US Airways Dividend Miles (Pre-FlightFund Merger) - USAIR Introduces E-Upgrades

USair has introduced E-Upgrades, exchange value is four to one on paper upgrades.

http://www.usair.com/dividendmiles/programinfo/eupgrades.htm

One major change is that a long trip like PHL-SFO which used 3 certs before will now use 5.

I have the information, according to DM Service Representative,
Until 2/28/03 (she wasn't sure beyond that, it wasn't in her book)

Silver 8 e-upgrades for every ten thousand miles.

12 upgrades at the twenty thousand mark

Gold preferred 16 e-upgrades for every ten thousand miles.

20 upgrades at the twenty thousand mark

She said Chairmans will not have a bank, and can still turn in any existing paper certificates at the 500 mile per cert level. Also they haven't stopped mailing paper certs and will not until 12/5/02. I qualified for 8 more paper certs on 10/21 and they were sent out. She said after 12/5/02 even when you hand in a paper cert it will be converted at 3-1 into your upgrade bank at the airport. Also, after you add them to the bank you can exchange them for miles, so 10 certs to 40 eupgrades to 20,000 miles.

Chris

[This message has been edited by catwood (edited 11-08-2002).]

chris-

I was just wandering around USAirways.com and didn't see this. It must be new, but it's cool nonetheless. Bye-bye 800-mi certs. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

If I read this correctly, or maybe interpret this correctly, First come, first served on a Coach ticket regardless of Elite level?

Interesting. My sole about-to-expire NAU that was going to be sent in for 500 miles, just became 4 E-Upgrades good for another 12 months. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by GregLeg (edited 11-07-2002).]

Notice on the chart another change in the program.......Silver members may request e-upgrades ( fare class M,H, Q, K, L, V) 24 HOURS IN ADVANCE , Gold members 72 HOURS IN ADVANCE. This is different from the current 1 day prior and 3 days prior. I believe this falls more in line with UA.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Gandalf:
If I read this correctly, or maybe interpret this correctly, First come, first served on a Coach ticket regardless of Elite level?</font>

Um, no ... the windows are now 24 hours for Silver (down from 1 day), 72 hours for Gold (down from 3 days), and ??? for Chairman's Preferred ... it doesn't seem to mention CP's for some reason ... maybe we get nothing. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Here's two interesting tid-bits from the Efares Facts (http://www.usair.com/dividendmiles/programinfo/eupgrade_facts.htm) page:

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">
* E-Upgrades are not valid on flights operated by other airlines, including code-share flights.

* Prior to expiration, E-Upgrades may be converted to 500 Dividend Miles by calling the Dividend Miles Service Center.
</font>

Our 1 800-mile NAU worth 500 miles is now 4 500-mile upgrades ... worth 500 miles each! Hope no one exchanged any NAU's recently http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif.

Of course, I wonder if us newly minted CP's will be able to convert NAU's to Eupgrades first ... before converting to miles ... I kind of doubt it personally, but I can hope ...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Beckles:

Our 1 800-mile NAU worth 500 miles is now 4 500-mile upgrades ... worth 500 miles each!

Of course, I wonder if us newly minted CP's will be able to convert NAU's to Eupgrades first ... before converting to miles ... I kind of doubt it personally, but I can hope ...</font>

I wonder if you can send in a DUMPSYS to be redeemed?

More importantly is will they send out all the NAUs you have earned (esp if you just made CP) before they switch over, or will they manage to "forget" to send out any NAUs for some interim time period?

Wowee, so if I mail in the 60 NAU's I've been hoarding, I'll get 240 E upgrades which will convert back to 120,000 miles.

Beckles, do you really think CP's can't cash in on this? After all, my last set of NAU's doesn't expire until 9/30/03 - theoretically I might want to exchange them in Sep 03 if I didn't think I would make CP again after my status runs out Feb 04 so I would have e-upgrades as a Gold.

If BWI2MCO97 or ChairPrefRes are listening in, please let us know if the 4:1 offer applies to all DM members or just silvers and golds!

For those of you the need to buy upgrades from time to time, the price is $40 each for elites. No more 4 for the price of 3.

I've read through this twice. What is the earning rate for e-upgrades for silvers and golds?

Does this mean that we can exchange Systemwides too?:

"Any unexpired paper upgrade issued by US Airways can be exchanged for E-Upgrades with the exception of upgrade awards redeemed using Dividend Miles. "

skip

[This message has been edited by student (edited 11-07-2002).]

If these don't come into effect until December 5, that means I should be able to go purchase 4 NAU's for $120 and convert them later into 16 500 milers. Sounds good to me.

One very negative thing I'm not sure anyone has noticed--you pay for each segment, with a minimum of 1 500 miler per segment, not the total mileage origin-to-destination.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ringmaruf:
One very negative thing I'm not sure anyone has noticed--you pay for each segment, with a minimum of 1 500 miler per segment, not the total mileage origin-to-destination.</font>

That's why they're being so generous with the conversion ...

Of course we need to wait and see what the new earning rate is ...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by gardener:
Beckles, do you really think CP's can't cash in on this? </font>

The problem as I see it is CP's don't have a counter, so there's nothing to add them to ...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by gardener:
Wowee, so if I mail in the 60 NAU's I've been hoarding, I'll get 240 E upgrades which will convert back to 120,000 miles.
</font>

Are they unexpired or expired? I've got a boatload from back when CP upgrades were unlimited, but they still sent the certs, but no one bothered to collect them because it was unlimited, etc.... but that's from years back. I got my hopes up, but found they specifically referred to exchanging unexpired paper upgrades.

Anything I can do with dozens of expired NAUs?

From the table provided, it looks like non-elites can never upgrade a non-full fare ticket ("Not Permitted"). Has this always been the case?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by CPRich:
From the table provided, it looks like non-elites can never upgrade a non-full fare ticket ("Not Permitted"). Has this always been the case?</font>

Non-elites can't upgrade with (current) 800-mile upgrades unless they are on a full fare. If on a full fare, they can upgrade using those certificates just like a preferred member (but they're more expensive for them than they are for preferred members). Of course, with GoFirst, full fares in many markets can sit in First Class for the price of a full coach fare without any certs whatsoever.

Of course, nonelites can still upgrade from any fare (excluding priceline et al) using Dividend Miles (US20 Award) or as a companion of a preferred member.


I hope we can find an answer to the question of what happens to newly minted CP's still sitting on a lot of 800 milers. I know that there is no way I'll make CP next year just getting out the standard amount, so I'd like to go ahead and pad my eupgr account.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by gardener:
Wowee, so if I mail in the 60 NAU's I've been hoarding, I'll get 240 E upgrades which will convert back to 120,000 miles.

Beckles, do you really think CP's can't cash in on this? After all, my last set of NAU's doesn't expire until 9/30/03 - theoretically I might want to exchange them in Sep 03 if I didn't think I would make CP again after my status runs out Feb 04 so I would have e-upgrades as a Gold.

If BWI2MCO97 or ChairPrefRes are listening in, please let us know if the 4:1 offer applies to all DM members or just silvers and golds!</font>

It looks like you only have until the end of January to exchange them.

A few more thoughts on this.

GP and SP can now use a kiosk to check in if using E-Upgrades. They can't with a paper upgade.

