Other Credit Card Programs - AAdvantage visa, should I have taken the bite?

This is the 3rd time that while traveling my visa was put on fraud hold. I was at the register trying to make a purchase and wasn't able to. When I got home today I phoned and told them I want to cancel my card. They suggested I phone each time before going away to tell them so I will be allowed to use my card. I said this was absurd as it's my card and I shouldn't have to ask permission like they are my parents or something. I tried to cancel and dude tried to give me incentives. My card expires in a month and they've already put the $70 membership fee on (which I plan on canceling anyway). So dude offered me 10k miles if I spend $5000 within 6 months. He tried to justify that I will still get the regular 5000 miles for the $5000 and that the $70 membership fee will be compensated for by those 10k. I said no as I plan to churn and they annoyed me with this nonsense. He then offered me 2500 with no restrictions and that I should just consider staying with them.

Any comments?

If you still have to pay the $70 for 2500 miles, I will cancel and churn. If they are waiving the $70, then take the 2500 wait a small period of time and then cancel and churn.

I recently got an AMEX Citicard am frustrated that in the first day I had a fraud alert for a grocery store 1 mile from my house and that I can only make one online payment every 15 days. The 25,000 miles posted yesterday from this card, so I am going to cancel soon.

Yes it is absurd, but the "call before you travel" nonsense has been the norm for the past few years. I learned this the hard way when Citibank put a hold on my card when I was travelling throughout Europe two years ago. I had to Skype call them that I really was in Europe and that my charges on trains were real. In their perspective, it's a way to ensure fraud prevention.

To me, it makes more sense if credit card companies would get off their butts and start implementing cards with embedded EMV chips inside them instead of relying on this inefficient method of "preventing fraud."

Yes it is absurd, but the "call before you travel" nonsense has been the norm for the past few years. I learned this the hard way when Citibank put a hold on my card when I was travelling throughout Europe two years ago. I had to Skype call them that I really was in Europe and that my charges on trains were real. In their perspective, it's a way to ensure fraud prevention.

To me, it makes more sense if credit card companies would get off their butts and start implementing cards with embedded EMV chips inside them instead of relying on this inefficient method of "preventing fraud."

I have long said that to greatly reduce credit card fraud, every transaction should take a 4 digit pin, like an ATM card. But that would lessen the convenience of the card and less convenience equals less use.

If you still have to pay the $70 for 2500 miles, I will cancel and churn. If they are waiving the $70, then take the 2500 wait a small period of time and then cancel and churn.

I recently got an AMEX Citicard am frustrated that in the first day I had a fraud alert for a grocery store 1 mile from my house and that I can only make one online payment every 15 days. The 25,000 miles posted yesterday from this card, so I am going to cancel soon.

You can get around that once every 15 day restriction by using your bank's online billpay. Instead of logging into Citicard.com and setting up to deduct from my bank's account, I log into bankofamerica.com and have BofA send an electronic check to Citibank. This way, I can maximize the use of miles and using the credit card as a middle man to payoff everything the next day I put a charge on it. $5 at Starbucks on Tuesday, pay off $5 from BofA to Citicard on Wednesday. At the end of the month, I carry a zero balance and carry no interest. And within Citibank's system I'm shown as a deadbeat who pays off everything each month :D

Call before you travel has become the norm and it's necessary. You can rail against it all you want, but that's simply the way it is. I travel with two Citi cards and an AMEX. I always call them both before I leave, with my itinerary and contact numbers and by doing so I haven't had any problems. It probably takes me 5 minutes to make both calls. A small investment of time to avoid having my cards shut down on me. Remember -- the card companies have algos that scan millions of transactions daily looking for unusual activity. Don't take it personally.

If you still have to pay the $70 for 2500 miles, I will cancel and churn. If they are waiving the $70, then take the 2500 wait a small period of time and then cancel and churn.

I recently got an AMEX Citicard am frustrated that in the first day I had a fraud alert for a grocery store 1 mile from my house and that I can only make one online payment every 15 days. The 25,000 miles posted yesterday from this card, so I am going to cancel soon.

