Other Asian, Australian and South Pacific Frequent Flyer Programs - China Eastern questions

Hello all,

Been a while since I was on here. Please excuse me for my absence but wondering if anyone can offer some thoughts on this.

We are soon to be living in Shanghai and will be travelling for several weeks in SE Asia. Our plan is to fly from PVG to HAN and then on the way back, from BKK to PVG.

I've never flown on any of the Chinese airlines so I wanted to see what people's experiences were. Online reviews of China Southern (who we would fly to HAN on) seem somewhat positive, but China Eastern has received rather poor reviews dating back a few years.

Our option for the return is direct flight on China Eastern or indirect through CAN on China Southern. Is China Eastern so bad/unreliable we should consider the stop over?

Or are both so unreliable we should go with Thai for an extra $330 each?

Thanks so much!

Let me move this to our appropriate Asian airlines forum for discussion. Ocn Vw 1K, Moderator, TravelBuzz.

If you're going to be living in SH, MU is impossible to avoid (they own FM now, so that option is about to disappear), so you might as well get used to it.

I do not advise that you take MU, since during IRROPS (cancellations / significant delays), they just leave you at the airport without much assistance. For normal operations, they're ok.

Taking into consideration that you are CO*G, I think Thai would be the better choice due to the additional benefits and priority services (especially useful during IRROPS). TG's service quality is far higher than MU and slightly higher than CZ.

So in your case it would be MU<CZ<TG

I do not advise that you take MU, since during IRROPS (cancellations / significant delays), they just leave you at the airport without much assistance. For normal operations, they're ok.


CZ is every bit as capable of screwing up as MU; friend of mine was held on a CZ plane in SZX last week for 4.5 hours with only cha su bao and soft drinks on board.

Once you are living in Shanghai, you will definitely be dealing with the likes of China Eastern and the other Chinese airlines. However, I recommend foregoing dealing with them whenever possible on international routes.

On the trip you are describing, my choice for PVG-HAN would be Vietnam Airlines nonstop (think it flies 4 or 5 days/week). And for return BKK-PVG, Thai airways nonstop. Hands down, no questions asked. I have found VN to be surprisingly decent to fly both in/out and within Vietnam, definitely better than the Chinese airlines.

I have never found the Chinese airlines to be that competitive price-wise on the regional routes to SE Asia--and if they are not offering me a significant cost savings over the alternative, I won't even consider them.

form PVG to SE Asia, I normally prefer one stop @ HKG.
This is why I will take CX/KA instead of PRC airlines.

I have never found the Chinese airlines to be that competitive price-wise on the regional routes to SE Asia--and if they are not offering me a significant cost savings over the alternative, I won't even consider them.

For those of us with DL miles, redeeming on MU/CZ is often a great way to go, even if doing so entails a stopover in Guangzhou (unpleasant).

Also, one ways on VN + TG may well be the most convenient for the OP, but at a substantial premium over ctrip's specials (rt to BKK is often less than Y2000).

For those of us with DL miles, redeeming on MU/CZ is often a great way to go, even if doing so entails a stopover in Guangzhou (unpleasant).

Also, one ways on VN + TG may well be the most convenient for the OP, but at a substantial premium over ctrip's specials (rt to BKK is often less than Y2000).

I didn't see the OP mentioning use of miles, but if he has DL miles, then redeeming them on CZ using CAN connection is a reasonable value proposition, that offsets the unpleasantness of having to transit in CAN. However, I wouldn't automatically jump on CZ for a paid ticket.

I'm sorry, but I continually scour the PEK-BKK and PVG-BKK fares and have for years, and I've never seen a roundtrip from PVG-BKK all-in for Y2000. One-way yes....are you sure that you read the Ctrip carefully, because I just looked and I'm not seeing what you are. Due to being burned by the supposed Ctrip teaser "specials" that never turn out to be real, I tend to avoid using them for any flight bookings other than domestic Chinese tickets.

The options that make sense for the OP on PVG-HAN are either the FM or VN nonstops (FM has terrible timing and watch out for the IRROPs issues as mentioned above, but VN doesn't fly every day). VN is the more expensive by about RMB 600. Or CZ via CAN (ugh-transit and long boring layover), or KA via HKG (ouch-price!). My value/time/convenience trade-off matrix ranks these as VN > CZ > FM > KA.

Options for BKK-PVG are FM, MU or TG nonstops (FM as above, with only wee hour departure options, MU is gross, TG more expensive but reasonable if purchased from an agent in BKK rather than online). Also CZ via CAN and CX/KA via HKG, with similar issues to above.