10,000 miles can be converted into 6 e-upgrades. This means you can use miles for a one-way upgrade. You still have to wait for your window to open.

The minimum of one e-upgrade per segment is going to hurt a lot of people. Who's going to blow an upgrade on a 90 mile flight?

With the generous initial conversion ratio, upgades will be tight in Q1 2003. Then people are going to cautious about how/when to use their upgrades.

I think this is a good step. All upgrades will be collected, checkin should be faster, we wanted an electronic system and this sets the base for UA upgrades.

As people have pointed out, we need to know next year's earnings rules to fully understand the effects of this.

I think we are going to see a lot more changes for 2003. What about systemwides next year? I hope we still get them.



[This message has been edited by mileshound (edited 11-07-2002).]

The exchange promotion is very generous, but once all those E-Upgrades are used up, the upgrade program will mirror AA's. And if I'm going to have to fly 10k miles for 4 E-Upgrades or buy them at $40 each, then I might as well fly AA because their first class is a higher quality product and upgrades actually clear when the 3 day window opens.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by johnep1:
It looks like you only have until the end of January to exchange them.</font>

Well, you have until 1/31/03 to exchange 1 paper for 4 E-Upgrades. After that, the rate is 1 paper for 2 E-Upgrades. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif I guess they really want to get rid of as many paper upgrades as possible by then, eh?

[This message has been edited by davohuang (edited 11-07-2002).]

Why do J/C fares show up as upgradeable with e-upgrades? Are these domestic legs? I thought that non-Envoy segments got connected with non-Envoy fares (eg J combined with Y)..

Ah, the signals, the signals... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

This is a big step towards integrating the United and US Airways program. United switched over to the e-upgrade program two years ago, and like US' new system, our elites clear at the 24,72,100 window (although, I think I heard that Premiers now clear at the 48 hour window). Of course, we use 500-milers as well.

Welcome! Soon, watch those upgrades on UA become available.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by JohnnyP:
Ah, the signals, the signals... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

This is a big step towards integrating the United and US Airways program. United switched over to the e-upgrade program two years ago, and like US' new system, our elites clear at the 24,72,100 window (although, I think I heard that Premiers now clear at the 48 hour window). Of course, we use 500-milers as well.

Welcome! Soon, watch those upgrades on UA become available.</font>

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

Nice assumption, but wrong.

US' program is not like UA's now ... it's like AA's, you know why? Because AA uses Sabre, and instead of paying EDS to modify AA's E-Upgrade programs, they just take AA's E-Upgrade program and are using that because it is less expensive.

Note that rules specifically say the new E-Upgrades will not be valid on codeshare flights ... that's pretty important since there's no codeshare flights they could be used on now ... what could they be referring to you suppose? I'll tell you ... UA codeshares ...

At first this looked great, trade in my US upgrades at a 1:4 ratio, my flights on US are almost exclusively EWR-CLT (where most likely I'll still only get charged 1 500 mi)--but then I thought, gee I was so excited about the UA codeshare on flights, but this specifically says not good on codeshares, so yes I can use them on my once or twice a month trips to CLT (where FC is not really any big deal), I won't get to use them on UA where I could possibly take advantage of upgrades on transcons out of NYC area. So I may hold on to them with the thought that the US paper certs will be usable on UA????

Another thing to point out is on UA's, the E-Upgrade requirement is calculated from origin to destination (includes connections).

Let's think about this for a sec... Imagine the poor guy who's been Chairman's for like 20 years and this year, only flies 75K miles (and doesn't know to Get Out More). Now he's faced with 500-mile upgrades instead of 800-mile upgrades and has NO PAPER UPGRADES to exchange. Nice, eh?

Glad I'm still Chairman's--though it may not matter next year http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Of course with all the routes I travel the most are moving to DASH8 and RJ service they can give me 100 for each one I have and I'll still never get a chance to use them http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif

See the first post for earning information.

Chris

No code-share on United flights---that is the worst part of this. So when I mail in all my paper certificated and get somewhere around 160 E-Upgrades good through December of next year -- Thats going to be a lot of flights on US I'll have to do. Was so looking forward to upgrading on UA

I spoke with an angel at Chairman's today and she had NO IDEA about the e-Upgrades. Apparently, as these don't apply to Chairman's they were never told about them.

The good news: She said that as of today, no change to Chairman's Preferred unlimited upgrades for next year.

The bad news: She told me to be prepared for anything to happen tomorrow or the next day http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif

So that means we still have our 7 day window. Look forward to upgrading on those Dash 8s. Wait, I forgot, I haven't been on US in 3 weeks.

But I do have a Christmas trip.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by FlyerAl:
The exchange promotion is very generous, but once all those E-Upgrades are used up, the upgrade program will mirror AA's. And if I'm going to have to fly 10k miles for 4 E-Upgrades or buy them at $40 each, then I might as well fly AA because their first class is a higher quality product and upgrades actually clear when the 3 day window opens.</font>

Let's also not forget that MRTC beats US Y in most instances without having to do anything. MRTC exit-row trounces US Y.

------------------
Saving the world, one clue at a time.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by FlyerAl:
The exchange promotion is very generous, but once all those E-Upgrades are used up, the upgrade program will mirror AA's. And if I'm going to have to fly 10k miles for 4 E-Upgrades or buy them at $40 each, then I might as well fly AA because their first class is a higher quality product and upgrades actually clear when the 3 day window opens.</font>
10000 Dividend Miles for 6 E-Ugrades sounds like a much better deal than $40 each (unless you actually had a better use for those Dividend Miles), and if you are contemplating AA, you probably don't.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by biggs:
So that means we still have our 7 day window. Look forward to upgrading on those Dash 8s. Wait, I forgot, I haven't been on US in 3 weeks.

But I do have a Christmas trip. </font>

I do almost exclusively transcon (SFO) and so I'm usually on 321s and 757s, and yesterday, I took one of those Dash-8's after a long time. They ****ing suck. No more USAir trips booked for me either... not even one.

Three more transcons this year, all on UA connecting through Chicago for a 777 or a 747, wknd trip to London on UA, and Dec to BKK on UA. Hoping my Chairman's status is worth something on UA next year, but not counting on it.

[This message has been edited by kv99 (edited 11-08-2002).]

[This message has been edited by kv99 (edited 11-08-2002).]

Ok, I just made CP and have around 30 or so certs lying around. Can I only exchange them for 500 each? I'd like to convert them to e-upgrades and then into miles somehow. Any way that can be done?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by lt1GM:
Ok, I just made CP and have around 30 or so certs lying around. Can I only exchange them for 500 each? I'd like to convert them to e-upgrades and then into miles somehow. Any way that can be done?</font>

If they match the UA model, the e-upgrades will convert into miles upon expiry also, so I suppose you could convert the paper certs into e-upgrades and then let them expire into miles. If US is around that long...

My three questions are:

1) What happens to the E-Upgrade bank of a Gold Preferred member who reaches Chairman's Preferred? Do they automatically covert to miles? Do they just sit there in the bank? Do they just disappear??

2) Can a Chairman's Preferred member who still has unexpired paper upgrades exchange them for E-Upgrades? Or are they left with 500 miles per paper upgrade as their only option? If the latter is the case, then CP's are getting hosed by this deal!

