WestJet Rewards - Woman arrested after allegedly trying to open Westjet plane door mid-flight

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/prairies/woman-arrested-after-allegedly-trying-to-open-plane-door-mid-flight/article1631929/

A 47-year-old Newfoundland woman is facing several charges after a passenger tried unsuccessfully to open the door of a WestJet flight while in the skies over the Prairies.

Police say the flight, which took off from Calgary midday Tuesday and was bound for Halifax, had to make an emergency landing in Winnipeg.

Winnipeg police Constable Shaun Chornley says the plane was about an hour into its flight when a woman made her way to one of the door hatches and started pulling at it.

Const. Chornley says the woman told the flight crew and frightened passengers that she wanted to get out.

Articles about people trying to open doors in-flight should always include a line about it being impossible to open doors in-flight, IMHO. Why needlessly worry readers?

Articles about people trying to open doors in-flight should always include a line about it being impossible to open doors in-flight, IMHO. Why needlessly worry readers?

Correct. Due to differences in air pressure, it is not in fact possible to open an airplane door during flight at normal cruising altitudes, despite what you may have seen in the movies. This goes for all doors of an aircraft, including emergency exit and main doors; you could fuss with the opening mechanism as much as you like, but you wouldn't ultimately be successful.

Correct. Due to differences in air pressure, it is not in fact possible to open an airplane door during flight at normal cruising altitudes, despite what you may have seen in the movies. This goes for all doors of an aircraft, including emergency exit and main doors; you could fuss with the opening mechanism as much as you like, but you wouldn't ultimately be successful.

Meh, I buy lotto tickets also with scarce chance of being successful but there's always that one in 29 million chance. While the rational side of me can easily see what your both saying makes complete sense I still don't want to see anyone fussing with the door on any of my flights, thankyouverymuch.

Maybe not for a commercial jet at 37000 ft, but based on another version of this story, someone else opened a door at 7000 metres in the air:

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100707/national/plane_open_door

Maybe not for a commercial jet at 37000 ft, but based on another version of this story, someone else opened a door at 7000 metres in the air:

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100707/national/plane_open_door

That was a small Beechcraft King Air 200 Turboprop with doors it is possible to open in flight as it's not a plug-type door used on larger commercial aircraft (though it's not easy to open in-flight unless the suicidal pax opened the cargo door, if the plane was so equipped). That flight was a chartered plane operated by Adlair Aviation.

Unfortunately for thw woman will have been banned flying on the commercial airplanes. This is not good for her at all. She can't have to opened the aircraft door during in-flight. Does the passengers were restrained her? She will have to stay away from aircraft door. Do they have federal air marshals all Canadian flight? :confused: I don't blames her for what she done something wrong. She won't allow to flying for awhile. I don't know whether if Sky marshals will have be there in the aircraft.

Correct. Due to differences in air pressure, it is not in fact possible to open an airplane door during flight at normal cruising altitudes, despite what you may have seen in the movies. This goes for all doors of an aircraft, including emergency exit and main doors; you could fuss with the opening mechanism as much as you like, but you wouldn't ultimately be successful.

Didn't DB Cooper jump out the ramp at the back of a 727? (edit: nevermind, he jumped out of an unpressurized plane at 10,000 ft)

That being said, you still can't get the main doors open, and do any airplanes have ramp doors at the back anymore? I'd still be uncomfortable watching some panicking woman trying to futz the door open!

Didn't DB Cooper jump out the ramp at the back of a 727? (edit: nevermind, he jumped out of an unpressurized plane at 10,000 ft)

That being said, you still can't get the main doors open, and do any airplanes have ramp doors at the back anymore? I'd still be uncomfortable watching some panicking woman trying to futz the door open!

I heard she was watching the Germany / Spain game live on the PTV's and was expressing her displeasure at the final outcome!

:)

Didn't DB Cooper jump out the ramp at the back of a 727? (edit: nevermind, he jumped out of an unpressurized plane at 10,000 ft)

That being said, you still can't get the main doors open, and do any airplanes have ramp doors at the back anymore? I'd still be uncomfortable watching some panicking woman trying to futz the door open!

DB Cooper's act resulted in the invention of the Cooper Vane to keep airstairs from being lowered inflight.

Yes, very improbable that the door could be opened but the women was verbally and physically abusive to crew and other passengers - that's more than enough to be banned IMHO.

Would messing with the door potentially cause problems with the door warning, arming and slide mechanisms?

