European Rail Travel - Dangerous Overnight Trains

We will be traveling in Central Europe in May. To maximize our time, we would like to take the overnight express trains from Krakow to Budapest and from Budapest to Prague. Is it all hype about the potential danger? Should we be concerned. If not, when and where should tickets be purchased. Thanks.

We will be traveling in Central Europe in May. To maximize our time, we would like to take the overnight express trains from Krakow to Budapest and from Budapest to Prague. Is it all hype about the potential danger? Should we be concerned. If not, when and where should tickets be purchased. Thanks.


Welcome to FT,fengsui888. While I can't answer your question you may find an answer in the below link.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/european-rail-travel-654/

what potential danger?

Why would trains in Poland/Hungary/Czech be any less safe than trains in other parts of the world/Europe?

It hasnt been 1993 for a long time.

The main risk on a night train in central Europe (as in most other places) is petty theft. This can be avoided by making sure that valuable/difficult-to-replace things (notably passport, money and credit cards) are kept on or very near your person in such a way that they can't be got at with your being disturbed.

There are scarier stories about trains in Russia and so on, but even here ordinary precautions will generally suffice.

please continue to follow this thread in our European Rail Travel forum :)

regards,

chrissxb
co-moderator
europe forum

The main risk on a night train in central Europe (as in most other places) is petty theft. This can be avoided by making sure that valuable/difficult-to-replace things (notably passport, money and credit cards) are kept on or very near your person in such a way that they can't be got at with your being disturbed.

I'd worry more about petty theft/pickpockets in Prague and Budapest than on the train.

I'd worry more about petty theft/pickpockets in Prague and Budapest than on the train.

No doubt!

I'm not saying that there was never an incident or even a concern, but this is a classic case of travel myth that has been circulating around the internet and poorly researched guide books for a good while now.

Half of your question might be easily answered: the Cracow-Budapest overnight train has sleepers and leaves and arrives at decent times. The Budapest-Prague-Berlin train, however, arrives in Prague at 4:00 a.m. You might want to take a daytime train and not worry about nighttime thieves.

No doubt!

I'm not saying that there was never an incident or even a concern, but this is a classic case of travel myth that has been circulating around the internet and poorly researched guide books for a good while now.
I have been taking overnight trains in Central & Eastern Europe and the former Soviet Union for nearly 20 years now. I recall the copies of Lonely Planet warning of being gassed in your sleep and having your worldly possessions stolen if you did not somehow barricade yourself in your compartment, and warning that you should never accept food or drinks from fellow travellers *eyeroll*. All I can say is I have never faced problems; never met anybody in the region who faced difficulties; and none of those acquiescences ever had tales of anybody else who had difficulties on overnight trains. Yes, you may not sleep well if you are sensitive and the toilets might smell a bit sometimes, but exercise some common sense and the chances are you won't be killed in your sleep like some second rate Agatha Christie tale!

We will be traveling in Central Europe in May. To maximize our time, we would like to take the overnight express trains from Krakow to Budapest and from Budapest to Prague. Is it all hype about the potential danger? Should we be concerned. If not, when and where should tickets be purchased. Thanks.

I've traveled several night trains in Romania, Hungary, CR, Poland, etc. They were all safe experience. Though the train in Romania was very run down and the door wouldn't lock. The only thing to watch for is petty theft while you sleep.

I've heard a few bad stories of Belarus night trains from other travelers, but no worries any where else.

The Budapest-Prague-Berlin train, however, arrives in Prague at 4:00 a.m. You might want to take a daytime train and not worry about nighttime thieves.

The Budapest-Prague sleepers on this train arrive in Prague at the less uncivilised time of 06:19.

Back to the OP - you are right to have some concerns. Night trains do tend to attract all sorts - remember, for some people in that part of the world, getting a seat on a night train can be the cheapest way of travelling long distances.

These trains are corridor trains which means that passengers can walk the whole length of the train. One of the problems is that you cannot lock the sleeping compartment door from the outside (except on the newest Comfortline accommodation which does not operate on these services). So if you leave your compartment, to go to the restaurant car for example, make sure you get the sleeping car attendant to lock it for you. He will tell you not to leave valuables inside.

I, too, have travelled extensively on night trains. I've seen a few incidents. On one train, a man in the couchette compartment I was in claimed he'd had his wallet stolen. On the last night train I was on (in Germany), the train was delayed en route, the police called and a dubious individual taken off the train.

Don't be hyper-sensitive about it, but do keep your wits about you, as you would in the street.