3) For how long are E-Upgrades valid after being earned or deposited into one's bank? If they expire after a year, then it's going to be upgrade mania next year and then not much after that.

Looking at catwood's first post, it appears as if the earning rate for Silvers and Golds stays pretty much the same. The increased upgrade-miles/mile earned will probably be offset by the increased wasteage per segment.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ThisFlightNoFuel:
3) For how long are E-Upgrades valid after being earned or deposited into one's bank? If they expire after a year, then it's going to be upgrade mania next year and then not much after that.</font>

From the E-Upgrade Facts Page: E-Upgrades are valid for 12 months and expire at the end of the twelfth month.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kv99:
If they match the UA model, the e-upgrades will convert into miles upon expiry also, so I suppose you could convert the paper certs into e-upgrades and then let them expire into miles. If US is around that long...</font>

Actually, it looks like you can convert directly into miles once they're in your bank by calling the service center. From the E-Upgrade Facts page: "Prior to expiration, E-Upgrades may be converted to 500 Dividend Miles by calling the Dividend Miles Service Center."

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ThisFlightNoFuel:
My three questions are:

2) Can a Chairman's Preferred member who still has unexpired paper upgrades exchange them for E-Upgrades? Or are they left with 500 miles per paper upgrade as their only option? If the latter is the case, then CP's are getting hosed by this deal!
</font>

Ahhh, this is the $64 question. Or in my case, the 90,000 mile question. Are my 60 NAU's worth 30,000 miles (what they were worth before this offer) or are they worth 120,000 miles?

Spoke to a CP rep, she didn't have a clue. She hadn't even heard about e-upgrades. At least she was able to upgrade me on the one segment (out of 4) I'm flying week after next that isn't an RJ or Dash8. Another B fare! This cockroach must be metamorphosing...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ThisFlightNoFuel:

2) Can a Chairman's Preferred member who still has unexpired paper upgrades exchange them for E-Upgrades? Or are they left with 500 miles per paper upgrade as their only option? If the latter is the case, then CP's are getting hosed by this deal!

</font>

Just read catwood's edited first post. Looks like we are getting hosed.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by RMINIONE:
No code-share on United flights---that is the worst part of this. Thats going to be a lot of flights on US I'll have to do. Was so looking forward to upgrading on UA</font>

According to the FAQ on the U website they will eventually allow us the opportunity to upgrade flights on UA. We can only hope they haven't changed there mind.


Benefits for Dividend Miles Members
How will US Airways' Dividend Miles members benefit from this agreement?

Starting November 1, 2002, Dividend Miles members will be able to earn mileage credit for every flight operated by United and its Express affiliates.
Starting January 1, 2003:

Preferred members will receive their Preferred bonuses when traveling on United
Dividend Miles members will receive mileage and segment credit toward Preferred qualification when flying on United
In addition:

US Airways Dividend Miles members will also have the ability to redeem Dividend Miles awards for flights to any destination served by United
Preferred members will be eligible to use Preferred ticketing lines and Preferred boarding when flying on United
Upgrades will be made available to members flying on United

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by planeluvr:
According to the FAQ on the U website they will eventually allow us the opportunity to upgrade flights on UA. We can only hope they haven't changed there mind.


Benefits for Dividend Miles Members
How will US Airways' Dividend Miles members benefit from this agreement?

Starting November 1, 2002, Dividend Miles members will be able to earn mileage credit for every flight operated by United and its Express affiliates.
Starting January 1, 2003:

Preferred members will receive their Preferred bonuses when traveling on United
Dividend Miles members will receive mileage and segment credit toward Preferred qualification when flying on United
In addition:

US Airways Dividend Miles members will also have the ability to redeem Dividend Miles awards for flights to any destination served by United
Preferred members will be eligible to use Preferred ticketing lines and Preferred boarding when flying on United
Upgrades will be made available to members flying on United

</font>


Yes it does look like we will be able to upgradee with our DM points, but not with our E-Upgrades if I read this correctly

From the "FACTS about E-Upgrades" the statement:
"E-Upgrades are not valid on flights operated by other airlines, including code-share flights"....
Which pretty much means no UA!!
I'm sure we'll be able to use miles etc to upgrade at some point in the future, but they do specifically say it can't be done with the new E-Upgrades.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by mauld:
"E-Upgrades are not valid on flights operated by other airlines, including code-share flights"</font>

I would rather this than lose my US CP privileges on US metal.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ThisFlightNoFuel:
2) Can a Chairman's Preferred member who still has unexpired paper upgrades exchange them for E-Upgrades? Or are they left with 500 miles per paper upgrade as their only option? If the latter is the case, then CP's are getting hosed by this deal!</font>

That's my big question. I have probably fifty or so paper upgrades. I'm going to make CP next week. If I read things correctly here, it looks like US has found another way to hate me. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

I'm going to make CP via a mileage run that's costing me about $230. Do you think I should ditch it and remain Gold this year to be able to use this upgrade program? Or should I do the run, make CP, and probably miss out on the value of my paper certs?

The reason I even bring this up is because I won't requalify for CP for 2004, I'm sure. So if I make CP and have to turn in all my paper upgrades for 500 miles each (as opposed to watching them become worthless), then I'll be left with nothing when I drop back to Gold in Feb 2004.

Thoughts?



[This message has been edited by US Hates Me (edited 11-08-2002).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by US Hates Me:
That's my big question. I have probably fifty or so paper upgrades. I'm going to make CP next week. If I read things correctly here, it looks like US has found another way to hate me. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

I'm going to make CP via a mileage run that's costing me about $230. Do you think I should ditch it and remain Gold this year to be able to use this upgrade program? Or should I do the run, make CP, and probably miss out on the value of my paper certs?

The reason I even bring this up is because I won't requalify for CP for 2004, I'm sure. So if I make CP and have to turn in all my paper upgrades for 500 miles each (as opposed to watching them become worthless), then I'll be left with nothing when I drop back to Gold in Feb 2004.

Thoughts?

[This message has been edited by US Hates Me (edited 11-08-2002).]</font>

ok you're not really making sense. you could stay gold and use the 500-mile certs w/a 3-day window or you could make chairman's and get unlimited upgrades w/ the longer 7-day window convert the paper certs into e-upgrades and get the 500 miles for each of these e-upgrades... why is this "upgrade program" better than the unlimited upgrade program CPs enjoy? deal with the downgrade to gold when it happens-- if us is still around.

[This message has been edited by kv99 (edited 11-08-2002).]

I'd guess that the UA upgrades will be like the NW/AS relationship. They get a certain number of certificates for use specifically on the partner airline.

I remember reading somewhere that we could upgrade on UA codeshares but AFTER US converted to e-upgrades.

The current disclaimer may be part of the bigger, we can't upgrade on UA yet.

Until the eupgrade system is in place will we still warn the old NAUsas usual.
I sould be getting a Gold welcome package soon( made GP in late Oct). will this include a couple of SWUs and NAUs.
How about the 4SWUs for 10,000 miles aftre reaching Silver?
I'd like to get these as NAU certificates and trade them in for eupgrades at the 4-1 ratio.

If I am flying around Txgiving and want tp upgrade will it be NAUs or eupgrades.

Quick question, does anyone see if its possible to selectively upgrade portions of your itinerary? For example, if someone flies PHL-PIT-MSP and only wants to upgrade the PIT-MSP part (ie and not use an e-upgrade for the couple hundred miles between PHL-PIT) is that possible?

