Singapore - relocating to SIN, new FFP and Creditcard

hi guys,

i'm going to relocate to SIN this year and need some advice on the following

Currently i'm a FB member but i don't think that's the best FFP for the region, i will be traveling a decent amount in Asia+ a few trips to the US/Europe (6-8 annual)
I know Sing Krisflyer looks like the logical choice because it's their hub, but i've heard that it's difficult to spend miles with them. how big are the upgrade changes?

I also need a new bank, so (a) new creditcard(s), are there any programs that you can earn status miles like AF/KL AMEX Gold FR?

thanks for your advice.

note: i travel mainly in coach/economy

for banks.. suggest you open a DBS/POSB bank which is most common and convenient as they have plenty of ATMs around and some branches open on weekends till late.. which is a plus point.

for FF programs. UOB credit cards allows you to do that and you don't need to have an account to apply for their cards.

hope it helps!

thanks!

but can i get status miles with credit cards in the region? for any FFP? i can't find it anywhere..

Your question is clear but how to respond probably isn't.

On the credit card with FFP linkage - it might be better if you think about your basic travel pattern to decide what will be your focus airline and/or primary airline alliance once you move here. Yes, SQ would be the logical one to earn miles on but they are generally more expensive than the competition - something to be mindful of if it is your company paying for your travel. What probably makes more sense is to look at where you will be flying to the most (both business and pleasure), and see which alliance services the majority of those locations, then choose an airline program where you can get the benefit of say Gold status on the bulk of your revenue flights plus redeem the points easily on the alliance partners for award tickets. For argument's sake, this might mean keeping your points with say QF or TG or CX or LH even though these are not these airline home countries. On the upgrade opporunities with SQ, you probably need to continue trolling the SQ forum, and ask there any specific questions that you can't find an answer to otherwise.

Back to the credit card with FFP linkage - you have already found the FT thread on the DBS/KrisFlyer linked card. This type of program is not as well publicized in this part of the world although I'm sure it exists in specific markets. Here in Singapore the abovementioned DBS/SQ program is one, and ohyum notes that UOB (another one of our local banks) has one as well. What is your specific question then?

Finally on the issue of bank accounts, if I might add on to ohyum's recommendiation of DBS/POSB - it is useful to get an account with this bank not only because the ATM machines are just about everywhere, but also because they work with the main local debit system called NETS. However note that as a foreigner soon to be based here traveling in the region and internationally you may wish to see if one of the other local (and foreign) banks may offer you an account that better suits your needs. I would say get a DBS or POSB (they're sister banks) account for local Singapore needs, and possibly an account with one of the other banks that you can use for local and overseas.

BTW who is FB? Nearest as I can see FB is the code for Bulgaria Airlines (that's on both Yahoo and Wikipedia).

Your question is clear but how to respond probably isn't.

On the credit card with FFP linkage - it might be better if you think about your basic travel pattern to decide what will be your focus airline and/or primary airline alliance once you move here. Yes, SQ would be the logical one to earn miles on but they are generally more expensive than the competition - something to be mindful of if it is your company paying for your travel. What probably makes more sense is to look at where you will be flying to the most (both business and pleasure), and see which alliance services the majority of those locations, then choose an airline program where you can get the benefit of say Gold status on the bulk of your revenue flights plus redeem the points easily on the alliance partners for award tickets. For argument's sake, this might mean keeping your points with say QF or TG or CX or LH even though these are not these airline home countries. On the upgrade opporunities with SQ, you probably need to continue trolling the SQ forum, and ask there any specific questions that you can't find an answer to otherwise.

Back to the credit card with FFP linkage - you have already found the FT thread on the DBS/KrisFlyer linked card. This type of program is not as well publicized in this part of the world although I'm sure it exists in specific markets. Here in Singapore the abovementioned DBS/SQ program is one, and ohyum notes that UOB (another one of our local banks) has one as well. What is your specific question then?

Finally on the issue of bank accounts, if I might add on to ohyum's recommendiation of DBS/POSB - it is useful to get an account with this bank not only because the ATM machines are just about everywhere, but also because they work with the main local debit system called NETS. However note that as a foreigner soon to be based here traveling in the region and internationally you may wish to see if one of the other local (and foreign) banks may offer you an account that better suits your needs. I would say get a DBS or POSB (they're sister banks) account for local Singapore needs, and possibly an account with one of the other banks that you can use for local and overseas.

