TalkBoard Topics - Suggestion: Allow post counts in Omni PR

I understand the issue of post padding, but all those threads are in OMNI and PR has for the most parts been a reasonable debate amongst one another.. IF the Good m/a/e thread in Community can count towards ones post count then PR posts should be as well… I have no problems with that thread or any thread which is serves as a post padding thread to some or a general hello amongst members… But when someone has 1000 plus posts in that thread, it pretty much looks like it’s a sanctioned padding thread and where as the threads of same nature in Omni doesn’t count..

Now that Omni is restricted to new members you can't use this as an excuse to still disable post counts with the fear of noobs running wild.. I ask the TB take a considerate look at allowing post counts in OMNI, if not in OMNI perhaps atleast in PR.

IF the Good m/a/e thread in Community can count towards ones post count then PR posts should be as well…

I agree with this point of view. If you can post "good morning" and get credit for it, a couple paragraphs in OMNI or OMNI/PR should also count.

It's a silly idea. :rolleyes:

dh

I agree with this point of view. If you can post "good morning" and get credit for it, a couple paragraphs in OMNI or OMNI/PR should also count.

I don't see it happening anytime soon. If they will ever reactivation the post count in OMNI again. Unfortunately, OMNI/PR the post count is no longer existed. If they don't considering to reinstating the post count in OMNI/PR again. Maybe there is forever.

I agree. If FT continues to permit the lounge threads, where I know that at least 1 person has earned an evangalist title just by posting good morning or what he had for lunch, then Omni* should count as well.

After all, at least people actually help each other and give information in Omni* - even to those who only show up when they need to know something after having bashed it as "not necessary to FT."

That's core of FT - a community of like minded individuals helping each other.

However, if you want to not count Omni P/R posts, I'm all for that. Political and religious infighting has no relation to the core of FT.

I think it's time to recognize that Omni* has a very useful place on FT and stop making it the redheaded stepchild.



*- Omni = Omni-lite - not P/R

I'm still good with the OMNI's not counting as post counts. As for the lounge threads - I personally don't really see the purpose of them - they're a playground within the playground. But the mods of the forums that have them support them, so there's not much to be done about it...

I'm still good with the OMNI's not counting as post counts. As for the lounge threads - I personally don't really see the purpose of them - they're a playground within the playground. But the mods of the forums that have them support them, so there's not much to be done about it...
Sure there is. The Talk Board controls what forums exist and ask for justification for creating or removing forums. Hence, they're looking at content, and righfully so.

Lounge threads serve absolutely no purpose to this community except to post pad. If anything, they fracture the community. Omni (lite) used to be the place people went to shoot the breeze, and now it's happening in each individual forum with a lounge thread. They have turned into private clubs with thousands of posts in them.

I never would have met two very close friends had it not been for Omni because I never visit the forums they frequent.

I wonder why the mods would want such threads to exist in their forums.

FWIW - I have yet to speak to a person who likes lounge threads. Most feel the same as I do about them. Seems the only people supporting them are those who are active participants.

I think it's time to recognize that Omni* has a very useful place on FT and stop making it the redheaded stepchild.



*- Omni = Omni-lite - not P/R

To truly end the "redheaded stepchild" stigma status of the OMNI("-lite") forum, the restrictions that prohibit the overwhelming majority of FTers from using the forum would have to end.

To truly end the "redheaded stepchild" stigma status of the OMNI("-lite") forum, the restrictions that prohibit the overwhelming majority of FTers from using the forum would have to end.
Are you still on that? What overwhelming majority? They need to be contributors just like in coupon connection. It keeps out the trolls. If you consider the vast majority people who come here and post a few times to get information and then disappear, well, then I can agree. I consider Omni for active participants, not they fly-bys or voyeurs.

As well, I haven't seen you in Omni for years. Did you take a break from FT?

Are you still on that? What overwhelming majority? They need to be contributors just like in coupon connection. It keeps out the trolls. If you consider the vast majority people who come here and post a few times to get information and then disappear, well, then I can agree. I consider Omni for active participants, not they fly-bys or voyeurs.

The lounge threads are open to all -- apparently not "redheaded stepchild" threads in FT forums.

As well, I haven't seen you in Omni for years. Did you take a break from FT?

You are free to do a search of the OMNI threads and elsewhere to research any username you wish to research. You can even search by username -- even mine -- to see how many posts in recent months are in any given forum. You'll find some there too.

The lounge threads are open to all -- apparently not "redheaded stepchild" threads in FT forums.Yeah, but they fracture the community.

You are free to do a search of the OMNI threads and elsewhere to research any username you wish to research. You can even search by username -- even mine -- to see how many posts in recent months are in any given forum. You'll find some there too.Actually, the only threads I've seen in Omni are those moved from TS&S, so I guess that means you didn't take a break. Other than that, I haven't seen you around in ages, except for here. No need for me to do a search, it was just a friendly question.

Good to see you.

Sure there is. The Talk Board controls what forums exist and ask for justification for creating or removing forums. Hence, they're looking at content, and righfully so.

Lounge threads serve absolutely no purpose to this community except to post pad. If anything, they fracture the community. Omni (lite) used to be the place people went to shoot the breeze, and now it's happening in each individual forum with a lounge thread. They have turned into private clubs with thousands of posts in them.

I never would have met two very close friends had it not been for Omni because I never visit the forums they frequent.

I wonder why the mods would want such threads to exist in their forums.

FWIW - I have yet to speak to a person who likes lounge threads. Most feel the same as I do about them. Seems the only people supporting them are those who are active participants.Bolding mine: I agree completely ^ and if one could find a way to not have "lounge thread" posts* not count, I would be all for it but going back to having OMNI posts counting or not counting, I say do not count them.


*Good morning. I had lightly buttered toast with strawberry jam for breakfast and it's raining in San Francisco ;)

Yeah, but they fracture the community.
I am against any treatment of any part of FT as if it is a "redheaded stepchild", which is why I think all OMNI posts should count just like the lounge and community forum posts. The most vibrant communities are going to involve people of different opinions and approaches, some who may linger at the periphery but have a need or interest from time to time to pick up or drop off something useful on main street or somewhere near or far from there -- as should be there entitlement as they are neither prisoners nor foreigners who have been classified as persona non-grata.

Other than that, I haven't seen you around in ages, except for here. No need for me to do a search, it was just a friendly question.

Good to see you.

I thought I had interesting posts in the Hyatt forum as well, but perhaps not as memorable. :o [I don't think there's been a month that has gone by in nearly a decade where I haven't had at least a hundred posts on FT.]

Bolding mine: I agree completely ^ and if one could find a way to not have "lounge thread" posts* not count, I would be all for it but going back to having OMNI posts counting or not counting, I say do not count them.


There is at least one way to do it within the mechanics that are already within the reach of moderators which would not bury the thread: move the threads to a forum where post counts don't count but leave a sticky in the forum that has a link to the lounge thread.

Personally, I wouldn't like that approach because I don't think the best use of a sticky in a forum is do something like this, and it creates an additional step in order to participate in a thread which does serve a purpose on FT whether or not I find much use for it or not.

Yeah, but they fracture the community.



May I ask exactly which one fractures the community? :confused:

OTOH, I posted in the Community lounge as part of my daily activity and its just nice to meet people there. Please note that not all posts are as worthless as people tends to have it said. Its a nice place to just hang out and talk to people not necessarily engaging in other topics.

But on the post count thing, I am kind of hanging in-between fences because I am not sure. On one hand I don't mind, but on the other hand, I like some post counts too.. :rolleyes:

May I ask exactly which one fractures the community? :confused:They all do.
OTOH, I posted in the Community lounge as part of my daily activity and its just nice to meet people there. Please note that not all posts are as worthless as people tends to have it said. Its a nice place to just hang out and talk to people not necessarily engaging in other topics. There was a time this all took place in Omni - the place for OT discussions. People from all programs used to visit there on a daily basis, as part of their daily routine, to shoot the breeze and hang out and talk. This all took place in various threads, most of them not too long.

Now we have single threads in some forums with thousands of posts in them, and it's nearly impossible to go in there and figure out what is being discussed.

As well, some grow by hundreds of posts overnight. Not everyone has the time to sift through that many useless "good morning/evening" posts.

Prior moderation activities and related technologies are not a subject of discussion. If you have any questions about moderation policies, please send a private message to Carol, the Community Director.

They all do.

Then I might have to differ from your viewpoint. :)

There was a time this all took place in Omni - the place for OT discussions. People from all programs used to visit there on a daily basis, as part of their daily routine, to shoot the breeze and hang out and talk. This all took place in various threads, most of them not too long.

As well, some grow by hundreds of posts overnight. Not everyone has the time to sift through that many useless "good morning/evening" posts.