I found 6 unexpired NAUs for me and 12 unexpired for my wife. That'll build a nice bank of 24 and 48 for us to start the year, I guess. I have turned in over 60 NAUs under the older program with 500 miles per NAU .. too bad, wish I had the oppty to get more miles...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kv99:
I do almost exclusively transcon (SFO) and so I'm usually on 321s and 757s, and yesterday, I took one of those Dash-8's after a long time. They ****ing suck. </font>

Ditto. After 26 months of SFO transcons, I scouted out a new project last week in West Nowhere, middle o'America. Nothing direct, and at least one ERJ, CRJ, Saab, etc. I really have been spoiled. And none of them are US - I'm $*&*&'ed

OK, I read the web site again. The e-upgrades only replace the DMUP01.

This means that you should keep your DMUPSYS02.

The big question is, will we get these next year.

How would a gold upgrade to Europe without using miles or a systemwide upgrade? Can you use e-upgrades for transatlantic flights?

[This message has been edited by nawlinsdoc (edited 11-09-2002).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by nawlinsdoc:
How would a gold upgrade to Europe without using miles or a systemwide upgrade? Can you use e-upgrades for transatlantic flights?

[This message has been edited by nawlinsdoc (edited 11-09-2002).]</font>

You can't - unless they turn the SWUs into a type of e-upgrade. Same goes for a Silver or Chairman's. Of course, they can always change the rules.



[This message has been edited by CLTFlyer (edited 11-09-2002).]

My guess is that if Preferred Members are allowed to use upgrades on UA, perhaps sometime in q1 or q2 of 2003, that CP's will no longer receive unlimited domestic upgrades. In fact, perhaps UA and US will begin awarding a similar number of 500 mile e-upgrades, so as to prevent for example all UA 1K's trying to become US CP's since that would be a better deal. If they really are not planning to allow US to upgrade on UA, then they might keep the CP program more or less the same. If I had to bet one way or another, I would say unlimited CP upgrades will disappear in line with much of the rest of the industry. I truly hope and expect though with such a change that US prefs are allowed to use e-upgrades on UA, again based on industry trends with alliances. I.e. CO and NW.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by jetsetter:
I would say unlimited CP upgrades will disappear in line with much of the rest of the industry. </font>

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/confused.gif

How do you figure that would be in line with the rest of the industry?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by jetsetter:
My guess is that if Preferred Members are allowed to use upgrades on UA, perhaps sometime in q1 or q2 of 2003, that CP's will no longer receive unlimited domestic upgrades. In fact, perhaps UA and US will begin awarding a similar number of 500 mile e-upgrades, so as to prevent for example all UA 1K's trying to become US CP's since that would be a better deal. If they really are not planning to allow US to upgrade on UA, then they might keep the CP program more or less the same. If I had to bet one way or another, I would say unlimited CP upgrades will disappear in line with much of the rest of the industry. I truly hope and expect though with such a change that US prefs are allowed to use e-upgrades on UA, again based on industry trends with alliances. I.e. CO and NW.</font>

it's possible that usairways will allow unlimited upgrades on us flights and limited controlled upgrading on ua flights using e-upgrades.

there is absolutely NO WAY that cp will become the equivalent of 1K for upgrades on ua flights.

I repeat: I would rather keep my CP unlimited upgrades than be able to e-upgrade on United.

Look people: We are all USAIR frequent flyers. Not United. If we flew alot of United, we'd be 1Ks. If they get rid of our CP benefits, we totally LOSE. Honestly, I'm happy to get preferred milage on United, but I'll give up the United upgrades to keep mine on US.

If you can't tell, I am slightly worried. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

I would rather be able to use the e-upgrades on UA, than to get just unlimited upgrades on US. I live in BOS, so being a UA 1K is not very practical given heavy east coast travel. But I would very much like to be able to fly UA more than US, mainly for channel 9 which is at least available 50% of the time on UA. If both US and UA served a route, I would fly UA since they have channel 9, and I would still want to upgrade. I really don't care or read things like on time statistics, etc. I am mainly interested in the quality and breath of services on the ground and in the air, i.e. food, lounges, IFE, waivers and favors, comfort of seats, laptop outlets, etc. If services are better I would rather connect than go nonstop, etc. However, I am likely in the minority palcing such a high emphasis on the overall service experience, as opposed to something "back to basics" like on time performance, or frequency in schedule.

jetsetter -- i agree with you on almost everything you said in the last post...

for me, unlimited upgrades can go away (if there's something like E+ on us planes...)

i'm just saying that cp's will never become the equivalent of 1K --i'm just hoping that between my cp status and (newly-minted) 1P status, that my life on united will become easier.

fwiw, i've been flying ua a lot the last few weeks and am really happy there w/food, service, and channel 9. i don't sit in first all the time, but that's more than compensated for by E+ and 3-class planes on domestic hub connections.

[This message has been edited by kv99 (edited 11-10-2002).]

The last 2 posts seem to talk about a willingness to give up some US benefits because they want to fly UA! For those who want to actually buy and fly US, keeping benefits is more important. I believe UA flyers are really loyal to United and if US reduces benefits, all US will do is lose customers. Not a lot of UA flyers will become US flyers just because of the codeshare. It probably is just a game of which airline will go under first.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by infiniteflyer:
The last 2 posts seem to talk about a willingness to give up some US benefits because they want to fly UA! For those who want to actually buy and fly US, keeping benefits is more important.</font>

Thank you, InfiniteFlyer.

Kv99, you are already an elite flyer of UA. As someone who flies exclusively US, I still refuse to give up my CP benefits to fly an airline I never fly!!

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kv99:
fwiw, i've been flying ua a lot the last few weeks and am really happy there w/food, service, and channel 9. i don't sit in first all the time, but that's more than compensated for by E+ and 3-class planes on domestic hub connections.

[This message has been edited by kv99 (edited 11-10-2002).]</font>


I'ver flown a few times now on United and haven't been overly impressed, but I LOVE Channel 9.
I have been mulling over the strategy aspect of gaining status on UA (as KV has) to allow me easier upgrades to E+ seats when I do fly on UA. I fly to Denmark a few times a year and love the SAS direct flight from IAD to CPH, but I love Envoy to LGW more. What is everyone's thoughts on trying to gain status on UA if you have already achieved CP?

Without unlimited upgrades (seat 1A in the new RJ fleet?), I'd change my travel over to UA since IMHO 1K is more valuable than CP.

The Star Alliance won't recognize CP's, but they do recognize 1K.

Having CP for the next 13 months will give me plenty of time to transition to 1K.

US CP's will always be second class compared to 1K's!

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by jetsetter:
... that CP's will no longer receive unlimited domestic upgrades</font>

That's not funny.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2"> ... unlimited CP upgrades will disappear in line with much of the rest of the industry.</font>

UA & DL do not "the rest of the industry" make. CO & NW both have extremely liberal upgrade policies.

Take away unlimited upgrades and kiss goodbye to your most frequent fliers. Why on Earth would they bother with US at all if you do that? That would make Ben & Mike's worst ideas look positively enlightened.

