Travel with Children - United Airlines insisted I change my baby on toilet seat or bathroom floor!

July 5 traveling from Dulles to LAX with my husband and 19 month old daughter on a full flight my family suffered a horrible experience.
Midway through the flight my daughter required a diaper change, at which point we took our baby to the restroom only to discover there was no changing table. Directly outside of the restroom was a flat padded bench that was not in use, which made sense as the logical place to do a quick change. As I was preparing the area, a stewardess came flying around the corner saying that I was not allowed to use the bench that it was against FAA policy, I looked at her confused and asked where to change my baby. The response I got was something no parent or caretaker should receive, she told me my two options were the top of a toilet seat (which at this time was clogged with feces) or the bathroom floor! I was appalled/hurt to say the least and refused to do either. Her compromise to me was giving me a trashbag to lay on the floor outside of the bathroom.
I am posting this in hopes for a change. It breaks my heart to think of the bacteria and worse our precious babies could be exposed to.

I see plenty of mothers who change babies diapers right on the seat. :(

Can yoiu tell me more specifically? What is happening your daughter who did not have diaper change during in-flight. I wasn't sure why they change the policy? You didn't put her in the diaper table. Can you wait for landed in LAX go to family restroom to change her diapers.

July 5 traveling from Dulles to LAX with my husband and 19 month old daughter on a full flight my family suffered a horrible experience.
Midway through the flight my daughter required a diaper change, at which point we took our baby to the restroom only to discover there was no changing table. Directly outside of the restroom was a flat padded bench that was not in use, which made sense as the logical place to do a quick change. As I was preparing the area, a stewardess came flying around the corner saying that I was not allowed to use the bench that it was against FAA policy, I looked at her confused and asked where to change my baby. The response I got was something no parent or caretaker should receive, she told me my two options were the top of a toilet seat (which at this time was clogged with feces) or the bathroom floor! I was appalled/hurt to say the least and refused to do either. Her compromise to me was giving me a trashbag to lay on the floor outside of the bathroom.
I am posting this in hopes for a change. It breaks my heart to think of the bacteria and worse our precious babies could be exposed to.

As opposed to the bacteria adults could have been exposed to from a dirty diaper on the padded bench ? How much more appaling/hurtful was it to change the diaper on the floor next to the padded bench? I'll bet money your child came thru the ordeal with flying colors and a set of wings from the flight attendant.
Sorry, I don't mean to sound cold or uncaring, but I've changed a couple million diapers on my two sons and as I recall neither of them really gave a hoot where it happened. I'm not seeing what the issue is here.

Can yoiu tell me more specifically? What is happening your daughter who did not have diaper change during in-flight. I wasn't sure why they change the policy? You didn't put her in the diaper table. Can you wait for landed in LAX go to family restroom to change her diapers.

It was a flight from the D.C. area to Los Angeles. I'm sure at some point, a 19 month old is going to need a diaper change. Sitting in a dirty diaper 3-5 hours doesn't do many people much good. Further, the OP stated the bathroom didn't have a changing table for her to use.

All I can say to the OP is at least they gave you a trash bag and I hope you write UAL directly as to installing changing tables in the lavs.

What ever did people do without changing tables?

Having changed a diaper or two myself, I'd be more horrified to offend other pax with my baby's stinky diaper than using the toilet seat. That's what antibacterial wipes are for. Also, there's more than one lav. Find the one that's not full of feces.

Sorry, OP, but I think you'll find limited sympathy here.

The FAs were completely correct. It is selfish, gross, unsanitary and even dangerous (to passengers with compromised immune systems and other health issues) to change a baby on the "bench." If you can't manage a change in the lav (and if you can't check ahead to ensure that there is an acceptable place to change your baby), then don't fly. I can't imagine why you would think a public changing on a seat used by the flight attendants (which is what the "padded bench" is) is remotely acceptable.

Oh, and welcome to FlyerTalk.

Um, why wouldn't you have a changing pad to use with you in the diaper bag in the first place?

It breaks my heart to think of the bacteria and worse our precious babies could be exposed to.

All airplanes and airports are teeming with all sorts of bacteria, vermin, and of course TSA (at the airports). We don't need any our your precious baby's feces to add to the mix.

While I agree that UA should have at least one lav with changing tables (isn't it usualy the front lav), that doesn't mean you should contaminate the FA's seat, other pax's seats or even the tray table--some people use that for eating.

Her compromise to me was giving me a trashbag to lay on the floor outside of the bathroom.

I'm confused.

You don't carry a changing pad in the diaper bag? You simply expect that wherever you go, there will always be a convenient and clean surface on which you can change your baby that won't expose other people to stinky diapers or bacteria?

(I've got a three-month-old. The diaper bag has a padded changing surface packed in it, with a stack of disposable covers (http://www.amazon.com/Munchkin-Disposable-Changing-Pad-Pack/dp/B002KCMSPQ) to be used.)

Can yoiu tell me more specifically?
What more do you need to know? :rolleyes:
You didn't put her in the diaper table.The OP said there wasn't one.
Can you wait for landed in LAX go to family restroom to change her diapers.That's 2-3 hours of sitting in a dirty diaper. Yes, it happens, but most parents would want to change that diaper right away. Would you want to sit in a dirty diaper for that length of time?

Even if the lavatory had a changing table, the OP should still have used a diaper pad, or clean trash bag, because those tables are nasty. :(

Barring any unknown disability, a 19 month old can usually stand. For my boys, we learned to change them standing up.

I'm sorry that I did not make it clear in my OP that I DO carry around a clean cushy blanket to use for public changes. She is a toddler and would not fit on a toilet seat, nor will I put her on on my seat on a packed flight. I WAS prepared for a quick, clean change. If you think by quickly changing my young child on a bench on her blankie over a filthy toilet or urine soaked floor, or the seat of my packed flight is wrong, then I have to question your judgement. I was put on this flight by American and will not fly United again!

yada yada yadaYou have to understand, one of the cardinal rules of folks are here is to "be prepared". And newbies whose first post is a complaint often don't get the benefit of the doubt. So welcome to FT!
I was put on this flight by American and will not fly United again!I bet you will. :p

Could the flat padded bench be the FA's jump seat? If so, I wouldn't want that either (and I am pretty sure it is against FAA regs).

And as far as not flying UA again, I'm sure many here (and especially in the UA forum) would cheer that. :eek:

July 5 traveling from Dulles to LAX with my husband and 19 month old daughter on a full flight my family suffered a horrible experience.

