US Airways Dividend Miles - Coach seat vs. FC bathroom

It has been my understanding that the FC bathroom is only for FC passengers, however, if the beverage cart is in the isle then they are too allow passengers to use the FC bathroom.

I flew PHX - ORD on Monday. Didn't get the upgrade as a Plat., but that was to be expected for this flight. I was in the exit row (10) and went to use the bathroom. The cart was further back in the plane, so I went up to the FC bathroom because I had already seen several people us it.

The FC bathroom was open and there weren't and FC passengers getting up to use it so I moved the stupid curtain out of the way. At that moment the FC flight attendant told me that I needed to go to the back of the plane and wait until they had finished the beverage service and use the bathrooms in the back of the plane. She said "Well, they are almost done. So you need to go back there and wait".

I know that this is picking at a small annoyance, but I disappointed and frustrated that I then had to wait 5 minutes at the back of the plane.

1) Am I right that I can use that bathroom if the cart is right?

2) has this happened to anyone else?

Wow, I thought this thread was about a new seat selection option on US.com. :D

that was pretty non-customer friendly of the flight attendant! considering you weren't disturbing anyone and you had a legit reason.

I dunno, but when sitting in FC, I always felt they should install an electrified fence between the front and coach. ;)

Flew to TPA last weekend, and was upgraded to First and I witnessed something that upset me.

It was the A321 and beverage service in the back has just commenced. Cart was by row 8. An elderly gentleman sitting in row 4, with a cane who could barely walk, struggled to make it to the then empty First class cabin lavatory and was just about to enter, when suddenly, the FA, stopped preping drinks and told him to turn back around and use one of "we have many toilets in the back". The FA was excellent and Above & Beyond worthy up until that incident, which made me put my envelope away and reconsider.

You don't do that to anyone, and definitely not a senior passenger, regardless of where the cart is (in this case it was by row 8, so still a long ways to go). :td:

Whats also interesting to note is that the F/A was not so young herself, so should completely understand what was going on. I'm not saying that this would be OK if it was a younger F/A, but today's youth that surrounds me possess a rhetoric that seems to say, we're young so it's OK for us to disrespect elders. It's not in any case.

-Kinglobjaw

...It was the A321 and beverage service in the back has just commenced. Cart was by row 8. An elderly gentleman sitting in row 4, ...

Perhaps you meant row 5 bulkhead, as row 4 in an A321 is FC? :)

I think a pax in the main cabin ought to ask a FA first before using the FC bathroom; something like, "I've an URGENT need and the cart is blocking my way/I'm handicapped and can't walk so far......may I use the bathroom up front?"

I think a pax in the main cabin ought to ask a FA first before using the FC bathroom; something like, "I've an URGENT need and the cart is blocking my way/I'm handicapped and can't walk so far......may I use the bathroom up front?"

Exactly. Just ask and you'll probably be fine.

There was a huge thread on this recently on the AA board (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-aadvantage/990783-use-lavatory-your-ticketed-cabin-only.html?highlight=Class+Bathrooms) - sorry, I don't know how to post the link correctly. As I recall, people were evenly split between "let anyone use any bathroom" and "FC is for FC only." US does routinely announce as part of their pre-departure message thet the FC lav is reserved for FC PAX. I have even heard some iterations of suggesting that this is an FAA reg., (although this was soundly debunked on the thread referred to above."

My opinion is live and let live, but please do not congest the FC aisle, lean on my seat back or just come up to rubberneck. As far as policy, if you announce it pre-flight, then enforce it. If you announce it and don't enforce it, you just cause confusion the same as if you enforce it but don't announce it.

I'm a firm believer if in FC use FC lav, if in Coach use the Coach lav. However, if the beverage cart is in the way, and there is no line for the FC lav, by all means, don't make people wait to be able to get to the Coach lav. If they REALLY want to enforce the rule, they should continuously move the bev cart to let people use their "approved" lav. I seriously doubt that they would want to do that. Silly.

OK, I think, that as the policy states, the First Class Bathroom is for First Class pax only. I think if it is the policy it needs to be enforced! It is not enforced enough. However, I think it needs to be enforced with discretion (i.e. the senior citizen in the example above). It is an extra perk of F to have the bathroom close and only shared amongst a few people. However, a senior citizen or passanger who would be adversly affected using the back of Y should gladly be welcomed to use F bathroom.