All-in totals of USD 500-550 (RMB 3600-3800) are pretty par for the course these days on the OP's segments, so if he can do it for that, he shouldn't feel too bad. I have never seen a situation for economy tickets where the non-Chinese carriers' pricing for the same days ended up to be different from the Chinese carriers pricing by as much as $330 for this routing--assuming one is going to the most favorable outlets for purchase (which are not necessarily the same for CH vs non-CH). I'd tend to believe the all-in differential of closer to $150-$200 for a VN/TG combo. And at that difference, I'd avoid the Chinese on this trip. My 2 cents.

One-way yes....are you sure that you read the Ctrip carefully, because I just looked and I'm not seeing what you are. Due to being burned by the supposed Ctrip teaser "specials" that never turn out to be real, I tend to avoid using them for any flight bookings other than domestic Chinese tickets.

Here's a RT PVG-BKK fare currently offered on their specials page:

曼谷 中国东方航空公司 普通 2-30天 1 RMB 1070 2011-3-31

I agree with you that finding flights with seats for sale at that fare is surely close to impossible, but I have availed of similar specials in the past.

From Beijing, there are a few random African airlines, plus Sri Lankan, that fly to SE Asia en route to other places. They often have good special fares, available on ctrip in addition other channels.

Here's a RT PVG-BKK fare currently offered on their specials page:

曼谷 中国东方航空公司 普通 2-30天 1 RMB 1070 2011-3-31

I agree with you that finding flights with seats for sale at that fare is surely close to impossible, but I have availed of similar specials in the past.

From Beijing, there are a few random African airlines, plus Sri Lankan, that fly to SE Asia en route to other places. They often have good special fares, available on ctrip in addition other channels.

Thanks for the heads up. Again, it's just very unlikely that one of these ctrip "specials" will coincide with OP's travel dates. If one is flexible and can work travel around whatever "specials" come up, I suppose you can get lucky. When I've tried in the past, I got the "oh, no more seats at that price" or "only 1 seat on next Tuesday flight" or similar BS--just completely frustrating. I've done Sri Lankan on a one-way BKK-PEK about 2-3 years ago, they were best pricing by far--purchased from agent in Bangkok--and actually exceeded my hard and soft product (economy) expectations, but since then they seem to have raised up pricing close to TG and CA. :( And flying them gets me nothing for FFP.

Hi there,

I have been searching extensively for more information on Eastern Miles FFP, but coming up empty handed.
Does anyone know or know where I can find information on the following:

- Fees charged for earning miles?
- Fees charged for redeeming miles?
- Any fees for participating in the FFP?
- Is the FFP a business unit of CEA, or is it third-party owned?
- % of total members active in FFP?

Any links that could lead me in the right direction would be greatly appreciated :)

Thanks for your help.
AAflyer1986

Hi there,

I have been searching extensively for more information on Eastern Miles FFP, but coming up empty handed.
Does anyone know or know where I can find information on the following:

- Fees charged for earning miles?
- Fees charged for redeeming miles?
- Any fees for participating in the FFP?
- Is the FFP a business unit of CEA, or is it third-party owned?
- % of total members active in FFP?

Any links that could lead me in the right direction would be greatly appreciated :)

Thanks for your help.
AAflyer1986

It appears that you're doing some sort of research project (the majority of us couldn't give a rat's behind about how many members they have or who owns their FFP). In any event, I advise you to call them.

I regularly fly CA/MU internally in China - same same IMHO

Recently flew CA SIN-PEK - new plane / excellent service.

1 week later flew MU PVG-SIN on the very first airbus ever built I think - disgraceful plane / disgraceful service - never ever again will I fly intl with MU

Do not downgrade yourself to MU/CZ.

I regularly fly CA/MU internally in China - same same IMHO

Recently flew CA SIN-PEK - new plane / excellent service.

1 week later flew MU PVG-SIN on the very first airbus ever built I think - disgraceful plane / disgraceful service - never ever again will I fly intl with MU

On the flip side, I've flown PEK-SIN on the very first 767 ever built (CA). :p

On the flip side, I've flown PEK-SIN on the very first 767 ever built (CA). :pDid they serve alchohol on flight?

If I have a drink in my hand I can tolerate pretty well anything - but alas - zero 'elixer' available on MU PVG-SIN flight. I would have even forced down a 'Dragon Seal' or 'Great Wall' had it been offered.

Did they serve alchohol on flight?

If I have a drink in my hand I can tolerate pretty well anything - but alas - zero 'elixer' available on MU PVG-SIN flight. I would have even forced down a 'Dragon Seal' or 'Great Wall' had it been offered.

Yes, but that flight was in ~2007. Since then, the Chinese airlines have, by in large, simply stopped serving alcohol to economy class passengers. I'm referring to domestic flights only because that's my data set. A good workaround to this is to grab a few beers from the lounge; even a few hours later, they will be much colder than anything you might have been able to get on the plane.

