Qantas Frequent Flyer - F SYD to LHR for A$5745 return!!!

Gday

Just had a look at flights SYD-LHR in June - return in July 2010. Bestflights.com.au has a fare in F for AU$5745!!!!

However I quickly grabbed 2 tickets - paid - got the e-tickets.

When looking up the booking on Qantas.com.au we are booked in class R (which I believe is First) and text is Premium Economy :confused:

I have a confirmation email from the travel agent confirming First so surely even if it is a mistake they can't take that away from me? Or?

Fares are still available on the www so be quick...

Thanks!
Thaigold

Have you done seat selections? If not, phone up Qantas and select seats ; if they are in single digit numbers then probably is in 1st

R is no longer used for 1st class, it was used for 1st class on 388 services; R is now used for Premium Economy priced above T but below W

if it is actually booked in premium economy with Qantas, then that is what I would expect that you fly in

Looking at paid fare on Expert Flyer, the published R r/t fare for that period is $5295 and is in Premium Economy

I would call QF and check asap since I suspect that it is not in 1st class

if it isn't and when you purchased the booking system told you it was 1st class before you bought it, I would suggest trying to get a refund with the cancellation penties waived

Dave

Hi Dave

According to the QF www it's PE - and that's where the preselected seats are. However according to the travel agents email confirmation and booking it's F...

Surely I'm in my rights to demand the F seat - as that is what I have searched and booked? I'm not paying this for a PE seat to LHR...

Tried to read the rules on the bestflights.com.au website however it doesnt say anything about this.

Thaigold

Hi Dave

According to the QF www it's PE - and that's where the preselected seats are. However according to the travel agents email confirmation and booking it's F...

Surely I'm in my rights to demand the F seat - as that is what I have searched and booked? I'm not paying this for a PE seat to LHR...

Tried to read the rules on the bestflights.com.au website however it doesnt say anything about this.

Thaigold

You have no right from Qantas to travel in 1st given that you have purchased a premium economy ticket. Your demands for a seat in 1st will be refused

If you want to fly 1st class, then you will have to purchase a 1st class ticket and not a PE ticket.

The Qantas system correctly shows the R class as Premium Economy, your issue is with the Travel Agent. Unless you are happy to pay 6k for PE, then I would get onto Bestflights and get a refund

Dave

I think your problem is best resolved with bestflights - It seems they haven't updated their system to reflect that R is now a Premium Economy class and no longer first.

I'd be on the phone now with bestflights.

\

I think your problem is best resolved with bestflights - It seems they haven't updated their system to reflect that R is now a Premium Economy class and no longer first.

I'd be on the phone now with bestflights.

\

Hey again

I realise my problem isn't with Qantas but with Bestflights. I am just wondering how they can sell and confirm a F booking and then it's actually PE?! Just imagine the disappointment at the airport if I didn't realise this :mad:

Aren't Bestflights responsible for their fares? Especially when the booking has gone through?

I have spoken to Bestflights and they are looking in to the booking.

Thaigold

Well the change is very very recent - it's possible they didn't get the memo about it. I'm sure there is something on their conditions that limits what they are required to give you. While I don't think they'll offer you an F ticket at the very least I suspect they will offer you a refund.

Let us know what they say.

Well the change is very very recent - it's possible they didn't get the memo about it. I'm sure there is something on their conditions that limits what they are required to give you. While I don't think they'll offer you an F ticket at the very least I suspect they will offer you a refund.

Let us know what they say.

I will let you know...

Even on Qantas www they still have the R class as First

Premium Economy T, W
Business C, D, I, J
First A, F, R

Thaigold

I will let you know...

Even on Qantas www they still have the R class as First

Premium Economy T, W
Business C, D, I, J
First A, F, R

Thaigold

Regardless, it seems pretty clear (to me) that you have a PE ticket

If you are not satisfied with that, then get onto Best Flights ASAP and request a refund waving cancellation penalties

Best Flights seem not to have updated their systems and are mistakenly claiming to offer 1st class for a v low fare so there should be no problem getting a full refund

Dave

See this announcement from October 22:

http://www.qantas.com.au/agents/dyn/qf/news/200910/1050

Qantas Introduces R Class for International Premium Economy 22 October 2009

Effective 04 November 2009, Qantas will introduce the R inventory class for use in the International Premium Economy Cabin for departures on or after Monday 16 November 2009.

