Diners Club Club Rewards - Chip & PIN?

I came here to see if there was any news on a Chip & PIN Diner's Club card. I had read that Citi was offering it on select card lines and figured that Diner's Club by Citi would be a great way to get it. I now see that BMO is taking it over. Even though BMO is Canadian, why do I think Chip & PIN is off the table for the time being?

Bank of Montreal announced Chip & PIN for Diners Club in May 2011. See this post (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/16434835-post47.html) in the main Credit Card Programs section, but no further information. Canada has adopted Chip & PIN, it seems probable that the Canadian Diners accounts will be converted first.

I don't think any card in the US will go Chip & PIN.

I don't think any card in the US will go Chip & PIN.

Chase, Citi, US Bank, Wells Fargo and several credit unions have already announced such cards, although most of the cards actually available today are using Chip & Signature rather than Chip & PIN.

Extensive discussion down the hallway:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credit-card-programs/1223331-usa-issuers-announce-emv-cards-chip-pin-chip-signature.html

Agree, will prob be a few years before DC in the US goes chip/pin. Annoying for those trips to Europe...

Agree, will prob be a few years before DC in the US goes chip/pin. Annoying for those trips to Europe...
Except that you're forgetting that as of next month DC in the US is (fully) owned & operated by a Canadiam bank (Bank of Montreal, in combination with its Harris Bank US subsidiary), and Canada is using Chip & PIN. So DC could actually be one of the first chip & PIN cards in the US, for this reason. (It wouldn't as likely have been one of the first had it stayed with US-based Citi.)

I just got a replacement card and my new card does have the chip in it. PIN will either be mailed or you can call them and they will give you instructions on going to an ATM within 4 hours to set it immediately. Either way, as I understood it, you have to request the PIN.

By the way, it came FedEx or UPS, don't recall which but it came from Canada.

Just used it this weekend for Airport Lounge access in AMS and SVO. No problems. Will be trying in at JFK later today.

It's almost impossible to use a card without a chip in Europe anymore.

Great news!^ Does DC USA accept new applications now? :confused:

Does DC USA accept new applications now? :confused:

Not yet. If you read other threads you will see that Diners (USA) is a month into the operational transition from Citi to BMO and there are serious persistent web and telephone customer service deficiencies. In any event, I wouldn't apply for a Diners Club card for the purpose of obtaining a Chip & PIN card because they still charge a 3% fee on foreign transactions. You can obtain a Chip & Signature VISA from Chase with no foreign transaction fee. See this thread to understand the differences between the two technologies:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credit-card-programs/1223331-usa-issuers-announce-emv-cards-chip-pin-chip-signature.html

It's almost impossible to use a card without a chip in Europe anymore.

I've been in Europe two out of the last five weeks, on separate trips and separate countries. I've had a problem only once - at a patisserie outside of Paris.

FYI, I have a DC corporate card, based in Washington DC. I lost my card this weekend and ordered another one. The new card came by courier from Markham, ON, and does NOT have a chip, though it does have the new BMO branding etc. Bummer.

You have to ask them specifically for a chip & pin card. They told me they would be sending these to everyone over the next few months, but I asked for one and they sent it by 2 day UPS from Canada. I am a US cardholder.

Ms mia requested a chipped card (USA, Professional). First CSR didn't understand the request, but after discussion advised her that she already had one, and sent her only the PIN. Today's CSR told her the chips are "not yet available" for USA cardholders.

It will go back into the safe for a few months, then we will try again.

Ms mia requested a chipped card (USA, Professional). First CSR didn't understand the request, but after discussion advised her that she already had one, and sent her only the PIN. Today's CSR told her the chips are "not yet available" for USA cardholders.

It will go back into the safe for a few months, then we will try again.

I called Monday night to make an initial request, and again yesterday (they told me the first time to call back). They said it is being sent out on Monday.

Will wait until Friday, and ask to cancel my card if I don't have it. That normally gets results.

I hope pin doesn't come to the US too.....

I hope pin doesn't come to the US too.....