So I would guess we should differentiate which lounges are useless and which ones are not? :rolleyes:

Just a thought.. ;)

Actually, all lounges are useless if they are in the core forums of FT. I believe OT posts are generally deleted or moved to the appropriate forums. Only lounge threads remain.

The content isn't any more useless than some Omni posts - they are just in the wrong place and too many of them together.

No one is going to stop you from shooting the breeze in Omni with all your usual friends and who knows, you may make a few more who don't visit the lounge threads.

And there are more people than you think who don't visit or think they're appropriate in core forums.

They all do.


it is a very convincing argument and unstoppable :rolleyes:

it is a very convincing argument and unstoppable :rolleyes:
:confused:

I think I clearly presented my argument in various posts.

However, I fully expect, and was even warned, that the denizens of these threads would start to come out in full force once word got out their playgrounds might be in jeopardy.

However, if you read through everything here, it's about getting post counts in Omni, which is off-topic, and people getting them for lounge threads, which are even more off-topic (good morning, breakfast, weather) than Omni.

I'm interested in conversing with people who post in all areas of FT, not just those who frequent one particular forum.

No one is going to stop you from shooting the breeze in Omni with all your usual friends and who knows, you may make a few more who don't visit the lounge threads.

And there are more people than you think who don't visit or think they're appropriate in core forums.

you are feeling at ease in Omni and other people are feeling at ease in lounges : that's called choice freedom.
If the count of your posts is so important at your eyes, I could only understand
that you'd ask that lounges' posts don't count anymore, not your affirmation about lounges not being core of FT.

you are feeling at ease in Omni and other people are feeling at ease in lounges : that's called choice freedom.No, it's called moderators making the call to allow OT posts in core forums.

If the count of your posts is so important at your eyes, I could only understand that you'd ask that lounges' posts don't count anymore, not your affirmation about lounges not being core of FT.It is not about my post count or anyone else's. It's about treating all members fairly. Right now, lounge posts count, and most of them are nonsense, yet information-filled Omni posts don't count.

Either make every contribution to FT count or none of them.

However, I can say that the only people who care for lounge threads are those who participate. Anyone else I've spoken with feels they're a total waste and shouldn't be permitted in core forums.

What is the issue of doing exactly the same thing you're doing in lounge threads in Omni? After all, you all click on Community, why can't you click on Omni to find the same thread?

:confused:

I think I clearly presented my argument in various posts.

However, I fully expect, and was even warned, that the denizens of these threads would start to come out in full force once word got out their playgrounds might be in jeopardy.

However, if you read through everything here, it's about getting post counts in Omni, which is off-topic, and people getting them for lounge threads, which are even more off-topic (good morning, breakfast, weather) than Omni.

I'm interested in conversing with people who post in all areas of FT, not just those who frequent one particular forum.

Were you the one who was predicting the end of world's day ?:D
Of course if we don't post in the same threads as yours we're only plebs ;)

No, I was laughing about it :D :D :D

And you're more than welcome to post in any thread. Newbies are always welcome.

You know, I recently had a conversation with a longtime FTer who acknowledged just how much good/accurate information/help is posted in Omni. Far better than you would find in just about any other BBS. The demographics are much higher and often you get an accurate and heartfelt response in minutes from a myriad of people.

The next time you need to buy a major appliance, or fix a leak, or buy jewelry, ask in Omni and I guarantee you'll have a good, honest answer in a very short period of time.

To my eyes, the OMNI forum threads have a higher information/entertainment ratio than the lounge threads; so if anything the OMNI forum posts should be valued at least as much or more than the posts in the lounge forums. Yet the "redheaded stepchild" stigma applies far more to the OMNI posts than to the lounge posts.

So I would guess we should differentiate which lounges are useless and which ones are not? :rolleyes:

Just a thought.. ;)

All the lounge threads are useless. You'll have more fun in Chat. ;)

Actually, all lounges are useless if they are in the core forums of FT.



To my eyes, the OMNI forum threads have a higher information/entertainment ratio than the lounge threads

The tone of this thread is much too serious for the topic. :confused:

dh

They all do.
There was a time this all took place in Omni - the place for OT discussions. People from all programs used to visit there on a daily basis, as part of their daily routine, to shoot the breeze and hang out and talk. This all took place in various threads, most of them not too long.

Now we have single threads in some forums with thousands of posts in them, and it's nearly impossible to go in there and figure out what is being discussed.

As well, some grow by hundreds of posts overnight. Not everyone has the time to sift through that many useless "good morning/evening" posts.
Mary, you and I are in agreement about yet another thing (which really does make me wonder if the end of the world is near! :D). I spent about 10 minutes trying to figure out what was being discussed in the Community Lounge thread a while back, and finally gave up. It seemed far too much like a semi-private club, and with the sheer number of posts each day, I knew that in no time, I'd have no clue what was being discussed again. Sorry, but I don't have time to sift through all of the hundreds of posts there to figure out what is being dicussed each day.
No, it's called moderators making the call to allow OT posts in core forums.

It is not about my post count or anyone else's. It's about treating all members fairly. Right now, lounge posts count, and most of them are nonsense, yet information-filled Omni posts don't count.

Either make every contribution to FT count or none of them.

However, I can say that the only people who care for lounge threads are those who participate. Anyone else I've spoken with feels they're a total waste and shouldn't be permitted in core forums.

What is the issue of doing exactly the same thing you're doing in lounge threads in Omni? After all, you all click on Community, why can't you click on Omni to find the same thread?
^ Either have all posts count, or don't allow the lounge threads.
To my eyes, the OMNI forum threads have a higher information/entertainment ratio than the lounge threads; so if anything the OMNI forum posts should be valued at least as much or more than the posts in the lounge forums. Yet the "redheaded stepchild" stigma applies far more to the OMNI posts than to the lounge posts.
^ I agree with this too. I've gleaned quite a bit of useful information from OMNI, and have participated in many entertaining threads there.

Mary, you and I are in agreement about yet another thing (which really does make me wonder if the end of the world is near! :D). Frightening, no? :D :D :D

No, it's called moderators making the call to allow OT posts in core forums.

It is not about my post count or anyone else's. It's about treating all members fairly. Right now, lounge posts count, and most of them are nonsense, yet information-filled Omni posts don't count.

Either make every contribution to FT count or none of them.

However, I can say that the only people who care for lounge threads are those who participate. Anyone else I've spoken with feels they're a total waste and shouldn't be permitted in core forums.

What is the issue of doing exactly the same thing you're doing in lounge threads in Omni? After all, you all click on Community, why can't you click on Omni to find the same thread?

+1. On this we AGREE! :)

Frightening, no? :D :D :D

:D Yes, rather frightening, since other than roses, we don't seem to agree on much, other than this and images in OMNI. :D

lounge threads, which are even more off-topic (good morning, breakfast, weather)

I'd suggest looking at a couple of different lounge threads.

One I follow is often (though less so these days) what you say. The other two I follow are very much not as you say. One in particular has definitely helped to foster a sense of community--I've met over half of the regular partipants in that one, learned about construction of a new Yogurtland at my local airport, found and bought airline memorabilia and logo swag at huge discounts, converted people to In-N-Out's secret menu, bought vodka for missydarlin, learned about ADS-B (a new replacement for radar-based aircraft positioning), learned about new 3D TV technology, and found a $29 cruise...and that's only four pages. In that thread, I've never seen a post that was simply "Good morning."

Yes, and the rest of us, who may also find that information helpful/useful, can't find it because it's buried in a lounge thread in a forum we don't visit and lost in thousands of posts.

While I disagree on the uselessness of some lounges, many other lounges maybe useless. On the other end, I have no problems of adding OMNI PR posts into the count anyways.

FWIW, I think all posts should count as post counts (unless its flagged, and etc).

No, it's called moderators making the call to allow OT posts in core forums.

It is not about my post count or anyone else's. It's about treating all members fairly. Right now, lounge posts count, and most of them are nonsense, yet information-filled Omni posts don't count.

Either make every contribution to FT count or none of them.

However, I can say that the only people who care for lounge threads are those who participate. Anyone else I've spoken with feels they're a total waste and shouldn't be permitted in core forums.

What is the issue of doing exactly the same thing you're doing in lounge threads in Omni? After all, you all click on Community, why can't you click on Omni to find the same thread?

it seems you are only speaking with people that are thinking like you :confused:
I don't believe that you or I have to decide what is in the core forums or not.

BTW personally I really don't care that lounges' posts could not count anymore : I'm not judging somebody at the number of his/her posts, that's really too superficial :rolleyes:
I never imagined that anyone would be upset that their posts are not counted :D
Where have you read that I can't click anywhere else to find my lounge ? :confused:
Are you caring about such things as an Ambassador or as a member ?
I ask this question because I haven't understand the utility of Ambassadors yet.