Upgrades on United aren't worth that. Not by a long shot. Anyone who is willing to give up something that important in order to upgrade on United ought to be flying on United enough to be a 1k not trying to back door status via US Airways. I'll settle for some sort of limited UA upgrade ability if the alternative is to lose unlimited on US. For that matter they can scrap the whole UA thing if there's even so much as a whiff of a chance that unlimited US upgrades might be threatened.

Don't mess with upgrades. Messing with miles was dumb. Messing with upgrades is suicide.

Oh my Gosh, Tom. Couldn't have said it better myself. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by catwood:
USair has introduced E-Upgrades, exchange value is four to one on paper upgrades.

One major change is that a long trip like PHL-SFO which used 3 certs before will now use 5.
</font>

Why not 6? It is 2521 miles, I know this well since I fly this route a lot. Is there a cap of 5 like there used to be a cap of 3?

Oh I just think I did my math wrong, but I would hope if it were 2521 they would take 5, but you know they probably wont.

I am mailing in 10 certs today, and I have another 8 to send in. Just to be safe I am not sending them all together.

Chris

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by infiniteflyer:
Does this mean that we can exchange Systemwides too?:

"Any unexpired paper upgrade issued by US Airways can be exchanged for E-Upgrades with the exception of upgrade awards redeemed using Dividend Miles. "</font>

Yes...but why would you want to?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Randeman:
Yes...but why would you want to?</font>

Because it's still better than throwing them out or redeeming them for only 500 miles ...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by gardener:
Why not 6? It is 2521 miles, I know this well since I fly this route a lot. Is there a cap of 5 like there used to be a cap of 3?

</font>

United only takes 5 for PHL-SFO. I think they have a grace--I've heard both 50 and 65 miles. UA also takes certs for the whole itinerary so even if you do a connect they look at origin and destination not segment-by-segment as US is planning to do.

gardener -- I fly this route three to five times a month and I've taken to flying UA PHL-ORD-SFO. There are at least 4 767s, 777s or 747s a day that fly ORD-SFO with Int'l Business class configurations and I usually book these for the virtually guaranteed upgrades and great seats and IFE. It adds about 1 hour to the trip to connect there but it's MUCH MORE pleasant. There is the risk of delays at ORD but it's a much more reliable airport than PHL.

I usually fly PHL-ORD in coach and do ORD-SFO in C for 1846 miles, 4 certs. Remember, folks, coach on UA is much more bearable w/E+ than coach on US, which simply stinks.

[This message has been edited by kv99 (edited 11-12-2002).]

Heh. The timing on this couldn't have been any better if I'd planned it.

In the mail on Saturday, what should be waiting for me, but new 4 DMUP01's from USAirways, issued 11/1/02, expiring 11/30/03, an overdue 10,000-mile printing. Looks like I have 16 more 500-mile credits. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

What I would like to is if cert miles carry over on segments. For instance, I primarily fly MYR to ORD via CLT. So that's going to be two 500 mile certs, one per segment. But the CLT to ORD portion is 570 or so. Does that mean that the miles from segment one (about 385 left over) will carry over to cover me or will I have to use three 500 mile certs at 1500 miles for a flight that actually only covers 700 miles?

Sorry, it looks like flight segments are considered separately. A minimum of one E-Upgrade is debited from the bank for each flight segment. I think the policy falls more in line with UA's upgrade policy, as mentioned on this thread.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by davohuang:
I think the policy falls more in line with UA's upgrade policy, as mentioned on this thread.</font>

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

I hate to repeat myself yet again on this exact same issue, but this change brings US inline with AA, not UA, most likely because US did not want to pay for a custom upgrade module on Sabre and is just using the same one AA uses.

I just bought a $120 book of 800-mile UGs and will be sending them in for 16 E-UGs. Thus, short flights (Northeast) I take will be upgraded 300% more often. That's a good deal, I think!

Ok maybe this is a loophole, and i will edit if it is.

You spend $120 for 4 upgrades, trade em in at 4-1. 16 upgrades now becomes 8,000 miles for $120 or 1.5cents a miles.

Chris

An excellent buy, indeed.

As for being a loophole, I can't imagine they aren't aware of this already.....maybe they are letting people buy them as a marketing gesture?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kv99:
... I usually fly PHL-ORD in coach and do ORD-SFO in C for 1846 miles, 4 certs. Remember, folks, coach on UA is much more bearable w/E+ than coach on US, which simply stinks.</font>

Great! Feel free to fly UA all you'd like. Just don't even think about hinting that you might even suggest that unlimited CP upgrades on US Airways metal are optional. They aren't. They are pretty much the only reason left to choose US over anyone else.

AMEN. Tom is the man.

Well, with all the new upgrade procedures and such, I just had an interesting little experience. I have a flight next Tuesday, CLT-TPA, and it didn't get upgraded automatically (either I forgot to ask for it to be queued or it may have gotten hosed on a schedule change), so I called the CP desk and asked if they could upgrade it and they said they couldn't but would waitlist me.

So, I of course wanted to see how the load looked if there were already no upgrades and checked the Japanese ETour site (http://www.etour.co.jp/Solar/index.html) ... G3 ... well, that's odd ... so I checked AOW (http://www.flyaow.com/classavailability.htm) too ... G3.

Well, now I'm thinking the real reason G and I got hosed last week may be because they don't mean anything anymore and I'm just about to call the CP desk back to get the 4-1-1 when my cell phone rings and it's the CP Desk telling me they could upgrade me and saying there were new procedures in place that had caused them to say they couldn't a few minutes earlier ...

Anyway, the moral of the story being to double check if you're told that FC is not available for upgrade!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Beckles:
Japanese ETour site ... G3 ... well, that's odd ... so I checked AOW, too ... G3.

I was freakin' out just READING your post at this point...I can't imagine what was going through YOUR mind! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Beckles:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

I hate to repeat myself yet again on this exact same issue, but this change brings US inline with AA, not UA, most likely because US did not want to pay for a custom upgrade module on Sabre and is just using the same one AA uses.</font>

Sorry, that's what I get for not reading the thread carefully. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/redface.gif

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by TomBascom:
Great! Feel free to fly UA all you'd like. Just don't even think about hinting that you might even suggest that unlimited CP upgrades on US Airways metal are optional. They aren't. They are pretty much the only reason left to choose US over anyone else.</font>

Whatever... I'm not making an analysis of whether there are any reasons left to fly on US or not -- and if this would be a good business decision for US or not.

My point is simply, with my flying patterns and recent experiences, I would pass on the unlimited upgrades on US IF upgrades were exchangeable w/UA. I'm not saying that will actually happen-- in fact, I have NO IDEA.

I enjoy the unlimited upgrades on US as much as the next person, but I think that F on US is not as good as C on a 3-class United plane (or even F on a 2-class UA flight...), and Coach on US is not even close to E+ on United. So, I'd forgo the unlimited upgrades on US if I'd have more upgrade opportunities on UA.

I can understand that others such as nawlinsdoc would feel differently because of their flying patterns.

I'm getting jaded too by the shrinking availability of G-class seats on the flights I'm taking...

[This message has been edited by kv99 (edited 11-14-2002).]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by kv99:
I'm getting jaded too by the shrinking availability of G-class seats on the flights I'm taking...</font>

I think that this explains your position rather well! Thanks for the clarification, kv99. Actually, I think that the G class shrinking is enough to drive ANYBODY insane. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

So now that I have mailed in a few of my paper certificates, how long until my "bank" of upgrades are available?

