Korean Air Skypass - Korean Air totally blew my mind

I just had the most amazing experience flying JFK-ICN on the DL-coded, KE-operated flight.

First of all, the flight was delightful. Very nice crew, good food, brand new fully-flat seats in J, great AVOD selection, on a 77W couldn't have been more than a year old. The JFK lounge attendant invited me into the first class side, even though I was in business. (E+ perk?)

Once onboard, doors closed 20 minutes early, and we arrived on time 14 hours later.

Immigration was a breeze, and I arrived at baggage claim the minute the belt started moving. First bags were all tagged priority, and of those mine was the 10th off the belt.

This was a flawless experience, how flying should be - and now, the mind blowing part:

When I retrieved my bag, I discovered it was dripping wet, on the outside. (It was not raining at ICN - no idea where the water came from.) The water hadn't permeated the interior of the bag and all my clothing was fine... but the exterior was now wet and fairly dirty. I really wasn't too upset about it, and I would have just left, had I not bumped right into a man in a KE uniform who was standing there to monitor the process.

As soon as he saw the bag, he immediately apologized, took out a two-way radio and called his supervisor, who ran over within 3 minutes.

The supervisor acted as if the airline had lost my dog. He apologized profusely, and filled out an incident report on the spot. He told me I can get the bag dry-cleaned in Korea and KE would reimburse me. But then, as he handed me my copy of the form, he handed me an envelope as well, saying it was "for dry cleaning." I figured this was the envelope to mail in a receipt. I was wrong.

In the envelope was 50,000 won in cash, the equivalent of $50!

I am a big fan of DL and DL people; I'm by no means knocking them. Having said that, I've never encountered such proactive service recovery. The entire process, from getting the bag to getting the cash, took less than 10 minutes.

Amazing!

Nearly every Asia based carrier>Any US legacy.

Its an equation you will become more familiar with the more you fly none US based legacies internationally.

I just had the most amazing experience flying JFK-ICN on the DL-coded, KE-operated flight.

First of all, the flight was delightful. Very nice crew, good food, brand new fully-flat seats in J, great AVOD selection, on a 77W couldn't have been more than a year old. The JFK lounge attendant invited me into the first class side, even though I was in business. (E+ perk?)

Once onboard, doors closed 20 minutes early, and we arrived on time 14 hours later.

Immigration was a breeze, and I arrived at baggage claim the minute the belt started moving. First bags were all tagged priority, and of those mine was the 10th off the belt.

This was a flawless experience, how flying should be - and now, the mind blowing part:

When I retrieved my bag, I discovered it was dripping wet, on the outside. (It was not raining at ICN - no idea where the water came from.) The water hadn't permeated the interior of the bag and all my clothing was fine... but the exterior was now wet and fairly dirty. I really wasn't too upset about it, and I would have just left, had I not bumped right into a man in a KE uniform who was standing there to monitor the process.

As soon as he saw the bag, he immediately apologized, took out a two-way radio and called his supervisor, who ran over within 3 minutes.

The supervisor acted as if the airline had lost my dog. He apologized profusely, and filled out an incident report on the spot. He told me I can get the bag dry-cleaned in Korea and KE would reimburse me. But then, as he handed me my copy of the form, he handed me an envelope as well, saying it was "for dry cleaning." I figured this was the envelope to mail in a receipt. I was wrong.

In the envelope was 50,000 won in cash, the equivalent of $50!

I am a big fan of DL and DL people; I'm by no means knocking them. Having said that, I've never encountered such proactive service recovery. The entire process, from getting the bag to getting the cash, took less than 10 minutes.

Amazing!


Yup, sounds like a great flight and performance by KE ( I use them from LA to INC sometimes).. This is where I was coming from in the "Delta is now World Class" thread. I like them, they do a good job, no real complaints but they do not have the same attention to detail and sense of urgency that good International Airlines are renowned for. Delta does a great job most of the time but putting them in the "World Class" league tells me the person doing so has not recently traveled in a real premium product.