Yes, and the rest of us, who may also find that information helpful/useful, can't find it because it's buried in a lounge thread in a forum we don't visit and lost in thousands of posts.

Well, it's not really much of a loss to you, then, because most of those topics would not have come up without the conversational flow in the lounge. The very reason those topics got discussed is not because they were major topics that deserve to have a new thread created but rather because people were chatting back and forth and the conversation drifted to those topics.

I think of lounges as virtual versions of a do. Sitting around the table chatting with your fellow FlyerTalk members, many different topics come up in the course of organic conversation. Few of them would be worth putting on a meeting agenda (i.e. creating a new thread); most are just small, fun conversational tangents--just like you would have in a normal conversation in-person at a do. Without a lounge, most of the stuff just wouldn't be posted at all.

Well, it's not really much of a loss to you, then, because most of those topics would not have come up without the conversational flow in the lounge. The very reason those topics got discussed is not because they were major topics that deserve to have a new thread created but rather because people were chatting back and forth and the conversation drifted to those topics.

I think of lounges as virtual versions of a do. Sitting around the table chatting with your fellow FlyerTalk members, many different topics come up in the course of organic conversation. Few of them would be worth putting on a meeting agenda (i.e. creating a new thread); most are just small, fun conversational tangents--just like you would have in a normal conversation in-person at a do. Without a lounge, most of the stuff just wouldn't be posted at all.

I agree with this statement 100%. ^^^

While I can't say much more than what was spoken for above, but suffice it to say it is there for casual conversation and such. As I defended the lounge as before, it's not useless as people here might denote it.

If this is about the post count, then I have no more argument because the existence of the lounges primarily is a place to chat, and it's existence should not be berated in a very bad light that it is actually part of the devaluation of the titles of FTers. Because in a sense, that is the general feeling here.

In a nutshell, if this is about titles n statuses, why not tell us so from the very beginning? :rolleyes:

it seems you are only speaking with people that are thinking like you :confused:
I don't believe that you or I have to decide what is in the core forums or not.You are correct. The talk board decides when a forum is needed and what should be going in it. Each one has a description. As well, IIRC, off-topic posts are against the TOS, that is, unless the mods allow it. I believe it's a wink & nog agreement.

Actually, people often comment that I somehow manage to find friends of all stripes and opinions. Perhaps those who frequent the lounge threads are those segregating themselves from the rest of the community.

BTW personally I really don't care that lounges' posts could not count anymore : I'm not judging somebody at the number of his/her posts, that's really too superficial :rolleyes:And neither do I. I couldn't tell you what my post count is. However, when I see that Omni posts are often derided as being off-topic and not fitting with the core mission of FT, and then see a lounge thread, where the posts do count, it is a little disheartening.

I never imagined that anyone would be upset that their posts are not counted :DI'm only upset because they contribute a great deal to the FT experience, yet are valued less than the "good morning" posts in the lounge threads.

Where have you read that I can't click anywhere else to find my lounge ? :confused:Nowhere. So why don't you post or start them where they belong - in the off-topic area called Omni.

Are you caring about such things as an Ambassador or as a member ?
I ask this question because I haven't understand the utility of Ambassadors yet.My role as an ambassador is to welcome newbies, show them around, and answer any question they may have without some of the sarcasm usually shown toward them.

But now that you mention it, those lounge threads are pretty much unwelcoming and, I imagine, daunting to newbies. They come off like a private club. So, I guess in my official capacity, perhaps I can and will suggest it ^^

I'm not a lounge person. Truthfully that's because I only have "X" amount of time to give to FT.

While I could care less about lounge threads, I've heard from multiple people that they've developed friendships/helped other FTers, etc, via these threads, and they have found them quite useful. So while it's not important to me it is to others. I don't have a problem w/ them, and appreciate it matters to others.

I'm never going to participate on the counting, blah, blah, threads in Omni for the same time constraint reason. So while those are not important to me, they are to others. I don't have a problem w/ them, and appreciate it matters to others (although I'd say less than the lounge, but that's just a guess).

FWIW - post count on Omni isn't the most important thing to me truthfully, compared to creating some travel forums, etc, but I'm always willing to listen to FTers so I'll keep an eye on this thread for folks ideas on why it should happen.

Cheers.

Well, it's not really much of a loss to you, then, because most of those topics would not have come up without the conversational flow in the lounge. The very reason those topics got discussed is not because they were major topics that deserve to have a new thread created but rather because people were chatting back and forth and the conversation drifted to those topics.

I think of lounges as virtual versions of a do. Sitting around the table chatting with your fellow FlyerTalk members, many different topics come up in the course of organic conversation. Few of them would be worth putting on a meeting agenda (i.e. creating a new thread); most are just small, fun conversational tangents--just like you would have in a normal conversation in-person at a do. Without a lounge, most of the stuff just wouldn't be posted at all.Then why isn't chat used for this virtual Do? It is available to everyone. Why are the forums allowed to be cluttered with these threads? I recall a time when one of them was always on the front page of FT.

In a nutshell, if this is about titles n statuses, why not tell us so from the very beginning? :rolleyes:It is not about titles and statuses.

It is about someone spending a good deal of time composing a response in Omni for someone looking for help and then have the community put zero value on it. As a matter of fact, Omni has long been derided by many people as not core to the primary mission of FT.

Yet, lounge threads are considered core because they are allowed to exist in the core forums.

Hence, my well thought out response is worth zero to this community while your "good morning" has a value of one.

That is the issue here. Not titles and statuses.

Then why isn't chat used for this virtual Do? It is available to everyone. Why are the forums allowed to be cluttered with these threads? I recall a time when one of them was always on the front page of FT.

In fairness, chat requires FTers to be on at the same time. Lounge threads don't.

Both create a sense of community. One might like chat but not lounge threads & vice versa. Some might like count down threads on Omni & others won't.

The nice part about FT is all type of things work for diff types of FTers.

Cheers.

In fairness, chat requires FTers to be on at the same time. Lounge threads don't.

Both create a sense of community. One might like chat but not lounge threads & vice versa. Some might like count down threads on Omni & others won't.

The nice part about FT is all type of things work for diff types of FTers.

Cheers.

All we are asking is for either enforce the TOS by moving off topic threads to Omni or allow OT topics be counted in OMNI as it is any of the lounges... Why not make an uniformed policy about OT subjects or continue as is and allow all OT threads to be counted.

All we are asking is for either enforce the TOS by moving off topic threads to Omni or allow OT topics be counted in OMNI as it is any of the lounges... Why not make an uniformed policy about OT subjects or continue as is and allow all OT threads to be counted.

TB is not responsible for OT threads in any forum, so if someone has a problem w/ that & where they belong they should contact the appropriate mod.

I didn't think Omni HAD any OT topics. Isn't that the point of Omni?

Cheers.

TB is not responsible for OT threads in any forum, so if someone has a problem w/ that & where they belong they should contact the appropriate mod.

I didn't think Omni HAD any OT topics. Isn't that the point of Omni?

Cheers.


Is it really appropriate to have a thread just for the sake of saying hello and servers no other purpose? I thought threads that serves no purpose belong in OMNI..

Then why isn't chat used for this virtual Do? It is available to everyone. Why are the forums allowed to be cluttered with these threads? I recall a time when one of them was always on the front page of FT.

Every time--except two--that I've logged into FT Chat, I've been the only person in there.

The lounges also allow the conversation to be archived and referenced later (as I just did for my post above). In Chat, the content scrolls off of the screen in a relatively short amount of time.

I have nothing against FT Chat; I just don't find that it works well for me. In the rare occasions that I find activity in there, I do enjoy it. I find the lounges a workable extension of the FT Chat experience.

The lounges really are quite fun, and I can't fathom why anyone would be so vehemently against them. I don't get the sense that they're exclusionary at all; in contrast, as soon as a new person stops by, I see nothing but warm welcomes all around.

I'd really encourage you to drop by and visit perhaps some of the other lounges you haven't said hi in before casting wide aspersion on all lounges. I think you'll find them very much within the spirit of the FlyerTalk community. Might I suggest a sampling of http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/alaska-airlines-mileage-plan/794919-alaska-airlines-lounge-thread-everybody-welcome.html? :)

(NB: I am indeed following and paying attention to the comments about the core subject of this thread; I simply wanted to address some of the misconceptions I've seen posted about this subject.)

Is it really appropriate to have a thread just for the sake of saying hello and servers no other purpose? I thought threads that serves no purpose belong in OMNI..