For any PAX having to use the lav is a horrible experience. That said I can see the OP's difficulties in finding a reasonable place to change their child's diaper. Sounds like a reasonable compromise was made - certainly not the worst and certainly not the best.

I'm sorry that I did not make it clear in my OP that I DO carry around a clean cushy blanket to use for public changes. She is a toddler and would not fit on a toilet seat, nor will I put her on on my seat on a packed flight. I WAS prepared for a quick, clean change. If you think by quickly changing my young child on a bench on her blankie over a filthy toilet or urine soaked floor, or the seat of my packed flight is wrong, then I have to question your judgement.Public diaper changes outside of airline lavs are disgusting, unsanitary and potentially dangerous. If you disagree then I question your judgment.

I was put on this flight by American and will not fly United again!I think that's a good decision. I don't fly AA very much and UA is my preferred carrier.

The OP is used to AA, where most lavatories do have changing tables. It is really pretty gross not to have them because it encourages diaper changes in the cabin.

The OP is used to AA, where most lavatories do have changing tables. It is really pretty gross not to have them because it encourages diaper changes in the cabin.

I usually fly WN and have not seen them there. Well, it is WN. (Go ahead, cattle cars, kettles, yeah yeah, if you are thinking it you might as well write it.)

I don't know why anyone is giving her grief for wanting to change her baby on the bench, let it happen, then file a complaint with the airline and get miles for the inconvenience, seems like SOP...

I don't know why anyone is giving her grief for wanting to change her baby on the bench, let it happen, then file a complaint with the airline and get miles for the inconvenience, seems like SOP...

If it is the jump seat, it may be more than just changing the diaper. It may be FAA regulations or possibly UA rules.

The bench is for FA's and needs to be kept clear at all times in case of tubulence. Have changed babies in UA lavs without changing tables and it's simply not a problem or an issue. Kids now 7 and no worse for wear.

It breaks my heart to think of the bacteria and worse our precious babies could be exposed to.

Oh boo-hoo, so much drama :rolleyes: Millions of kids around the world are exposed to a lot worse than aircraft toilets, multiple times a day. Life goes on.
Solutions:
1) Fly on an aircraft with a changing table (this can be researched in advance of booking).
2) Fly short hop trips so no segment longer than 1-1.5 hours. Change kid in the airport. An onboard mess at least isn't facing a long transcontinental time span.
3) Don't fly until child is older.
4) Train or Drive.
5) Potty train the kid asap.

I can't find fault with the FA's actions or solution, under the circumstances. I'm not getting how this is a Travel Safety or Security issue?

...nor will I put her on on my seat on a packed flight. I WAS prepared for a quick, clean change. If you think by quickly changing my young child on a bench on her blankie over a filthy toilet or urine soaked floor, or the seat of my packed flight is wrong, then I have to question your judgement.
So how do you feel about changing her at your seat on a non-packed flight?

I'm sorry that I did not make it clear in my OP that I DO carry around a clean cushy blanket to use for public changes. She is a toddler and would not fit on a toilet seat, nor will I put her on on my seat on a packed flight. I WAS prepared for a quick, clean change. If you think by quickly changing my young child on a bench on her blankie over a filthy toilet or urine soaked floor, or the seat of my packed flight is wrong, then I have to question your judgement. I was put on this flight by American and will not fly United again!

Blanket? Cloth right, can absorb urine from said urine-soaked floor. Why on earth did you not have a padded plastic changing pad??? Every parent i've known has one in their diaper bag.

Moving this to TravelBuzz! as it's neither a safety or security issue nor airline specific, i.e., it could have happened at any airline.

__________________
Cholula
TS/S Co-Moderator

Blanket? Cloth right, can absorb urine from said urine-soaked floor. Why on earth did you not have a padded plastic changing pad??? Every parent i've known has one in their diaper bag.

That is what I don't get. If there is a padded plastic changing pad, in combination with the trash bag provided by the FA, why is it so nasty to change a child on the floor of the lav? Granted it's not ideal, however, the lavs are not ideal for most people using them, and they aren't exactly the height of cleanliness. And at 19 months there is no reason why a diaper change couldn't have been done with the child standing up.

UA should have more changing tables in their lavs. But, parents have been changing dirty diapers for years in airplane lavs without the convenience of a changing table. It is not and shouldn't be the end of the world.

The FAs were completely correct. It is selfish, gross, unsanitary and even dangerous (to passengers with compromised immune systems and other health issues) to change a baby on the "bench." If you can't manage a change in the lav (and if you can't check ahead to ensure that there is an acceptable place to change your baby), then don't fly. I can't imagine why you would think a public changing on a seat used by the flight attendants (which is what the "padded bench" is) is remotely acceptable.

Oh, and welcome to FlyerTalk.

That "bench" sounds an awful lot like the FA jumpseats.

I find it disappointing that there was no lav with a changing table available or anywhere else you could do it (that you knew of or to which the FAs cared to direct you), but that doesn't make using the FA jumpseats a solution.

...
I bet you will. :p

Isn't "I'll never fly this airline again!" the mating-call of the Kettle?

JessKasha, welcome to FlyerTalk!

Please follow as the thread moves to the Travel with Children forum. Ocn Vw 1K, Moderator, TravelBuzz.

July 5 traveling from Dulles to LAX with my husband and 19 month old daughter on a full flight my family suffered a horrible experience.
Midway through the flight my daughter required a diaper change, at which point we took our baby to the restroom only to discover there was no changing table. Directly outside of the restroom was a flat padded bench that was not in use, which made sense as the logical place to do a quick change. As I was preparing the area, a stewardess came flying around the corner saying that I was not allowed to use the bench that it was against FAA policy, I looked at her confused and asked where to change my baby. The response I got was something no parent or caretaker should receive, she told me my two options were the top of a toilet seat (which at this time was clogged with feces) or the bathroom floor! I was appalled/hurt to say the least and refused to do either. Her compromise to me was giving me a trashbag to lay on the floor outside of the bathroom.
I am posting this in hopes for a change. It breaks my heart to think of the bacteria and worse our precious babies could be exposed to.I find this post hysterically funny, especially in combination with:

I'm sorry that I did not make it clear in my OP that I DO carry around a clean cushy blanket to use for public changes. She is a toddler and would not fit on a toilet seat, nor will I put her on on my seat on a packed flight. I WAS prepared for a quick, clean change. If you think by quickly changing my young child on a bench on her blankie over a filthy toilet or urine soaked floor, or the seat of my packed flight is wrong, then I have to question your judgement.How did the kid reach 19 months of age without ever having to be changed in a less than hygienic place before? Why would anyone who cares about germs ever change a diaper on a "clean cushy blanket"? Blankets = absorbent fabric = germ breeding grounds, how about a nice plastic-lined disposable changing pad in the diaper bag? You can get a 12 pack of them for about $5.