US has recieved my package on Tuesday (since i sent them byregistered receipt)

Website says e-upgrades received before Dec. 5 will be completed by Dec. 31. That said, you're probably looking at a 2- or 3-week wait until everything is up and running.

I got an official E-Upgrades mailing today that confirms the new GP earning rates for E-Upgrades (16/20 for 10,000/20,000 Preferred Miles). As an added bonus, they included a post-paid envelope for mailing in my (26) paper certs. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

Two people I know who have never had status also got the mailing. Why send this out to people with no status? They don't have DMUP01s to send in and have never bought a ticket that is upgradable for a non elite.
It was a waste of money.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by mileshound:
Two people I know who have never had status also got the mailing. Why send this out to people with no status? They don't have DMUP01s to send in and have never bought a ticket that is upgradable for a non elite.
It was a waste of money.</font>

Kind of like a couple of thousand voicemails about the RCC reciprocity..... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif



------------------
Saving the world, one clue at a time.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by mileshound:
Two people I know who have never had status also got the mailing. Why send this out to people with no status? They don't have DMUP01s to send in and have never bought a ticket that is upgradable for a non elite.
It was a waste of money.</font>

Because non-elites can buy or redeem miles for 800 mile upgrades, so it is possible they would have them.

I have a bunch of old paper upgrades that I purchased in '98, I was never able to use them up (not to mention 50 or so DMUP01's I got after that) before becoming CP...I'm not clear if they'll still be good in the future. Does anyone know? I'll be CP for atleast another year, so it doesn't seem to make sense to turn them in for the E-upgrades.

Ok...I had my E-Upgrade training tonight...
a. The grace is going to be 25 miles
b. The windows for upgrading restricted
fares/ non refundeable will change to
170hrs/72hrs/24hrs in advance for
CP/GP/SP.
c. Even though all this info is available
now, there is no implementation date.
d. I find it hard to believe it will
still cost $40/$50 to buy one E-Upgr
that is only valid for up to 500 miles
e. You can use 10000 Dividend Miles for
a pack of 6 E Upgrades which can be
processed by res.
Keep in mind if you should call res and ask about any of this..most reps haven't been trained yet...so email me and I'll try to help. I posed a lot of questions I thought many of you might ask...I am supposed to check with training Thursday for answers.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by BWI2MCO97:
a. The grace is going to be 25 miles</font>
I assume that's 25 miles per segment and not per certificate?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">b. The windows for upgrading restricted fares/ non refundeable will change to 170hrs/72hrs/24hrs in advance for
CP/GP/SP.</font>
Even dropping CP's down to five days, that's still better than top tier on most (all?) other major US carriers.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2"> d. I find it hard to believe it will
still cost $40/$50 to buy one E-Upgr
that is only valid for up to 500 miles</font>

This is significantly less than what UA charges for a 500 mile upgrade cert

Thanks for the information!

170 hours = 7 days + 2 hours

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by BillMorrow:
170 hours = 7 days + 2 hours</font>

Ummm ... yeah, except for flights leaving between midnight and 2 A.M. (of which I don't think there are any), that's a reduction.

(Okay, so maybe I was thinking 170 hours = 5 days for some stupid reason and am just trying to justify my stupidity after the fact)

170 seems like a weird number. Why not do 168? Typo? Should it be 100 hours?

What I would like to know is what bank does a CP have? I expect to only be Gold in 2004 and a reserve bank would be nice.

Any new information on whether CPs mailing in a paper upgrade get 4 e-upgrades or a single 500 mile credit?

CP will still have unlimited E Upgrades and one of the questions I asked was can a CP still start a bank and hold it until they lose status or convert the E Upgrades to miles later. I am supposed to check back later this week for the answer.

The 25 mile grace is per segment

Question,

I have several DMUP01 certs, which I am planing to send in.

1. What should I do with several upgrade certs I bought at the airport, will they also magically turn into a 4 for 1 swap?

2. What about the DMUPSYS02 certs, what should be done with them, I would guess save them and use them as opposed to sending them in and only getting 2K worth of credit for them...am I on the right track here?


------------------

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by BWI2MCO97:
CP will still have unlimited E Upgrades and one of the questions I asked was can a CP still start a bank and hold it until they lose status or convert the E Upgrades to miles later. I am supposed to check back later this week for the answer.
</font>

You rock http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif.

I suspect that a lot of people are interested in that answer. I'd like to know if I want to start a CP bank now, or just mail in the certs for 500 miles.


------------------
Saving the world, one clue at a time.

I stopped by my office today and asked again and was told CP will not have an E Upgrade Bank. I posed the question that if one has just recently acheived CP status , but has a stack of DMUP01 which expire on Sept 30, 2003 ...and they want the 4:1 exchange ratio...is it possible to start a bank? Answer I got was NO. I was told that this questions similar to this should be directed to DMSC....maybe they can provide some sort of alternative. By converting the NAU's to 500 miles would be about the only way a current CP later get the E Upgrades without paying for them. Yes, the rate of exchange is lower, but you could still use the miles to buy the 6 pack once status drops to GP/SP.

Can the conversion/submission be handled at a CTO? Or do I have to mail them in?

And will a DMUPSYS convert to 4 e-upgrades as well? I have one DMUPSYS that is due to expire at the end of the month and figure I might as well get something for it.

Thanks,
S.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by BWI2MCO97:
I stopped by my office today and asked again and was told CP will not have an E Upgrade Bank. I posed the question that if one has just recently acheived CP status , but has a stack of DMUP01 which expire on Sept 30, 2003 ...and they want the 4:1 exchange ratio...is it possible to start a bank? Answer I got was NO. </font>

Ouch. So Getting Out More cost me 90,000 miles since I will get 30K miles for my 60 NAU's instead of 120K. I didn't even earn that much on GOM.

Ben's Revenge.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by sbm12:
Can the conversion/submission be handled at a CTO? Or do I have to mail them in?

And will a DMUPSYS convert to 4 e-upgrades as well? I have one DMUPSYS that is due to expire at the end of the month and figure I might as well get something for it.
</font>

Conversion can be handled at any CTO, ATO, or US Airways Club starting December 5. Note that the conversion rate is lower at any of those places than mailing them in (3-to-1 as opposed to 4-to-1). The conversion rates for DMUPSYS and DMUPSYS02 are still open questions as far as I know.

[This message has been edited by davohuang (edited 11-19-2002).]

Per my training yesterday...ONLY DMUP01(NAU) can be exchanged for E-Upgrades....DMUPSYS/SYS02 valid for 500 miles into ones account.

what about upgrades previously purchased at the ticket counter? Do they count as 4 to 1 as well?

------------------

Today, I received the offer and postage paid envelope in the mail. The offer is exactly like the 1st post, except mine didn't refer to Silver getting 8 e-upgrades (as I'm not silver).

To 1 of the posters: they said to send in UNexpired DMUP01's. There was no mention of DMUPSYS02 (systemwide).