I dunno, but when sitting in FC, I always felt they should install an electrified fence between the front and coach. ;)

HA! Love it.

Mixed responses, as expected. I totally understand that the FC bathroom is for FC passengers. Most of the time I am in F and I do not mind when coach passengers occassionally use the F bathroom as long as they are not congesting the isle or leaning on the seats.

I am frustrated at the response I got from the attendant because she could clearly see that I would be waiting several minutes to use the bathroom at the back of the plane. Who is she to determine how long I could/should wait to use the bathroom. If the cart is out they should not deny access to the bathroom.

I was especially frustrated because she did not deny coach passengers who used the F bathroom several minutes before me.

I'll move on. It isn't that big of a deal. Hopefully it won't happen again though.

Flew to TPA last weekend, and was upgraded to First and I witnessed something that upset me.

It was the A321 and beverage service in the back has just commenced. Cart was by row 8. An elderly gentleman sitting in row 4, with a cane who could barely walk, struggled to make it to the then empty First class cabin lavatory and was just about to enter, when suddenly, the FA, stopped preping drinks and told him to turn back around and use one of "we have many toilets in the back". The FA was excellent and Above & Beyond worthy up until that incident, which made me put my envelope away and reconsider.

You don't do that to anyone, and definitely not a senior passenger, regardless of where the cart is (in this case it was by row 8, so still a long ways to go). :td:


-Kinglobjaw

Perhaps you meant row 5 bulkhead, as row 4 in an A321 is FC? :)

I think a pax in the main cabin ought to ask a FA first before using the FC bathroom; something like, "I've an URGENT need and the cart is blocking my way/I'm handicapped and can't walk so far......may I use the bathroom up front?"

If the F lav is empty and there's no one in line, it's absolutely no skin off my back if someone wants to use it. It's not like people are using it because it's so luxurious; If you've gotta go, you've gotta go.

But in King's example above, the FA's attitude was inexcusable. Anyone with an ounce of common sense, would have realized why the gentleman was making his way to the front.

Mike

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Makes me think back to the Seinfeld airplane episode, "They really need a locking door. That curtain provides no security."

When I'm in F, there are several times when I scope out the scene, take off headphones, put away electonics, am about to get up to use the lav...when a coach pax bursts through to use it. Once one starts, there's usually a waterfall effect.

I can't recall a single instance when I've been in coach and used the F lav. Certainly if I have to go that bad, I would...but the cart coming down the aisle usually isn't a surprise, so it would be poor timing on my part.

I had a similar situation happen with the drink car in the aisle. The FA ran – literally ran up the aisle and slammed the restroom door just as I opened it. I discussed the situation for a few minutes with him and eventually gave up and sat back down and waited. Some other PAX did the same thing, only they actually used the bathroom. The FA ended up calling ahead and having LAS Metro PD waiting for them to talk with them about “interfering with a flight crew”.

This whole situation bothers me because I sit in F most weeks and not a trip goes by without a coach passenger using the F bathroom with no issue. It is almost like their policy is to not enforce their policy – unless they want to. Then we as pax have no idea what is fair game.

The FA ended up calling ahead and having LAS Metro PD waiting for them to talk with them about “interfering with a flight crew”.

This “interfering with the crew” nonsense has officially gotten out of control. When you gotta go, you gotta go.

This “interfering with the crew” nonsense has officially gotten out of control. When you gotta go, you gotta go.


It's not that simple. What if there is no drink cart blocking the aisle and all the Y bathrooms have at least 2-3 people waiting to enter? Do you use the F bathroom then? I suppose if you have a medical condition, telling the F-cabin's FA you situation would be ok. But you can't just walk into the F bathroom because there is a line for the Y bathrooms.

I had a similar situation happen with the drink car in the aisle. The FA ran – literally ran up the aisle and slammed the restroom door just as I opened it. I discussed the situation for a few minutes with him and eventually gave up and sat back down and waited. Some other PAX did the same thing, only they actually used the bathroom. The FA ended up calling ahead and having LAS Metro PD waiting for them to talk with them about “interfering with a flight crew”.