Where were you in 2007 when the lounge thread started in the CO forum? That one has been out there for 4 years now and has over 300,000 posts. If it was going to be moved to OMNI, or the subsequent threads in Community or UA moved to OMNI, that would have happened long ago. Just accept that we have lounge threads even though you may not participate in them (I don't, but I accept they're in various forums and those posts count).

I think you're better off spending your energy getting OMNI posts counted versus complaining about lounge threads.

You are correct. The talk board decides when a forum is needed and what should be going in it. Each one has a description. As well, IIRC, off-topic posts are against the TOS, that is, unless the mods allow it. I believe it's a wink & nog agreement.

Actually, people often comment that I somehow manage to find friends of all stripes and opinions. Perhaps those who frequent the lounge threads are those segregating themselves from the rest of the community.

And neither do I. I couldn't tell you what my post count is. However, when I see that Omni posts are often derided as being off-topic and not fitting with the core mission of FT, and then see a lounge thread, where the posts do count, it is a little disheartening.

I'm only upset because they contribute a great deal to the FT experience, yet are valued less than the "good morning" posts in the lounge threads.

Nowhere. So why don't you post or start them where they belong - in the off-topic area called Omni.

My role as an ambassador is to welcome newbies, show them around, and answer any question they may have without some of the sarcasm usually shown toward them.

But now that you mention it, those lounge threads are pretty much unwelcoming and, I imagine, daunting to newbies. They come off like a private club. So, I guess in my official capacity, perhaps I can and will suggest it ^^

You seem absolutely wanting to impose your vision.:eek:
That's amazing and conflicting IMO with the description of Ambassador's role you've made.
If your Omni topics are so important and helpful why not post them in an other forum ? :confused:
Count of negative posts for lounges posting and even hide lounges threads if that help you to feel better :D:p

BTW :
- Saying 'Good Morning' is a social proof of respect (even if respect is not important for people nowadays)
- lounges posts have been the basis of several DOs
- lounges posts allowed me to meet physically people that I never knew in other circumstances because I frequent BA /BD / LH forums and theirs are UA / DL / AA.

In conclusion I respect the participants of Omni and I'd like that they could be able to argue to obtain the counting of their posts without denigrating other threads on which they have no idea.

If your Omni topics are so important and helpful why not post them in an other forum ? :confused:

Which forum would you suggest for posts on how to make home repairs or handle a hit and run accident, if not OMNI? These have both been recent topics there.

Is it really appropriate to have a thread just for the sake of saying hello and servers no other purpose? I thought threads that serves no purpose belong in OMNI..

Apparently, lounge threads also serve the purpose of post-padding, so that members can gain access to CC and OMNI.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/16437361-post294.html

If your Omni topics are so important and helpful why not post them in an other forum ? :confused:


Where would you have posted this thread... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/omni/209984-yo-yo-maker-duncan-dies-75-a.html

Dan

You seem absolutely wanting to impose your vision.:eek:No, I stated my opinion and backed it up with an example which I felt fit the situation.

That's amazing and conflicting IMO with the description of Ambassador's role you've made.Feel free to complain if you feel I'm not being welcoming to newbies, because that's my role.

If your Omni topics are so important and helpful why not post them in an other forum ? :confused:My topics? I'm talking about helping others and having the community put zero value on it. It's not about my topics or anyone else's. It the value the community places on mine, and other's responses, as I noted above.

Count of negative posts for lounges posting and even hide lounges threads if that help you to feel better :D:p:confused: :confused: I wish I could hide them, and I'm sure others do as well.
BTW :
- Saying 'Good Morning' is a social proof of respect (even if respect is not important for people nowadays)
- lounges posts have been the basis of several DOs
- lounges posts allowed me to meet physically people that I never knew in other circumstances because I frequent BA /BD / LH forums and theirs are UA / DL / AA.All of that... every one, has taken place in Omni.

In conclusion I respect the participants of Omni and I'd like that they could be able to argue to obtain the counting of their posts without denigrating other threads on which they have no idea.No idea? I tried to follow one and it became impossible. I simply do not have the time to sift through 300-400 posts that can appear overnight.

There is no denigration here. The issue I raised is why a good morning has value to the community and my identifying a rose plant and telling people about it's culture does not. Or someone assisting another FTer getting the best price on an engagement ring, or how to easily fix plumbing.

Isn't this just an extension of the previous discussion (albeit, the one I was actually involved in dealt with CC)? If OMNI should be masked because it's a special forum that has nothing to do with travel, then why should posts count? The posts themselves don't contribute to the 'core' of FT.

And is the only real value of a post an additional tick-box next to your name? Isn't the value of posting in, say, an OMNI Clinic thread that you're helping a fellow forum user?

Further, I'd argue, that this only increases the dim view I have of certain posts in the CC discussion. Given that the discussion included opinions that the two forums should be *more* restricted than they currently are, counting posts in them just serves as another slap in the face to members who don't have that access. Sort of a "well, if y'all just post in OMNI, you can make sure that your post counts stay high enough to always have access". Which may or may not make sense or be representative of anyone's desired reality, but just adds to the perception that it's an elite club whose members are trying to make it more elite and/or exclusionary.

* I should note that I've read through the thread, and I understand where some folks are coming from, and I'm not trying to attribute the above to anyone, but it seems like a lot of these discussions don't have a clear point of view from people 'of my post count', so I wanted to throw it in.

No, I stated my opinion and backed it up with an example which I felt fit the situation.

Feel free to complain if you feel I'm not being welcoming to newbies, because that's my role.

My topics? I'm talking about helping others and having the community put zero value on it. It's not about my topics or anyone else's. It the value the community places on mine, and other's responses, as I noted above.

:confused: :confused: I wish I could hide them, and I'm sure others do as well.
All of that... every one, has taken place in Omni.

No idea? I tried to follow one and it became impossible. I simply do not have the time to sift through 300-400 posts that can appear overnight.

There is no denigration here. The issue I raised is why a good morning has value to the community and my identifying a rose plant and telling people about it's culture does not. Or someone assisting another FTer getting the best price on an engagement ring, or how to easily fix plumbing.

You are repeating the same things again and again !;)
Is this the Coué method ? :p
I'm sorry but I get out of the loop :D

Can you make your point without accumulating any additional emoticons? You've already used 14 in this thread.

that would be nice to also count the emoticons ;)

Apparently, lounge threads also serve the purpose of post-padding, so that members can gain access to CC and OMNI.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/16437361-post294.html

Quite unfair to base your entire perception about a valuable community feature on a statement about something that is infinitesimally minor and that I have never seen be a problem.

Additionally, the moderator corps is very good at spotting these kinds of "runners" who post with only the goal of accessing Coupon Connection and dealing with them appropriately.

No idea? I tried to follow one and it became impossible. I simply do not have the time to sift through 300-400 posts that can appear overnight.

That's never happened in the Delta Lounge...or in the one I welcomed you to last night (an invitation which I notice you did not respond to):

I'd really encourage you to drop by and visit perhaps some of the other lounges you haven't said hi in before casting wide aspersion on all lounges. I think you'll find them very much within the spirit of the FlyerTalk community. Might I suggest a sampling of http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/alaska-airlines-mileage-plan/794919-alaska-airlines-lounge-thread-everybody-welcome.html? :)

That's never happened in the Delta Lounge...or in the one I welcomed you to last night (an invitation which I notice you did not respond to):I apologize. I was packing last night and am getting ready to leave for the airport shortly. I'll take a look as soon as I get a chance.

I can tell you that it happened on a regular basis in the CO lounge thread. I see 40 posts per page and it was not unusual for me to see 5-10 new pages overnight - never-mind how many there were during the day.

FWIW - I don't have an issue with lounge threads, per se. My issue is with them in the core forums when, IMHO, they belong in the off-topic area. That way, if everyone who now participates in those threads all show up in Omni, the wealth of information will expand greatly, and more people will get to know each other that otherwise would not.

all those threads are in OMNI and PR has for the most parts been a reasonable debate amongst one another

How can I possibly take seriously any suggestion which includes that statement?

I apologize. I was packing last night and am getting ready to leave for the airport shortly. I'll take a look as soon as I get a chance.

I can tell you that it happened on a regular basis in the CO lounge thread. I see 40 posts per page and it was not unusual for me to see 5-10 new pages overnight - never-mind how many there were during the day.

FWIW - I don't have an issue with lounge threads, per se. My issue is with them in the core forums when, IMHO, they belong in the off-topic area. That way, if everyone who now participates in those threads all show up in Omni, the wealth of information will expand greatly, and more people will get to know each other that otherwise would not.

That's fine. :)

I will say the CO Box has slowed down tremendously. Like you, I couldn't follow it in the past, but now, there's maybe a half a page of posts a day, and I've been following the newest incarnation since its inception.