Discussion in progress:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credit-card-programs/1188514-should-usa-card-issuers-adopt-emv-chip-pin-opinion-discussion.html

I called Monday night to make an initial request, and again yesterday (they told me the first time to call back). They said it is being sent out on Monday.

Will wait until Friday, and ask to cancel my card if I don't have it. That normally gets results.

So of course, I had nothing in my mailbox today.
Called in this afternoon to cancel and explained why. Put on hold for 15 minutes, and when they came back I was told that my account was now updated to support Chip/Pin, and that a card was being mailed out tonight via UPS Overnight for delivery on Wednesday.

As this was flagged as an "express" replacement, the "pin" is supposed to be included in the package. I was informed that there was no way to change the pin to a number of my choosing (which is what I thought).

Only the mag stripe / cash advance pin is settable.

I will report back tomorrow.

Victory is mine!
UPS just knocked on my door (signature required for package).

Opened it up and two envelopes where inside. One includes my new Chip+Pin card, and the other includes the pin.

Europe, here I come!
:cool:

So of course, I had nothing in my mailbox today.
Called in this afternoon to cancel and explained why. Put on hold for 15 minutes, and when they came back I was told that my account was now updated to support Chip/Pin, and that a card was being mailed out tonight via UPS Overnight for delivery on Wednesday.

As this was flagged as an "express" replacement, the "pin" is supposed to be included in the package. I was informed that there was no way to change the pin to a number of my choosing (which is what I thought).

Only the mag stripe / cash advance pin is settable.

I will report back tomorrow.

Also of note, the card has the PayPass logo on the back. MasterCard logo remains on the front.

The MasterCard hologram on the front, is gone. It is now on the back.

My credit card number was not changed. Expiration is unchanged.
The CVV on the back was changed.

Photos/scans of front and back would be appreciated, confidential part covered of course.

Photos/scans of front and back would be appreciated, confidential part covered of course.

Don't think that I will have time before end of day, but will get it done, later.

Click on images for better view

http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/1v6b6v8T57GbOa2qoypYciySrna7Ju_thumb.jpg (http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1v6b6v8T57GbOa2qoypYciySrna7Ju)

http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/12x8AuS82PleUIknOf611aDp3YleX61_thumb.jpg (http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=12x8AuS82PleUIknOf611aDp3YleX61)

Thanks, the added PayPass feature along with the EMV chip is big plus now, comparable to the US Bank FlexPerks card.

I'll revise the Google Docs spreadsheet (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ani-u3tGk5hedGRvcE1ELVg5UmlGZk01SHZvTUMxdUE#gid=0) noting this.


[edit: seems like someone already did! Thanks!]

I'll revise the Google Docs spreadsheet (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ani-u3tGk5hedGRvcE1ELVg5UmlGZk01SHZvTUMxdUE#gid=0) noting this.


[edit: seems like someone already did! Thanks!]

That was me. Feel free to change my wording.

Just wanted to chime in. I called and asked for an EMV card about a month ago and they sent it right away. It arrived in about a week. It works fine but my existing card did not work after it was ordered even though they told me it would.

Just wanted to chime in. I called and asked for an EMV card about a month ago and they sent it right away. It arrived in about a week. It works fine but my existing card did not work after it was ordered even though they told me it would.

They told me that once I requested the Chip & Pin card my old card would be deactivated and I could not charge anything until the new card arrived and was activated.

I got an unsolicited PIN in the mail today, saying CHIP+PIN card was on its way. I'm about 2.5 years from a normal card expiration, so I guess they are rolling it out more agressively now.

I got an unsolicited PIN in the mail today, saying CHIP+PIN card was on its way. I'm about 2.5 years from a normal card expiration, so I guess they are rolling it out more agressively now.

I think you're right.

I called them about a week ago to request an annual fee waiver and when I punched in my acc't number it said that they had recently sent me a new card and was I trying to activate it. I hadn't rec'd a new card so I skipped the activation and went to a live CSR.

I asked her about the new card and she said that the new card was "set-up" but hadn't been sent to me yet. She confirmed that the new card would be chip-and-pin.

