US Airways Dividend Miles (Pre-FlightFund Merger) - No Corkscrew, NO Wine in Envoy (funny)

I was on US71 yesterday from SNN to PHL, sitting in Envoy. Right after snack service begins the woman next to me asks for wine and is told that because there is no corkscrew on board, the purser has decided to NOT serve the Envoy wines, but instead passed out the economy bottles. She was also serving the pre-departure champagne during the flight - which addmittedly is a LOT better than the vevue Amiot stuff I am used to on UA.

Anyway, the woman gets upset and complaints that she did not pay envoy ticket to get served coach vinum.

To this, the FA replies in a discrete and nice sort of way, but firmly that she should be lucky to have gotten the upgrade today.

I chatted up the purser during the flight (she later thanked me for being US1 - though I'm just a UA 1K) - she told me that everyone on that flight was an upgrade. So I was wondering...

Did she just make up that cork screw story to avoid wasting the premium bottles on the upgraded bunch?

She later offered me a glass of Piper, after commenting I was the only US1 on that flight - which was great service!

Anyone else here have a similar experience?

Who knows of course, but I really doubt it. I think they were likely telling the truth. Certainly they usually have mostly upgraded people and serve the wine. By the way, I agree that the champagne is better on US. I think even their domestic champagne on transcons is better than what UA serves in international business. On my last US trip from PHL to SAN I drank a bottle and a half on a Saturday morning I liked it so much http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

[This message has been edited by GadgetFreak (edited 05-26-2003).]

It sounds suspicious......but I can't think that it was a plot to deny cockroaches (upgraders) vino. What if somebody walked up and actually PAID for envoy at the last minute?

With the way that caterers and other service people are being screwed over by US, things like a corkscrew disappearing can just "happen".

J-H, OT, What means did you upgrade the flight or was it an award? Just curious.

Write to consumer affairs. It matters not to the flight crew if you upgraded into a seat or paid full freight.

In fact, the only time it is supposed to matter is when non-revs are sitting in those seats.

Paid pax or upgrades--ultimately, the service should be the same and should be of no concern to the flight crew.

This is a very slippery slope to start down--I fear that the attitude of "blame the pax" might be spreading like SARS from Crystal City (and B. Ben's office in particular) to the frontline folks. US cannot afford to have that happen.

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Saving the world, one clue at a time.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by J-H:
I was on US71 yesterday from SNN to PHL, sitting in Envoy. Right after snack service begins the woman next to me asks for wine and is told that because there is no corkscrew on board [...]
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It could be worse. A few months after 9/11, one of my colleagues was flying F (on UA, I think) and asked for wine. When the FA asdly observed that no corkscrew had been loaded, another passenger in F blithely produced one from his carry-on.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by planeluvr:
J-H, OT, What means did you upgrade the flight or was it an award? Just curious.</font>

I used a space available voucher - which was compted to my boss when she flew US to the UK. But these things clear by status, so I don't think it would have cleared had it not been for my US 1 status (UA 1K)...but in any case I was quite impressed with US service, and would recommend them to colleagues and friends.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ClueByFour:

Paid pax or upgrades--ultimately, the service should be the same and should be of no concern to the flight crew.

This is a very slippery slope to start down--I fear that the attitude of "blame the pax" might be spreading like SARS from Crystal City (and B. Ben's office in particular) to the frontline folks. US cannot afford to have that happen.

</font>

Well actaully, I kind of agree with the purser (if that was the case with the wine and cork screw) -

Frankly, I don't think the Non-Elite passengers should be upgraded (to Envoy) at all. Its probably fair that cockroaches NOT get the same level of service as someone who paid full fare J-class...but again, I don't think there are that many people buying J these days...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by J-H:
Well actaully, I kind of agree with the purser (if that was the case with the wine and cork screw) -

Frankly, I don't think the Non-Elite passengers should be upgraded (to Envoy) at all. Its probably fair that cockroaches NOT get the same level of service as someone who paid full fare J-class...but again, I don't think there are that many people buying J these days...</font>

This might make sense in a world without inventory control but those seats are empty or filled with someone upgrading. An empty seat generates no revenue. The main reason many people fly a particular airline when they could get cheaper flights and better connections on another is to get upgrades. Without that the low cost carriers would be doing even better and not many people from NYC for instance would fly US because they always have to connect.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by J-H:
Well actaully, I kind of agree with the purser (if that was the case with the wine and cork screw) -

Frankly, I don't think the Non-Elite passengers should be upgraded (to Envoy) at all. Its probably fair that cockroaches NOT get the same level of service as someone who paid full fare J-class...but again, I don't think there are that many people buying J these days...</font>

This is nonsense. Anyone should be able to upgrade-- you might question the upgrade rules and whether non-elites can upgrade before elites using miles, etc. etc. but its better to have a non-elite in the seat spending 30K miles than to let it go empty. Some airlines (SQ, for example) can fill their Premium seats with no upgrades at all--this is certainly not the case with USAirways.

