shifting the flight from IAD to DCA.

while that may be true...having the only DCA-AUS flight could be attractive instead of a highly competitive route such as LAX.

also, you could have some connection possibilities beyond AUS, say, DCA-AUS-LGB/SFO instead of going up to BOS.

With WN applying also to get DCA-AUS, however, I'm betting that B6 doesn't get it. My prediction is:
B6 - SJU
WN - AUS
AS - PDX
VX - SFO

In their application B6 specifically says that SJU with continuing service to STT is their top priority and the AUS slot should only be considered if SJU absolutely will not be approved.

I think sbm12's predictions are the most logical choices.

With WN applying also to get DCA-AUS, however, I'm betting that B6 doesn't get it. My prediction is:
B6 - SJU
WN - AUS
AS - PDX
VX - SFO

You forgetting more airlines who already applying. AA will apply DCA-LAX and also, UA will apply DCA-SFO, too.

You forgetting more airlines who already applying. AA will apply DCA-LAX and also, UA will apply DCA-SFO, too.

those are separate slots which do not need to be approved. there are eight round trip slots, four to the incumbents and four to new entrants. the incumbents have to replace a within perimeter slot for a beyond perimeter slot, with the DOT approving the flight times. so you have

UA - SFO
AA - LAX
DL - SLC
US - ?

JetBlue's Application (http://www.regulations.gov/#!documentDetail;D=DOT-OST-2012-0029-0006)

In their application B6 specifically says that SJU with continuing service to STT is their top priority and the AUS slot should only be considered if SJU absolutely will not be approved.

If that's the case, then JetBlue's application is not worded correctly. (emphasis mine)

JetBlue Airways (“JetBlue”) hereby applies for exemptions from 49 U.S.C. 41714 (h) (4) and 14 CFR Part 93, subparts K and S (“High Density Rule” or “HDR”), to allow JetBlue to add service in up to two unique markets: 1) one daily nonstop roundtrip flight between Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport (“DCA”) and San Juan, Puerto Rico’s Luiz Munoz Marin International Airport (“SJU”), the capital of Puerto Rico, with connecting service to St. Thomas (“STT”), the capital of the United States Virgin Islands; and 2) one daily nonstop round trip flight between DCA and Austin-Bergstrom International Airport (“AUS”), the capital of Texas. JetBlue requests two (2) slot exemptions for new service between DCA and JetBlue’s focus city at SJU and, if the slots for SJU are granted, two (2) slot exemptions for new service between DCA and JetBlue’s growth city of AUS, both of which are capital cities located beyond the DCA perimeter pursuant the FAA Modernization and Reform Act of 2012 (Pub. L. No. 112-
95).1

1 In making this application JetBlue seeks consideration of its request to serve DCA-SJU/STT as its first choice. Only if that service to our focus city (SJU) is granted does JetBlue request that DOT consider its second request for service to Austin, Texas.

Shouldn't it read "If the slots for SJU are not granted..." and "Only if that service to our focus city (SJU) is not granted..."?

Shouldn't it read "If the slots for SJU are not granted..." and "Only if that service to our focus city (SJU) is not granted..."?

What is does this mean? I don't really understand why they won't approval it. Maybe they will have find someplace else.

What is does this mean?

It means that DCA-SJU is B6's first choice. If it is approved, then they're asking for a second pair of slots to serve DCA-AUS. If DCA-SJU is not approved, then B6 is not asking for DCA-AUS as a second choice.

They state it again in the conclusion of their application

Based upon the forgoing, JetBlue respectfully requests the Department award it two (2)slots to operate service between DCA and SJU for the reasons set forth above. If, and only if, the SJU service proposal is selected, JetBlue also requests that it be awarded two (2) slots for service between DCA and Austin, Texas, again for the reasons set forth herein.

This is the opposite of what sfozrhfco said a few posts up.

UA - SFO
AA - LAX
DL - SLC
US - ?

US announced today that they're going with SAN. That's going to likely put a damper on the AS, F9 and WN applications. And if that nixes the WN route then it might help B6 get both SJU and AUS, though I doubt any carrier gets two.

jetBlue will be happy just getting SJU as that is part of their core strategy to grow Caribbean markets. The other part of the strategy is to grow BOS business markets and AUS-DCA does not fit into that plan. If they got both SJU and AUS they won't refuse it but they are looking first and foremost to get DCA-SJU. AUS would be the icing on the cake but is not a top priority.

jetBlue will be happy just getting SJU as that is part of their core strategy to grow Caribbean markets. The other part of the strategy is to grow BOS business markets and AUS-DCA does not fit into that plan. If they got both SJU and AUS they won't refuse it but they are looking first and foremost to get DCA-SJU. AUS would be the icing on the cake but is not a top priority.

it's not a top priority over SJU, but it would be a nice route to have. B6 is growing in AUS, and to have the only flight to DCA would be huge.

The other part of the strategy is to grow BOS business markets and AUS-DCA does not fit into that plan. .

Is growing BOS business markets still the strategy? B6 reduced BOS-ORD to just 2x daily, although a day trip (BOS-ORD ORD-BOS) is still possible.

Is growing BOS business markets still the strategy? B6 reduced BOS-ORD to just 2x daily, although a day trip (BOS-ORD ORD-BOS) is still possible.

Very much so. Barger has commented on BOS at nearly every investor meeting recently, Dallas was just added as a matter of fact.