Honestly, you'd think from some guidebooks that the second you set foot on European soil, you'll be robbed blind the second your back's turned, and have the clothes taken off your back before you even sit down on one of the trains.

Yes, lots of sleeping people in one place can be tempting for opportunistic thieves, as can crowds and luggage racks. There are some hotspots for it, but even these get overblown.

As said above, be aware, don't take unnecessary risks (particularly with things that would be a major hassle to be without when far from home), but don't be paranoid. You're not likely to get robbed, just as you're not likely to catch rabies from every dog you see when you arrive in France*, not likely to be held up at gunpoint the second you enter the US, and not likely to be arrested as a spy the moment you arrive in China.

* This is a British thing, from some years ago now, when we were less well travelled and less well acquainted with our neighbours. The UK is almost entirely rabies-free now, thanks to the combination of being an island and strict quarantine measures. Terrifying-looking RABIES posters used to be displayed at all ports of entry, which, coupled with a certain infamiliarity, used to cause some visitors to France to be in a constant state of worry about rabid animals all around them.

I think trains, even night trains, are actually safer than streets because the criminals cannot get away after committing a crime. They can only leave the train when it is in a station. And not all night trains have stops during the night.

And not all night trains have stops during the night.

:confused: That's very helpful - perhaps you can give an example?

Note to OP: the Krakow - Budapest night train has 13 intermediate stops, and the Budapest - Prague night train has 11 intermediate stops.

I don't have an example from memory, however, this comes fairly close: CNL40419 leaves Cologne at 23:46 and arrives in Zürich the next morning at 08:20. There are a couple of stops in Germany, but the last is at 01:56 and the rest of the trip has no stops until the destination.

The Budapest-Prague sleepers on this train arrive in Prague at the less uncivilised time of 06:19.



The Czech railways and the Slovak railways websites as well as the Winter 2010-2011 Cook's European Rail Timetable[I] show one train leaving Budapest at 19:55, with the through cars to Berlin calling at Prague at 4:00 and the cars with a Prague destination added to a slower train from Bratislava and arriving at Prague at 6:19. The German rail website, [I]generally up-to-date and authoritative, however, doesn't show the Prague cars, nor does the Hungarian website. I wonder whether they might have been recently dropped. Ideal, of course, would be to run them in the faster train and have them sit in Prague station until a decent hour, as is done in England and was also done in the U.S. until not too long ago, but I'm not aware of any setup like that on the continent.

I was Hungarian some years ago (fixed that since, thanks Canada!) and while the trains there are slow and often smelly the worst that will happen there that you sit on a seat still wet from another passengers various bodily fluids :/ sorry but that's quite often, alas. I have slept on the Budapest-Munich train and nothing happened.

I'd worry more about petty theft/pickpockets in Prague and Budapest than on the train.
So would I. I was merely saying that petty theft on the train is more likely than anything "dangerous" happening...

I don't have an example from memory, however, this comes fairly close: CNL40419 leaves Cologne at 23:46 and arrives in Zürich the next morning at 08:20. There are a couple of stops in Germany, but the last is at 01:56 and the rest of the trip has no stops until the destination.

Actually, it makes 6 stops from 04:37 before it gets to Zürich.

The German rail website, generally up-to-date and authoritative, however, doesn't show the Prague cars, nor does the Hungarian website.

Both the DB site and the MAV site show this train.

Presumably you are not seeing it on the DB site, because it will only show the fastest service unless prompted to do otherwise. If you put up a stopover in Pardubice of an hour, it will show a "connecting" service, but if you then click on EN 476 for the detail, it shows the through service from Budapest to Prague arriving at 06:19.

And here (http://www.mav-start.hu/res/en_476_477_metropol_11.pdf) is the train in detail on the MAV website. Conveniently for the OP, this shows the composition of both the Krakow-Budapest and Budapest-Prague services, since they are effectively portions of the same train to/from Budapest.

Presumably you are not seeing it on the DB site, because it will only show the fastest service unless prompted to do otherwise. If you put up a stopover in Pardubice of an hour, it will show a "connecting" service, but if you then click on EN 476 for the detail, it shows the through service from Budapest to Prague arriving at 06:19.


Ah yes,there it is. Thanks. It looks as if the former Bratislava-Prague train which took the Budapest-Prague cars has now been cut back to Pardubice-Prague, with the cars laying over for 2 1/2 hours in Pardubice. That's much better of course, since the slow Bratislava-Prague train stopped at every little town during the night. The DB website has a provision for finding this slower - but more comfortable - connection, but the Hungarian one doesn't seem to - or do you see a way of finding the slower connections on the Hungarian site when looking up train connections (not on the specific schedule for the "Metropol")? Is the Hungarian Railway one that bases its reservation and train information system on the DB's Hafas?

thx for sharing this experience! it is calming!

