Miles & More (Lufthansa, Austrian, Swiss, and other partners) - canceled flight with missed follow up flight ....

Yesterday ( 08.June ) the 6 pm flight DUS-CDG LH 3224 was cancelled (due to a tech. aircraft problem .
Starting from gate the right engine already made very loud strange sound.
The captain decided to stop in the end of the green in a parking position.
20 minutes waiting until some technicans came.
30 minuter waiting during them check the engine.
15 minutes captain said we start again.
Sound still there ( even more ) and captain decided to cancel the flight
again roll back to outside parking another 10 minutes
Then it took 30 minutes !!! until them got organized a bus to take all pax back to arrival. Everyone had to pick up luggage and should go after that to ticketing for rebookings.
Aprox 2h. and 10m later them start to rebook people.

We 2 adult + INF 19month were booked
DUS-CDG with LH in business and onward to BKK with TG in first class.
Specially booked this connection because of suite F class and nightflight for the baby.
Anyhow the backoffice very incompetent, not was able to find anything for the same day and only want to book us on an alternative flight with O class, which I denied. If LH cause the problem them have to book one in any available F class.
I asked them to book me via LON/SIN on SQ because I want a suite ( which we also booked on TG bevore ) . LH only offered TG in 2 days via Paris again, or LH tomorrow.
Them not offered any compensation, even not mentioned about.
I understand EU regulation 261/2004
* forced them to inform customers about them rights
* hand them an information
* offer them in this case 600 Euro cash ( or 1200 voucher ) per pax

nothing of what them did.
Any experience here ?
One friend of mine already mentioned, them never pay out, without someone go to court with them.

They are supposed to hand you an info sheet about 261/04 in such cases with a request for you to contact customer relations to sort it out. AFAIR LH never handed out cash comp on the spot in the past 7 years.

Also if you are picky about the alternative offered (ie refuse LH tomorrow but only to fly via XXX and with carrierr YY) you pretty much provided them with a excuse to get out of their obligations. They have to offer you next possible available transportation in the booked class. F is the key, not TG F or SQ F. So make sure you word your complaint appropriately.

Some discussion about missed connections and EU261/2004 here:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/miles-more-lufthansa-austrian-swiss-other-partners/1219896-compensation-delayed-flight-missed-connection.html

In short, unless you take your case to the ECJ you are unlikely to get anything (though I suspect in many cases if you take them to court LH may settle to avoid the additional costs. Even with the ECJ Sturgeon ruling, a county court in Hamburg ruled last year that technical defects were force majeur and no compensation should be provided (just duty of care and next available flight).

bertheike, so what did you do in the end? Take TG in two days? Or did you decide that staying in DUS is better than flying LH F the next day or TG F the day after? :confused:

If you would have booked a ticket in a suites fare class, as it is available on SQ, then you would have been fully justified, however if they didn't offer to book you in a paid fare class, since there was O available, you can't do much about it.

They still owe you money for getting you to your destination more than 2 hours later than scheduled.

[QUOTE=bertheike;

Any experience here ?
One friend of mine already mentioned, them never pay out, without someone go to court with them.[/QUOTE]

Here is an account of something similar from the UK.

http://flightmole.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1122

Maybe LH like their passengers to take them to court short of any form of attempt to compromise short of court process?

A court in a particular jurisdiction might decide that obliging a passenger with an ostensibly legitimate grievance to bring a dispute before a court was an unneccessary burden upon the court's own resources.

That court might look to its own existing rules of procedure to deter unneccessary burden upon that valuable resource.

To make it short,
Them not willing to offer anything else than O class ( even F on other *aliance was available ).
We than choose LH DUS-FRA-BKK for today
Ticketing prommissed it's a new F config ( stupid , them only have 1 or 2 747's with new config, and this never fly to BKK ).
Them only block 8 seats on every 747 since last week.
Them not informed anything about EU regulations , nore them hand out a copy of that.
Them offered a Hotel in DUS or Taxi rt. voucher, ( I choosed the Taxi ).