I'd have sued the living bejesus out of the flight attendant had I not been charged with anything. One of the problems with FAs who have the Captain do this is they really believe that either the FAA, their union, or the company make them omnipotent sky gods. Particularly if one has multiple witnesses, the correct solution there is to tell the cops you are leaving absent the FA swearing out a complaint.

I use the bathroom in coach. If I had to use the restroom that badly and the drink cart was blocking my egress to the coach lavs, I'd head for the FC lavs. If stopped, I'd explain my situation to the FA, voice recorder running. If I was told to wait, I'd explain to the FA the gravity of the situation. If told to "wait," I'd then utilize the galley floor, and subsequently take my chance with the inevitable jury. I don't think 12 people will convict for airplane-urination, particularly if one is polite and reasonable on the tape.

There are reasonable solutions to these kinds of problems, but they require that both parties be reasonable about it.

If told to "wait," I'd then utilize the galley floor, and subsequently take my chance with the inevitable jury. I don't think 12 people will convict for airplane-urination, particularly if one is polite and reasonable on the tape.


That reminded me of this old FT thread: http://http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-safety-security/497334-passenger-urinates-aisle-diverts-flight.html"] old FT thread (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-safety-security/497334-passenger-urinates-aisle-diverts-flight.html) which (albeit with complications) got the passenger in a lot of doodoo --OK, maybe not the best metaphor when speaking of bodily wastes. :eek:

HA! Love it.

I'm all for a door with lock and key, lol

But seriously, f/a's forget the little note in the announcement book under the Lavatory Use section.

"Flight attendants should should use good judgement in allowing customers to utilize other cabin lavatories when necessary, i.e. medical condition, elderly, small children, inoperative lavatories, etc."

Page 39 in the announcement book, fyi.

I would think about to pee in your pants and can't hold it would fall in the category. I think I would show some urgency if that were the case.

I'm all for a door with lock and key, lol

But seriously, f/a's forget the little note in the announcement book under the Lavatory Use section.

"Flight attendants should should use good judgement in allowing customers to utilize other cabin lavatories when necessary, i.e. medical condition, elderly, small children, inoperative lavatories, etc."

Page 39 in the announcement book, fyi.

I would think about to pee in your pants and can't hold it would fall in the category. I think I would show some urgency if that were the case.

thank you flight62. I used to be a trainer for a major department store chain, and one of the things that was posted in the classroom: "Who is the most important person in the store today? THE CUSTOMER. Without him/her, we wouldn't be open today.

I don't have a problem with a coach passenger using the FC bathroom as long as there isn't a line of coach passengers waiting to use the FC bathroom. It has been my experiences when sitting in FC that there is a line of coach passengers waiting to use the FC bathroom; however, when I am sitting in coach, they enforce the FC only uses the FC bathroom with an iron hand.

on a flight a few weeks ago, i woke up and realized the bottle of water i chugged when i got on the plane was talkin' to me! the bev cart was just about even/slightly before my row 10 seat, and i asked the flight attendant nicely if it would be easier for them - i actually started with the words "would it be easier for you" if i were to go forward to use the lavs (hey, i see coach passengers doing it when i'm in F too!). She turned and snapped at me "NO". i must have looked startled by this overreaction, because the FA at the other end of the cart nicely said, "don't worry, you can go on back and we'll be happy to move the cart forward when you get back". I thanked her and apologized for not being able to wait until beverage service was over to use the lav...
I do appreciate the rule, but I'm glad even the quidebook allows for, um, common sense and common courtesy in the face of someone that has to "GO"! As for that flight attendant, not only was she not displaying common sense, she wasnt displaying any common courtesy either... Geez, you would've though I asked for a pillow or something totally outrageous like that :)