BTW who is FB? Nearest as I can see FB is the code for Bulgaria Airlines (that's on both Yahoo and Wikipedia).

Thanks for the time you've spent on your post.

unfortunately i don't know yet, where i will be flying to most. it al depends on where they need me ;-)
My company is paying for the flights and i book the flights myself(or assistent) so i'm flexibel as long as the price difference is not to big)

So for what i understand, there is no Creditcard+FFP where you can get qualification miles for a higher tier?
FB is Flying Blue from KLM and AF.

thanks!

As a traveler DBS is not a good bank to have your primary account with. They charge $5 / transaction overseas. Otherwise I do agree regarding ATM availability on the Island.

As far as FFP goes, I stress you will be at a loss if you decide on any plan other than SQ Krisflyer. SQ has the best airline departure lounge in SIN, and even if you are Star Alliance gold, you get to use just the SATS lounges - a far cry from the SQ lounge. In addition, SQ uses T3 and T2, much better than T1 to depart and Arrive.

Frequent flyers in SIN recommend the Citibank PremierMiles card giving the best miles / $ ratio. But miles accrued by credit card spend do not contribute to status (Does any airline allow this ?)

Hope this helps.

As a traveler DBS is not a good bank to have your primary account with. They charge $5 / transaction overseas. Otherwise I do agree regarding ATM availability on the Island.

As far as FFP goes, I stress you will be at a loss if you decide on any plan other than SQ Krisflyer. SQ has the best airline departure lounge in SIN, and even if you are Star Alliance gold, you get to use just the SATS lounges - a far cry from the SQ lounge. In addition, SQ uses T3 and T2, much better than T1 to depart and Arrive.

Frequent flyers in SIN recommend the Citibank PremierMiles card giving the best miles / $ ratio. But miles accrued by credit card spend do not contribute to status (Does any airline allow this ?)

Hope this helps.

ok, thanks a lot, again valuable information!

When you live in France and have a Amex FLying Blue Gold card, the miles you collect contribute to your status! that's awesome!

As far as FFP goes, I stress you will be at a loss if you decide on any plan other than SQ Krisflyer. SQ has the best airline departure lounge in SIN, and even if you are Star Alliance gold, you get to use just the SATS lounges - a far cry from the SQ lounge. In addition, SQ uses T3 and T2, much better than T1 to depart and Arrive.
Note that you can only use the Silver Kris Lounges if you're PPS, merely SQ*G will not cut it. If the OP is not going to qualify for PPS, the KrisFlyer program may not be a good call at all.

I went through this when I moved to Singapore in 2007. In the end I went with:
- Citibank for banking. I did look very closely at DBS, but Citibank were faster to establish the accounts and offer me a decent credit limit on the PremierMiles card. Citibank also do not charge for foreign ATM withdrawals which was a huge benefit for me. There are Citi ATMs in nearly every MRT station, and the atm5 network (HSBC, ANZ, Maybank, Standard Chartered, SBI, and Citi) is widely enough spread that I never found it an issue finding an ATM nearby. The very rare occasion NETS was taken but credit card wasn't, I was either okay with cash or EZ-Link (which was linked to my credit card...). NETS would have been handy but the other Citi benefits outweighed the lack of NETS.
- AmEx Platinum Reserve credit card for my other credit card, this was mostly because I retained my Australian AmEx and they offered me a Singaporean card with a hefty credit limit which was very useful with the amount of travel I did.
- I opened a KrisFlyer account but only posted MI flights to it, and used it for the credit card miles I accrued.
- I kept my UA and NZ accounts and credited flights to them based on what earned the most for me.

For the most part, if you are not going to be able to qualify as SQ PPS (i.e. a lot of business/first class travel) I think I wouldn't bother with KrisFlyer, unless you are likely to do a lot of flying on MI. I'd look at UA, AC, OZ, TG or A3 for a Star FFP depending on what you want out of it and which airlines you're likely to fly long haul out of SIN. Some of the TG deals for business class can be quite attractive to Europe.

Singapore is a great place to live. I miss it!