That said I agree 100% with ClueByFour that it should be irrelevant to the crew whether a passenger used miles or certs to upgrade or paid for the ticket. If this incident occurred exactly as reported (and there's always another side to the story), the purser should have simply provided an apology for the missing corkscrew and having to serve coach wine and written up the incident. We can all understand that mistakes happen and passengers shouldn't get too upset when things like this happen imho (esp. because in my recent experience, even Envoy wine just ain't that good).

It is NOT, however, appropriate to tell a passenger that they were "lucky enough" to get the upgrade. Again, if this occurred exactly as reported above, the purser should be reported to Consumer Affairs. This is not the kind of service that we've come to expect from USAirways.

[This message has been edited by kv99 (edited 05-26-2003).]

I think the passenger was out of line and was politely put back in her place. It's a little tacky to be telling the crew how unfair it is to pay Envoy prices and recieve coach wine when, in fact, this customer didn't PAY Envoy prices. I think the Purser was merely pointing THAT out.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kv99:
This is nonsense. Anyone should be able to upgrade-- you might question the upgrade rules and whether non-elites can upgrade before elites using miles, etc. etc. but its better to have a non-elite in the seat spending 30K miles than to let it go empty.

It is NOT, however, appropriate to tell a passenger that they were "lucky enough" to get the upgrade.

[This message has been edited by kv99 (edited 05-26-2003).]</font>

Actually, I think that if the pax starts the conversation by, in effect, lying, there was nothing wrong with the purser POLITELY telling her that she is an upgrade - though I think she might have bought a really high economy fare class.

I'm 98% sure that the manifest the flight crew receives does not show how an Envoy seat was obtained (i.e., whether paid Envoy or upgraded). It will show if someone is a non-rev (NRSA), which may be the case here, otherwise it was a guess by the purser

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Beckles:
I'm 98% sure that the manifest the flight crew receives does not show how an Envoy seat was obtained (i.e., whether paid Envoy or upgraded). It will show if someone is a non-rev (NRSA), which may be the case here, otherwise it was a guess by the purser</font>

I agree with Beckles. Was talking with a FA yesterday who showed me the US1-4 status (or none at all), non-rev status and now at the bottom is a list of UA elites so that FA's so inclined can thank them for flying US Airways.

That being said, in January, the entire crew on a LGW-PHL 330 knew that there were 2 walk-up full F's onboard.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Beckles:
I'm 98% sure that the manifest the flight crew receives does not show how an Envoy seat was obtained (i.e., whether paid Envoy or upgraded). It will show if someone is a non-rev (NRSA), which may be the case here, otherwise it was a guess by the purser</font>


Beckles -- in all my months here on FT, I've never seen you print something that wasn't dead-on right! However, in this case, the 2% you were unsure about allowed the truth to slip past. Be assured that F/As most certainly do know who paid for their business class ticket and who UG'ed. The manifests used to show all of this info based on class paid (A,O,J,M,etc). I haven't peeked at an int'l manifest for a while, but my biz travel colleagues at work just told me they are certain F/A's have that info.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by AS Flyer:
I think the passenger was out of line and was politely put back in her place. It's a little tacky to be telling the crew how unfair it is to pay Envoy prices and recieve coach wine when, in fact, this customer didn't PAY Envoy prices. I think the Purser was merely pointing THAT out.</font>


ASFlyer -- Sorry to disagree, but even if the pax was tacky (and, believe me, most of them are!), the proper way to handle this was to politely apologize and seek a solution of some sort. To counter with a snide remark about how one was able to get into the Envoy seat itself is in poor taste. Other posters are correct in stating that US offers its most loyal consumers the CHANCE to upgrade using either vouchers or miles from one's account. In fact, the airline encourages it. When a loyal pax opts to upgrade at that cost to him/herself (miles or voucher relinquishment, s/he should expect nothing less than the FULL EXPERIENCE of flying in business; as if s/he had paid $6200 r/t.

My 2 cents.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Beckles:
I'm 98% sure that the manifest the flight crew receives does not show how an Envoy seat was obtained (i.e., whether paid Envoy or upgraded). It will show if someone is a non-rev (NRSA), which may be the case here, otherwise it was a guess by the purser</font>

Actually...she pointed out the fare class column, and explained to me that an "E" class fare on the manifest stood for coupon upgraders - some other symbol for free mileage redemption tickets.

She had a whole list of fare classes - I was going to ask the US board if anyone had a list of fare basis codes...my boarding pass also showed a E fare class (I thought it stood for Envoy, but apparently not).