R class will be inventory controlled and sit between W class and T class.

T class year round fares will move to R class. T class will be used for tactical fares as required. ...



See here from yesterday:

http://www.qantas.com.au/agents/dyn/qf/news/200911/1108

International Premium Economy Fares Update 03 November 2009

The following Premium Economy fares have been released for sale effective 04 November 2009:

...

Australia to UK / Europe Premium Economy Super Saver OW/RT Excursion Fares (QF/BA) (R*SS1Y/ R*SSOW)
- QF R class fare introduced for Travel from 16Nov09
- BA E class fare introduced for Travel from 16Nov09
- Existing T class fares, travel end 15Nov09.

Hey again

I realise my problem isn't with Qantas but with Bestflights. I am just wondering how they can sell and confirm a F booking and then it's actually PE?! Just imagine the disappointment at the airport if I didn't realise this :mad:

Aren't Bestflights responsible for their fares? Especially when the booking has gone through?

I have spoken to Bestflights and they are looking in to the booking.

Thaigold

Many people here have reported problems with Bestflights so it doesn't surprise that they have not updated their system yet.

I hope this is a fully refundable fare otherwise you will have a very long discussion.

In many countries airlines are liable for the actions of their agents, particularly if the agent has been paid a fee by the airline. Legally the agent is acting as a representative of the airline; however the legal "paper" is the actual ticket issued by the agent and not the covering description. So if the ticket is for Premium Economy and the cover letter says "First", you have a PE ticket and no legal claim (except for fraud against the agent but not the airline). If the agent erroneously issued an F ticket, for example, the airline would have to honour it and could not deny you passage, saying that was a fraudulent ticket for example. Probably it is a valid R PE ticket and you are out of luck for anything other than a refund or whatever goodwill gesture bestflights is willing to make. This type of confusion does come up from time to time when the meaning of fare codes is changed.

...
I have a confirmation email from the travel agent confirming First ...I would be hanging on to that email!

Do not delete it! It may be your only proof you believe you were booking First.

Also, I'd be going through the booking process, step by step and taking screen shots of each page - it may all be different tomorrow.

I am on the phoen with best flights now, the said its PE, a mistake.

Interesting enough when Qantas first brought out R class for the A380, I booked an exconomy ticket Sin - Syd return for S$900 on Qantas website and it was confirmed, "economy not available travel wiill be in First Class".

I also doubted that I would actually get a F suite so I called Qantas and they confirmed that for S$900, I would not receive a F Suite sorth S$5,000, however, they compensated my by giving me 50% of the fare componjent of the economy class fare.

In many countries airlines are liable for the actions of their agents, particularly if the agent has been paid a fee by the airline. Legally the agent is acting as a representative of the airline; however the legal "paper" is the actual ticket issued by the agent and not the covering description. So if the ticket is for Premium Economy and the cover letter says "First", you have a PE ticket and no legal claim (except for fraud against the agent but not the airline). If the agent erroneously issued an F ticket, for example, the airline would have to honour it and could not deny you passage, saying that was a fraudulent ticket for example. Probably it is a valid R PE ticket and you are out of luck for anything other than a refund or whatever goodwill gesture bestflights is willing to make. This type of confusion does come up from time to time when the meaning of fare codes is changed.

Well the problem is that they don't give you the fare class on the ticket - hence you can only believe that you are actually booked in the right cabin, which should be the case.

This is ours - few details removed:



Flight Booking, Payment Confirmation and E-ticket
Your Booking Reference is:
xxxxxx
This is your e-ticket. Please print and carry with you at all times when travelling.
Thank you for booking with Best Flights. We are now processing your payment. This confirmation is also your actual e-ticket and payment receipt.
Your e-ticket must be carried with you at all times. Photographic identification may be required at any stage of your journey.
If you wish to alter any details of your booking please ring our on-line service centre on
1300 737 410 (within Australia) or + 61 8 9227 3380 (outside Australia).
Please note amendment and cancellation charges will apply.