A main plug-door will have a force of about 10 tonnes keeping it in place at 40000 feet and an over-wing emergency exit a force of about 2.5 tonnes. Not something any human being could break loose without the aircraft being de-pressurized first.

Those who know me here know what I do and for whom..

There is NO F*cking way you can open a door in flight in a pressurized aircraft.

Physics.. its too much pressure inside the cabin..

Those who know me here know what I do and for whom..

There is NO F*cking way you can open a door in flight in a pressurized aircraft.

Physics.. its too much pressure inside the cabin..

Yes, you sit in the very first row. ;) However please review post #4. :D

Let's try a back-of-the-envelope calculation here.

Air pressure at ground level is roughly 100 kiloPascals. Air pressure at cruise level is roughly 20 kiloPascals. Difference roughly 80 kiloPascals.

One pascal is a newton per meter squared. Door is roughly one meter wide and two meters high so say two meters squared. 80 kiloPascals times two meters squared is 160 kiloNewtons of force.

Door handle provides some leverage, let's guess it's one meter long and you move it a half rotation to open the door. And opening the door moves it ten centimeters. (After that you swing it inwards).

2*pi*r for the full rotation, pi*r for a half rotation. Say three meters at the long end of the lever. That is 300/10 = 30 times mechanical advantage.

So to open the door at cruise you need to apply a force of 160/30 = around 5 kiloNewtons.

Gravity is around 10 newtons per kilogram, so 5 kiloNewtons is like the weight of 500 kilograms.

So bottom line, if the woman weighs 500 kilograms and puts her whole weight into the door handle, she might be able to get it open.

Should you be worried? I am a little worried. I could swear the woman next to me on my last flight to Florida was at least 1000 pounds...

Can someone check my math?

I don't think any of that math is necessary. Have you ever watched an FA struggle to open the door of a plane not moving, not pressurized on the ground?

Husband claims he warned WS flight attendant that his wife was acting abnormally.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/manitoba/story/2010/08/18/mb-westjet-morton-fitzpatrick.html

acting normally.

Abnormally I think you mean, AB, but it seems another case of hindsight being 20-20. If the guy was so smart maybe he wouldn't have let her board the plane in the first place. @:-)

Abnormally I think you mean, AB, but it seems another case of hindsight being 20-20. If the guy was so smart maybe he wouldn't have let her board the plane in the first place. @:-)

Now corrected. Thanks

Let's try a back-of-the-envelope calculation here.

Air pressure at ground level is roughly 100 kiloPascals. Air pressure at cruise level is roughly 20 kiloPascals. Difference roughly 80 kiloPascals.

One pascal is a newton per meter squared. Door is roughly one meter wide and two meters high so say two meters squared. 80 kiloPascals times two meters squared is 160 kiloNewtons of force.

Door handle provides some leverage, let's guess it's one meter long and you move it a half rotation to open the door. And opening the door moves it ten centimeters. (After that you swing it inwards).

2*pi*r for the full rotation, pi*r for a half rotation. Say three meters at the long end of the lever. That is 300/10 = 30 times mechanical advantage.

So to open the door at cruise you need to apply a force of 160/30 = around 5 kiloNewtons.

Gravity is around 10 newtons per kilogram, so 5 kiloNewtons is like the weight of 500 kilograms.

So bottom line, if the woman weighs 500 kilograms and puts her whole weight into the door handle, she might be able to get it open.

Should you be worried? I am a little worried. I could swear the woman next to me on my last flight to Florida was at least 1000 pounds...

Can someone check my math?

Assuming no frictional losses in the door mechanism and ignoring the friction between the door and fuselage.

Assuming no frictional losses in the door mechanism and ignoring the friction between the door and fuselage.

Too much Physics but basically Boeing & Airbus states that cabin doors cannot be opened in-flight and we're going with that...

Too much Physics but basically Boeing & Airbus states that cabin doors cannot be opened in-flight and we're going with that...

And on that note, is it standard protocol to close threads after a certain time or do they still stay posted indefinitely? Seems like this story and the associated comments have reached their natural conclusion and not much is left to say about it.

And on that note, is it standard protocol to close threads after a certain time or do they still stay posted indefinitely? Seems like this story and the associated comments have reached their natural conclusion and not much is left to say about it.

The only guideline that I could find on the subject is from the FlyerTalk rules:

"Unless there is a compelling reason, avoid bumping threads that are more than two years old. Often the information is out-dated and it clogs the forums, making it difficult to find current threads."