Remember when there was a thread about DL becoming a "Premium" carrier in Asia? Well, this is the sort of thing that people were talking about when they were basically laughing at that notion.

Remember when there was a thread about DL becoming a "Premium" carrier in Asia? Well, this is the sort of thing that people were talking about when they were basically laughing at that notion.

^

Asian carriers tend to be much more proactive, in particular in the terms of baggage and logistics. My experience with JL is they know the bag didn't make it by the time you get to baggage claim and they are looking for you.

Priority baggage also MEANS something to the ground staff. They take pride in getting off on the belt first.

Asian carriers tend to be much more proactive, in particular in the terms of baggage and logistics. My experience with JL is they know the bag didn't make it by the time you get to baggage claim and they are looking for you.

To be completely fair, I have to say that a few years ago I was flying NWA:
MSN-DTW-YOW-DTW-AMS-onward (MR -- don't ask).
Anyway, MSN-DTW was delayed, making my connection at YOW (different tickets) a quick one since I was supposed to be on the same aircraft turning around (you have to clear customs and immigration at YOW before you can board). We made it, but our bags didn't. By the time that I reached DTW, I had two voicemails stating that my bags had not made the flight, but that they would be on the next one out and on to AMS from there. ^

Yup, sounds like a great flight and performance by KE ( I use them from LA to INC sometimes).. This is where I was coming from in the "Delta is now World Class" thread. I like them, they do a good job, no real complaints but they do not have the same attention to detail and sense of urgency that good International Airlines are renowned for. Delta does a great job most of the time but putting them in the "World Class" league tells me the person doing so has not recently traveled in a real premium product.

You're absolutely right. It's foolish to expect this type of service from any US carrier. Their networks are just too unwieldy to allow such service for every passenger. (Remember, I wasn't being treated like a DM here...)

I think the reason has more to do with size than anything else. KE is a small airline with one hub (which happens to be one of the best airports in the world - that certainly helps). With such a comparatively-uncomplicated operation, it has many more available resources to deal with pure customer service. The same is true for all the respected Asian carriers.

Remember when there was a thread about DL becoming a "Premium" carrier in Asia? Well, this is the sort of thing that people were talking about when they were basically laughing at that notion. KE, CX, SQ, MH, TG: when it comes to service recovery, all these Asian carriers will apologize and take fast action while DL, AA, UA laugh in your face and walk away. American carriers don't have the DNA to ever be "premium" carriers in Asia.

You're absolutely right. It's foolish to expect this type of service from any US carrier. Their networks are just too unwieldy to allow such service for every passenger. (Remember, I wasn't being treated like a DM here...)

I think the reason has more to do with size than anything else. KE is a small airline with one hub (which happens to be one of the best airports in the world - that certainly helps). With such a comparatively-uncomplicated operation, it has many more available resources to deal with pure customer service. The same is true for all the respected Asian carriers.

Agreed. I gotta tell you though, I just flew in an all Biz Singapore A340-500 from LA to SIN and the service made KE look slightly lacking. The price was a ridiculous $3200!~ To say they treat you like an elite is to make the understatement of the year..It was completely amazing and I am not a rookie on Asian and ME airlines. I was not sure what to expect because some very informed FT'ers had told me that SQ was going downhill. They need to give it another shot ;) AMAZING.

I just had the most amazing experience flying JFK-ICN on the DL-coded, KE-operated flight.

First of all, the flight was delightful. Very nice crew, good food, brand new fully-flat seats in J, great AVOD selection, on a 77W couldn't have been more than a year old. The JFK lounge attendant invited me into the first class side, even though I was in business. (E+ perk?)

Once onboard, doors closed 20 minutes early, and we arrived on time 14 hours later.

Immigration was a breeze, and I arrived at baggage claim the minute the belt started moving. First bags were all tagged priority, and of those mine was the 10th off the belt.