The culture there is definitely different from the DL and AS lounges that I'm used to, but it's still fun and educational. ;)

As to your other statement about lounges being moved to OMNI: I see your point, but I don't know that they would function in the same manner there. They certainly would not have naturally sprung up there. The lounges in the individual airline forums began somewhat organically and feel like a natural fit. Herding the cattle all the way over to OMNI and making the lounges harder to find could have the effect of dropping participation in the lounges as they become less visible and/or more difficult to access.

I will say the CO Box has slowed down tremendously. Like you, I couldn't follow it in the past, but now, there's maybe a half a page of posts a day, and I've been following the newest incarnation since its inception.

So has the Delta Forum Lounge. By sheer coincidence, no doubt, this began on the day that MilePoint was launched.

Here you have a thread in GLBT Travelers called Best gay Movie you've ever seen (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/glbt-travelers/830675-best-gay-movie-youve-ever-seen.html) How is that Travel related and why isn't a thread of same caliber (best movies) not worth the same is Omni? Its because of thread such as this, I ask the TB to implement new rules which mandates off topic threads be moved into Omni or give posts in Omni the same credit as the rest of the forums.

Then there is Travel Health and Fitness, and just by glancing at the first page most post in there are not travel related but of the health/fitness variety, which makes me ask why have a forum to itself when the same can be discussed in Omni.

You really need to get back to your original topic ("Allow post counts in OMNI PR"), rather than trying to clean up all the other forums on FT.

I have over 28,500 posts.

I hereby officially authorize TalkBoard, Carol, or anyone else to remove all but 180 of them from my account and to split the remaining ones among those posters on this thread who really want them.

As a plus, you can give my "Evangelist" title to the OP.

I have over 28,500 posts.

I hereby officially authorize TalkBoard, Carol, or anyone else to remove all but 180 of them from my account and to split the remaining ones among those posters on this thread who really want them.

As a plus, you can give my "Evangelist" title to the OP.

Thanks, but no Thanks.. Post counts don’t bother me, so that’s not the reason for starting this thread.. I started it to have Omni be treated just like the other forums, which should includes post counts and images.. The concern before was post padding, so the post counts were done away with, that’s fine.. Now you have threads in different forums that serves the purpose of post padding and they are allowed to be counted when threads of same nature goes uncounted in Omni. To say those threads serves a purpose to its respected forum is a bit naive, when they're OT for the most part.. I’m asking for a unified policy which either states threads that serves the purpose of post padding or OT be moved to omni, or allow every single post to be counted site wide..

Here you have a thread in GLBT Travelers called Best gay Movie you've ever seen (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/glbt-travelers/830675-best-gay-movie-youve-ever-seen.html) How is that Travel related and why isn't a thread of same caliber (best movies) not worth the same is Omni? Its because of thread such as this, I ask the TB to implement new rules which mandates off topic threads be moved into Omni or give posts in Omni the same credit as the rest of the forums.


If that post isn't in the right forum, than I give up. It relates to that forum much better than Omni.

If that post isn't in the right forum, than I give up. It relates to that forum much better than Omni. I think the point is is that the thread has nothing to do with GLBT travel and thus should be non-post count as are the threads in OMNI. As as example, a thread was recently started in the AC forum about club lounge showers and who has made use of them for various purposes. It was moved to Omni...so what's the difference? There is no longer a solid argument that Omni posts should not count as there are many threads on the "post count" forums which have nothing to do about miles/points/travel.:)

There is no longer a solid argument that Omni posts should not count


But in real life, the number of posts someone has really does not count for anything at all (at least, not above 180 posts which does get you something).

What does it really matter? It is not like Omni is a person whose feelings are going to be deeply hurt because he is not seen as being worth as much as his friends Mr. Community Buzz and Ms. TalkBoard Topics.

I agree with this point of view. If you can post "good morning" and get credit for it, a couple paragraphs in OMNI or OMNI/PR should also count.

Since "+1" posts seem to draw criticism by many FT'ers, then I'll have to use redundant text that in essence echos Tom's opinion...in other-words, I concur. ;)

Because the OP specifically spoke about allowing post count for OMNI and OMNI/PR, I'll address that first. I disagree. It's not in the "spirit of FT." Regarding lounge threads, that's another beast entirely which needs its own discussion. There are many posts that are absolutely travel related, whereas the "Good mornings" got so out of hand that I had to unsubscribe from the Community Lounge thread. I don't think there's a blanket rule that can be applied to those.

Because the OP specifically spoke about allowing post count for OMNI and OMNI/PR, I'll address that first. I disagree. It's not in the "spirit of FT." Regarding lounge threads, that's another beast entirely which needs its own discussion. There are many posts that are absolutely travel related, whereas the "Good mornings" got so out of hand that I had to unsubscribe from the Community Lounge thread. I don't think there's a blanket rule that can be applied to those.

Care to answer how the aforementioned best movie thread is travel related? That thread has been up since 08… If I were to go on a hunt for OT threads I’m pretty sure I’ll come across tons of them in each forum.. I’m not saying move those threads, just give the same credit those threads get in its posted forum to omni threads of same nature.

Care to answer how the aforementioned best movie thread is travel related? That thread has been up since 08… If I were to go on a hunt for OT threads I’m pretty sure I’ll come across tons of them in each forum.. I’m not saying move those threads, just give the same credit those threads get in its posted forum to omni threads of same nature.

I do not. You specifically asked about allowing OMNI posts to count. Perhaps, in a future thread you can ask about making mods be more forceful about not allowing stuff like that. Because a movie thread is not travel related doesn't mean OMNI should count. One has no relevance or bearing on the other.

If OMNI posts were to be counted in the post count, a very interesting piece of information would be the count of posts that are OMNI and OMNI/PR. How many like this would we see?

Total Posts: 20,000
OMNI Posts: 19,500

:)

If OMNI posts were to be counted in the post count, a very interesting piece of information would be the count of posts that are OMNI and OMNI/PR. How many like this would we see?

Total Posts: 20,000
OMNI Posts: 19,500

:)

Of those FTers who care about such a divided count of post counts and (a) have 180 posts+180 days of membership and (b) aren't otherwise restricted from accessing OMNI, the above kind of information already can be determined. Where there's a will there's a way.

Of those FTers who care about such a divided count of post counts and (a) have 180 posts+180 days of membership and (b) aren't otherwise restricted from accessing OMNI, the above kind of information already can be determined. Where there's a will there's a way.

Short of counting posts one by one, how exactly does one find out how many posts an individual FTer has in OMNI vs. non-OMNI? :confused:

Just use the search feature.... it can help... but when you get over 500 posts.... which many OMNI and OMNI PR members have, you cannot do it easily.

Short of counting posts one by one, how exactly does one find out how many posts an individual FTer has in OMNI vs. non-OMNI? :confused:

Short of counting posts one by one, how exactly does one find out how many posts an individual FTer has in OMNI vs. non-OMNI? :confused: Actually it is automated and just not a feature to regular posters on FT

Just use the search feature.... it can help... but when you get over 500 posts.... which many OMNI and OMNI PR members have, you cannot do it easily. Not completely correct, the statistics are available of each poster(as per the V bulletin software upgrade of late), and where they spend the most time posting !

But in real life, the number of posts someone has really does not count for anything at all (at least, not above 180 posts which does get you something).

What does it really matter? It is not like Omni is a person whose feelings are going to be deeply hurt because he is not seen as being worth as much as his friends Mr. Community Buzz and Ms. TalkBoard Topics. Actually as this bulletin board is a money making venture , the more page views they get the higher revenues and ad click thru they can get. Omni is one of the most viewed forums on FT, thus one of the highest revenue contributors. Shouldn't those that supply the revenue to this site be rewarded with at least having their posts count from there. The distinction between the 2 areas is not valid....same as your argument ! Cheers

Shouldn't those that supply the revenue to this site be rewarded with at least having their posts count from there.

What exactly, other than a higher post number, is the "reward", and who is being harmed by their OMNI posts not counting? :confused:

Right now, the post count is a reflection of the number of travel-related or points/miles posts they have made on FT. As such, it is perhaps a bit of a crude rubric of how much travel-related knowledge that person has, the exception of course being lounge threads, which I'm not fond of, but that's a different topic! :rolleyes:

At one time, a "reputation" system was tried and failed, so post count is the best we can do to ascertain who does and doesn't generally know their travel "stuff". I would like it to continue to be that way.

According to a search, I have 181 posts in OMNI and OMNI/PR. Would I rather have 700+ posts than my current 520+? Sure, but I don't feel harmed in any way by only having 520+ reflected currently.

