US Airways Dividend Miles (Pre-FlightFund Merger) - First Envoy Row on A330 Blocked

As has been discussed, even though First Class no longer exists as an international category, the better recline seats in the first row on A330 aircraft are apparently still intact. I was following seat inventory an a particular flight, and noticed that a day or so before the actual departure, the row opened up on seat maps. Wonder who they are holding those for? Seems no matter what date you pull a seat map, you will find that row blocked.

Those seats are only available in advance to full fare Envoy Class passengers and Chairman's Preferred members and their campainions (upgraded/free ticket/whatever).

No other Preferreds can access the seat w/o a full fare ticket. For example, I (a gold) and traveling with a CP and a non status on an upcoming PHL-LGW-PHL. On the return, all three of us were already upgraded, so they were able to give us three seats in Row 1. On the outbound, they only had two seats open, so we decided the CP would have the best chance of clearing later, so the non status and I (gold) upgraded. However, no one at int'l reservations were able to give us two row 1 seats until the CP clears (in which case they will gladly move us to row 1 of they still have seats).

In exploring the seat maps, I rarely see Row 1 seats taken. At first I thought that it was testimony to how few Full Fare Envoy and CPs are on int'l routes, but from my experience on the phone, I've learned that almost every agent will just seat you in ther regular Envoy Cabin, unless you specifcally request row one.

Additionally, even if you're CP, not every agent will do it, not really sure why...

If you get an int'l agent who won't seat you in Row 1 and you're a CP, call again until you find an agent who will.

Do they still have separate F/As serving row 1? I remember when I flew CLT-LGW in Envoy last December, the curtain was shut to the F cabin the whole flight - there were one or two F/As serving the pax up there, and those F/As didn't serve regular Envoy pax.

I was fortunate to get an agent that seated me and my companion in row 1 on our PHL-LGW flight and back. I loved her comment after viewing my flight activity..."oh you live on USAirways, you deserve it".

Anyone know how the seats are in Envoy on the 767? I am going to AMS in July and MAD in September.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by das:
Do they still have separate F/As serving row 1? I remember when I flew CLT-LGW in Envoy last December, the curtain was shut to the F cabin the whole flight - there were one or two F/As serving the pax up there, and those F/As didn't serve regular Envoy pax.</font>

During my two flights last month in Row 1, the curtains remained open and we had the same FA's and service that the rest of Envoy had.

But the seats are sure alot nicer!!

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by trvlr64:
I was fortunate to get an agent that seated me and my companion in row 1 on our PHL-LGW flight and back. I loved her comment after viewing my flight activity..."oh you live on USAirways, you deserve it".

Anyone know how the seats are in Envoy on the 767? I am going to AMS in July and MAD in September.

</font>

In my opinion, the 767 Envoy is a real let-down compared to the 330, but not everyone feels this way... The MAD flight is switching to a 330 btw and is scheduled that way for September from what I can see...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by trvlr64:
I was fortunate to get an agent that seated me and my companion in row 1 on our PHL-LGW flight and back.
</font>

On my FRA-PIT return, I was pre-assigned 1A. When I upgraded MrsGP using my companion cert, we got bumped back to row 3, and were told 2 seats weren't available in 1. The flight went with only 2 pax in row 1.

No matter - I actually prefer rows 3 and 4 on the return. Sleeping flat eastbound is nice, but I feel claustrophobic in Row 1 when awake.

I just came back from Paris and had row 1 roundtrip. Also got it when I booked an award ticket for next October, and didn't ask for it either time. I find it too warm and stuffy in row 1. There's poor ventilation. I'm almost inclined to ask to be moved back a couple rows. Anyone else agree? When I blew 125,000 miles for one of these seats last year I was sorely disappointed.
Interestingly, on my flight to Paris last week, two of the row 1 seats were empty, and on the way back, three were empty until the last minute when two of them were taken, apparently by non-revs brought from further back.

[This message has been edited by mbmbbost (edited 04-18-2003).]

Was happy to experience Row 1 R/T last month PIT-FRA (well, FRA-PHL-PIT on the cancelled direct return).

Have to say I agree that that part of the cabin is stuffy. Only a few windows, gets dark easily, etc.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by CPRich:


No matter - I actually prefer rows 3 and 4 on the return. Sleeping flat eastbound is nice, but I feel claustrophobic in Row 1 when awake.</font>

Exactly how I feel.

IMO, on the A-330, you want row 1 on the eastbound overnight flight and Envoy row 3 or 4 on the westbound return. I'd hardly call the row 1 cabin claustophobic given there are only 6 people up there and each side has three windows - although the middle two seats are less desirable. As has been mentioned, row 1 will only be assignmed to full fare Envoy passengers or CPs (and their companions).

[This message has been edited by geo1005 (edited 04-20-2003).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by geo1005:
As has been mentioned, row 1 will only be assignmed to full fare Envoy passengers or CPs (and their companions).</font>

I had it as a CP, but couldn't get it with a companion. As mentioned, they moved us back to 4, and told us (lied to us?) that there weren't seats in 1. We left with 2 or 3 passengers in 1, middle seats empty.