Flight Schedule - First Class Flights

Airline Duration Departs / Arrives
(local time)
FLIGHTS
OUT

Qantas Airways
(QF 31) 23h 15m Sydney [SYD]
16:25 xx-Jun-2010 London-Heathrow [LHR]
06:40 xx-Jun-2010

FLIGHTS
BACK

Qantas Airways
(QF 2) 22h 15m London-Heathrow [LHR]
22:15 xx-Jul-2010 Sydney [SYD]
05:30 xx-Jul-2010

Fare Conditions
Passenger & Pricing Information
Name/Item Price Taxes Total
Lead Passenger xxxx $5,189.10 $556.60 $5,745.70

Adult 2 xxxx $5,189.10 $556.60 $5,745.70

Other Charges Best Flights Service Fee $18.95 $18.95

Total Price (Australian Dollars): $11,510.35

Still waiting for Bestflights to call me back - had to discuss with management and IT department...
Thaigold

I am on the phoen with best flights now, the said its PE, a mistake.
...

Good luck in a speedy refund from bestflights.

When they made a mistake and did a totally unauthorised charge to my cc for travel I had not asked for (or indeed anything), they acknowledged a mistake there and then. It was > $2000. It took almost 2 months before the money made its way back into my cc account. Westpac Altitude said that since they (bestflights) had admitted a mistake there was nothing that they were going to do. In the meantime the unauthorised charge blew my credit limit and it cost me $35 in addition to paying the > $2000 to settle the cc bill (the > $2000 was refunded but not the $35).

More than a year later, I still have not got the $35 back in spite of their promise that they would and 3 faxes, an odd email and one phone call has come to zero. Its just not worth the stress of pursuing it.

Lesson learnt, avoid bestflights.com.au and deal with a local agent - or indeed - anyone else.

I have never seen an e-ticket in that format (also it should show an IATA ticket number), however in the absence of a fare class and the written words "First Class", I think you have a contractual F ticket that QF is obliged to honour. Quaint.

There should be no issue getting a refund out of them if you have an email confirming 1st class ; as suggested, make a dummy booking and get screen shots showing the error. in the unlikely event that BF decided to try to avoid refunding then you would have little trouble in a small claims action for the $300 cancellation penalty that I think the fare has

Dave

I have never seen an e-ticket in that format (also it should show an IATA ticket number), however in the absence of a fare class and the written words "First Class", I think you have a contractual F ticket that QF is obliged to honour. Quaint.

But would you want to take that risk!

But would you want to take that risk!The OP has 8 months until flight date to sort it out. Simply done by contacting QF by letter, advising that their agent has issued a First Class ticket, and requesting confirmation that QF recognizes the authenticity of the transaction. QF will respond either to deny it or accept it. Legally the OP can get a few palm trees out of QF (or is it only BA that gives palm trees?). :) :) :)

Most likely QF will honour F travel and bill it back to the travel agent. That is what usually happens for good-faith errors. Almost all error fares are honoured by airlines after ticketing (FT is full of these stories, fwiw) and the OP just happens to be in luck, based on the e-ticket that he was issued.

The OP has 8 months until flight date to sort it out. Simply done by contacting QF by letter, advising that their agent has issued a First Class ticket, and requesting confirmation that QF recognizes the authenticity of the transaction. QF will respond either to deny it or accept it. Legally the OP can get a few palm trees out of QF (or is it only BA that gives palm trees?). :) :) :)

Most likely QF will honour F travel and bill it back to the travel agent. That is what usually happens for good-faith errors. Almost all error fares are honoured by airlines after ticketing (FT is full of these stories, fwiw) and the OP just happens to be in luck, based on the e-ticket that he was issued.

Qantas will simply see that an R class booking has been made and that it is an agency booking and send the customer to the agent to resolve

Note that the OPs e-ticket receipt (as shown above) only has a PNR and not a ticket number. Is this a true e-ticket receipt or just a receipt for payment?

I have never seen an e-ticket in that format (also it should show an IATA ticket number), however in the absence of a fare class and the written words "First Class", I think you have a contractual F ticket that QF is obliged to honour. Quaint.

I'm not too sure about that. If the OP turns up to the airport with that email, the Qantas staff will tell them to speak to Bestflights as it's their issue to sort out.

Yes there may be legal remedies available, but these may not help someone who is intending to sit in F, arrives at the airport without doing checks, and is then seated in PE.

Qantas will simply see that an R class booking has been made and that it is an agency booking and send the customer to the agent to resolve

My thoughts exactly!

When all else fails, the Department of Fair Trading can mediate. They say you can never force Apple's hand, and I did, twice!

get screen shots of BF pages as the TPA may be able to be used in a false and misleading action.