This was a flawless experience, how flying should be - and now, the mind blowing part:

When I retrieved my bag, I discovered it was dripping wet, on the outside. (It was not raining at ICN - no idea where the water came from.) The water hadn't permeated the interior of the bag and all my clothing was fine... but the exterior was now wet and fairly dirty. I really wasn't too upset about it, and I would have just left, had I not bumped right into a man in a KE uniform who was standing there to monitor the process.

As soon as he saw the bag, he immediately apologized, took out a two-way radio and called his supervisor, who ran over within 3 minutes.

The supervisor acted as if the airline had lost my dog. He apologized profusely, and filled out an incident report on the spot. He told me I can get the bag dry-cleaned in Korea and KE would reimburse me. But then, as he handed me my copy of the form, he handed me an envelope as well, saying it was "for dry cleaning." I figured this was the envelope to mail in a receipt. I was wrong.

In the envelope was 50,000 won in cash, the equivalent of $50!

I am a big fan of DL and DL people; I'm by no means knocking them. Having said that, I've never encountered such proactive service recovery. The entire process, from getting the bag to getting the cash, took less than 10 minutes.

Amazing!

Thanks for posting this. I like KE; they can be a little ridid at times, but the FAs are first rate. The ICN Business Lounge is super.

There could be others, but KE is the only airline I know of that has one of the FAs clean the toilets during the flight.

Passed through TPE and NRT last week on a MR, my first time in Asia, and its amazing how much nicer and more polite the airline staff are over there then in the US.

Flew ORD-ICN KE on the 744 last year and the baggage service was horrific almost worse than DTW when they split the bags between two belts and you don't know where your luggage is going to come out. Took nearly an hour for the first bags to start rolling and then as far as I could tell there was no priority just everyones bags at once. And there was only one round of alcohol service in Y for the entire flight. Beats Delta's 744's in Y but not even close to service on their 777

Thanks for posting this. I like KE; they can be a little ridid at times, but the FAs are first rate. The ICN Business Lounge is super.

There could be others, but KE is the only airline I know of that has one of the FAs clean the toilets during the flight.

You can add EVA (Taiwan based) to the in-flight toilet cleaning list. They are also an exceptional airline. The premium economy cabin is great and J is even better.

All my KE experiences have been great even the ones in Y.

Passed through TPE and NRT last week on a MR, my first time in Asia, and its amazing how much nicer and more polite the airline staff are over there then in the US.

No doubt on the airline front-line employees.

OTOH, the gate lice are worse!

You're absolutely right. It's foolish to expect this type of service from any US carrier. Their networks are just too unwieldy to allow such service for every passenger. (Remember, I wasn't being treated like a DM here...)

I think the reason has more to do with size than anything else. KE is a small airline with one hub (which happens to be one of the best airports in the world - that certainly helps). With such a comparatively-uncomplicated operation, it has many more available resources to deal with pure customer service. The same is true for all the respected Asian carriers.
It has Nothing to do with network size. Small us carriers like jet blue and southwest can't be imagined having the same service standards. It is much more cultural - Asian carriers are run for their customers, US carriers are run for their employees.

There could be others, but KE is the only airline I know of that has one of the FAs clean the toilets during the flight.

JL does that too. Even in Y. They even have a special cleaning apron (different from the meal service apron).

JL does that too. Even in Y. They even have a special cleaning apron (different from the meal service apron).

SQ as well. Every time I went to the lav, the tp was folded hotel style and there wasn't a spot of water or anything else anywhere.

Flew on both KE & DL Transpacific in J two weeks ago. The attention to detail on KE was amazing. KE had staff always smiling. The KE pursar introduced himself to everyone in J at takeoff and thanked us for fying KE. Service on KE was always prompt and with a smile - felt like they cared about us. At the end of the flight KE purar and flight attendant thank us for flying KE again.

There could be others, but KE is the only airline I know of that has one of the FAs clean the toilets during the flight.

Actually, it's mostly US carriers that DON'T do this. KL, MH and others definitely clean the lavs. In fact, MH Y lavs have the amenities that DL has in J lavs, and then some. (I may be mistaking but I think DL started to do it, or was planning on it anyway, so there may be an improvement there.)