Oh, and yes, I have changed many a diaper on an airplane. It really ain't that difficult to do in the loo - which is where diaper changing belongs, even if there is no table. Small kid - diaper pad on the sink counter, bigger kid - standing.

Can yoiu tell me more specifically? What is happening your daughter who did not have diaper change during in-flight. I wasn't sure why they change the policy? You didn't put her in the diaper table. Can you wait for landed in LAX go to family restroom to change her diapers.

When the diaper is full.. and child sits.. then the poop squishes out.. all over the plane..

There may not be too much remorse for us parents having to deal with diaper changes.. but when it starts inconveniencing everyone on board.. i.e. feces management and odors.. I think that's when everyone needs to say stop!.. nip this in the bud..

I have a 5 year old and a 1 year old.. ime.. dirty diaper changed will help everyone..

Same thing happened to us on LAX-HNL and the FAs told us to either change our son at our seats or offered to give us blankets to put on the toilet. Now ya'll know where they have been next time you cuddle up :p

But yeah when I called United to ask which aircraft have changing tables (since up until then we had only flown UA internationally and they always had tables) I was told that no UA domestic aircraft have them (which I later found to be untrue as every UA Airbus I have been on since has had them) and was offered an unsolicited $150 e-cert. Funny thing was that Hawaiian Airlines 717 has changing tables for the 45 minute flights. Seriously how much can it cost to attach a few changing tables.

Same thing happened to us on LAX-HNL and the FAs told us to either change our son at our seats or offered to give us blankets to put on the toilet. Now ya'll know where they have been next time you cuddle up :p

But yeah when I called United to ask which aircraft have changing tables (since up until then we had only flown UA internationally and they always had tables) I was told that no UA domestic aircraft have them (which I later found to be untrue as every UA Airbus I have been on since has had them) and was offered an unsolicited $150 e-cert. Funny thing was that Hawaiian Airlines 717 has changing tables for the 45 minute flights. Seriously how much can it cost to attach a few changing tables.

Funny.. we fly to KOA.. hop to OGG via Hawaiian as well..

We just change at our seats if we have to.. but we seemed to be getting planes with change tables lately.. so that's always good..

Even if there were a changing table, a 19 month old won't fit on it. Mine were too big for the airplane changing tables from about 6-8 months on.

I learned to change my babies standing up. They don't even need to stand independently. As soon as they could stand with support, I could change their diaper this way. I recommend doing this at home first. This is super convenient any time you're out in public. No more hunting down changing tables. It's cleaner and getting a toddler to lie down in a strange place can be a challenge that you don't need to face.

I would look for the handicapped lav on aiplanes which has more room.

The F/A jumpseat is not a place for changing diapers. By FAA rules, no one can even sit there (if you see someone allowed in normal clothes they should be off-duty F/A's).

They are very strict about hygiene on airplanes, especially about "human waste". Someone threw up on me once and I couldn't participate in the next meal service, even when I was all cleaned up. Luckily it wasn't even that bad but I had come in contact with it. I could only clean up after and make coffee during.

FAA rules apply to all U.S. companies, including American. Their F/A's would have prevented you from doing this too.

Recently there was a list of the top passenger complaints somewhere on the net and changing diapers in the seat was close to the top.

Sometimes you have to change babies in less-than-ideal circumstances, on the road even more than on airplanes.

If you want to complain to United, you can but don't tell them that you're upset that the F/A's didn't let you use the jumpseat. That's a FAA reg and can't be changed. You can complain about the F/A's conduct and how she spoke to you. You can also complain about the state of the lav and the lack of a baby changer (even though a 19 monther couldn't have used it anyway).

Barring any unknown disability, a 19 month old can usually stand. For my boys, we learned to change them standing up.


I, too, was going to ask this.

I don't want to blame the "victim" here (using the term VERY loosely), but I don't get why standing wasn't an option.

YES, planes should have diaper changing stations, but the OP couldn't have used one even if they did, so I am not quite sure what plan s/he had in mind upon boarding the plane.

I, too, was going to ask this.

I don't want to blame the "victim" here (using the term VERY loosely), but I don't get why standing wasn't an option.

YES, planes should have diaper changing stations, but the OP couldn't have used one even if they did, so I am not quite sure what plan s/he had in mind upon boarding the plane.

We'll depending on the "type" of baggage in the diaper I can see how trying to control it while the child is standing could be an issue. As for when the changing table becomes unusable depends on the child and situation I guess. Our's is generally very cooperative when laying down for a diaper change even if the table is a bit short.

Man up ! Just whip the changing blanket out, find a secluded place, get on with it, and clean up. My experience is that changing a nappy/diaper on any kid means that an invisible total exclusion zone appears and it can be done anywhere with no drama, no fuss, just keep calm and carry on.

Whilst I agree a 19month wouldn't fit on a change table, I am not sure how they would fit on the loo floor either (and have room for someone to change them without the door being opened). I find the loos tiny at the best of times, I am not sure logistically how you manage with another person in there, however small!

Man up ! Just whip the changing blanket out, find a secluded place, get on with it, and clean up. My experience is that changing a nappy/diaper on any kid means that an invisible total exclusion zone appears and it can be done anywhere with no drama, no fuss, just keep calm and carry on.And how exactly do you "clean up" without a sink and trash can? Human waste belongs in the loo, and so does handwashing after diaper changes.

And how exactly do you "clean up" without a sink and trash can? Human waste belongs in the loo, and so does handwashing after diaper changes.

LOL, I am sure you can work it out ! :)

LOL, I am sure you can work it out ! :)

Yeah.. I think after the staff and other passengers understand the feces end of things.. umm fingers..

Everyone will be clearing a path and all of a sudden very accomodating..:eek::)

I was put on this flight by American and will not fly United again!