WHat you have shown here IS NOT an eTicket... eTicket MUST HAVE a number!!!

Note that the OPs e-ticket receipt (as shown above) only has a PNR and not a ticket number. Is this a true e-ticket receipt or just a receipt for payment?

I had a booking with BestFlight HKG-CAN and had exactly the same e-ticket as this booking. It does staten on this booking that:

Your Booking Reference is:
xxxxxx (I have withheld this)
This is your e-ticket. Please print and carry with you at all times when travelling.


Still waiting to hear back from BF.... Never had a problem with them before....
Thaigold

I put in some random dates while here...

http://adoota.com/FT/bestflights-first.jpg

Bestflights are clearly selling a first class fare.......

I put in some random dates while here...

http://adoota.com/FT/bestflights-first.jpg

Bestflights are clearly selling a first class fare.......

You beat me - I did the same and yes, it is still there as first. What concerns me is teh fact that there is no way of checking bucket from which it is being sold. I would never ever buy such ticket.

Also, considering that you cannot buy even C class on QF for that price, I would be immediatelly VERY suspicious...

You beat me - I did the same and yes, it is still there as first. What concerns me is teh fact that there is no way of checking bucket from which it is being sold. I would never ever buy such ticket.

Also, considering that you cannot buy even C class on QF for that price, I would be immediatelly VERY suspicious...

Perhaps, it's slightly confusing, but it's all got to do with would a reasonable person be able to understand what they are purchasing. If they are not really purchasing a first class fare then this is deceptive and misleading conduct 101.

Bestflights either need to honour it and take a loss, OR they refund you and you report to ACCC.

I really love their "Fare Conditions" - http://www.bestflights.com.au/information/terms-conditions/?airlineCode=QF
In particularl I am amazed how they stress out that they are under WA jurisdiction...

I will follow this for sure - this might be entertaining...:D

I recently booked a PER - JFK - PER in business for $7250 with flightcentre matching a bestflights fare loaded incorrectly. I thought that was a very good deal and very good of flight centre matching this.

Cheers

I had a booking with BestFlight HKG-CAN and had exactly the same e-ticket as this booking. It does staten on this booking that:

Your Booking Reference is:
xxxxxx (I have withheld this)
This is your e-ticket. Please print and carry with you at all times when travelling.


Still waiting to hear back from BF.... Never had a problem with them before....
Thaigold

booking reference is not the same as a ticket number. you need a number that starts with 081 (QF ticket stock). i think you will have no problem getting ticket numbers... but they will be for PE, not F.

If you intend to fly on this as an F fare, make sure you have ticket numbers in hand (and, even better, charges shown on your credit card statement) before contacting the TA. Otherwise, they can just cancel the ticket and are not liable for anything because no ticket was ever issued.

Uh oh....... :eek:
QF ditched R class F and ReLaunched it as Y+.
This effort by BestFlights sounds like something you'd expect from STA Travel.

Plug your xxxxxx booking reference into www.checkmytrip.com; if ticketed the ticket number would be revealed:https://www.checkmytrip.com/plnext/XCMTXITN/200910150913/static/img/search_flights.gif e-ticket numbers

You might like to try the LAN utility as well, if it works it should show fare basis and tax breakdown:

http://www.lan.com/cgi-bin/recibo_eticket/recibo_eticket.cgi

You might like to try the LAX utility as well, if it works it should show fare basis and tax breakdown:

http://www.lan.com/cgi-bin/recibo_eticket/recibo_eticket.cgi

Good point. I forgot to mention above that the AUD tax breakdown from lan.com from my absolutely last bestflights ticket did not match what I paid. The mismatch was around AUD$150. They never explained this difference inspite of repeated questions. I can only suggest they fiddled and padded the taxes / fines / extras as their "ë-ticket" receipt did not give the breakdown.

Bestflights either need to honour it and take a loss, OR they refund you and you report to ACCC.

The ACCC will not act on the OPs behalf. You will need to go through a state body or a court for this.

I am not taking the case unless I get a very substantial retainer.

I am not taking the case unless I get a very substantial retainer.

You can get one of the tickets :D

Thanks all for all your replies - I will keep you posted/updated when I hear back from BestFlights.

Thaigold

If it's too good to be true....

Lastminute.com over here in the UK is showing a similar price for QF LHR>MEL>LHR in F = £2003.70 I called Lastminute.com and they confirmed this price, but I have a feeling that the bloke in the call centre didn't really understand, even when I asked him if this was an error in their system.