On the flip side, I've flown PEK-SIN on the very first 767 ever built (CA). :p

Isn't the very first 767 built a prototype sitting in the desert somewhere in California? (Or are you exaggerating, I can't quite tell).

Either way, all of the three major Chinese carriers are pretty close (translation: they all suck equally). HU, as I've said before is the only one that kind of stands out.

Like Cruiser Elite, I was being facetious or maybe hyperbolic. My point was that both CA and MU have some real dinosaurs in their fleets. But, since you mentioned HU, I find their 767s to be the absolute worst... single class and worn well beyond their years.

Like Cruiser Elite, I was being facetious or maybe hyperbolic. My point was that both CA and MU have some real dinosaurs in their fleets. But, since you mentioned HU, I find their 767s to be the absolute worst... single class and worn well beyond their years.

HU's 763's have above average (though non lieflat) seats in J with inseat power and PTVs in all classes. What one-class 767 are you referring to? :confused:

HU's 763's have above average (though non lieflat) seats in J with inseat power and PTVs in all classes. What one-class 767 are you referring to? :confused:

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Hainan-Airlines/Boeing-767-3BG-ER/0762614/&sid=ce056992ca06df62d8fd02dc8c511a68

I do not advise that you take MU, since during IRROPS (cancellations / significant delays), they just leave you at the airport without much assistance. For normal operations, they're ok.

Taking into consideration that you are CO*G, I think Thai would be the better choice due to the additional benefits and priority services (especially useful during IRROPS). TG's service quality is far higher than MU and slightly higher than CZ.

So in your case it would be MU<CZ<TG

I totally agree. Just got home after China Eastern IRROPS would have had me missing my international connection home. Completely unhelpful. I would have gotten home, at best, 24 hours later. Instead, I called AA in the US from the gate in Shanghai and they got me home with a completely different reroute, only a few hours later than my scheduled arrival.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Hainan-Airlines/Boeing-767-3BG-ER/0762614/&sid=ce056992ca06df62d8fd02dc8c511a68

These have been retired and are now flying with Ethiopian. The only 767's left for Hainan are the three Internationally configured ones.

Also, they're good drivers.

At HND, tokyo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvsfvQJdfco

At KIX, osaka
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXwtzYudk0M

1 week later flew MU PVG-SIN on the very first airbus ever built I think - disgraceful plane / disgraceful service - never ever again will I fly intl with MU
Care to elaborate given i'm doing this route on 24 Dec? :confused:
What plane was it? Any in-seat power (i'll get a new laptop battery if there isn't!!)?

None of the MU aircraft in coach have any form of in seat power or even PTVs for that matter.

Also, they're good drivers.

At HND, tokyo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvsfvQJdfco

At KIX, osaka
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXwtzYudk0M


Don't quite see what is wrong here. I used to work with a view of the runway at SFO and saw this kind of "double touch" landing quite often on windy days.

Chinese pilots are well trained and the planes are maintained up to international standards. The interiors of some of the planes are another story (the "small logo" CA 737 I took from PEK to SHE last week was the worst interior and least comfy seat I've ever been on). The safety of Chinese airlines, however, is equal to European, US or other reputable Asian carriers.

Hmmm, from the replies I gather that I'm one of the few people that actually take MU quite often… I took MU/FM about 40 times this year, CA maybe 7-8 times, CZ maybe 3-4 times. MU/FM is nothing special, but CA and CZ seem only slightly better. Regarding flight delays, I've had really bad experiences with all three of them. Worst case was boarding delayed for 1h, then sitting in the plane for another 3.5 hours before take-off.

The reason why I'm taking MU/FM is that they seem to be the best deal being based in Shanghai. So if you anticipate staying in Shanghai for a while, and flying a lot, better start collecting those MU flights. (I made the mistake of booking about 10 FM flights to Miles&More while they were still in Star Allicance.)

How is China Eastern for international Business Class? I am booked on JFK-PVG-BKK, SIN-PVG-JFK about 11 months from now, using DL SkyMiles. As far as I can tell, the TPAC's are operated by A340-600, BKK is an A330, and SIN is on the dreaded AB6.

Surely they serve drinks in Business on international flights. It'd be hard to cross the Pacific without a glass of vino.

How is China Eastern for international Business Class?I have only flown MU inter once - that was 3 years ago - MEL-PVG-LAX - the MEL-PVG / PVG-MEL legs were very ordinary - very old metal - PVG-LAX / LAX-PVG was really good - new plane - cannot remember what it was - and great service.

At that time I bought return J for A$3,800 - would readily fly it again if I could get a fare like that.