Hmmmm, interesting. I had a friend booked in Envoy for months (using my miles). He was confirmed in row 4. I was a CP waiting until the 7 day window for the same flight to upgrade a K fare using a SYSUP02. Seven days out - no luck. 3 days out the CP desk called inventory and opened up a seat for me. Once that was completed and I was upgraded to Envoy, I asked if I could be in row 1 with a companion who was already in Envoy - "Sure, no problem" - and we had a great flight PIT-FRA in row 1 on the A-330.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by geo1005:
Hmmmm, interesting. I had a friend booked in Envoy for months (using my miles). He was confirmed in row 4. I was a CP waiting until the 7 day window for the same flight to upgrade a K fare using a SYSUP02. Seven days out - no luck. 3 days out the CP desk called inventory and opened up a seat for me. Once that was completed and I was upgraded to Envoy, I asked if I could be in row 1 with a companion who was already in Envoy - "Sure, no problem" - and we had a great flight PIT-FRA in row 1 on the A-330.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif</font>

This has been my experience as well. As long as I am in Envoy, I've been able to confirm as many as THREE companions with me in Row 1.

I think, though that it might take an extra step or something to assign Row 1 that some agents are unwilling to take or do not understand, because I have had agents who would not assign it. So I just call back and ask again!

My wife flew CLT to LGW this weekend on an award. She's US2. I was able to get her in row 1. Checked day of departure, and her seat was the only one assigned in that row. In fact, there were at least 15 open in the Envoy compartment. At departure, they announced the plane was overbooked, and offered up to $400 and an Envoy seat the next day, as an inducement to get people off. Needless to say the compartment filled up with overbooks (including the famous row 1). They must have thought they won the lottery. So much for holding it out.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by deelmakur:
So much for holding it out.</font>

I think all bets are off once you get to day of departure. The CP/full fare Envoy rule(?) applies to advance seat assignments.

They should open it up for Golds too.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by BizJet:
They should open it up for Golds too.</font>

Why?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by trvlr64:
Why?</font>

I think they should throw it open to all elite levels, myself, and I'll tell you why:

I think they should treat row 1 like exit rows or bulkheads in the back. Open it to all (elites).

------------------
Saving the world, one clue at a time.

Anecdotal evidence from this thread specifically and a look at the seat maps on ITN in general reveals that almost categorically very few to no Row 1 seats are going to Chairman's Preferred members or full fare passengers, regardless of whether these two groups aren't on board or don't know. So what is happening is that last minute operational upgrades and non revenue passengers are taking the row one seating, since they are the only ones that are open at the airport. Yeah, you can ask at the gate or whatever, but most outstations (connecting passengers) aren't willing to assign Row 1 seats unless preassigned, and it is simply a pain to ask. Plus last minute passengers can beat you to it.

It's absurd that I (gold) can't reserve a seat in row 1 with my companion without traveling with a Chairman Preferred. I'm also a little peeved that there are only six out of 40 Envoy seats taken and US still can't open inventory to upgrade a Chairman's Preferred traveling with me (who has over 100K YTD, not that this is an impressive statistic to many of you). But, hey, they say just wait till 3 days out and then the magic will happen. Whatever, whatever, I know, I know, that is the nature of the beast.

The problem starts when you do away with the class of service, but leave 6 seats which are arguably better than the others in the compartment. Recognizing this, they try to devise a policy which uses them to reward better customers, but fail to agree on what exactly that means. Then individual agents make their own determinations on who gets what, and in the vortex of all the overbooking confusion at the gate, resulting from dumping too much inventory with consolidators, the seats end up being given to people who get their tickets on Priceline. And they wonder why people join the ranks of the cockroaches.

I dont see any reason why they dont allow other non-CP elites to grab Row 1 on day of departure.

What's worse is if they 'protect' Row 1 with some arbitrary rules, it actually limits upgrade inventory for everyone. So if there are a few seats open in 1, but none in 2-7, a GP or SP (or general DM) wouldnt get in to Envoy.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by hscottm:
I dont see any reason why they dont allow other non-CP elites to grab Row 1 on day of departure.

What's worse is if they 'protect' Row 1 with some arbitrary rules, it actually limits upgrade inventory for everyone. So if there are a few seats open in 1, but none in 2-7, a GP or SP (or general DM) wouldnt get in to Envoy.</font>

I don't think they actually "protect" the Envoy inventory this way -- this seems to simply be a question of seat assignments.

I think there are still 41 Envoy seats to sell or to upgrade passengers to...

Personally, for the eastbound flight, I they they should ONLY allow full-fare Envoy to sit in Row 1 seats w/advance assignment. Full fare passengers have to be the priority here.

If there are seats left AT THE AIRPORT RIGHT prior to flight time, they should assign them automatically by going down the list by status, within status by fare basis. It's complicated but really the only fair way.

Bottom line-- these are ostensibly better seats for the overnight flight, and there has to be a system in place to give these out.

For the westbound flight, shouldn't matter--they should let anyone have the seat.

What do you all think?

You're talking 6 seats on 9 planes, or a max of 54 seats a day in each direction. It's impractical to write a special software program for that little bit of inventory, which means a great deal of discretion available to lots of different people in the booking and boarding process. In that vacuum, these will never be assigned on any kind of equitable basis. If they were smart, they'd take them out, and avoid the problems they create.

Leave it as it is. Full fare Envoy should have rights to these better seats. CP's next. On the day of departure, if you are an upgraded Silver or Gold and they are available, fine. I would imagine that a CP would have every right to be upset if a comped-Silver and his or her companion were given the best seats on the plane in advance.

For the few times they are actually forced to pull non-Preferred passengers out of coach and comp-upgrade them to Envoy, I'd look at it as a chance for US to win over a few more advocates. We can only hope that the Silvers and Golds who have already upgraded their coach tickets to Envoy don't feel too cheated. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

[This message has been edited by geo1005 (edited 04-22-2003).]