Until they have the cheapest fare for your desired destination

isn't that how it always works?

back on topic

I still don't see the problem changing in the lav; yes you do your best using the Paper towels to clean up, drop your changing blanket or item down and change the kid. you talk of bacteria etc, you are on a plane, going to/from an airport, you just are in the middle of one big bacteria breeding process to begin with; factor in the bacteria in your kids diaper.. I see no harm no foul on changing on the seat in the lav

Yes I have two kids who have flown with me since they were little

We'll depending on the "type" of baggage in the diaper I can see how trying to control it while the child is standing could be an issue

Nope, not an issue and I have a boy and two girls. No problem BUT you need to try it out at home. Putting the child in the "frisk" position works well with the hands against a wall or whatever. Their hands AND feet and kept busy. Much, much easier than fighting them to stay lying down on a table!

Even if your child doesn't "mind" that the table is "too short", that's not the problem. A 19 month old is too big to even fit on any of those tables. There's nowhere for the legs to hang down. Often too, the ceiling is bending down as well. Toddlers can't be changed on those changing tables, end of story.

As I mentioned earlier, look for the handicapped lav. More room.

in tight spaces.. I bring a package of wipes and a diaper to the lav..

leaving the diaper bag on the seat..

Its a lot easier to have just two items and aim for the change.. then to fumble around with the diaper bag in the lav..

I agree changing on the floor is pretty disgusting but not sure what the alternative is. I would've asked for a blanket (from F) and one or 2 additional trash bags to cover the area. You can't be expected to put your own changer on a urine soaked floor.

It would be good for FAs to receive some guidance on planes without changing tables that is service oriented.

I agree changing on the floor is pretty disgusting but not sure what the alternative is. I would've asked for a blanket (from F) and one or 2 additional trash bags to cover the area. You can't be expected to put your own changer on a urine soaked floor.

It would be good for FAs to receive some guidance on planes without changing tables that is service oriented.

Good tip.. urine infested floor isn't where I would want to change my kid neither..

But a blanket or covering would help the situation..

July 5 traveling from Dulles to LAX with my husband and 19 month old daughter on a full flight my family suffered a horrible experience.
Midway through the flight my daughter required a diaper change, at which point we took our baby to the restroom only to discover there was no changing table. Directly outside of the restroom was a flat padded bench that was not in use, which made sense as the logical place to do a quick change. As I was preparing the area, a stewardess came flying around the corner saying that I was not allowed to use the bench that it was against FAA policy, I looked at her confused and asked where to change my baby. The response I got was something no parent or caretaker should receive, she told me my two options were the top of a toilet seat (which at this time was clogged with feces) or the bathroom floor! I was appalled/hurt to say the least and refused to do either. Her compromise to me was giving me a trashbag to lay on the floor outside of the bathroom.
I am posting this in hopes for a change. It breaks my heart to think of the bacteria and worse our precious babies could be exposed to.

At least it wasn't an international flight across the Atlantic Ocean.

Of airlines that fly across the Atlantic Ocean and are a member of one of the big three global airline alliances, Delta Airlines is the only one to have some flights that don't have baby changing facilities on its planes.

If there is a padded plastic changing pad, in combination with the trash bag provided by the FA, why is it so nasty to change a child on the floor of the lav?

Because it actually is nastier to do so on the floor of the lavatory unless you hog-tie an average sized 19 month old to make sure the child's hands don't touch anything that was already in the lavatory prior to the child and caretaker entering the lavatory.

Most bathrooms on most US airlines' flights don't have a lot of room to stretch out a 19 month old on the floor and have an adult bending down to do what needs to be done.

And at 19 months there is no reason why a diaper change couldn't have been done with the child standing up.

There are reasons why diaper changes being done with the child standing up cannot be done absent a caretaker's willingness to leave a nastier mess than would be the case if the caretaker would change such a child on his/her back.

We'll depending on the "type" of baggage in the diaper I can see how trying to control it while the child is standing could be an issue

Nope, not an issue and I have a boy and two girls.

While that may be your experience, it is not reflective of the experience of all.

Even if your child doesn't "mind" that the table is "too short", that's not the problem. A 19 month old is too big to even fit on any of those tables. There's nowhere for the legs to hang down. Often too, the ceiling is bending down as well. Toddlers can't be changed on those changing tables, end of story.

Most average to above-US average 19-month old children fit well enough on most airplane lavatory tables for things to be handled well for cleaning and diaper substitution purposes. But at least on some of the smaller UA planes, those angled ceilings and the latches for the table may need to be factored into how to deal with the cleaning/changing process in the lavatory.

I agree changing on the floor is pretty disgusting but not sure what the alternative is. I would've asked for a blanket (from F) and one or 2 additional trash bags to cover the area.
The alternative is planning ahead, because not everywhere you go is going to have pristine changing table.

Disposable plastic backed changing pads (http://www.amazon.com/Huggies-Disposable-Changing-8-Count-Packages/dp/B003D7LADI/ref=pd_cp_ba_1) are cheap, don't weigh much and solve a lot of problems.

You can't be expected to put your own changer on a urine soaked floor. Isn't the purpose of a changing pad to deal with "urine soaked" messes? They're washable for a reason, you know, and who would travel with only one changing pad? Blowouts happen, especially with travel related changes in diet and air pressure.

Yeah.. I think after the staff and other passengers understand the feces end of things.. umm fingers..

Everyone will be clearing a path and all of a sudden very accomodating..:eek::)

I'm not sure how you change diapers, but I don't rub my hands in the diaper contents! Unfasten, remove and fold and fasten shut, wipe, wipe into diaper tash bag, rediaper, done! My fingers haven't touched anything nasty, and a baby wipe will get me to a sink without glares of anger from others!

I used to compare changing my son's diaper to changing the hubcap on a moving car; that's how squirmy he was at a certain age. Try doing THAT in a cramped airplane lav.:p

There are reasons why diaper changes being done with the child standing up cannot be done absent a caretaker's willingness to leave a nastier mess than would be the case if the caretaker would change such a child on his/her back.

Changing a toddler standing up is much, much, much cleaner than fighting the child to lie on their back, risking their rolling around, touching other stuff in the restroom, etc. It's cleaner and easier because the legs are planted and I had them put their hands on the wall. They moved less, which usually means less mess!

As long as the parent is used to doing it this way, it should be much cleaner. If they're used to only changing the child lying down, they may find it difficult doing both. You have to adjust to the child as they grow and forcing them to do all changes lying down in public restrooms doesn't usually work.

The A380 is the ONLY plane which had changing tables big enough for a 19 month old. There was no way I could stuff a bigger baby on any of the others.

Changing a toddler standing up is much, much, much cleaner than fighting the child to lie on their back, risking their rolling around, touching other stuff in the restroom, etc.