It is much more cultural - Asian carriers are run for their customers, US carriers are run for their employees.
I disagree. US carriers are run for the shareholders and for the execs. Customers are among the last in the list of priorities and they're only on the list because without them there would be no profits/dividends.

OTOH, the gate lice are worse!

There is nothing like flying in China.
F,J, means nothing when boarding time comes.

I flew economy on KE quite recently. In the final days of NW miles I was able to book three tickets for early january 2010 at 60K each to Seoul and oward to SIN.

It really was nice -- flying with a small child they ushered us into a fenced off area of the gate in ORD and boarded us before businss class. The stroller and car seat were wrapped in thick plastic to prevent any dirt. They gave us a little plane shaped magnetic drawing slate to entertain our toddler.

On board the wine was served in really tiny cups, which seemed weird until I realized that even in economy they would replenish it regularly. (Although the gin and tonic was equally minute and wasn't refilled). The AVOD worked well, and the food was good. In the KE business lounge in Seoul they served Remy Martin XO.


Much superior to the NRT-ATL DL flight on the way home, though to be fair as others have pointed out this is a US vs. Asian carrier thing rather than anything particularly bad about DL transpacific economy.

Only weird thing: the plane was stiflingly hot, yet the Koreans were in heavy coats and shivering. Dress lightly.

There is nothing like flying in China.
F,J, means nothing when boarding time comes.

Worse than AF passengers? :D

There is nothing like flying in China.
F,J, means nothing when boarding time comes.


China is bad, India is worse.

Further, I do not understand any argument here; US Legacy Carriers are some of the worst in the world. If I could leave delta forever and instead fly Emirates from ATL-LAX, trust me I would. But of course, this isn't an option. I put up with these US Legacies because I live in the US; no other reason. When Im over in Italy ill fly LF/AF/CX/BA etc.

Try telling an Asian business man who regularly flys a 1.2 hour flight from say PVG to PEK and gets a hot meal in coach that in the US we have our heads so far up our A** that we don't serve a meal on a 5.6 hour JFK-LAX transcontinental flight. Chances are he will laugh in disgust (and trust me, they do!).

China is bad, India is worse.

Further, I do not understand any argument here; US Legacy Carriers are some of the worst in the world. If I could leave delta forever and instead fly Emirates from ATL-LAX, trust me I would. But of course, this isn't an option. I put up with these US Legacies because I live in the US; no other reason. When Im over in Italy ill fly LF/AF/CX/BA etc.

But until we shake the 95% of the folks in this country to wake them up from their trance of lowest-common-denominator consumption, we're doomed to mediocre. Passable, but mediocre nonetheless.

China is bad, India is worse.

Boarding an IC regional jet in DEL last month was like 4th and Goal at the final play of the Super Bowl. The flight was inexplicably delayed. When it started boarding, we boarded through the same gate as 3 other flights. When you exit the gate, you shove onto a bus that drives you out onto the tarmac where the plane is waiting. Then you shove to board the plane. When you land, you shove to get off the plane. There was no drink/meal service (even for purchase) on either part of the flight (DEL-KNU-IXD).

US legacy carriers are a joke compared to East Asian ones, even the discount airlines. As was said earlier, if I could fly SQ/CX/KE domestically, I would in a second.

I got a snack box in F from CVG-LAX because I only had a 36 minute window to connect and couldn't get dinner.

The "basket" is ok but you can't put together a meal out of it.

On another note, my choices to get to LA are connect through DTW and ATL, which have more F services that I can't get upgraded to, or connect through MEM and CVG, which have only the bigger seats (A320s, for the most part) that I can get upgraded to.

I generally choose the smaller hubs and the actual upgrades. I haven't tried MSP - how easy is it to get an upgrade on MSP-LAX and what planes do they fly?

KL, MH and others definitely clean the lavs. In fact, MH Y lavs have the amenities that DL has in J lavs, and then some. (I may be mistaking but I think DL started to do it, or was planning on it anyway, so there may be an improvement there.) Even if DL FAs were directed to maintain lav cleanliness inflight, chances are they wouldn't do it. One of the big service problems on US carriers is that flight crews are free to ignore service directives without reprisal. They mostly do whatever they want no matter what the "experience design" may be.