What exactly, other than a higher post number, is the "reward", and who is being harmed by their OMNI posts not counting? :confused:

Right now, the post count is a reflection of the number of travel-related or points/miles posts they have made on FT. As such, it is perhaps a bit of a crude rubric of how much travel-related knowledge that person has, the exception of course being lounge threads, which I'm not fond of, but that's a different topic! :rolleyes:

At one time, a "reputation" system was tried and failed, so post count is the best we can do to ascertain who does and doesn't generally know their travel "stuff". I would like it to continue to be that way.

According to a search, I have 181 posts in OMNI and OMNI/PR. Would I rather have 700+ posts than my current 520+? Sure, but I don't feel harmed in any way by only having 520+ reflected currently. To be frank this whole website is about points, whether they be likes or other currency! There is no reason (as you note above) that the lounge thread dribble should count as a deposit of currency when the dribble in Omni does not.....same, same! And no one here can refute that the OMNI`s are some of the biggest generators of page views on FT ! And eyeballs mean revenue....and if FT is making a killing off of OMNI why not share some of it in FT currency (post count, and titles)! This site is ALL about the post counts and titles! I can think of very few anointed posters that have refused their titles and said they did not care about their posts counting!

This site is ALL about the post counts and titles! I can think of very few anointed posters that have refused their titles and said they did not care about their posts counting!

And likewise I can also think of very few that have ego trips about their titles or post counts. Most of us seem to be in the middle somewhere.

How are threads of Political nature allowed in TS/S.. TS/S was a the creation of congress.. So why is TB the allowing TS/S to exist when every thread has a hit of politics..

I guess I should be posting anything that has a hint of politics in TS/S since those posts count and eventually gets dumped, get this, in another political forum, PR.

In light of the "images in Omni" decision and equalizing it with the rest of FT, is the talk board now considering this proposal?

If not, why?

On March 20th, 2011 I started a thread in the private TB forum with this post:

I feel we righted one wrong with restoring the 180/180 and logged-in entrance requirement for OMNI.

I'm now having second thoughts about not allowing posting credit for OMNI. I voted to remove it when it last came before the TB. But I can no longer see the rationale for doing so.

Now I can live with or without allowing post credit for the OMNI's but would probably vote in favor of restoring it if it came to a vote tomorrow.

Just wanted to take the temperature in the forum here and see where the rest of you are on this issue.

Thanks.

The TB discussed this for a short while and then the thread kind of died without any further discussion.

I'll bump the thread and see if we can eventually get this to a motion.

Too funny. I was just reading the thread you started cholula, thinking we needed to bump it up for discussion again.

Mary, one of the questions I had in the thread in private TB was re: the new entry requirements being in place & if we say posts in Omni count in posts total, does that mean that people who don't have entry now have entry (something like that; need to go back & reread what I said)?

Also we had a couple of other technical software issues that we needed answers on. I'm going to ask IB-Dick to take a look at the private thread & get back to us on the software stuff.

Cheers.

Too funny. I was just reading the thread you started cholula, thinking we needed to bump it up for discussion again.

Mary, one of the questions I had in the thread in private TB was re: the new entry requirements being in place & if we say posts in Omni count in posts total, does that mean that people who don't have entry now have entry (something like that; need to go back & reread what I said)?

Also we had a couple of other technical software issues that we needed answers on. I'm going to ask IB-Dick to take a look at the private thread & get back to us on the software stuff.

Cheers.
Sharon,

I'm guessing your question about access is, "If we count OMNI posts again, will those who posted in OMNI when it was open have those posts added to their post count, and will that mean they gain access," or some such.

When post counts were done away with we didn't lose the post counts, so if and when post counts are allowed, wouldn't it start counting from the day it's activated?

I would hope that we could just flip the switch again and allow post count credit from Date X forward......if this should ever pass....rather than making it retroactive.

But if it is all or nothing and it sucks in a few hundred folks who might have otherwise been below the 180 threshold, fine.

The 180/180 and logged-in rule was not intended as much to discriminate against low-post FT lurkers as to deny entrance to Spammers, Google Bots and suspended members.

I would hope that we could just flip the switch again and allow post count credit from Date X forward......if this should ever pass....rather than making it retroactive.

But if it is all or nothing and it sucks in a few hundred folks who might have otherwise been below the 180 threshold, fine.

The 180/180 and logged-in rule was not intended as much to discriminate against low-post FT lurkers as to deny entrance to Spammers, Google Bots and suspended members.

I agree.

Cheers.

Too funny. I was just reading the thread you started cholula, thinking we needed to bump it up for discussion again.

Mary, one of the questions I had in the thread in private TB was re: the new entry requirements being in place & if we say posts in Omni count in posts total, does that mean that people who don't have entry now have entry (something like that; need to go back & reread what I said)?

Also we had a couple of other technical software issues that we needed answers on. I'm going to ask IB-Dick to take a look at the private thread & get back to us on the software stuff.

Cheers.No, it leaves entry requirements the same. And honestly, for me, it doesn't have anything to do with denying access or upping post counts. In my mind, and I posted it above I think, is that if I spend time researching and composing a response to someone asking for help in Omni the community places zero value on it, but if I post "good morning" in a thread in the M&P areas, those posts are given a value of 1. It just doesn't make sense and reinforces the general opinion that Omni doesn't belong on FT.

No, it leaves entry requirements the same. And honestly, for me, it doesn't have anything to do with denying access or upping post counts. In my mind, and I posted it above I think, is that if I spend time researching and composing a response to someone asking for help in Omni the community places zero value on it, but if I post "good morning" in a thread in the M&P areas, those posts are given a value of 1. It just doesn't make sense and reinforces the general opinion that Omni doesn't belong on FT.

It doesn't matter how long you spend on that post- it's not adding to the main aim of FT-

FlyerTalk is an interactive community that provides up-to-date information on travel-related loyalty reward programs. It's the hub that brings everyone together -- from leisure travelers to mileage junkies -- to converse about programs, get the latest program buzz or discuss how to maximize points or miles. You'll even get some good general travel information!

Whether or not Lounge Threads should be allowed in the main forums is a separate issues, and this is the not the appropriate thread to (repeatedly) bring this up.

It doesn't matter how long you spend on that post- it's not adding to the main aim of FT-but it matters to the bottom line of IB. This is the only forum that makes the off topic area posters second class citizens, all while saying it's one of the busiest and most popular boards in the forum.

Whether or not Lounge Threads should be allowed in the main forums is a separate issues, and this is the not the appropriate thread to (repeatedly) bring this up.why not? Just because someone posts off topic information in a miles and points area doesn't make them contributors to the core of this community. I've seen a few who only post in lounge threads. Why do their posts have value and mine in Omni do not? At least I also post elsewhere.

I only bring it up to make a case for Omni posts counting. Your example proves my point. Lounge threads have zero to do with the core mission of this forum.

The 180/180 and logged-in rule was not intended as much to discriminate against low-post FT lurkers as to deny entrance to Spammers, Google Bots and suspended members.

That's nice to hear, and yet I'm still left trying to understand this.

1. Was there a huge problem with large numbers of suspended members creating new FT accounts under a 90-day+90-post rule so as to post in OMNI?


2. Was there a huge problem with large numbers of commercially-oriented spammers using FT accounts under a 90-day+90-post rule so as to post in OMNI and not elsewhere on FT as well?


3. Was there a huge problem with Google bots creating FT accounts under a 90-day+90-post rule so as to do who knows what with OMNI?

With regard to the first question:

As suspended members creating new FT accounts (so as to post on FT) is not limited to OMNI, I'm not sure I understand the basis for the intent to deny entrance to suspended members with yet another raising of barriers like this.

With regard to the second question:

As spammers have hit various parts of FT that have no entry restrictions, I'm not sure I understand the basis for how spammers could be a bigger issue for the OMNI forum(s) than for the rest of FT. Commercially it doesn't make sense to focus on spamming OMNI as the forum is unpopular in its most basic way -- unlike with access to most of the rest of FT, the overwhelming majority of FTers were not able to post in the OMNI forum(s) even before the furhter raising of the barrier like this.

With regard to the third question:

Unless Google bots have any history of creating FT accounts to post 90 times on FT and then maintain membership for 90 days before trying to use the OMNI forum(s), I'm not sure I understand the basis of how Google bots would be thwarted by a 180-post+180-day restriction any more or less than under a 90-post+90-day restriction.

I'm just not sure how a 90-day+90-post rule would be insufficient for delivering on the intent stated in the post above while a 180-day+180-post rule would be sufficient for delivering on said intent.

The focus on intent -- (pseudo)-legislative or otherwise -- is less interesting to me than a focus on actual delivery.

I would hope that we could just flip the switch again and allow post count credit from Date X forward......if this should ever pass....rather than making it retroactive.