Not necessarily. There are situations where standing up diaper changes (and involved cleaning) is far messier and less useful for properly cleaning a 19-month old than doing so while the child is on her/his back.

As long as the parent is used to doing it this way, it should be much cleaner.Not necessarily even for those used to it.

You have to adjust to the child as they grow and forcing them to do all changes lying down in public restrooms doesn't usually work.

Ideally.

The A380 is the ONLY plane which had changing tables big enough for a 19 month old. There was no way I could stuff a bigger baby on any of the others.

I've seen many 19-month olds get changed on changing tables on planes other than A380s too. I'm sure the batch of 18-24 month old children whose transport I provided for this year had the majority of their diaper changes on flights -- A380s, 747s, 767s, 757s, and a variety of Airbus single and double aisle flights and even some regional jets -- done on changing tray tables.

Not necessarily. There are situations where standing up diaper changes (and involved cleaning) is far messier and less useful for properly cleaning a 19-month old than doing so while the child is on her/his back.


I'm sure anyone with a child has dealt with legs "turning off" when something is happening the child doesn't like. I can imagine that would be great to have happen with an explosive diaper while doing a stand up changing.

I've seen many 19-month olds get changed on changing tables on planes other than A380s too. I'm sure the batch of 18-24 month old children whose transport I provided for this year had the majority of their diaper changes on flights -- A380s, 747s, 767s, 757s, and a variety of Airbus single and double aisle flights and even some regional jets -- done on changing tray tables.

Personally A321, 747, 717 with zero issues on up to 24 month old child. At around 24 months I noticed the length being a bit short, but the tables were more fine in area and strength to get the job done.

I'm not sure how you change diapers, but I don't rub my hands in the diaper contents! Unfasten, remove and fold and fasten shut, wipe, wipe into diaper tash bag, rediaper, done! My fingers haven't touched anything nasty, and a baby wipe will get me to a sink without glares of anger from others!

Pees.. no problem..

In and out..

The sloppy joes.. well changing on the floor will only squish things out.. I'm 6'5" and when I bend over my stomach gets in the way.. so its finger pickings..

Most of the time I can do a dirty diaper change no problem.. but the sloppy joes.. well, they are just sloppy.. and when they are near leaking and you place the baby's bum on the floor and open the package.. remnants can squish out..

Less chance of that happening while they're standing up because of good old gravity. Much less chance of squishing. Don't bend over. Put them up on the toilet seat. Pinch and close immediately. Away it goes with no rolling around in it which gets really messy with the older ones.

It's all in the technique. You have to try it at home first but once it's down, it's sooooo much easier and cleaner, especially with an oversized son who didn't train till after his 3rd birthday, after the sister arrived (yes, double diaper duty on transatlantics... alone...)

Less chance of that happening while they're standing up because of good old gravity. Much less chance of squishing. Don't bend over. Put them up on the toilet seat. Pinch and close immediately. Away it goes with no rolling around in it which gets really messy with the older ones.

It's all in the technique. You have to try it at home first but once it's down, it's sooooo much easier and cleaner, especially with an oversized son who didn't train till after his 3rd birthday, after the sister arrived (yes, double diaper duty on transatlantics... alone...)

Diaper changes get easier when around 2 going 3.. They just run to you and say poo poo or pee pee..

I think technique.. and speed is the key.. no point dragging out a diaper change more the 15 seconds.. especially for men.:)

I'll be honest, I tried to train my daughter to do standing diaper changes for travel purposes at eclipsepearl's suggestion, and it never really worked for me. Getting the #1 diaper off was easy (forget about dealing with messy #2!), but putting the new diaper back on was always a challenge for me. When we've flown without changing tables, we've been allowed to change her on a trash bag on the floor in front of the FA jumpseats in the back of the plane. We've flown a lot with DD (at least compared to your "average" family) and we've never been forced into a situation by the FAs that I thought was particularly unhygenic or physically impossible. Maybe I'm good at sweet talking... :)

I think technique.. and speed is the key.. no point dragging out a diaper change more the 15 seconds.. especially for men.

So true. I think my husband holds some kind of speed record.

On Continental today and basically there was only enough room for my feet..

CO1020.. How would they expect to change a baby on the floor? There was a change table thankfully..

Yes, it stinks that some of UA's planes do not have changing tables. That's true for some of DL's planes, too. (I don't fly AA enough to know for sure.) Yes, it's tough to change a 19-mo old on a toilet seat, but I assure you I've done it many, many times. A changing pad and sanitary wipes are your friend. It's all part of traveling with a youngster.

I agree with the previous posters that it is quite presumptuous of you to want to change your child on what in all likelihood was the FAs' seat. Moreover, I'm appalled by those that think it's OK to change diapers at the seat (I realize the OP was not advocating that), and would invite them to spend the entirety of their next flight sitting in a well-used lav if they don't see the issue.

Interesting to note that the OP hasn't returned, other than for a brief expression of surprise (and contempt) when virtually no one agreed with her. From this, I make two observations:

1. It speaks highly for FT posters and, particularly, FT parents who don't buy into her nonsense.

2. It is, perhaps, illustrative of the kind of parents one all too often encounters out in the real world.

In any event, I am glad the OP will not be flying UA in the future, and equally glad that FT parents will.

Public diaper changes outside of airline lavs are disgusting, unsanitary and potentially dangerous. If you disagree then I question your judgment.

I just want to be clear: the OP should have changed the baby on the lav floor or on the toilet seat?

I just want to be clear: the OP should have changed the baby on the lav floor or on the toilet seat?I'm not a parent and have no idea what is practical or possible, nor do I have any particular interest in the detailed mechanics of diaper changing. I only know that public diaper changes outside of airline lavs are disgusting, unsanitary and potentially dangerous.

Many experienced parents in this thread have described alternative means for diaper changing that don't involve doing it on seats (whether passenger seats or FA jump seats, i.e. the "padded bench" of the OP). These parents are also, obviously, experienced fliers, like most of us on FT. From these two facts, I conclude that any contention that the only way to change a diaper is in a way that constitutes a nuisance to other passengers and crew and is incorrect.

I'm sorry that I did not make it clear in my OP that I DO carry around a clean cushy blanket to use for public changes. She is a toddler and would not fit on a toilet seat, nor will I put her on on my seat on a packed flight. I WAS prepared for a quick, clean change. If you think by quickly changing my young child on a bench on her blankie over a filthy toilet or urine soaked floor, or the seat of my packed flight is wrong, then I have to question your judgement. I was put on this flight by American and will not fly United again!