Pardon my nostalgia, but thinking back to the days when you traveled TATL by ship, the liners (like the Titanic- but I'm not THAT old) all had clearly defined classes- steerage (Titanic era), tourist, cabin and first. There were solid walls dividing the classes on deck and below. No passenger could go from one to the other (unless he was Leonardo de Caprio) for any reason. Today, of course, the cruise ships have done away with the distinction apart from cabin size and restaurant choice. On a plane, though, what are you paying all the extra money for besides a seat size and meal choice and miles? Well, the relative calm and privacy of the cabin is one feature that makes the journey more pleasant. I have watched econ passengers lunge through the curtain on almost every journey. While the FAs generally ignore them coming up front, invariably the FAs are busy in the tiny front galley trying to deal with food and drinks and have to move carts or shift themselves to make room for the 'visitor' (intruder?). That curtain means nothing to some people. One idea- give premium passengers a little hotel-type swipe card (coded only for that flight) with their boarding pass that admits them to the FC restroom (a premium FF card would also work). If you don't have a card, you don't get in the front toilet. Elitist? Yes, but that's the sort of name the airlines give their FF programs anyway. If you're paying for First Class, you deserve some exclusivity, even in our supposedly egalitarian world.

Well, here is how I handle the FC lav situation.

As an add on, I make the FC lav announcement and add that this prevents crowding around the cockpit door. Seems to work pretty well, but there is alway somebody who will slide up there even if no carts are out.

Old people and kids definitely get a pass, but I am strict on families. If it is going to be a constant bathroom run, go to the back!! I have seen families take over the front of the cabin and I don't allow that.

If the f/a's are over four rows from being finished, I'll let someone use he front. But I also keep a watchful eye on what is going on in the cabin. Sadly, many f/a's don't.

I think if anyone gets the wrath after ONE person from coach went to the front lav, they were probably afraid a trend had started. Believe it or not, there is a lot of monkey see, monkey do on the a/c. Still doesn't justify being rude.

Flight62 - Thanks for your input - directly on point as usual - so what is the answer on whether or not his is an FAA regulation? I routinely hear the following as part of the US pre-dparture announcement, "per FAA regulations, passengers are required to use the lavatory in their cabin - we have 2 lavatories at the rear of the aircraft for our coach passengers, the lavatorie at the front of the airctraft is reserved for our first class passengers.")

It would seem per the guidelines you referenced, that this is not an FAA regulation - and I have been told that by others as well. So why does US announce it that way? Of course if it is a reg., then there is no question about who should and should not use the FC lav.

Well its FAA regulation to follow the instruction of cabin personnel. So if cabin personnel instruct you to use the aft-lav, then heretofor, its FAA regulation

;)

If you're paying for First Class, you deserve some exclusivity, even in our supposedly egalitarian world.


Our world is not egalitarian. If it were, then we'd all fly for free since some people can't afford to pay to fly at all.

If you're in F, one of the perks is not having to share the lav with Y pax (unless there is an absolutely urgent need).

BTW, all because there is no line for the lav in F doesn't make it ok for a Y passenger to use the F lav. For as soon as a any passenger is in the F lav, it is no longer vacant.

Well its FAA regulation to follow the instruction of cabin personnel. So if cabin personnel instruct you to use the aft-lav, then heretofor, its FAA regulation

;)

so if cabin personnel tells me I can't eat my bag of chips because they sell food on the plane (think Skybus), then that becomes an FAA regulation?

There are FAA mandates and then there are policies and procedures that the FAA backs up as FAR's. i.e, carry on bags. There is no FAA mandated rule as to number of bags. Each airline has their policy. Each airline is expected to carry out that policy. It therefore is part of the FAR of each individual airline's policy.

I dunno, but when sitting in FC, I always felt they should install an electrified fence between the front and coach. ;)

I totally agree....Unless there is a legit reason like a handicap/disabled person...

Well its FAA regulation to follow the instruction of cabin personnel. So if cabin personnel instruct you to use the aft-lav, then heretofor, its FAA regulation

;)

I hope a flight attendant never tells me to open a door at 30,000 feet. Granted it would likely be impossible but I'd hate to talk to the police on arrival too.

I was on United (I know, wrong post) and was surprised a guy jumped up from E+ and used F lav. I didn't see and Monkey do afterward.

BTW, all because there is no line for the lav in F doesn't make it ok for a Y passenger to use the F lav. For as soon as a any passenger is in the F lav, it is no longer vacant.

Also, don't the announcements discourage forming lines ("congregating") near the lavatory's? :confused: especially the one up front? Hence technically, no line would form for the front lavatory since F pax will only leave their seats after the front lavatory is empty....