It's frustrating to not have chip and pin on the US cards. Everywhere else, everyone asks for it and has a hard time using regular cards. Sometimes they won't even accept non-chip.

Got my unsolicited PIN mailing today, along with a promise that I will get the new card with a chip within 10 days. My current card's expiration is Oct. 2012.

I just spent 2 weeks in Europe and had no trouble using chip-less cards anywhere, except that I had to point out the need to swipe a couple of times. ATM usage and one ticket-vending machine at Heathrow T5 also were no problem.

However, I'll be glad to have the Diners chip-&-pin card, when it comes.

Got my unsolicited PIN mailing today, along with a promise that I will get the new card with a chip within 10 days. My current card's expiration is Oct. 2012.

I just spent 2 weeks in Europe and had no trouble using chip-less cards anywhere, except that I had to point out the need to swipe a couple of times. ATM usage and one ticket-vending machine at Heathrow T5 also were no problem.

However, I'll be glad to have the Diners chip-&-pin card, when it comes.

Likewise, my unsolicited PIN arrived yesterday and promise of new card in 10 days.

UPDATE: Card arrived today (Tuesday). Activated new plastic. However, because of a "system glitch" was unable to change PIN.

Ms mia received card with EMV chip plus contactless chip in today's mail. Now if they would eliminate the 3% foreign transaction fee.

Ms mia received card with EMV chip plus contactless chip in today's mail. Now if they would eliminate the 3% foreign transaction fee.

Indeed. As moderator, it seems as though you should take the lead on this. ;)

Hmmm. I must have preselected my PIN because it's the same PIN I use with my debit card. (I'm not remembering, but I called them so many times during "the troubles" that I may have been distracted. :D)

Even with the 3% fee, I may use the card sometimes in Europe, just to be :cool:

Ms mia received card with EMV chip plus contactless chip in today's mail.

Got mine yesterday!

I got an unsolicited PIN in the mail today, saying CHIP+PIN card was on its way. I'm about 2.5 years from a normal card expiration, so I guess they are rolling it out more agressively now.
And the card showed up today.

Got mine yesterday!
+1
Came in today's mail. :)

+1
Came in today's mail. :)

+2 Got mine!!!

I hope pin doesn't come to the US too.....

I hope it does. It's much easier and more secure than signing.

I got mine today too. Unfortunately, I pay several regular bills/donations, etc. with the card. Now I have to go through the process of changing the security code and expiration date on each of these a year and a half early. :(

I hope it does. It's much easier and more secure than signing.

+1 ^

I'm happy to report that the chip and card are waterproof. I left the card in a shirt pocket while on vacation in Paris and accidentally tossed it in the washing machine. It took a licking and kept on ticking, just like in the Timex commercial.

My card with chip and PayPass arrived together today with the additional card I have on my account. I was getting worried because I had been told the card was mailed weeks ago but was later clarfied that they were running the printing in batches (so while printed on the date they said, the mailing was done in rolling batches) and that the PINs would arrive first and then 2-3 days later the cards would arrive -- which they did.

I do have to say that the card is definitely very cool and welcome the PayPass for quick use in taxis and stores here in NYC. Will likely not use the card on my next trip abroad (well, maybe just to test the chip) until they get rid of the 3% transaction fee. Will be interesting to see where Harris takes the card and Club Rewards in the coming year(s).

Hi all...... received the DC chip'n'PIN card last week.....called to activate.....and to request a PIN change.

Got connected to customer service..... the nice lady asked whether I was "in Canada or the States?"

Turns out because I'm in the States, the PIN cannot be changed "because it's programmed in the chip." But the "good news is that you don't have to use the PIN in the States."

Oh well....... time to double-check that the Discover Business card as as-good-as-DC coverage for auto rentals...... take care everyone!

I am a US cardholder, presently on assignment in London. Chip and pin cards arrived here this week, although I am not sure of the wisdom of bundling the card and the separate letter with the pin in one UPS envelope and sending that!

... PIN cannot be changed "because it's programmed in the chip."