Can I request that you also scrap American from your list of carriers too? If you attitude really is that we should have our seats slimed by your child's fecal matter, then I certainly hope you aren't doing it on my flights. :rolleyes:

Perhaps the airlines should provide a change table after all?

OP may not be on the airlines.. but I can assure you that others will be..

to eliminate fecal matter on floor and toilet seat.. best to install one of those change tables on flight.. One installed change table will do wonders..

I'm not a parent and have no idea what is practical or possible,

I don't get it - do you have a solution to suggest?

I don't get it - do you have a solution to suggest?I have a solution to the problem of parents changing their children on seats: don't do it.

I don't know how many times I have to say this: passengers have no right to impose on other passengers. Period. That you have a problem doesn't make it my problem. Solve it yourself. If you can't, don't fly. You don't have the right to expose passengers to a disgusting, unsanitary and potentially dangerous condition, just because you can't figure out a solution.

When the lavs are occupied or hostile to a safe, sanitary change, or even when the "don't get up" lights are on, I will change a diaper on my own lap (kid's head at my knees), as I have done in public places. There are cons, but I think the pros outweigh them. I don't want a child to suffer from sitting in waste longer than is necessary, and no one wants to listen to a dirty child cry...or smell the waste.

My lap has built-in anti-rollover contours and wiggle-alert sensors. Baby is not on the seat, which helps lower the risk of germ transmission both ways (those seats are nasty, mostly because of us adults); I am the changing pad, and my clothes and I get washed regularly...and leave the plane. Danger zone is my torso, and my arms help shield any onlookers...sometimes jamming a safety card along the armrest can help with the appearance of boundaries.

Cleanup involves gel sanitizer and another wipe, if it's even necessary. Of all the changes I've done, I believe I have completed 99 percent without getting any waste on my hands...it's just a practice thing. Luck helps, though.

Standing changes are a great option for #1s, but no, they aren't always the way to keep #2 waste controlled.

Would definitely prefer changing tables to be available all the time, but they just aren't. For every time there has been someone complaining about a child getting changed in the cabin, I can imagine there's been someone needing to use the lav saying, "Why can't they just change the danged baby on the floor/at their seat? I need to go NOW."

And I think much of the stress and tension folk display about this issue is exacerbated by how crowded the planes are to begin with. If you weren't made to sit right on top of us, you'd probably never know we even had a kid with us over all the engine and wind noise. Sigh.


In terms of fecal material getting left behind... I'm puzzled. I know there are blowouts, but they are rare IME, and unless the changer is really oblivious and careless, I can't imagine it getting *everywhere*. I'm sure it has happened, but I would happily rise to a challenge of doing diaper changes in a white cleanroom and having a microbe count done on the surface I used. I don't think it would be cause for alarm.

If a parent sees a poop emergency, I think we know to hightail it to a place with hard, washable surfaces. I have a hard time believing that a controlled change is more of a health hazard than the germs already on our clothing from going to the lav and having clothing touch the walls and possibly the floor... From our shoes brushing our legs when they are crossed. From rotting food particles in the seats and on the floors already. From others coughing or sneezing.


I've never detected a dirty look or heard a complaint about how I've chosen to take care of my child on a plane. Quite the reverse...I've gotten compliments, including times when I have changed a diaper in-cabin.

As for the "don't fly if you don't take care of your business the way I want you to" argument: it works both ways. If you can't stand to have people do things out of your control, don't fly commercial yourself. You've got the same options you leave for the people you don't like...private tran$portation.

Crap, that was long.

ETA: Can't believe that was my first post. Been lurking all this time, and it's poop that lures me out. Ahh, parenthood.

I've never detected a dirty look or heard a complaint about how I've chosen to take care of my child on a plane. Quite the reverse...I've gotten compliments, including times when I have changed a diaper in-cabin.If I'm sitting next to you when you do this, you're going to hear plenty of complaints, as well as directives from the FA about where you should be doing this.

As for the "don't fly if you don't take care of your business the way I want you to" argument:No one has made that argument -- that's your own invention. What I have said is that passengers have no right to impose on other passengers. Anyone who can't figure out how to avoid imposing on other passengers shouldn't fly.

Isn't in an imposition when I don't do things they way you think they ought to be done? (And I thought *someone* upthread had said pulled out the "just don't fly" argument, but if it wasn't you, and if it wasn't this thread, well...it's said and done. Just ignore.)

For both our sakes, I hope we never sit beside each other. I'm sure the FAs would hope for the same, if they knew us. (I'm related to and friends with some, so I've heard the inside line on complaints IRL, too, not just from other FTers.)

Isn't in an imposition when I don't do things they way you think they ought to be done?Hunh? Why would I care how you do things, as long as you don't impose on me?

(And I thought *someone* upthread had said pulled out the "just don't fly" argument, but if it wasn't you, and if it wasn't this thread, well...it's said and done. Just ignore.)I said it several times in this thread.

For both our sakes, I hope we never sit beside each other. I'm sure the FAs would hope for the same, if they knew us. (I'm related to and friends with some, so I've heard the inside line on complaints IRL, too, not just from other FTers.)I'll agree that we shouldn't be seatmates. And regardless of your friends and relations, you may be surprised at the attitude of FAs towards people who think its fine to change their kid at their seat.

Standing changes are a great option for #1s, but no, they aren't always the way to keep #2 waste controlled.

Totally not true and this is not a valid excuse for changing a child in your seat.

If you're going to fly, and if your child is too large for the changing table, you need to practice changing him or her at home first. Don't try it once and give up. Make an effort. This solves so many problems when outside the home. Too many parents wont face a learning curse (with a lot of things) but a bit of effort goes a long way (and more wipes than you usually use.

I also wouldn't monitor anything by what complaints you personally hear. Often passengers don't want confrontations and will keep quiet, especially on a short flight.

It's actually not worth arguing the point about whether or not to change diapers in the seat. There seem to be parents determined to change their children wherever and whenever they want, even though this was recently listed as one of the biggest pet peeves when flying.

Cleanup involves gel sanitizer and another wipe, if it's even necessary. Of all the changes I've done, I believe I have completed 99 percent without getting any waste on my hands...it's just a practice thing. Luck helps, though.Hand "sanitzer" - the placebo of the masses, and a significant factor in the rise of antibiotic resistant bacteria.