US Legacy Carriers are some of the worst in the world. If I could leave delta forever and instead fly Emirates from ATL-LAX, trust me I would. Well, I would say US legacy carriers are the worst major ones in the developed world, anyway. But the operating environment here is totally different. Airlines in the US are public transit. There is a big difference operationally between dispatching twelve 757s a day from ORD to DFW and dispatching one A380 from DXB to SYD.

The cultural problem here is that US network carriers use the fact that it's a high-volume, price-sensitive market as an excuse to provide unpleasant service. I can't tell you how often, these past ten years, I've heard FAs blame passengers for chasing low fares and ruining their industry. Hey, I didn't set the fares, I just buy 'em.

Only weird thing: the plane was stiflingly hot, yet the Koreans were in heavy coats and shivering. Dress lightly.

If you think that was bad, try riding the bus in Korea! I still don't understand how Koreans can wear coats/blankets in an 80 degree bus or plane!

The cultural problem here is that US network carriers use the fact that it's a high-volume, price-sensitive market as an excuse to provide unpleasant service. I can't tell you how often, these past ten years, I've heard FAs blame passengers for chasing low fares and ruining their industry. Hey, I didn't set the fares, I just buy 'em. True not sure how many industries can blame the customers for ruining it.

When I was a boy in the 1980s, the US airlines were great, domestic service and meals were first rate, in both Y & F. The US international flight standards Asia/Europe of UA, Pan Am, Braniff, TWA, AA, CO, and DL were amoung the best in the world!

I fondly remember my first flight on KE and they served a single black olive. I thought it was a rotten grape. :D

I have flown KE many times over the years and never had a bad experience flying...their corporate issues (ie palau fare) are a completely different matter

I have flown KE many times over the years and never had a bad experience flying...their corporate issues (ie palau fare) are a completely different matter

I laugh every time I hear their commercial with the tagline "Excellence in Flight."

It is much more cultural - Asian carriers are run for their customers, US carriers are run for their employees.I disagree. US carriers are run for the shareholders and for the execs. Customers are among the last in the list of priorities and they're only on the list because without them there would be no profits/dividends.
I have to disagree with both of you. All carriers are operated with shareholder profits as its number one priority. If they didn't, then they would be out of business. Remember, profits keep you in the game. But, OTOH, US-based carriers seem to think that outstanding customer service should take a back seat. That's a big no-no.

In the envelope was 50,000 won in cash, the equivalent of $50!


I have flown NZ in C. I was standing next to the captain and NZ staff when I collected my bags off the belt soaking wet. It dried by the time I got to the hotel. So meh. Didn't receive any compensation. Guess I got a reason to fly Korean.

Just read that KE has their own organic farm on Jeju to provide ingredients for their in-flight meals.
That's quite amazing actually.

I have 4 flights SEA ICN on KE and 6 on UA SEA to SIN via Narita, so 12 flights UA in total. KE was nicer for sure but the UA flights were just fine, and far better than the Lufthansa flights SEA to FRA I've been on. And my flights in Lufthansa 1st in Europe were quite lame compared to a lot of domestic 1st I've had in the states.

Maybe I've been lucky, but I'm good for a US to Asia UA flight anytime in J or F.

They also got the top price for the airlinetrends.com’s 2012 ranking of the world’s most innovative airlines.

Just read that KE has their own organic farm on Jeju to provide ingredients for their in-flight meals.
That's quite amazing actually.

Just for premium travellers or everyone?

There could be others, but KE is the only airline I know of that has one of the FAs clean the toilets during the flight.

This is standard on many world class carriers when it comes to long haul flights.

This is standard on many world class carriers when it comes to long haul flights.
KE is much more conscientious about it than MH in my experience.

Just for premium travellers or everyone?

Probably makes sense to do it for all class. They do own other transportation sectors like hotels and employee food programs.