So far, in 4 h we will drive again to DUS and I will ask them about EU regulation.
Any experience about an INF ticket ? Has the same rights or not ?

just want to give an update.
Next day we arrive well 2h. ahead departure in DUS.
I went to the first sales counter and told them about the unregularies the day bevore. Ask for a claimdocument and some infos about EU regulations and them promt hand over the requested things. She said them now only pay up to 600 Euro per pax ( but also for infants !!! ), but not anymore the double amount in LH vouchers. So I asked, who in the world will take LH vouchers over cash, if it is the same amount.
Now the 6 pm flight DUS-FRA was cancelled, and our 7.05 pm flight delayed more than 1 h., for us not dramatic as we had more than 3 h. in FRA.
But the staff on this aircraft together with the backoffice in FRA was much better prpaired than the day bevore. Them already rebooked people with missed connection in FRA and staff picked them up in FRA at the gate ( that`s how it should be " normaly" but I think, this only works in FRA/MUC and not in province airport DUS.
Anyhow, we went to the FCT had a nice dinner and after the flight to BKK was nice and quiet. Every 8 pax had 2 seats, the windowseat with a matrass for sleeping and the aisle seat. So very nice if travelling with an infant, which could sleep next to us.
Now only have to contact LH CS to claim back 1800 Euro ( 3*600), let's see how them will response ? :D

So LH F (old configuration with 8 seats) is the way to go with infants!
(I hope word doesn't spread on this ...)

So LH F (old configuration with 8 seats) is the way to go with infants!
(I hope word doesn't spread on this ...)

This was my thinking as well when the OP first posted about the offer of FRA-BKK, that the bed (even seat-bed) adjacent to a parent's seat would be ideal, maybe better than a 77W suite.

This was my thinking as well when the OP first posted about the offer of FRA-BKK, that the bed (even seat-bed) adjacent to a parent's seat would be ideal, maybe better than a 77W suite.
The first agent, who offered the via FRA connection did not mention about a 8 seat configuration. And if you compare the 16 seat config, the TG suite is by far better than the LH style ! If you get the 2 middle suites on the 77W, you can close the 2 slidingdoors, and the little one can move around without the chance to run away. Also the seat itselve is far better not to speak about entertainment. The only thing better with LH is the FCT in FRA.
*** And yes, also people with infants travel in first class ! I did it with my first 2 sons ( now already nearly 16 and 18y old and some of the youngest SEN's with 2y age ). And now with our youngest 19 month old and another one comming soon in AUG/SEP . :p

j.........Now only have to contact LH CS to claim back 1800 Euro ( 3*600), let's see how them will response ? :D

sent an email 11.June to feedback.Germany@dlh.de to claim the EU compensation. Not any response yet, even not " we received your email......". Did I sent to the wrong email ? If someone know pl. help out. Thanks.

I had a similar problem last year. I had a paid ticket from LCY to FRA connecting in FRA on a award ticket in F (with LH). My LCY got cancelled and because of earlier snow related problems they said they could not rebook me on any of the other flights leaving LCY or LHR that day (the other 3 flights from LCY departed on time to FRA). In fact I was only offered flight a new flight in 3 days. When I asked about my connecting flight ex FRA with LH, I was told I could rebook for the standard 50 EUR penalty if there would be seats available (which they could not offer only waitlist!!). So LH not only refused to rebook me nor did they offer to pay compensation but also wanted to charge me for rebooking my connection flight that they made me miss. As I had booked/paid for hotel, onward connecting, I decided in the end to drive from London to Frankfurt not to miss my holiday. When I contacted LH, I got nothing: no compensation, no reimbursement for my travel expenses,..
So I m interested to hear if you would have any more luck

I had a similar problem last year. I had a paid ticket from LCY to FRA connecting in FRA on a award ticket in F (with LH). My LCY got cancelled and because of earlier snow related problems they said they could not rebook me on any of the other flights leaving LCY or LHR that day (the other 3 flights from LCY departed on time to FRA). In fact I was only offered flight a new flight in 3 days. When I asked about my connecting flight ex FRA with LH, I was told I could rebook for the standard 50 EUR penalty if there would be seats available (which they could not offer only waitlist!!). So LH not only refused to rebook me nor did they offer to pay compensation but also wanted to charge me for rebooking my connection flight that they made me miss. As I had booked/paid for hotel, onward connecting, I decided in the end to drive from London to Frankfurt not to miss my holiday. When I contacted LH, I got nothing: no compensation, no reimbursement for my travel expenses,..
So I m interested to hear if you would have any more luck

I'm afraid to say that IMHO there is nothing Lufthansa should have done differently in your case as you were booked on two different tickets, ie. your award ticket was completely separate. I do understand your frustration but dont believe Lufthansa will be coming your way at all. That is why I always try and avoid traveling longhaul on multiple tickets.