I guess the question is - do I go ahead and book and then have a fight with lastminute.com?

Looking at their Ts & Cs:

Where we act as agent this will mean that we have no contractual liability to you in respect of that product. However, we may still be liable to you if we have been negligent, we have misrepresented important information or have been in breach of any other relevant law

Clearly they will have misrepresented important information by getting the fare class wrong but I wonder if I am likely to get my money back or to get the trip in F?

If it's too good to be true....

Not necessarily. This is FT after all and there have always been error fares which were then honoured by the hotel/airline/rental car company. There are entire trip reports of people flying for $1 half way around the world.

Not necessarily. This is FT after all and there have always been error fares which were then honoured by the hotel/airline/rental car company. There are entire trip reports of people flying for $1 half way around the world.

...and Concorde!

If you don't get any joy.

SImply ask the bank for the credit card dispute form - one of the boxes available is that you purchased goods online you have not received. Boom bank chases the merchant for selling something they have not delivered on.

As it is then fraud.

This still hasn't been fixed yet...
To the OP - once they take your money, there is offer and acceptance ie a contract is formed. The agent has an obligation to deliver the service. You'd be on pretty solid grounds to force them to honour the sale - it'd even be worth the $100s to get a solicitor in WA to act on your behalf in order to obtain an order that the company has to fulfil contractual obligations.

[SIZE="2"] - one of the boxes available is that you purchased goods online you have not received. Boom bank chases the merchant for selling something they have not delivered on.
...

so long as the merchant is keeping quiet on the mistake / fraud or whatever. Bestflights (in my case) acknowledged the problem and took their sweet time in doing the refund (2 months). If the bank knows the merchant accepts there is a mistake (etc), they will do nothing.

Who in their right mind would pay 5.5K for Y+? you could travel J class for the same amount or around 1K more at worst.:confused:

CJ:p

Who in their right mind would pay 5.5K for Y+? you could travel J class for the same amount or around 1K more at worst.:confused:

CJ:pSome people are required by contract to travel in Y or Y+ (often no distinction is made). They don't care about the price -- it is reimbursed -- but do care about the fare code :) Many airlines do things like offer more FF miles to encourage using Y instead of B or H (e.g. AA has Y the same as J). Finally Y has no restrictions and almost never sold out (i.e. most airlines will bump some discounted fare from the flight in order to sell a Y seat), so sometimes Y is available when J is sold out :) I think QF offers a guaranteed Y seat as a WP benefit (not really a benefit as they will do this for anyone).

I think QF offers a guaranteed Y seat as a WP benefit (not really a benefit as they will do this for anyone).

It is a benefit since otherwise, if Y has no availability, they will not sell it. The Platinum benefit provides guaranteed availability for H and Y class for member plus 1

I have been on flights only recently where Y was zeroed and couldn't be booked without the use of the Platinum benefit

Dave

Gday all

Thanks for all your comments and advise ^

I am still waiting to get the matter solved however have had phone calls back from Bestflights ensuring me they are working on this. I should have final outcome next week. They have been very good in getting some information to me...

Apparantly it's now a matter for QF to solve as they would have loaded the fare/booking class in to the system?! Not sure how it all works?!

I have been advised that I'm entitled to the F tickets as I would not have any way of knowing the tickets would be in Y+.

Thanks again - update to follow
Thaigold

I think QF offers a guaranteed Y seat as a WP benefit (not really a benefit as they will do this for anyone).

Not quite a guarantee, as I once discovered:


(e) Qantas may occasionally have to restrict this facility without prior notice on some routes or under special circumstances;

Apparantly it's now a matter for QF to solve as they would have loaded the fare/booking class in to the system?! Not sure how it all works?!

I have been advised that I'm entitled to the F tickets as I would not have any way of knowing the tickets would be in Y+.


So they have hand balled you back to QF? QF are not going to care as you made the booking through a 3rd party.

You won't be getting F tickets from QF. That's my opinion anyway

So they have hand balled you back to QF? QF are not going to care as you made the booking through a 3rd party.

You won't be getting F tickets from QF. That's my opinion anyway

It sounds like it, but OP said that the TA claimed he was entitled to F tickets. That's gotta count for something. Even if QF doesn't do anything (and I don't think they will), the OP can go back to the TA and tell them to fix it.