I think this means that the chip supports "offline" verification, which means that it can authorize charges at POS locations which do not verify transactions in real time. Such terminals are common in certain European countries. There should still be a way to change the PIN, typically at an ATM because the new PIN must be written to the chip, but because Chip & PIN ATMs are not common in the USA it may be that BMO does not yet have a facility in place.

Yes, I received the same thing. Now I am waiting... waiting...

This is good news - I can use this for purchasing train tickets in advance and recovering them in kiosks or purchasing in unstaffed kiosks, etc. in Europe! (My Citi AA Executive card has chip and signature - the PIN is only usable if one wishes to pay extortionate rates to use the card as a Cash / ATM card and get a cash advance; I do love the no forex charge, though.).


I got an unsolicited PIN in the mail today, saying CHIP+PIN card was on its way. I'm about 2.5 years from a normal card expiration, so I guess they are rolling it out more agressively now.

Just out of curiosity, if you have an option of "credit" or "debit" when making a purchase and you choose debit and use your PIN, will you be able to make the purchase? I'm thinking of Costco, for example, where you have a choice of debit or AMEX and the Diners credit option wouldn't be accepted.

Secondly, if you use your Diners to get money from an ATM, what kind of charges are there? I can't find it anywhere on the website.

https://www.dinersclubus.com/home/customer-service/customer-service-l2/faqs/professional-cards#1-3

"Each time you use your Card at an ATM, a transaction fee will be assessed. The fee is the greater of $4 or 4% of your cash advance total and will appear on your next monthly billing statement. "

I assume this is in addition to forex fees, if any.

I first tried using cards at Madrid (Spain) Metro kiosks on Sun 29 April. Swipe cards made the kiosk ask for a PIN, and it was unhappy with 0000. DC MC asked for a PIN, and I entered the real PIN, and it said "PIN CORRECT", on the card mini-display but then the main screen said the transaction could not be completed.

I called DC US after that and they said they had not seen any activity on my card, so the kiosk had never communicated with them. This seems to verify that the PIN verification was offline, since online verification would have required them to communicate with the bank, no?

On Fri 4 May, the software in those kiosks looked different (I was at a different station though). I did not try the swipe card again, but did use my DC MC with PIN successfully to buy 3 or more tickets. (The kiosks at this point said that just 2 tickets for 3 Euros was an insufficient amount to use a credit card for. I had not gotten any such messages earlier that week, which is why I said I think the software was different.)

I was unable to try to use any card (chip, PIN, or otherwise) with the Renfe (Spanish train system) because the kiosks were totally not working the day I needed to tickets (the touchscreens were acting up). And btw, a few days later they had different software loaded, which didn't require typing in the destination any more, but this new software didn't list the city I had traveled to, so I couldn't have used the kiosk in any case!)

I saw no unattended gas stations in Spain, in fact, I never even once saw a pay-at-the-pump card interface in Spain. (Nor, in fact, did I ever have to pay up front to pump, not even in Madrid!)

I did go through toll booths a couple times but always used the manned lane. (I was in too much of hurry then to experiment iwth the credit card only lanes, sorry.)

I never once had an issue in Spain with anyone either turning down or even being confused by swipe card. So the Metro kiosk was the only place that I ran into that seemed to have a swipe card issue.

I did go through toll booths a couple times but always used the manned lane. (I was in too much of hurry then to experiment iwth the credit card only lanes, sorry.)
I recently went through a French tool booth at night and thought there was no one to get mad at me if I took too long. There were no manned lanes, so I went for the one that you could use a credit card. I could not get the DC to work; the machine did not recognize the card. I finally pushed the "talk to a live nude agent!" button, and tried to explain that I was having trouble with my card and the agent remotely did something to turn on the card interface ... a new light came on, and then I could complete the transaction. I had no idea they would pull something like turning off the card interface at an unmanned booth! Apparently most people in that area (it was in the Savoie) use transponders or change :)

https://www.dinersclubus.com/home/customer-service/customer-service-l2/faqs/professional-cards#1-3

"Each time you use your Card at an ATM, a transaction fee will be assessed. The fee is the greater of $4 or 4% of your cash advance total and will appear on your next monthly billing statement. "

I assume this is in addition to forex fees, if any.