Well, I was charged the $70 on 12th Oct and I have 35 days to cancel and get that money back. So I already told them I will accept the 2500 and 'think about it'. So, I will get the 2500 miles and cancel the card in a week or so and get my $70 back AND churn baby churn

I have long said that to greatly reduce credit card fraud, every transaction should take a 4 digit pin, like an ATM card. But that would lessen the convenience of the card and less convenience equals less use.

That would be a great idea!

Call before you travel has become the norm and it's necessary. You can rail against it all you want, but that's simply the way it is. I travel with two Citi cards and an AMEX. I always call them both before I leave, with my itinerary and contact numbers and by doing so I haven't had any problems. It probably takes me 5 minutes to make both calls. A small investment of time to avoid having my cards shut down on me. Remember -- the card companies have algos that scan millions of transactions daily looking for unusual activity. Don't take it personally.

Yea, I hear you but wouldn't you think the fraud dept would look into it a bit. Perhaps they could see that I bought 3 tickets on my credit card and then spent money in that particular place a few weeks later?

If the credit card companies didn't proactively put a hold on the card when "unusual" foreign transactions showed up, everyone would complain about that too. In the end it's probably better that they err on the side of caution. As another poster said, a quick phone call to the 800 number on the back of your card will let them know what countries you'll be in and will avoid having your card frozen while abroad.

Call before you travel has become the norm and it's necessary. You can rail against it all you want, but that's simply the way it is. I travel with two Citi cards and an AMEX. I always call them both before I leave, with my itinerary and contact numbers and by doing so I haven't had any problems. It probably takes me 5 minutes to make both calls. A small investment of time to avoid having my cards shut down on me. Remember -- the card companies have algos that scan millions of transactions daily looking for unusual activity. Don't take it personally.

uh, that might be your experience but that doesn't make it a norm ...

I've gone on countless trips to Europe plus one each to SA and Asia. only time I had a CC problem was real fraud perpetrated in the UK before I even got there. my CITI cards don't get put on hold just because I show up making charges on a different continent.

I suggest you check around before making blanket statements.

uh, that might be your experience but that doesn't make it a norm ...

I've gone on countless trips to Europe plus one each to SA and Asia. only time I had a CC problem was real fraud perpetrated in the UK before I even got there. my CITI cards don't get put on hold just because I show up making charges on a different continent.

I suggest you check around before making blanket statements.

true true.
I went off on citibank. Perhaps I should understand that there are so many scammers around and so much fraud. But, they are really protecting themselves not me as they are the ones that have to pay for fraudulent purchases. I just find it annoying that I have to have citibank be my parents, asking permission to use MY card, spending MY money when I leave town. Citibank aka babysitters of my cash?

Call before you travel has become the norm and it's necessary. You can rail against it all you want, but that's simply the way it is. I travel with two Citi cards and an AMEX. I always call them both before I leave, with my itinerary and contact numbers and by doing so I haven't had any problems. It probably takes me 5 minutes to make both calls. A small investment of time to avoid having my cards shut down on me. Remember -- the card companies have algos that scan millions of transactions daily looking for unusual activity. Don't take it personally.

I have a Citi and a couple of Amex cards, plus my bank ATM card, travel internationally 2-3 times a year, and haven't called anyone in advance of travel for many years, and have never had a problem with fraud blockage. Perhaps it makes a difference that I don't travel to countries where they have a lot of fraud problems, or perhaps my patterns have established themselves enough that they don't worry. I don't really know, but I can say that I have zero problems with it.

true true.
I went off on citibank. Perhaps I should understand that there are so many scammers around and so much fraud. But, they are really protecting themselves not me as they are the ones that have to pay for fraudulent purchases. I just find it annoying that I have to have citibank be my parents, asking permission to use MY card, spending MY money when I leave town. Citibank aka babysitters of my cash?

Babysitters or parents isn't quite the right analogy, as babysitters or parents might say no. Citi just wants you to tell them in advance if you're traveling to a place that is outside the norm their algorithms determine from your history so they know it's you using your card.

Incidentally, my credit union's web site has a link to notify them of travel plans in advance so I don't have to pick up the phone; it's annoying that Citi doesn't. (I use the credit union card for travel abroad because it has only a 1% foreign transaction fee, and I always get much, much better service than from a big bank.)

true true.
I went off on citibank. Perhaps I should understand that there are so many scammers around and so much fraud. But, they are really protecting themselves not me as they are the ones that have to pay for fraudulent purchases. I just find it annoying that I have to have citibank be my parents, asking permission to use MY card, spending MY money when I leave town. Citibank aka babysitters of my cash?