I strongly oppose this. I believe it would result in making me a "FlyerTalk Posting Legend", thus making it even clearer than my "Evangelist" title does that I have no life.

but it matters to the bottom line of IB. This is the only forum that makes the off topic area posters second class citizens, all while saying it's one of the busiest and most popular boards in the forum.

Luckily, the Talkboard doesn't base its decisions on how to maximize profit for IB.

And there are plenty of forums out there where posts on the off-topic board don't count.

why not? Just because someone posts off topic information in a miles and points area doesn't make them contributors to the core of this community. I've seen a few who only post in lounge threads. Why do their posts have value and mine in Omni do not? At least I also post elsewhere.

I only bring it up to make a case for Omni posts counting. Your example proves my point. Lounge threads have zero to do with the core mission of this forum.

Off topic posts are a moderation issue, not a TB issue. This isn't the right forum to (repeatedly) bring it up.

With regard to the above post, it's clear as mud that "off topic posts are a moderation issues, not a TB issue". What's clear as good air on a sunny day is that there is irony in claiming that an issue should not be brought up here yet brining it up anyway.

I would hope that we could just flip the switch again and allow post count credit from Date X forward......if this should ever pass....rather than making it retroactive. I strongly oppose this. I believe it would result in making me a "FlyerTalk Posting Legend", thus making it even clearer than my "Evangelist" title does that I have no life.

Talk about a post having internal inconsistency.

the overwhelming majority of FTers were not able to post in the OMNI forum(s) even before the furhter raising of the barrier like this.

(Bolding mine)

Really?!

I strongly oppose this. I believe it would result in making me a "FlyerTalk Posting Legend", thus making it even clearer than my "Evangelist" title does that I have no life.

:D

Luckily, the Talkboard doesn't base its decisions on how to maximize profit for IB.

And there are plenty of forums out there where posts on the off-topic board don't count.I haven't seen any. I've seen forums where you have to pay to get to a special off-topic area, but not those with posts that don't count.

Off topic posts are a moderation issue, not a TB issue. This isn't the right forum to (repeatedly) bring it up.First of all, in my last post on the subject, I mentioned any off topic posts, not just those in lounge threads.

As well, how else do I make my point about the community valuing some posts more than others when they are all off-topic?

That is the gist here. If the TB is trying to equalize Omni with the other forums, such as now allowing images, why stop there? Posts should count for that reason alone.

Or better yet, no posts should count anywhere on FT.

(Bolding mine)

Really?!

Do you think that majority of FT member accounts have at least 180 posts per account? They don't.

180 days of membership duration is something the majority of FTers have achieved.

unlike with access to most of the rest of FT, the overwhelming majority of FTers were not able to post in the OMNI forums) even before the furhter raising of the barrier like this.The overwhelming majority of FTers are not even really members of the community - they may have signed up and posted once or twice, or signed up to win an ipod (remember that nonsense?), or to get information. I believe the core number of users is a small fraction of the actual number of people who are "members."

This thread isn't about giving equal access or removing restrictions to Omni - there is a thread for that.

This is about having the posts count. If you'd like to discuss having people unmasked from Omni then you should create a thread for that - however, I believe that truly is a moderation issue.

I've seen a few people who were allowed back in, and they're back to their old pot-stirring ways.

So please, restrict your opinion to whether or not you are for or against posts counting for Omni and a reason why.

Or better yet, no posts should count anywhere on FT.

That can be easily done, and retroactively at that too. However, I doubt that such will be implemented across the board.

Even those who mock the concept of post counts on FT do so because of concern about it. The irony of that.

The overwhelming majority of FTers are not even really members of the community - they may have signed up and posted once or twice, or signed up to win an ipod (remember that nonsense?), or to get information. I believe the core number of users is a small fraction of the actual number of people who are "members."

This thread isn't about giving equal access or removing restrictions to Omni - there is a thread for that.

This is about having the posts count. If you'd like to discuss having people unmasked from Omni then you should create a thread for that - however, I believe that truly is a moderation issue.

I've seen a few people who were allowed back in, and they're back to their old pot-stirring ways.

So please, restrict your opinion to whether or not you are for or against posts counting for Omni and a reason why.

With regard to restricting my opinion, I don't see why it should be restricted when the communication is not a FT TOS violation and my post is on topic. The post which you quoted above -- but only in fragment -- is but an example of my responding to a post in the thread in an appropriate manner. And opinion about this topic need not be one built upon a single, isolated pillar that supports who knows what or nothing at all.

I'm not asking you to restrict your opinion, just to start a new thread about the issues you have, nor have I said it's a TOS violation. This thread is about allowing posts to count.

So far, every single motion or suggestion that has come up about Omni you mention the inability for people not to see it for various reasons, yet I have to see you start a thread about that. That's the appropriate procedure to get converstaion going about it and the talk board to take notice.

I'm not asking you to restrict your opinion, just to start a new thread about the issues you have, nor have I said it's a TOS violation. This thread is about allowing posts to count.

The threads that exist are ones I deem sufficient as is. I am still of the opinion that I'd be all in favor of allowing posts to count (again) for the OMNI forum(s) if the forum were treated in a manner consistent with most all of FT. Unfortunately such consistency does not exist.

So far, every single motion or suggestion that has come up about Omni you mention the inability for people not to see it for various reasons, yet I have to see you start a thread about that. That's the appropriate procedure to get converstaion going about it and the talk board to take notice.

That is certainly not the case, as I read it.

I haven't seen any. I've seen forums where you have to pay to get to a special off-topic area, but not those with posts that don't count.

So because you haven't seen any, means they don't exist?


First of all, in my last post on the subject, I mentioned any off topic posts, not just those in lounge threads.

As well, how else do I make my point about the community valuing some posts more than others when they are all off-topic?

That is the gist here. If the TB is trying to equalize Omni with the other forums, such as now allowing images, why stop there? Posts should count for that reason alone.

Or better yet, no posts should count anywhere on FT.

Off-topic posts are a violation of the TOS and a moderation issue. If you have a problem with them, bring them up in the right forum.

The threads that exist are ones I deem sufficient as is. I am still of the opinion that I'd be all in favor of allowing posts to count (again) for the OMNI forum(s) if the forum were treated in a manner consistent with most all of FT. Unfortunately such consistency does not exist.



That is certainly not the case, as I read it.

I’m of the opinion that if the site wants to keep new members out for a certain period, its up to the site.. I disagree with it, but it’s not concern for me to get worked up over.. My concern is masking people from one part of the site while allowing them full access.

When post counts were done away with we didn't lose the post counts
I did not know that OMNI and OMNI/PR posts ever counted in post counts. When did that change happen?

I always assumed that those people in OMNI/PR with over 10,000 posts had gotten that high count by posting in airline forums and other travel-related sections, but this is obviously not true. If a switch could be flipped to adjust the current post count for each member to not include any OMNI and OMNI/PR posts ever made, would there be an awful lot of new "newbies"? ;)

Omni posts counted until about 3 or 4 years ago when "counting" threads became so popular that they were constantly on the first page of new posts for FT. There are a few people who got their "titles" via those threads alone. IIRC, one person was posting all day nearly every day for his title :D

The posts before the cut-off never were removed from post counts. If they were, you'd see some people with none or very few.

FWIW - the rise of the lounge threads occurred around the same time. Coincidence? Maybe.

Personally, if the TB decides Omni posts shouldn't count, I'm all for removing them from post counts. Since the decision would be that only posts to core forums count, then they should be removed since it is not a measure of contributions to the core community.

Mary, thanks for the very good explanation. ^

The posts before the cut-off never were removed from post counts. If they were, you'd see some people with none or very few.

...

Personally, if the TB decides Omni posts shouldn't count, I'm all for removing them from post counts. Since the decision would be that only posts to core forums count, then they should be removed since it is not a measure of contributions to the core community.
As of right now, the TalkBoard already made a decision (from a few years ago) that OMNI posts should not count in a member's post count. So perhaps a motion to adjust all historical post counts to be consistent with that decision (OMNI posts do not count in the post count) should be considered first? The name of this site is FlyerTalk.

I do not believe TB made the decision. I believe it was Randy, who almost exclusively handled all matters relating to Omni. I could very well be wrong about that, but I don't think I am.

Mary, thanks for the very good explanation. ^


As of right now, the TalkBoard already made a decision (from a few years ago) that OMNI posts should not count in a member's post count. So perhaps a motion to adjust all historical post counts to be consistent with that decision (OMNI posts do not count in the post count) should be considered first? The name of this site is FlyerTalk.

When I was on TalkBoard I made exactly that motion. As I recall, Cholula seconded it.

It touched off a lengthy and furious thread on TalkBoard Topics by posters who foresaw their beloved post counts and titles disappearing. As a result, the motion was overwhelmingly rejected by TalkBoard.