And I think much of the stress and tension folk display about this issue is exacerbated by how crowded the planes are to begin with. If you weren't made to sit right on top of us, you'd probably never know we even had a kid with us over all the engine and wind noise. Sigh.Oh, nice dump off! Everything is the airline's fault!


In terms of fecal material getting left behind... I'm puzzled. I know there are blowouts, but they are rare IME, and unless the changer is really oblivious and careless, I can't imagine it getting *everywhere*. I'm sure it has happened, but I would happily rise to a challenge of doing diaper changes in a white cleanroom and having a microbe count done on the surface I used. I don't think it would be cause for alarm. You "don't think it would be cause for alarm" and so we should believe you? I'm parent who has done many diaper changing, including in a hospital situation (as staff) where we used a method set out by the infection control department, and I call BS on your speculation about the risk of microorganism contamination from your method, and on your comments on germs in the paragraph below.

I have a hard time believing that a controlled change is more of a health hazard than the germs already on our clothing from going to the lav and having clothing touch the walls and possibly the floor... From our shoes brushing our legs when they are crossed. From rotting food particles in the seats and on the floors already. From others coughing or sneezing. If you don't know the difference between fecal microorganisms, such as giardia, which is more common in the diaper-wearing age group than in adults, and decomposing bacteria as might be in "rotting food particles in the seats" and airborne pathogens which would be those found in sneezes or coughs - and how these pathogens are transmitted between hosts, then I suggest you refrain from writing about them, because your comments above are nonsense.


I've never detected a dirty look or heard a complaint about how I've chosen to take care of my child on a plane. Quite the reverse...I've gotten compliments, including times when I have changed a diaper in-cabin. Again, I call BS on the thought that someone would "compliment" you on changing a diaper at the seat. Whether or not you understand the health care issues related to the action, it's disgusting to do it in a public place.

Crap I'd agree with that summation of your post.

There's lots to clarify and respond to, but the main one I don't want to let stand is that hand sanitizer is responsible for antibiotic resistance. Alcohol-based gels without antibiotic agents --what I use-- cannot cause antibiotic resistance.

A second point, only implied in my OP, but I see that it needs to be explicit: I do not insist on changing at my seat if a changing table is accessible.

I will sort through the seemingly purposeful misunderstandings in some of the above responses before I respond. If it's even worth it. If the thread gets really old, I for one won't help bump it!

A second point, only implied in my OP, but I see that it needs to be explicit: I do not insist on changing at my seat if a changing table is accessible.No, you insist on changing at your seat if a changing table is not accessible.

Are you for real? Stop being a "victim" and take a parenting class.

If I do nothing (changing the kid).. It'll help to be polite..

Problem is that the sloppy joe will eventually leak.. and cause a fecal smell in the cabin..

I agree with OP. Planes should have changing tables or somewhere reasonable and safe to change a child.

I agree with OP. Planes should have changing tables or somewhere reasonable and safe to change a child.Who disagrees with that?

I agree with OP. Planes should have changing tables or somewhere reasonable and safe to change a child.

Some of the smaller planes don't even have lavs. Someone did ask me about this once and I simply told them to ask the F/A's what they should do.

I agree that changing tables should be in every lav but the airlines would argue that it's one more thing to inspect and clean before every flight.

For the record, other passengers usually let us skip the line and enter the lav with a changing table before the others.

Of intercontinental flights by US airlines, only DL has some planes flying between continents without baby changing facilities.

Some of the smaller planes don't even have lavs. Someone did ask me about this once and I simply told them to ask the F/A's what they should do.

.

Wow, planes not having lavs..

Are these commercial airlines? I've never been on a commercial airplane that didn't have a lav..

Some of the smaller planes don't even have lavs. Someone did ask me about this once and I simply told them to ask the F/A's what they should do.



I'd really enjoy knowing what the answer was.

The A380 is the ONLY plane which had changing tables big enough for a 19 month old. There was no way I could stuff a bigger baby on any of the others.

I've never had any trouble changing my 2-year-old on the changing tables in JAL planes (747 and 777).

I've never had any trouble changing my 2-year-old on the changing tables in JAL planes (747 and 777).

Babies and toddlers differ in size and weight within a variety range of ages..

I'd really enjoy knowing what the answer was.

They were shown a corner, near but not on the jumpseats. The F/A put a plastic bag on the floor, discarded of it right away and let the passenger wash their hands in the galley.

The point is to let the crew know so they can do whatever their hygiene procedure is and to get rid of it as quickly as possible.

I personally have never flown on a plane without lavs but I understand that this is only on really tiny aircraft which fly only really short hops and don't have meal services.

We fly the 747 and 777 a lot and no way could I even put an 18 month old on those changing tables, let alone a 2 year old. Often the sloping ceiling is the problem. Our family is tall and my kids are very active. Luckily I managed the standing-changing routine because two were really late trainers.

I'm a fan of the stand-up change myself. I don't think my boy lay down for a change at all after 9 months. And when he was smaller I managed several changes on my lap in the lav when there wasn't a changing table available.

Most babies are robust enough to handle a variety of germs, given the dreck that they all get to their mouth at one time or another.

Babies and toddlers differ in size and weight within a variety range of ages..

Indeed. Even for children aged 18-24 months, the overwhelming majority are going to be in the range where they fit on changing tables that are in the wide-body planes flying across the Atlantic or Pacific for airlines that are amongst the big three global airline alliances.

Wow, planes not having lavs..

Are these commercial airlines? I've never been on a commercial airplane that didn't have a lav..

I've been on some scheduled commercial passenger flights. But no such flight of mine was ever in the air for more than a couple of hundred miles or two before landing.

They were shown a corner, near but not on the jumpseats. The F/A put a plastic bag on the floor, discarded of it right away and let the passenger wash their hands in the galley.

The point is to let the crew know so they can do whatever their hygiene procedure is and to get rid of it as quickly as possible.

I personally have never flown on a plane without lavs but I understand that this is only on really tiny aircraft which fly only really short hops and don't have meal services.

Thanks for the info. I think that my body would, um, lock up under those circumstances and I'd wait until I arrived...

Indeed. Even for children aged 18-24 months, the overwhelming majority are going to be in the range where they fit on changing tables that are in the wide-body planes flying across the Atlantic or Pacific for airlines that are amongst the big three global airline alliances.

For the minority of bablie who don't fit.. probably oversized children..

I guess the other options talked about in the thread, including the floor..