I've seen gangs of thieves on the Prague metro train and elsewhere, and was victimized once on my first day there (quite a professional operation). After that I never carried anything valuable that wasn't well concealed and in a place that would require stripping of some of my clothes to get to.

I've seen gangs of thieves on the Prague metro train and elsewhere, and was victimized once on my first day there (quite a professional operation). After that I never carried anything valuable that wasn't well concealed and in a place that would require stripping of some of my clothes to get to.

Well, there are pickpockets on public transportation (and in other places tourists frequent) in Prague, like many cities in Europe, and yes, they sometimes work in pairs or groups, but "gangs of thieves" is a bit overly dramatic.

I travelled many times in Europe by train, for example Zurich - Amsterdam. I never felt unsafe or uncomfortable. Of course, look your door and be careful, but its not more dangerous than other ways of travel.

Enjoy your train ride.

Well, there are pickpockets on public transportation (and in other places tourists frequent) in Prague, like many cities in Europe, and yes, they sometimes work in pairs or groups, but "gangs of thieves" is a bit overly dramatic.

Don't take it personally, Czech R. is wonderful, people are wonderful, and I hope to return again some day. It is wise to be very careful when in crowded public areas.

Don't take it personally, Czech R. is wonderful, people are wonderful, and I hope to return again some day. It is wise to be very careful when in crowded public areas.

Most definitely. And the same is true in almost any city in Europe of size.

I didn't take it personally, I just didn't want people to get the wrong idea...the words "gangs" and "thieves" seem like severe words to me when 'pickpocketers of opportunity' is more apt. Your phrase makes it sound as if people are being surrounded on the street and made to give up their worldly possessions and not, as is most often, distracted tourists who are not being mindful of their electronics, bags, or cash.

'pickpocketers of opportunity' is more apt.
While touristy areas offer lots of "opportunity" for pickpockets, I wouldn't use "opportunity" or "opportunistic" to describe the pickpockets who target tourists many large European cities. The way they select their "marks" and execute their crimes is planned and deliberate.

While touristy areas offer lots of "opportunity" for pickpockets, I wouldn't use "opportunity" or "opportunistic" to describe the pickpockets who target tourists many large European cities. The way they select their "marks" and execute their crimes is planned and deliberate.

It's deliberate but it's not planned in that they select the best target in the region. They pick whomever is likely to lend the greatest return with the least effort. While disgusted with the result I am amazed at the skill.

Note: I've not been prey to or observed active pickpockets in Europe, put have had a map (joke's on you) stolen in Argnentina, and seen theives at work in SEAsia

It's deliberate but it's not planned in that they select the best target in the region. They pick whomever is likely to lend the greatest return with the least effort.

"Picking whomever is likely to lend the greatest return with the least effort" is a significant element in what I would call planned and deliberate crime. In any line of business, planning your activities to achieve greatest return for least effort is a considered strategy - it's planned. It's quite different from opportunistic action.

The modi operandi of the criminals are well rehearsed and the various tactics actually have names:
The mustard squirter (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/dec/13/alan-bennett-pickpocket-scam).
The pratfall.
The bump, stall and dip.
(It's like Ocean's 11, but without George Clooney).

I don't want to sound hysterical about this. In truth, I'm pretty relaxed in most cities I visit. However, in crowded, touristy places, I try to behave in ways that don't make me a "mark" for the very deliberate criminals who hang out in those places and are well prepared to carry out crimes with rehearsed and planned tactics.

Honestly, what I've seen in Prague isn't like what you'll see in southern European cities. Never seen the mustard/goo squirter or the pratfall. If you sit down and watch the people in Old Town Square, you'll see how it works. People gather around, staring up at the astronomical clock. There's a path and a pace that tourists take (and most people in the square are tourists during the summer). Then there are these people who aren't going with the flow, who are moving at a different pace, and who also are in the same place they were 20 minutes earlier. They're walking around, seeing what electronics or bags or cash is easily accessible. Then, as the area in front of the clock fills up before it chimes, they settle in behind their target. As the chiming ends, people disperse.

See it happen on the Charles Bridge...tourists crawling alone, pointing at the kitsch for sale, looking at the view of the castle, of the old town, of the river, pointing at paddle boats, looking at the statues on the side of the bridge. Stop and put your bag down for a second while your friend takes a photo of you. Your purse dips open as your arm extends and you point at the paddleboaters.