Bank: You will need a DBS Bank account. Otherwise you will spend 1/2 the time searching for ATMs. Additional bank - See Standard Chartered/Citi/HSBC

Credit Card: No card gives you status miles. In fact even in the US, except AA, I believe no airline does it

Recommended cards:
Maybank horizon platinum for overseas spending
Citibank premier miles for regular spending
AMEX Rewards card for initial 16000 points for 50 dollars annual fee. Then throw away the card

FFP: Depends on your usage patterns. If you fly a lot of silkair, Krisflyer is only option. Else I recommend crediting your miles to BMI or a US-based airline.

sorry for bringing this old topic up again ;-) but the move is close now.

I will travel between Singapore (home), Dubai and Sydney often (2-3 times per Q.
Next to that twice a month within SEA and some trips to Tokio/Taiwan

do you think SQ is the best option for me?

Any change of a status match from KL/LH/EK?

Hmm. If you wind up in HK/Taiwan/big cities in China, HSBC would be useful as well as Citibank.

do you think SQ is the best option for me?
Probably. Since SIN is their hub. But CX (make sure you visit HK during your time in SE A - great city) also serves all of those locations - so you might want to check with them.

Worth asking about status matching. Would have a better shot if your company wasn't so cheap and sent you in Business. Those are some long Economy flights - hope they don't expect you to be at 100% the minute you hit the ground.

Probably. Since SIN is their hub. But CX (make sure you visit HK during your time in SE A - great city) also serves all of those locations - so you might want to check with them.

Worth asking about status matching. Would have a better shot if your company wasn't so cheap and sent you in Business. Those are some long Economy flights - hope they don't expect you to be at 100% the minute you hit the ground.
thanks for the update.
HK is absolutely on my list, don't worry ;-)
i wil check CX and yes the company is cheap on me but it's my personal choice in the beginning, going to found the APAC office for my current company and want to start with a healty P&L, Busclass tickets are (in the beginning) not part of that.

Any change of a status match from KL/LH/EK?

You may want to status match to BD and then start banking in a new program or into BD.

You may want to status match to BD and then start banking in a new program or into BD.
what's the benefit of going to BD now?

what's the benefit of going to BD now?

Easier to status match than many others. Big multipliers if you travel higher classes. Cash & Miles redemptions. Only need 38K miles to re-qualify for Gold.

Easier to status match than many others. Big multipliers if you travel higher classes. Cash & Miles redemptions. Only need 38K miles to re-qualify for Gold.

Just be aware that BD Diamond Club may have a limited shelf life of another year or so and then could (god forbid it will really happen) be integrated into LH M&M program. Your status would transfer to LH and your miles too, just that redemption values are not as good in LH M&M than in BD.

As it appears that you will be the decision maker of what airlines to use for your travels I would say with a SIN base fly SQ in mileage accruing Eco fares point to point (instead of going via HKG on CX) and credit to BD, LH or UA for example. A3 (Aegan) is great for just getting *A status quickly but redemption values are not as good as BD. Nothing beats BD at this point in time as long as it lasts. Definitely have a *A program to bank to.

A SQ KF account is useful for converting credit card points into KrisFlyer miles and using them for regional travel as needed. At least that's what I do. Many credit cards out there and there is a lively discussion with loads of info in the Singapore Airlines forum here on FT.

As far as banks go, I for one have been here for over 6 years and survived just fine without a DBS / POSB account. My main banking is with Citi and I have a secondary account with Maybank (a large Malaysian bank) for some savings products. But HSBC is definitely also a strong choice.

I had banking relationships with Citi in the previous places I lived at and they got a global funds transfer facility that allows free or almost free transfers (e.g. 10 USD fee) between Citi accounts in different countries. Neat feature if you or family happen to bank with them at home and if you will maintain your accounts there. There are sufficient places to get money from Citi or affiliated (5 network) ATMs in town. If you live centrally in SIN it will be no issue. If you move out further into the heartland than it can get a bit more difficult if out there quick cash is needed.

Have you moved yet? I am on iPhone app and can't see location but where are you moving from?

Have you moved yet? I am on iPhone app and can't see location but where are you moving from?

sept 1 is the date, moving from the Netherlands

Let me know when you arrive. We can grab a beer. Where in NL? My previous employer had HQ in Den Haag so spent a little time here and there in NL.

I'm relocating to SIN in two days. Always look forward to meeting up with FTers. Maybe we can initiate some monthly gathering similar to the Mabodofu in Tokyo.

I'm relocating to SIN in two days. Always look forward to meeting up with FTers. Maybe we can initiate some monthly gathering similar to the Mabodofu in Tokyo.