I didn't think they would, but ^ if the TA honors this.

Apparantly it's now a matter for QF to solve as they would have loaded the fare/booking class in to the system?! Not sure how it all works?!

Methinks they may be telling porkies.

Qantas publishes a list of fares. The bestflights IT system picks these up and converts them into readable format for people to search on.

So from my understanding, it is Bestflights that does the translation between "R" and First - not Qantas telling Bestflights that R is a First class fare.

Certainly notice was given to agents advising of this change. I think Bestflights may not have noted the change correctly, or implemented the change properly.

I reckon a full refund + some minor compensation is the best you can hope for.

Not quite a guarantee, as I once discovered:

I believe that if the booking class is closed to waitlisting, then it can be declined. I have only used the benefit once ( for 2 sectors ) in the 9 years of having access to it so not the most major benefit around imo

Dave

From Qantas Industry Sales

https://www.qantas.com.au/agents/dyn/qf/news/200910/1050


Qantas Introduces R Class for International Premium Economy 22 October 2009

Effective 04 November 2009, Qantas will introduce the R inventory class for use in the International Premium Economy Cabin for departures on or after Monday 16 November 2009.

R class will be inventory controlled and sit between W class and T class.

T class year round fares will move to R class. T class will be used for tactical fares as required.

For existing ticketed T class bookings, these will remain unchanged rather than being reaccommodated in R class. Any unticketed T class bookings should either:
1. remain in T class and be ticketed before Wednesday 04 November 2009; or
2. be rebooked to R class and ticketed in accordance with ticketing time limits.

GDS availability displays and fares will be updated from 04 November 2009.

Some people are required by contract to travel in Y or Y+ (often no distinction is made). They don't care about the price -- it is reimbursed -- but do care about the fare code :) Many airlines do things like offer more FF miles to encourage using Y instead of B or H (e.g. AA has Y the same as J). Finally Y has no restrictions and almost never sold out (i.e. most airlines will bump some discounted fare from the flight in order to sell a Y seat), so sometimes Y is available when J is sold out :) I think QF offers a guaranteed Y seat as a WP benefit (not really a benefit as they will do this for anyone).

Noted but I'd still pay the extra out of my own pocket and fly JAL for 6250AUD SYD-LHR-SYD (current J fare) and get my status credits and points. And for not too much a difference in a seat or service or food I'm told. The QF J offering for 5k more mind you is hardly worth the extra other than the IFE. However, if work pays for J it's QF all the way ;) If they only do Y/Y+ I'd pay the extra and do a JAL where possible or even AY in J.

CJ

I've recently had this argument about incorrect prices on web sites (it was in reference to the Linksys router selling at 10% of the RRP - here (http://www.lifehacker.com.au/2009/11/dell-offering-insanely-cheap-wireless-n-router)). Dell do not issue an invoice saying your order has been accepted and paid.

Best Flights state in their terms and conditions (http://www.bestflights.com.au/information/terms-conditions):

"Although every care has been taken the prices are not guaranteed until paid in full and documents have been issued."

While Best Flights have made an "invitation to treat" with their price, the contract of sale does not occur until both parties have accepted the offer. According to Best Flights this does not occur until paid in full and documents issued. From what I have read this does seem to have occured if you have been issued an e-ticket "documents" and a receipt "payment".

The ACCC expands further on this here (http://www.accc.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/322984).

In any case, QF are under no obligation as they did not make the offer to the OP.

Jase.

I am still waiting to get the matter solved however have had phone calls back from Bestflights ensuring me they are working on this. I should have final outcome next week. They have been very good in getting some information to me...

Ensure you get comments in writing (email) from BestFlights. I simply don't trust them from being burned either with false promises or through being ignored.

While Best Flights have made an "invitation to treat" with their price, the contract of sale does not occur until both parties have accepted the offer. According to Best Flights this does not occur until paid in full and documents issued. From what I have read this does seem to have occured if you have been issued an e-ticket "documents" and a receipt "payment".

The ACCC expands further on this here (http://www.accc.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/322984).

In any case, QF are under no obligation as they did not make the offer to the OP.

Jase.

ACCC makes the point that there is a complex relationship between contract law and deceptive or misleading conduct.

For example, in the OPs case I am wondering if there may be an argument that the contract could be voided because of mistake. (However, this may not necessarily absolve liabilities under deceptive and misleading advertising...)