On the metro. Put your bag down, bury your head in a map, talk to your companions. A lot of people get off at the nexrt stop, but where's your bag?

I know violent crime does happen. I have no doubt that people get mugged or beaten. But out of all the places I've visited and lived, PRague feels like the safest to me.

I travelled many times in Europe by train, for example Zurich - Amsterdam. I never felt unsafe or uncomfortable. Of course, look your door and be careful, but its not more dangerous than other ways of travel.

Enjoy your train ride.


No offense, but a train trip from Zurich to Amsterdam is hard to compare to an overnight journey in eastern Europe. As recently as the mid 90s I heard horror stories of banditry while I was residing in Prague. While conditions have improved considerably, I would still suggest being extra cautious.

Both the DB site and the MAV site show this train.

Presumably you are not seeing it on the DB site, because it will only show the fastest service unless prompted to do otherwise. If you put up a stopover in Pardubice of an hour, it will show a "connecting" service, but if you then click on EN 476 for the detail, it shows the through service from Budapest to Prague arriving at 06:19.

And here (http://www.mav-start.hu/res/en_476_477_metropol_11.pdf) is the train in detail on the MAV website. Conveniently for the OP, this shows the composition of both the Krakow-Budapest and Budapest-Prague services, since they are effectively portions of the same train to/from Budapest.


Pardon using an old thread, but it contained a lot of useful information for me. Thanks to the previous posters! It's been super helpful in my planning process.

I am looking at booking the Budapest to Prague Night train referenced above, with EN476/718 arriving in Prague at 6:19am. I had a couple of questions since there's a wealth of knowledge in this forum.

1. It sounds like I can only book the tickets when I get to Budapest without going through a travel agent. I'm looking for a 2-person sleeper for a Monday night. I arrive in Budapest 2 days prior. a) What are the odds of the sleeper being sold out? b) Will the price jump significantly by not booking in advance? c) What is the ballpark price for a 2-person sleeper for 2 people?

2. How long after arrival can you stay on the train? I'm not sure if I would better off sleeping in a bit and heading out when more of the city is open (ie someplace to pick up a day pass and get change in the train station)

I apologize if the questions seem ignorant or too detailed (Type a personality :-P) Thanks in advance for the help!

Pardon using an old thread, but it contained a lot of useful information for me. Thanks to the previous posters! It's been super helpful in my planning process.

I am looking at booking the Budapest to Prague Night train referenced above, with EN476/718 arriving in Prague at 6:19am. I had a couple of questions since there's a wealth of knowledge in this forum.

1. It sounds like I can only book the tickets when I get to Budapest without going through a travel agent. I'm looking for a 2-person sleeper for a Monday night. I arrive in Budapest 2 days prior. a) What are the odds of the sleeper being sold out? b) Will the price jump significantly by not booking in advance? c) What is the ballpark price for a 2-person sleeper for 2 people?

2. How long after arrival can you stay on the train? I'm not sure if I would better off sleeping in a bit and heading out when more of the city is open (ie someplace to pick up a day pass and get change in the train station)

I apologize if the questions seem ignorant or too detailed (Type a personality :-P) Thanks in advance for the help!

Surprisingly, there are no global, advance-purchase fares for the night train from Budapest to Prague. This means that you have to buy a ticket plus a separate supplement for the sleeper.

The full one-way 2nd class fare is an eye-watering €78.40 each. (Don't get a first class ticket - the sleeping compartments are all the same, and you only need a first class ticket if you are travelling alone and want a whole compartment to yourself).

However, you can now buy a cheap, walk-up, excursion ticket (“kirándulójegy”) from Budapest to Prague for only €49 each. This is valid on all direct trains, including the night train, without break of journey. This is actually a round-trip ticket, valid for up to 4 days, but you just don’t use the return.

The sleeper supplement, for two people sharing one compartment, is only €21 each on the train arriving Prague at 06:19. (The supplement for the earlier arrival at Prague, on the portion of the train going to Berlin, is higher).

There are no guarantees there will be sleeper availability if you only book when you get to Budapest, but Monday is certainly not the busiest night of the week on which to travel. Agencies such as Rail Europe can book it for you in advance, but at a price. However, you can only buy the excursion ticket in Hungary.

You will almost certainly be turfed off the train as soon as you get to Prague - no lie-ins allowed, I'm afraid. :eek:

Thanks for the advice! I appreciate the information.

The trip is not until Sept so I have a bit of time to narrow my itinerary. Hopefully that will be shoulder season too, so I will have fewer people to compete against. I guess I'll take my chances with booking it there.