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by beltway:
It could be worse. A few months after 9/11, one of my colleagues was flying F (on UA, I think) and asked for wine. When the FA asdly observed that no corkscrew had been loaded, another passenger in F blithely produced one from his carry-on.</font>

To get back to the corkscrew matter, the TSA now allows them in your carry on, so the lesson when in Envoy is to bring your own. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Unfortunately, the only corkscrew I have is attached to my Swiss Army knife. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif

I was on a UA flight from SFO-JFK in October of 2001. While on the ground the purser came on the PA and said the corkscrew in the business galley had disappeared and they couldnt take off till they found it, asked if someone had picked it up maybe. No corkscrew, purser again, asking people to help look, maybe it fell off the shelf and got knocked somewhere. Then the pilot comes on and asks for help. By now people are walking around looking for the **** thing. Finally an FA finds it in the galley behind an ice bucket and off to New York we went. You definately couldnt have uncontrolled corkscrews in the cabin then. I didnt know you could bring your own now.

I think the "official" rule is that, yes, we, the F/A's (or anyone else for that matter), may bring them on. That rule, however, is interpreted differently at each airport you go to. That being the case, you may be able to carry it with you through security at one airport, yet at another they will take it away or spend 15 minutes trying to figure out if it is permissable. Having experienced this several times myself, I no longer carry one with me. Many of my co-workers have also experienced this problem, so much so that the company has advised us to not carry them and that they will supply one on board all aircraft. On rare occasions, the corkscrews are lost are misplaced and we have to resort to main cabin wine. For most wine bottles I have a trick that works with a spoon. It takes a little muscle and alot of effort, but I carefully (as carefully as I can) push the cork down into the bottle. This way I can serve F/C wine even without a corkscrew. Not everyone knows of this trick and not everyone can get that cork shoved down into the bottle.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by sbtinme:

ASFlyer -- Sorry to disagree, but even if the pax was tacky (and, believe me, most of them are!), the proper way to handle this was to politely apologize and seek a solution of some sort. To counter with a snide remark about how one was able to get into the Envoy seat itself is in poor taste. Other posters are correct in stating that US offers its most loyal consumers the CHANCE to upgrade using either vouchers or miles from one's account. In fact, the airline encourages it. When a loyal pax opts to upgrade at that cost to him/herself (miles or voucher relinquishment, s/he should expect nothing less than the FULL EXPERIENCE of flying in business; as if s/he had paid $6200 r/t.

My 2 cents.</font>

I was probably a little too critical initially and apologize. I, most likely, wouldn't point out that they were traveling on an upgrade. None the less, the passenger was offered another option, the only one available to them at that time, which was the main cabin wine. It wasn't the best wine, assuredly, but better than nothing and probably the only thing that the crew could offer at the time.

Although it was tacky of the woman to start complaining about a fare she didn't actually pay, it was probably not the best move to remind her of her upgrade. I'm confident that the F/A handled it with finesse though. At least that's the indication that the intial poster gave.

I've carried a corkscrew on several flights recently. However, I did remove its blade for cutting the bottle capsule. It didn't raise any eyebrows or cause any comments.

On the others side, the TSA did confiscate a small pack of matches from the emergency kit in my checked baggage. Guess I'll have to buy a bic lighter. Now that makes sense: lighters yes; matches no. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/tongue.gif

[This message has been edited by BillMorrow (edited 05-29-2003).]

Why should I be treated like a cabin class citizen if I upgraded or purchased a ticket with miles. The great airline FF promise is that if you fly us, you can UG or fly in Biz. Not fly with an asterick.

Corkscrews are allowed. The little foil knife is not.

UA has quite decent champagne on Transatlantic flights in C, very poor still wines(under $20 shelf price).

The fact that not a single(or even very few) Envoy class seat can be sold is an indication to me that the product/pricing structure is seriously defective. In many instances, the price of business class tickets Europe-USA-Europe are about 50% the price of USA-Europe-USA tickets.

[This message has been edited by slawecki (edited 06-02-2003).]

Both UA and US have pretty medicore wine in C. If only it were &lt;$20. Many selections are &lt;$10. E.g. Mondavi Coastal on UA. They also had a Chilean wine that I priced at $7 retail. (They gave me a bottle.) It was acutally decent.

UA had Veuve Clicquot in C to LHR in March. Last week they had Drapier although VC is listed as the alternate.

Last US Envoy flight the FA gave me a bottle of champagne in plastic bag. I was really happy because I saw some red on the label thinking it was the Piper that they were serving. However, it turned out to be some nasty CA sparkler that is only sold to restaurants. (Has a French name.) Is it their domestic "champagne"?