I agree wth Oli20. Your case is completely different due to separate bookings. This is also the reason why you have no recourse against LH - LH was under no duty to rebook your award ticket.

That's still not answer my question. Is the emailaddress I used the correct one ? Or do I have to contact someone else in this matter?
Or should I immediately go by an advocate ? Nothing to lose as this pays my insurance.

PS I also think the issue from the other poster is different, because booked in 2 PNR`s and weather/snow related.

writing an email won't work you have to fill out the customer relations form here:

http://www.lufthansa.com/de/en/Feedback?feedbackType=FBCA

To which category would you like to give us your feedback?* : 'complaint'

Please select a reason for your feedback*: flight ops and irreg

That should file the complaint correctly. You can add additional passengers to the complaint there.

I agree wth Oli20. Your case is completely different due to separate bookings. This is also the reason why you have no recourse against LH - LH was under no duty to rebook your award ticket.

FYI, I did not ask LH to rebook my award ticket for free but I wanted compensation (about 200 euro as per EU regulation not 600 EUR as in your case but still enough to cover the rebooking fee) as LH had cancelled my flight (IMHO not weather related as the other LH operated flights ex LCY left as per the schedule and it was the only flight that got cancelled/delayed that day ex LCY but probably operational related as LH probably wanted to use the plane to collect stranded passengers elsewhere).

LH could not rebook me on any of the other flights LH (or any other carrier) operated so I believe I was entitled to compensation for the LCY=>FRA ticket as I did arrive with more than 12 hours delay at my final destination (being Frankfurt).

Not only did LH refuse to offer me an alternative flight (even as Senator) and pay me compensation, they asked me, to add to the insult, a rebooking fee for my flight ex Frankfurt.
If the flight from LCY got cancelled because of weather problems in Frankfurt, I was appalled that I could not use the same excuse to rebook my flight ex Fra.

writing an email won't work you have to fill out the customer relations form here:

http://www.lufthansa.com/de/en/Feedback?feedbackType=FBCA

To which category would you like to give us your feedback?* : 'complaint'

Please select a reason for your feedback*: flight ops and irreg

That should file the complaint correctly. You can add additional passengers to the complaint there.
Thank's for the Link,
used it and filled out the form with an add word.doc ( copy my emails ).
not received the confirmationmail ( also checked spamfilter )
also it was not possible to add BD FFno's, system responded it's not a valid M&M number, even in the form them ask also about FFno's from other *aliance members.

writing an email won't work you have to fill out the customer relations form here:

http://www.lufthansa.com/de/en/Feedback?feedbackType=FBCA

To which category would you like to give us your feedback?* : 'complaint'

Please select a reason for your feedback*: flight ops and irreg

That should file the complaint correctly. You can add additional passengers to the complaint there.

first Emai sent to feedback.germany@dlh.de 11.June
reminder sent to same Email 14.June
filed claim fro link above 15th. June and got the automatic response email
from feedback@lufthansa-crm.com with the following
Sehr geehrter Herr bertheike,

herzlichen Dank für Ihre Nachricht an die Deutsche Lufthansa AG.

Wir haben Ihr Anliegen unter der Feedback ID xxxxxxxx gespeichert und an die
entsprechende Stelle zur Bearbeitung weitergeleitet. Unser Ziel ist es, Ihre
Anfrage schnellstmöglich zu bearbeiten. Aktuell verzeichnen wir einen erhöhten
Eingang von Anfragen und bitten Sie, von einer weiteren E-mail mit dem gleichen
Anliegen abzusehen. Vielen Dank.

Antworten zu den häufigsten Fragen finden Sie auch im Internet im Bereich
Hilfe & Kontakt" auf www.lufthansa.com.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen

Deutsche Lufthansa AG
Kundendialog


Dies ist eine automatisch generierte e-mail Antwort. Der Absender nimmt keine
e-mails entgegen. Für weitere Nachrichten nutzen Sie bitte die entsprechenden
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After that nothing.
Any experience how long them need to answer ?