It looks like many people will have too many e-upgrades for 2003(at a redemption rate of 4:1 by mail, 3:1 in person, 2:1 after December). At least they said you can redeem unused e-upgrades for 500 ff miles. This part is nice. DL is mean as they make it hard to redeem then taketh away expired upgrade credits.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by BWI2MCO97:
Per my training yesterday...ONLY DMUP01(NAU) can be exchanged for E-Upgrades....DMUPSYS/SYS02 valid for 500 miles into ones account. </font>
That's lousy! One returned e-upgrade will be credited 500 miles. One returned DMUP01 will be credited up to 4 e-upgrades (which are worth up to 2000 mi. if returned unused). Therefore, the very valuable systemwide is now worth very little if unused!

BWI2MCO97, you should check what happens after February 28, 2003. The upgrade mailer I received states that the earning of upgrades (for Silver) is 8 for every 10K miles flown, THRU FEBRUARY 28, 2003. As many are aware, UA currently provides only 4 upgrades for every 10K miles flown. Incompatabilities like this cannot remain if UA and US flyers are to be on equal footing. Since the date noted corresponds with the end of the status year (i.e. anyone who didn't requalify does not have Preferred benefits), I suspect that things will change once again on March 1. Perhaps US will drop the earnings ratio to 4 per 10K miles flown at that time. Of course this still leaves open the big question of how you upgrade on the other airline (UA is you are a US Preferred member). It also suggests that it will be a difficult choice of which program to go with come January 1.

MileKing-
Part of the codeshare agreement stipulates that both UA's and US' frequent flyer programs are to remain separate. Additionally, the mailings that are going out to all of us say that US e-upgrades will not be valid on codeshare flights. I don't think the programs will try to (or can) emulate each other at all. It obviously won't help us if the e-upgrade rewards for SP goes down to 4/10K miles flown instead of 8/10K miles flown.

[This message has been edited by A320 EOW (edited 11-19-2002).]

How long do I have to buy 4 DMUP01 upgrades using 10,000 DM miles from the DMSC (which I can then convert into 16-E-Upgrades) before they make me buy just 6 EUG's for the same 10,000 miles?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by MileKing:
...Incompatabilities like this cannot remain if UA and US flyers are to be on equal footing...</font>

Why would they need to be on equal footing? Remember that this is not a revenue-sharing alliance. For US to make money off of it, people have to fly on US-metal. It is to their advantage, then, to make DM attractive enough to keep flyers and entice others to book US.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by BizJet:
How long do I have to buy 4 DMUP01 upgrades using 10,000 DM miles from the DMSC (which I can then convert into 16-E-Upgrades) before they make me buy just 6 EUG's for the same 10,000 miles?</font>

Not very long... In fact, you can't do it. Check out the small print on the website (http://www.usairways.com/dividendmiles/programinfo/eupgrade_promotion.htm):

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">* Any unexpired paper upgrade issued by US Airways can be exchanged for E-Upgrades with the exception of upgrade awards redeemed using Dividend Miles.
</font>

The Upgrade Awards mentioned above are the US20/US10 and whatever the transatlantic ones are.....I think....one can buy DMUP01's using miles or money ( or earn them by threshhold or in Elite member kits). FYI the E Upgrades are known as DMU500's and I failed to mention it before, but if you purchase them through res or redeem miles for them, you will be sent a statement/receipt reflecting the purchase. They will later be able to be purchased online and at the kiosk also. When I heard about the kiosk purchase I asked how and when since you can't even check in at kiosk when you're already upgraded. No answer on that one.

[This message has been edited by BWI2MCO97 (edited 11-19-2002).]

What do I do with a 15 YR old DS0013 that was purchased from US AIR that never expires? These are the ones that were sold in books of 10.

Up until now, they were still valid.

IIRC, others here also had some that were as old.

Also, aren't the DMUPSYS02s still going to be valid next year? They never said they are not going to be valid.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by mileshound:
What do I do with a 15 YR old DS0013 that was purchased from US AIR that never expires? These are the ones that were sold in books of 10.
</font>

Ah, good question, I forgot about those. I still have a pack of them from the '93 Triple Play promotion. What's a CP to do with those? Can I deposit them in my wife's account- there is no name on them.

That's a REAL bummer that CP's can't have an upgrade bank. Pretty silly if you ask me. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

I've got about 50 paper upgrades. The latest expiry date is 11/2003. What do you think I should do? Should I try sending ALL of them in with a letter asking for 2K each? Or, should I do that with some of them and save the ones that expire 11/2003 in hopes I might be able to convert them to e-upgrades at that point (or otherwise extend them) when it's obvious that I probably won't requalify for CP 2004?

Or maybe we can somehow get US to change their mind about this... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

I see a problem with US not telling CP liasons anything about this program. I called up two days ago because I received the envelope last week for sending my NAU's in even though I've been Chairman for over a month. The lady I spoke with checked with the GP line. She told me that I could send mine in for the 4:1 exchange, which I have done. She also told me that beginning in January, I would be able to exchange the e-upgrades in for 500/piece. Having said that, a different operator told my co-worker that CP will NOT have an e-upgrade account. So I'm not sure what will happen to the papers that I sent away. I assume if I can't get in on the 4:1 exchange, they will give the 500 mi/NAU rate. In this case it does not benefit a traveler who has flown with them all year and hit CP early, it does benefit the person who hits CP after Dec. 5 (apparently). I think they'll just make up the rules as they go along. BTW, I read that e-upgrades will not be accepted on UA flights or UA code shares.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by underwoodn:
I assume if I can't get in on the 4:1 exchange, they will give the 500 mi/NAU rate. In this case it does not benefit a traveler who has flown with them all year and hit CP early, it does benefit the person who hits CP after Dec. 5 </font>

That's the hard part for me to swallow. We are being punished for flying more.

I'd like to double check something. As a SP, if I exchange two UP01 for 2x4 500 milers, I wonder if those 8 500 milers can convert to actual miles. I asked DM and was told no. Was I told correctly?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Warrenlm:
I'd like to double check something. As a SP, if I exchange two UP01 for 2x4 500 milers, I wonder if those 8 500 milers can convert to actual miles. I asked DM and was told no. Was I told correctly?</font>

The E-upgrades can be "liquidated" for 500 miles/cert, but not until after the E-upgrade program officially begins on 12/5 at the earliest. I'd suggest giving US the next couple of weeks to fully develop the system and train its employees before making further inquiries to DMSC or US Reservations.

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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by BWI2MCO97:
Per my training yesterday...ONLY DMUP01(NAU) can be exchanged for E-Upgrades....DMUPSYS/SYS02 valid for 500 miles into ones account. </font>


Perhaps in response to all these questions - now posted on the main eUpgrades page:

"Members may also choose to exchange system-wide paper upgrades (Award Code: DMUPSYS02) and any other paper upgrade for E-Upgrades. All paper upgrades will be exchanged at the same ratio as the 800-mile North American upgrades. Each member must decide if exchanging paper upgrades for E-Upgrade meets their travel needs."

Not the best answer, but at least an answer.

I suppose the decision depends on whether you expect to need to upgrade a 2000+ mile flight where a SWU would be better than 4-500's. Or a flight to Europe. Or an SWU that will expire before you can use it - you can extend the life for another year.

I still haven't figured out what to do with my DS0013's. I can get 28-500's for MrsCPRich, but I doubt she'll use that many in the year before they expire. Will they become worthles at any point?



[This message has been edited by CPRich (edited 11-22-2002).]