No forex fee that I can see for purchases, and pretty much market rates on the transaction. Example: 5-Apr charge = 113.90€ @ 1.305619 = $148.71 plus $4.46 fee. Published interbank rate that day was 1.306 ... That's effectively 1.3447 which is better than you'd get at a bureau de change. I got fees charged on smaller amounts that were below $4 (i.e., $1.78 on a $59.47 charge), so maybe that's just for a cash advances?

ATMs take swipe cards anyway, so there's no reason not to use a real bank card for cash.

No forex fee that I can see for purchases, and pretty much market rates on the transaction. Example: 5-Apr charge = 113.90€ @ 1.305619 = $148.71 plus $4.46 fee. Published interbank rate that day was 1.306 ... That's effectively 1.3447 which is better than you'd get at a bureau de change. I got fees charged on smaller amounts that were below $4 (i.e., $1.78 on a $59.47 charge), so maybe that's just for a cash advances?.
I'm not sure where you're looking, but the $1.78 fee on the $59.47 charge and the $4.46 fee on the $148.71 are exactly the 3% forex fees! So what do you mean no forex that you can see for purchases??? :confused: Where are you looking that you can't see that the "fee" you're mentioning is the forex fee???

In my case (personal account based in the US), I see it now clearly spelled out on a separate line even on my "New Transactions" page online:

May-04-2012 METRO DE MADRID MADRID 280
EUR 6.00 @ 1.310000 $ 7.86 xxxxxxxxxxxx Dispute
May-07-2012 FOREIGN TRANSACTION FEE $ 0.23 xxxxxxxxxxxx Dispute

(Just in case you're not aware, "forex" refers to any kind of foreign whatever fee. IOTW, these days "forex" tends to be foreign transaction fees, rather than foreign currency fees, but the term "forex" is still used in either case.)

Hi all...... received the DC chip'n'PIN card last week.....called to activate.....and to request a PIN change.

Got connected to customer service..... the nice lady asked whether I was "in Canada or the States?"

Turns out because I'm in the States, the PIN cannot be changed "because it's programmed in the chip." But the "good news is that you don't have to use the PIN in the States."


Not entirely correct. Apparently, you can only change the PIN outside the States at a Chip enabled machine. I was told that when I arrived in my next country outside of the US, I can give them a call and then I have 12 hours to find a chip enabled AMT (Cirrus or another one on the back of the card or Citibank machine) and you can change it at the machine.

I was on a 12-day trip in Switzerland and Austria. Almost all that time I was driving a rental.

Most gas stations were manned. I saw automated ones here and there, but there was always a manned one down the road. And I was never desperate for gas. And at any rate, I didn't understand the German-only instructions for the automated gas kiosks. So I never tried using them.

Restaurants either took my swipe card or didn't take credit cards at all.

I had no problem using swipe cards at any location where a human was involved. One person at a truck stop gas station (where they presumably don't see many Americans) didn't understand how to swipe, but I pointed at the swipe area on the side of her machine and she then figured it out. Everyone else I dealt with I didn't even have to explain how to swipe.

So my one and only chip experience was with a parking lot kiosk in Hallstatt, Austria (in the Lake District east of Salzburg), at one of those parking lots where you get a ticket when you enter, and then have to walk to a machine to pay the ticket, and then are given back the ticket encoded with "ok to open the gate, they paid". This kiosk just tried my swipe card moving it in and out and in and out and gave up. I tried again and same thing. Then I tried my chip Diners card, and it took it, and returned my ticket (which ended up letting me exit fine). No prompt for a PIN. (I presume a chip & signature card would have worked as well, but I don't have one.) For the few hours I'd parked it was 6 Euros.

Parking lots which cost much less didn't take credit cards at all. So even though I parked a lot, this was the only parking lot where I had the chance to pay by card.

(Which makes this the second European trip on which I've had exactly one case on the whole trip where a chip card made the difference. But of course, that's related both to where I've been and also what I do while traveling; others may have quite different experiences. )