After that nothing.
Any experience how long them need to answer ?

Without joking, LH can easily take 4 weeks before you will get a reply. Sending a follow up E-Mail after a few days or even 2 weeks is futile.

+1. If you keep sending follow up mails you just slow down the process as it opens another ticket that most probably is not associated with the original and gets processed again.

Without joking, LH can easily take 4 weeks before you will get a reply. Sending a follow up E-Mail after a few days or even 2 weeks is futile.
May be LUFTHANSA misunderstand the passanger rights ! People not begging for something, them have the right to get a response within an acceptable businness time, and that's defenetly not after 4 weeks. I will wait 3 more days, and if them not react, I do it with an advocate. Have a legal cost insurance which will pay for this case ( them already confirmed ). And in the end LH even will have to reimburse them.
It is a shame LH even not offer a link on them website to claim things like this. Them only offer "compliment & critic", but should defenetly also have a link for "complaints/compensation" regarding passanger rights, or them so conceited them be so perfect, that them not need this one !?

I agree wth Oli20. Your case is completely different due to separate bookings. This is also the reason why you have no recourse against LH - LH was under no duty to rebook your award ticket.

No obligation, no duty, true. But you might think an airline could see some sense in behaving with a generous spirit when dealing with a commercially important passenger. But of course, this is Lufthansa.

TAP, Lufthansa's country cousin, accommodated me in a very similar situation. The gate agent at LIS called her supervisor, saying "he's one of ours" and everything turned out fine. I'm now TAP's friend for life!

No obligation, no duty, true. But you might think an airline could see some sense in behaving with a generous spirit when dealing with a commercially important passenger. But of course, this is Lufthansa.

TAP, Lufthansa's country cousin, accommodated me in a very similar situation. The gate agent at LIS called her supervisor, saying "he's one of ours" and everything turned out fine. I'm now TAP's friend for life!
That's true, some airlines do a much better job in customer service.
Last christmas my son's were booked DUS(LX)-ZRH(TG)-BKK on an BD award tix in i/O and the LX feeder was cancelled, really due to weather (snow ) reasons.
I watched the situation from Thailand and called LH as them be handling LX in Germany. No help from this side even thought both LX and BD belong to LH group. The answer I got " them should drive back home, because all flights in O for the next 2 or 3 days leaving from Europe are anyhow sold out and them could not be rebooked.
As it was early morning in Europe I called LX in Zwizerland ( was connected with an agent in Southafrica callcenter ), she helpfully noted my number and called me back ( rerouted them QKL(LH) train-FRA(LX)-ZRH(LX)-BKK ) and issued new tickets on LX stock in C/F instead of I/O.
I called the taxi them sit in and let them bring to QKL trainstation. LX did a very good job ^

just want to give an update.
No answer for 4 weeks.
Then I gave it to my advocat. Him sent a letter 11.July and them answered 14.JUL
with the following letter.

http://i1232.photobucket.com/albums/ff371/router2323/Lufthansa_Seite_1.jpg
http://i1232.photobucket.com/albums/ff371/router2323/Lufthansa_Seite_2.jpg

just to give another update.
The case went to court, and 2 weeks ago the court terminated a first appointment for early december. Some days ago LH's advocates now called my advocate and offered 1350 Euro ( sharing cost 2/3 to 1/3 ), if we not go onward ( we asked for 1800 Euro ).
I think them never would offer a penny, if them see a chance to win.
I think not to accept, but my spouse meant to offer them 1500 Euro and 5/6 to 1/6 sharing costs and let's see if them accept that ?

=======

And just a day later already got the OK, them will pay the 1500 ++, I just wonder why them always wait until court terminations ? Isn't it cheaper to pay the $$ customers are entitled to ?

So typical LH - thank you very much for the Update & Congratulations...
The sad point is, LH still stole your time by not rerouting you and by making you go the stony way via the court. And most likely paying now still saves them $$$ compared to the rerouting in C/F on another carrier as they should have done. But who pays 20k$ for last minute F tickets if you cannot be sure to get reimbursed...