I'm sending in my upgrades with a letter requesting 2000 miles for each one if I'm not allowed to exchange them for E-Upgrades as CP. I'm writing that this would make my upgrades maintain equal value as those for Silvers and Golds under the current exchange rates. And I'm wishing them good luck with the upgrade transition.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by flymetothemoon:
I'm sending in my upgrades with a letter requesting 2000 miles for each one if I'm not allowed to exchange them for E-Upgrades as CP. </font>

Would you be kind enough to post their reply to your letter?

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by CPRich:


I suppose the decision depends on whether you expect to need to upgrade a 2000+ mile flight where a SWU would be better than 4-500's. Or a flight to Europe. Or an SWU that will expire before you can use it - you can extend the life for another year.


[This message has been edited by CPRich (edited 11-22-2002).]</font>

How do I go about extending it for a year? Is it as easy as calling and asking?

Thanks,
S.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by sbm12:
[B] How do I go about extending it for a year? Is it as easy as calling and asking?
B]</font>

Perhaps I didn't use the best terms. You can't extend the SWU, but the 4 500-milers that you get are good for one year from issue. So, if your SWU expires in Feb, but you turn it in for exchange in Jan, they are good until next Jan. It's as good for flights up to 2000 miles, but not as good for transcons and presumable worthless overseas.

I can't believe a Chairman's comp has actually come back to bite me in the a$$. I got comped an additional year but then never used it -- only got unupgradeable award tickets and a trip to Europe upgraded with the old systemwides; so I never got anything from my Chairman's status this year. But in the flipside I now can't deposit all my initial Gold upgrades into my bank to set me up for next year.

Argh! I hope others are lucky in getting those upgrades deposited at least for miles..

And what happens to CP's this year who will downgrade to Gold next year who DON'T have any paper certs. How many e-upgrades will US put in their DM account to 'get them started' again as a downgraded Gold??

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by PHL:
And what happens to CP's this year who will downgrade to Gold next year who DON'T have any paper certs. How many e-upgrades will US put in their DM account to 'get them started' again as a downgraded Gold??</font>

When I asked about this, I was told that 'some' provision had been made for this, but was not told the number.

On the 23rd and 29th I spoke to the CP desk. As a newly minted CP, I have naive questions AND a lot of NAU's. I mentioned those coupons and was told "provision" was being made for CP's by both the CP liaisons and that something should be announced soon. Both calls were after the posting noted above (?).

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by nehopper:
On the 23rd and 29th I spoke to the CP desk. As a newly minted CP, I have naive questions AND a lot of NAU's. I mentioned those coupons and was told "provision" was being made for CP's by both the CP liaisons and that something should be announced soon. Both calls were after the posting noted above (?).</font>

Thanks nehopper. Please keep us posted. I'll check out the website to see if anything new is posted there.

Ok, here goes on the CP issue and eligibility for the 4 for 1 conversion of unexpired NAU's.

Just spoke with Diane in the DM Preferred Service Centre. I explained the situation of wanting to set up an E-upgrade account and then converting the account to miles.

Diane's answer was we are not eligible for the 1:4 paper to electronic conversion promotion b/c we have no account as CP's, BUT she said for CP's the paper certs will be converted to miles at the rate of 1 cert for 2,000 miles.

Assuming a CP wants to fly US (and not UA), this is a good move on US' part b/c why try to change system programming to set up an E-upgrade acct for CP's who probably just use the E-upgrade account temporarily, just to convert to miles.

I mentioned the 1 NAU for 2,000 miles for CP's situation is unclear from reading the Press Releases and asked if US would publish it on their web-site, in some manner, such as in the FAQ. She said they would not be doing so. The DM Preferred Service reps have been told, if this question arises, then the answer to give the caller is 1 NAU can be converted only to miles, at the rate of 2,000 miles for 1 NAU.

I explained I was a bit hesitant relying on verbal info from US/DM (note, not Diane hereself, but US/DM) and asked again if the 1 NAU = 2,000 miles for CP's would be published somewhere and she said no, just that ... and repeated her above comment.

So, it looks like the deal for CP's is 1 NAU = 2,000 miles.


Re the issue about those reaching CP in 2002 for the 2003 year, and then in 2003 not making CP for 2004 year: Diane mentioned that an E-upgrade acct would be set up for such persons with some amount of E-upgrades placed in the acct to get the person started on their way to regaining CP. She did not know at what point in the calendar year the acct would be set up, but presumably as soon as the CP status ceases, the computer program should be setting up E-upgrade accts for many persons.

Note, the DM program does not allow a CP in a particular year to drop below Gold the following year, so one might expect the # of E-upgrades to be uniform for 2002/2003 CP's not qualifying for CP for 2004.

Comments??

[This message has been edited by Expatriate (edited 12-03-2002).]

I plan to photocopy the NAU's, and submit with a letter mentioning the phone discussion and what DM is telling their reps to reply to CPs. Diane had no problem with this approach.

Plan to wait a couple of days just to see if DM puts anything in print that can be quoted for reference. 50 NAU's = 100k miles = one very good flight somewhere!

The logic I expressed was:
- in 2002, who/why do persons have paper NAU's?
- CP's from the prior year would not have paper NAU's, so must be persons who were previously not pfd members, or SP, or GP.
- so, the unexpired paper NAU's issued in 2002 are held by persons who were at least a SP or GP earlier in the year. It seems very unfair to not extend the same offer to those who were just a short time ago in the calendar year at the levels for which now are eligible for the 1:4 conversion program.

I called today to verify my earning information on eupgrades before, and now they are stating that GP's earn 8 eupgrades every 10k miles flown, with no additional bonus at the 20k mark. I guess the dropped it down from the 16 they were doing.

Chris

This was slipped in a few weeks ago.

This is a significant depreciation of upgrade value for Golds and Silvers. They get you both earning (500 vs. 800 miles), and spending (wasteage since they are applied per segment rather than origin to destination).

My wife is a SP and she received the envelope to send in her paper upgrades. The flyer looked like the others but had an additional block of text:
"Earning silver preferred e-upgrades - no more waiting for the mail! You will earn 8 e-upgrades for every 10,000 preferred miles flown an 12 for every 20,000 preferred miles flown through the preferred benefit period ending Feb 28th 2003."

It looks like there was an introductory offer to finish out the status year.

I'll probably get booed off the Board, but this is a reasonable way for the company to increase income. If US2s and US3s want to upgrade all segments, assuming they are available, the cost for this service will result in additional revenue without increasing the cost of the underlying ticket.

It would not be surprising to see a future decrease in the US1 companion benefit, too.

To be honest, at this reduced level of earning, you might as well be enjoying the superior coach product of AA or UA's E+. US2s, in particular, are really going to feel the hurt. US3s could never earn enough upgrades to upgrade all mainline flights without using miles or buying upgrades (or I could never do it as a US3. But I flew lots of mainline).

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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ClueByFour:
To be honest, at this reduced level of earning, you might as well be enjoying the superior coach product of AA or UA's E+.
</font>

BINGO!! You know, I've been flying around a lot in UA E+ and it's really not too bad.

When I run low, I will buy e-upgrades if necessary. While E+ or MRTC are acceptable for some people, seat WIDTH is more important than seat PITCH to me (your body shape may vary).