I was actually quite disappointed as I had hoped that it would result in pruning down my obscenely high post count to a reasonable level.

Thanks for the correction/reminder Dov.

I was actually quite disappointed as I had hoped that it would result in pruning down my obscenely high post count to a reasonable level.

It wouldn't prune your high post count; rather it would prune the most visibly observed post count number affiliated with your member ID.

As of right now, the TalkBoard already made a decision (from a few years ago) that OMNI posts should not count in a member's post count. So perhaps a motion to adjust all historical post counts to be consistent with that decision (OMNI posts do not count in the post count) should be considered first? The name of this site is FlyerTalk.

There are flyer-related posts/threads in the OMNI forum(s) too.

Has this gone anywhere?

These are my impressions


Omni is still a second class citizen when it comes to post count.
It's ok to normalize Omni with the rest of FT when it comes to posting images, but not when it comes to post counts. Why?
I've seen several good alternate suggestions to combat post padding via the counting threads, are those being considered?
Having posts count in regular Omni and not in P/R has been suggested, has that been considered?
Has anyone explained why off-topic Omni-like posts in other forums count and seem to be appreciated by the membership, and yet Omni posts, which often contain real information do not?
Has the removal of all posts counts and/or titles based upon that count been considered?

Right now you have a group of second class citizens based upon the old feeling that Randy never wanted Omni and only added it begrudingly. Things have changed, it's time to start treating all contributing members the same.

Wait, I thought OMNI had nothing to do with the core of FT. I mean, it didn't when entry requirements were discussed. So why should something that apparently has no relation to FT 'count' the same as something posted to the 'core' of FT? Solely because some other boards have 'off topic' posts? It seems clear that OMNI is either part of the core, and is being restricted out of elitism, or that it's not part of the core and shouldn't be treated as such.

Wait, I thought OMNI had nothing to do with the core of FT. I mean, it didn't when entry requirements were discussed. So why should something that apparently has no relation to FT 'count' the same as something posted to the 'core' of FT? Solely because some other boards have 'off topic' posts? It seems clear that OMNI is either part of the core, and is being restricted out of elitism, or that it's not part of the core and shouldn't be treated as such.There was also talk of normalizing it with the rest of FT. And yes, if OT posts are allowed in other forums that are core, you are creating a second set of rules - one which values OT posts differently. Either OT posts are the same or they're not.

It was being restricted because of trolls not because of elitism. That was made clear by posts from the Mods of Omni. They're life is much easier now.

There was also talk of normalizing it with the rest of FT. And yes, if OT posts are allowed in other forums that are core, you are creating a second set of rules - one which values OT posts differently. Either OT posts are the same or they're not.

It was being restricted because of trolls not because of elitism. That was made clear by posts from the Mods of Omni. They're life is much easier now.

Sorry, I should've been more clear, as I think I said in the CC thread (I think), I understand the closure(s), and it (they) makes perfect sense. What I don't get is how, in some cases the boards aren't "real" FT, but then in some cases they are. As in the case of CC, I don't believe that it's an 'elitist' thing, but I can clearly see how someone else would come to that conclusion.

And in general, I agree. There were all sorts of topics in OMNI-lite that were hugely useful (numerous clinics were very helpful, for instance) and I can understand the feeling that they ought to count as much as some of the 'less useful' posts in lounge threads. That said, seeing some of the counting threads and things of that nature, coupled with comments that the requirements ought to be higher, I can also understand the view that it's being done to allow OMNI posters to continue to only post in OMNI (no accusation or implication intended) while allowing further future roadblocks to admittance. And moreso after being repeatedly told that OMNI doesn't count and that me and some of my fellow lurkers should contribute more to gain access, while older members are allowed to not 'contribute' (again, I say this only in terms of the above, as I know the 'contributions' are still there) and still hold access.

Sorry for the ramble, and again, apologies for the unintentional insinuation.

No problem at all. I now fully understand your point.

Its been well over a month and I have not seen the TB either take up this issue or dismiss it… Perhaps someone can tell me, what the status is on this petition ?

Its been well over a month and I have not seen the TB either take up this issue or dismiss it… Perhaps someone can tell me, what the status is on this petition ?

I'm not taking up the position. I can't speak for the other 8 TB members.

I'm not taking up the position. I can't speak for the other 8 TB members.

May I ask why?

As I may have mentioned earlier in this thread, I started a thread in our private forum in March to discuss this issue. And I bumped it again about a month ago.

The thread stalled out in early June and there hasn't been any further commentary on the issue.

Without divulging any actual numbers or naming names(and we haven't even taken a straw poll yet), let me just say that there is not currently overwhelming support for this issue among the current TB.

May I ask why?

Not interested. This is a place to primarily discuss miles and points.

Not interested. This is a place to primarily discuss miles and points.

Ok, if that’s what you feel the purpose of FT is, then why do you take part in threads in Omni since they add no value to this site.. Unless Omni severs a purpose, then shouldn’t it be viewed the same as rest of FT, or be shut down?

Ok, if that’s what you feel the purpose of FT is, then why do you take part in threads in Omni since they add no value to this site.. Unless Omni severs a purpose, then shouldn’t it be viewed the same as rest of FT, or be shut down?

Omni is a diversion, not a purpose. I spend most of my time elsewhere. When did I say "no value"? Those are your words, not mine.

Omni is a diversion, not a purpose. I spend most of my time elsewhere. When did I say "no value"? Those are your words, not mine.

When you say "This is a place to primarily discuss miles and points" you are basically saying anything that doesn't fall into either category means noting, that is how i interpreted it.

IF you are saying it a diversion, then why are lounge threads or threads that are off topic to Miles and Points allowed to be counted when OT threads are not in Omni and you as the TB president, shouldn't you be either implementing or devising a plan to roots out FT of such diversions as they serve no purpose?

IF you are saying it a diversion, then why are lounge threads or threads that are off topic to Miles and Points allowed to be counted when OT threads are not in Omni and you as the TB president, shouldn't you be either implementing or devising a plan to roots out FT of such diversions as they serve no purpose?

Sorry, I'm just not that concerned.

The software doesn't have the capability to count posts in one thread and not in the other within the same forum. Forum content is the moderators' purview.

Sorry, I'm just not that concerned.

The software doesn't have the capability to count posts in one thread and not in the other within the same forum. Forum content is the moderators' purview.

If you were to allow post counts in all of FT, then one doesn't have question as to why moderators allow threads that belongs in Omni be allowed elsewhere. That’s my take on it and a major reason I started this thread. I respect your views and I hope another TB member might view it the way I and others see it, and perhaps will start up the debate and hopefully put it to vote.

When you say "This is a place to primarily discuss miles and points" you are basically saying anything that doesn't fall into either category means noting, that is how i interpreted it.

I'm not seeing where you're getting the idea that having a "primary" focus means everything else is "nothing". Can't there be a secondary, tertiary, etc focus?

If you were to allow post counts in all of FT, then one doesn't have question as to why moderators allow threads that belongs in Omni be allowed elsewhere. That’s my take on it and a major reason I started this thread. I respect your views and I hope another TB member might view it the way I and others see it, and perhaps will start up the debate and hopefully put it to vote.

Putting it to a vote with the current TB composition is an invitation to have it fail and creating a voting record that delivers no real change.

Perhaps consider making this topic an issue during the next TB election campaign season -- or better yet, consider a run for TB -- and then perhaps there will be some motion in this direction.

Putting it to a vote with the current TB composition is an invitation to have it fail and creating a voting record that delivers no real change.

Perhaps consider making this topic an issue during the next TB election campaign season -- or better yet, consider a run for TB -- and then perhaps there will be some motion in this direction.Very well said on all counts ^

Some TB members have been on vacation during June (including me) & early July, which may be one reason some discussions haven't moved forward. Note I am not speaking for other TB members & reasons why discussions haven't moved forward, but just offering up a possible explanation. When folk are back we can potentially discuss again.

FWIW - I'm supportive of Omni posts counting.

Cheers.

Just let OMNI posts count when you reach a threshold of posts in other threads, for example 1,550 posts is as a good a number as any (1,551 now I guess). :D

Just let OMNI posts count when you reach a threshold of posts in other threads, for example 1,550 posts is as a good a number as any (1,551 now I guess). :D

That's actually a brilliant idea IMO, but I'm not sure if the software has that capability to allow posts to count for some and not for others. If that capability is not there, the only way to make your idea work would be for moderators to manually take away posts from those who haven't reached x non-OMNI posts, and I wouldn't wish that job on anybody.

I'm still good with the OMNI's not counting as post counts.

As for the lounge threads - I personally don't really see the purpose of them - they're a playground within the playground.

Agree - total waste of space both of them, on a travel board.