So a complex case.

A contract exists because their was a meeting of the minds over a specific product and price with the exact details agreed to.

The seller in this case is breaching the contract - the compensation should be a refund. I believe you should also be able to go after QF as somebody selling the ticket ON THEIR BEHALF acted in error. Unless they have a clause to get out but it is unlikely. It won't work for me selling you a ticket because I am not an agent and it is not a role of mine to sell tickets.

I have to write a contract law exam tomorrow.

Well then get of FT and study! Good luck for the exam :)

I believe you should also be able to go after QF as somebody selling the ticket ON THEIR BEHALF acted in error.

What has Qantas got to do with this? So if you went to a car dealer and agreed to purchase a luxury car, yet they order in a little crap box, the car manufacturer is liable? Because this is the same scenario... Qantas makes available R class fares for sale as premium economy, yet Best Flights is telling customers its an First class fare. Its no ones fault but Best Flights.

A contract exists because their was a meeting of the minds over a specific product and price with the exact details agreed to.

The seller in this case is breaching the contract - the compensation should be a refund. I believe you should also be able to go after QF as somebody selling the ticket ON THEIR BEHALF acted in error. Unless they have a clause to get out but it is unlikely. It won't work for me selling you a ticket because I am not an agent and it is not a role of mine to sell tickets.

I have to write a contract law exam tomorrow.

I really wish you all the luck for the contract law exam

You are going to need it based on this post!

A "meeting of the minds" = A contract :rolleyes:

A contract exists because their was a meeting of the minds over a specific product and price with the exact details agreed to.


If you are going to do a contract law exam tomorrow, and you think that a 'meeting of the minds' is the only pre-requisite for a contract forming, then I think I'd get off FT and do some more studying. :)

What BF offered on their website is an invitation to treat (Boots Pharmaceutical I'm sure you're well aware of). I strongly doubt that any contract has been formed between OP and BF. As previous poster has mentioned, I doubt you'll get anything more than a refund.

I really wish you all the luck for the contract law exam

You are going to need it based on this post!

A "meeting of the minds" = A contract :rolleyes:

I didn't say a meeting of the minds is a contract - I said according to the OP a meeting of the minds took place.

A meeting of the minds is a term often used to describe when the intentions of both parties are agreable to one another. The common understand here is that the OP would provide A$5745 and company X would provide an F ticket.

In this case a contract has been reached. By failing to provide the OP with a F flight on Qantas they are in breach of contract. The best he will get is a refund and maybe a sorry.

I am under the impression that the OP has paid and received a confirmation from the seller about the ticket. They have acknowledged receipt of his monies and in return provided him with an e-ticket and confirmation.

A contract exists because their was a meeting of the minds over a specific product and price with the exact details agreed to.

The seller in this case is breaching the contract - the compensation should be a refund. I believe you should also be able to go after QF as somebody selling the ticket ON THEIR BEHALF acted in error. Unless they have a clause to get out but it is unlikely. It won't work for me selling you a ticket because I am not an agent and it is not a role of mine to sell tickets.




Well you see that's the issue - did they agree over a specific product? And what is that specific product?

Did they agree over an R class ticket? Yes.

Did both parties think they were selling and buying a First class ticket? Probably not.

Did the buyer honestly believe they were buying First class for AUD5000 odd? That's not inconceivable if there was a 2-for-1 deal or something - especially in these days of fare cuts. But there should have been a question over the correctness of the fare - it was way too low for first class on QF.

Did Bestflights actually think they were selling a First class ticket? I doubt it.

Just because there appears to have been offer and acceptance and consideration does not mean that there is a contract.

Are there other avenues open under ACCC guidelines? I don't know.

If there has been a breach of contract, why would the best form of compensation be a refund? Why would the OP not seek specific performance?

Regards

lme ff

I didn't say a meeting of the minds is a contract - I said according to the OP a meeting of the minds took place.



I will quote you again:

"A contract exists because their was a meeting of the minds over a specific product and price with the exact details agreed to."

I will quote you again:

"A contract exists because their was a meeting of the minds over a specific product and price with the exact details agreed to."

No there was a meeting of one mind with a (mindless) website.:rolleyes:

A lot of half-baked lawyers here.

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FT isn't jurisprudence 101...

I'm sure the OP can PM me once they have a resolution from Bestflights (either way). Then perhaps we can unlock this thread.

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