I've been on some scheduled commercial passenger flights. But no such flight of mine was ever in the air for more than a couple of hundred miles or two before landing.

So based on a typical 500 miles per hour.. I'm guessing the flight is around 20 minutes in the air plus taxiing time..

I wonder what would happen in the case of an emergency?:eek:

So based on a typical 500 miles per hour.. I'm guessing the flight is around 20 minutes in the air plus taxiing time..


Most such flights of mine didn't fly anywhere near 500 mph and probably had speeds closer to half of that. Sub-1 hour flights from boarding to disembarkation would characterize all such flights of mine.

I wonder what would happen in the case of an emergency?:eek:

In case of an emergency, probably the same thing as is done on some military-operated and private flights that have no permanent bathroom fixtures. Desperately try to hold it in; piddle packs, diapers or somethings that function as a near-equivalent to the same; an in-flight (re)movable potty -- like one for toddlers but bigger; and things along those lines that either collect the urine/excrement on person, in an object on person or in an object that can be retrieved and disposed of readily.

I'm sure desperate diaper changes are rare on these small aircraft but one poster described the above. I'm sure the adults were well warned that this was the situation before boarding.

When I mean that 18 month olds wont fit on most airplane changing tables, I'm talking lying down. Those tables are tiny so be warned! Center lavs are better because an older child can stand up on the table and be changed in that position.

Most such flights of mine didn't fly anywhere near 500 mph and probably had speeds closer to half of that. Sub-1 hour flights from boarding to disembarkation would characterize all such flights of mine.



In case of an emergency, probably the same thing as is done on some military-operated and private flights that have no permanent bathroom fixtures. Desperately try to hold it in; piddle packs, diapers or somethings that function as a near-equivalent to the same; an in-flight (re)movable potty -- like one for toddlers but bigger; and things along those lines that either collect the urine/excrement on person, in an object on person or in an object that can be retrieved and disposed of readily.

Bit archaic on emergencies.. Seems like these type of flights are on the phase out..

Seems like maybe tubes on emergency connected would be in order.. I wonder how the #2 is handled?:D I see diapers for men and women are now being sold all over the place.. perhaps more common place as a result of no washrooms on some commercial flights?
I'm sure desperate diaper changes are rare on these small aircraft but one poster described the above. I'm sure the adults were well warned that this was the situation before boarding.

When I mean that 18 month olds wont fit on most airplane changing tables, I'm talking lying down. Those tables are tiny so be warned! Center lavs are better because an older child can stand up on the table and be changed in that position.

Gotta grab both legs by one hand.. knees bent.. and do the wipe and change as the toddler is scrunched up.. Being doing that today as we speak..

When I mean that 18 month olds wont fit on most airplane changing tables, I'm talking lying down. Those tables are tiny so be warned! Center lavs are better because an older child can stand up on the table and be changed in that position.

You've said this many times as if it is fact and applicable to children in general, but I've never had any trouble changing my average-sized 2-year-old on an airplane lav changing table (lying down).

Maybe it is not possible to change your child on an airplane changing table, but perhaps your experience cannot be generalized to everyone else's children.

Mine preferred to stand up (as soon as they could stand), so I did it in the lav without using the changing board.

I did remember once I was on an old aircraft without changing board, and I changed my 4 months old on our seats (I knew it wasn't nice but we tried not to let anyone see as we had a whole row). We were fast and I don't think anyone realised until we have done it ane ready to dispose the soiled diaper (I actually asked the crew with a soiled diaper). Then we heard an announcement saying that the crew has a board that can be attached in the lav.

I have been flying quite a few times and that was the first time there was no changing table in lav. I guess Europe is a more children friendly place.

The 1st kid you change on your seat. The 2nd on the changing table. The 3d you don't change at all until you arrive.

You've said this many times as if it is fact and applicable to children in general, but I've never had any trouble changing my average-sized 2-year-old on an airplane lav changing table (lying down).

Maybe it is not possible to change your child on an airplane changing table, but perhaps your experience cannot be generalized to everyone else's children.

My child is oversized.. but when I have my child on the change table, I grab both legs in one hand and have them bend their knees on every change while lying flat.. I suppose that is one method to get the child on the small change table..

One should think some rulemakers never had kids!

One should think some rulemakers never had kids!
Are you going through all the travel-with-kids threads and posting this? I'm not sure what your point is, particularly with respect to a thread that has been dormant for some time, but why would you think rulemakers would have to have kids (or, worse, why would you assume that everyone has, had or will have kids)?

Are you going through all the travel-with-kids threads and posting this? I'm not sure what your point is, particularly with respect to a thread that has been dormant for some time, but why would you think rulemakers would have to have kids (or, worse, why would you assume that everyone has, had or will have kids)?

I think that someone may have had too much coffee today, or is trying to achieve some sort of target or goal? :confused: My response in one of the other threads on this particular subject holds true here as well.

Ah, it's August 15th - that may have something to do with the responses.

I think that someone may have had too much coffee today, or is trying to achieve some sort of target or goal? :confused: My response in one of the other threads on this particular subject holds true here as well.

Ah, it's August 15th - that may have something to do with the responses.Beware the ides of August? ;)

Beware the ides of August? ;)

Mariä Himmelfahrt as well as apparently a big day for some on FT! All of which has not much to do with the original subject matter (although in my experience LH pursers are especially cutting at dealing with in seat diaper changes :D ) but may explain the patterns of some posters today.

One should think some rulemakers never had kids!

I think that is a sentiment sometimes shared by parents..

But one could never know, unless talking to a rulemaker themselves..:eek:

You've said this many times as if it is fact and applicable to children in general, but I've never had any trouble changing my average-sized 2-year-old on an airplane lav changing table (lying down).

Maybe it is not possible to change your child on an airplane changing table, but perhaps your experience cannot be generalized to everyone else's children.

It also depends on the willingness of the child to lie down in a strange place. I'm not good at forcing my children into this position and mine are very active. If you have an undersized, very placid child, perhaps you can manage but other parents deserved to be warned that lying a toddler down is not always a practical idea. Changing standing up is easy and a good solution for a lot of us!

It also depends on the willingness of the child to lie down in a strange place. I'm not good at forcing my children into this position and mine are very active. If you have an undersized, very placid child, perhaps you can manage but other parents deserved to be warned that lying a toddler down is not always a practical idea. Changing standing up is easy and a good solution for a lot of us!

I never thought of this angle before..

Perhaps little children do get freaked out in unfamilar places.. I'll keep a watch out for that..