Welcome to SIN then. Hope you are settling in well. drop me a PM if you got any questions.

Welcome to SIN then. Hope you are settling in well. drop me a PM if you got any questions.

Thanks. I've suggested some folks get together this Friday in http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/singapore/1239704-ongoing-singapore-meet-flyertalker-thread.html if you are free.

I'm resurrecting a somewhat old thread with some banking advice for Singapore.

For the best bank account, I currently prefer Citibank's "Tap and Save" account. It includes a Visa ATM/debit card that doubles as an EZ-Link card (for use on trains, buses, taxis, and for certain purchases). You get a rebate of 1% (Visa transactions) to 1.167% (net rebate for EZ-Link transactions after the reload fee) every time you use the card for purchases with no minimums and no maximums -- really outstanding for a debit card. (Note, however, that Citibank does not allow using the card for Internet purchases.) The ATM card works at plenty of machines, including HSBC, Standard Chartered, Maybank, ANZ, and SBI machines in Singapore. You can withdraw cash using your ATM card anywhere globally, and there's no fee (except possibly the usual 1% Visa network rate and the local machine operator's fee, if any). Maintain a minimum S$2000 balance and the account is free of maintenance fees, and you also get free checks. Interest paid on the account is less awful than elsewhere, particularly if you have regular deposits. Citibank's Global Transfer service, to send money to another Citibank account in most Citibank countries, is much cheaper than any other bank's wire transfer service. (If you qualify for HSBC Premier their comparable service is good, too.) There are some pretty good Citibank promotions at various restaurants and other merchants in Singapore.

What people don't tell you about DBS/POSB is that it's the only bank that routinely has long lines. Sure, there are lots of DBS and POSB ATMs, but you often have to wait to use them. And Singapore is rather small -- let's be honest -- so even if you have a smaller ATM network than DBS's you still have an awful lot of convenience. (But it isn't that much smaller given the "ATM5" network.)

Citibank is not part of NETS, although as another poster mentioned that's not really a problem. If the merchant doesn't take EZ-Link or Visa, just use EPINS (a smaller debit card network) or cash. Not a big deal.

For a credit card, oddly enough Diners Club has the lowest (1% total, including network fee) foreign transaction fee among Singapore-issued cards. Diners Club is accepted in China anywhere UnionPay is accepted (which is as big as it gets there), anywhere JCB is accepted in Japan (ditto), and anywhere Discover Card and Diners Club are accepted. It doesn't have the reach of Visa or MasterCard, but it's pretty good. The only downside I can see is that Diners Club has an annual fee after the first year, although you can pay for it if you accumulate enough reward points.

Almost universally the other credit cards charge a 2.5% total foreign transaction fee (network rate plus bank rate), plus there's a double currency conversion if the foreign transaction is not in either Singapore dollars or U.S. dollars resulting in some extra currency loss. You're better off withdrawing cash at a local fee-free ATM using your Citibank Singapore ATM card and spending that.

Among the mediocre foreign exchange credit cards that aren't named Diners Club, CIMB's World MasterCard is decent with a 1% rebate on everything and no annual fee. CIMB publishes a 1.5% foreign currency markup, but that apparently doesn't include the MasterCard network fee (probably 1%). So expect to pay a net 1.5% on foreign currency transactions with that card. Plus there's a double currency conversion for any non-U.S./Singapore dollar transactions. It's probably the best among a bad bunch when used outside Singapore.

If anyone has found a better credit or debit card issued in Singapore for foreign currency transactions overseas, please post. I'm really quite disappointed.

Some random comments:

Consider getting an AmEx Plat Card issued in Singapore; there seem to be lots of promos for good restaurants, etc. Look for all of the local credit card tie-ins.

SkyTeam could work well for mainland China travel as they have CZ and MU, both of which have large networks and good service. CX has surprisingly few connections from HKG to most major Chinese cities.

For travel from SIN to Dubai and Australia, consider how much of your travel could be covered by Emirates. However, coach is very different from business class, including the business class terminal and lounges in DXB.

While SQ's coach might be as good as coach gets now, it is expensive (as are most SQ biz and IFC tickets) and doesn't help for PSS or whatever status on SQ, which is the valuable status for flying exSIN and flying SQ. Don't confuse coach on SQ with their premier cabins in comparing airlines or FF programs.