The problem, of course, is that they can't tell the difference between you spending your money and somebody else spending what ends up being their money. And you aren't asking for permission, because they can't say no. You are giving them the information that they need in order to provide this service for you.

Not everything that happens in the world is always about oneself, so it is a mistake to take everything personally. The alternative is not to use credit cards overseas. Many of us remember doing a lot of traveling without them. Traveler's checks and cash work OK.

Babysitters or parents isn't quite the right analogy, as babysitters or parents might say no. Citi just wants you to tell them in advance if you're traveling to a place that is outside the norm their algorithms determine from your history so they know it's you using your card.

Incidentally, my credit union's web site has a link to notify them of travel plans in advance so I don't have to pick up the phone; it's annoying that Citi doesn't. (I use the credit union card for travel abroad because it has only a 1% foreign transaction fee, and I always get much, much better service than from a big bank.)

I was obviously trying to be silly, make it funny.........

I like the online idea. I don't mind clicking a button or two but I do mind punching in my info, listening to muzak, holding on forever, getting a rep who asks me to repeat everything all over again b/c the info didn't go through, have them sound like they are connected through a tin can and have a very strong accent making it difficult for me to understand them to tell them I'm going away.

I've traveled the world and never had to do this before. Now this new card gives me trouble three times.

My gripe time.

Actually, I just wondered if anyone would have taken the 10k but the story was the set up for the question. Fun anyway....

As this topic is relevant to many different credit cards, not just AAdvantage Visa, please continue to follow this thread in the Other Credit Cards forum.

dstan
AA Forum Co-Moderator

He tried to justify that I will still get the regular 5000 miles for the $5000 and that the $70 membership fee will be compensated for by those 10k. I said no as I plan to churn and they annoyed me with this nonsense.

Any comments?

Hope you really didn't tell them about churning.

Hope you really didn't tell them about churning.

I write as I speak, that's pretty funny. No, didn't tell them about the churning. tee hee

FWIW - I have had an AMEX PLT card for decades, and have used it overseas many, many times - NEVER had an issue and NEVER, EVER called them to let them know. Perhaps the systems look at my past spending, and maybe when it started, they didn't do the checking as often. But, for me, AMEX over Visa/MC ANYDAY!

When I was living in Washington, DC I got a fraud alert call from Citibank telling me that someone was spending money in multiple states on my card. It turns out that the charges were from VA, MD, and DC - I asked the rep if he had ever taken a geography lesson!

If you travel frequently internationally: I told Citibank about my frequent travel situation and it has cut the fraud alerts to basically zero; you should do the same.

Finally, as a previous poster said, Citi should really add the chips to their cards as they make sure you're spending your own money. Not only that, but you'll find that you can't use a chip-less card in a French vending machine (Metro, train tickets, etc.).

true true.
I went off on citibank. Perhaps I should understand that there are so many scammers around and so much fraud. But, they are really protecting themselves not me as they are the ones that have to pay for fraudulent purchases. I just find it annoying that I have to have citibank be my parents, asking permission to use MY card, spending MY money when I leave town. Citibank aka babysitters of my cash?

Actually while they may be the ones who "pay" for the fraudlent charges directly, we all do indirectly. Minimising fraud helps keep other fees and interest rates lower. Yes, I realise that they are high, but they would be even higer if fraud were worse

FYI, I went to Asia for a month and called both citi and american express to notify them. Citi made a note in the records, and I had no problems. American Express politely told me that I don't have to call in as it is no longer required.

So, at least american express has found a way to do it without having to call in...

In the past we never call, and never have had any problem with cards being used in far flung places of the world.

However, these days some regions in the world are really high risk on credit card fraud, now I use secured emails to inform issuers our travel plans. So far it seems to work well and the effort required from me is really minimal.

The spending pattern on a card with long history probably also makes a difference in how a fraud alert is triggered.

To me, it makes more sense if credit card companies would get off their butts and start implementing cards with embedded EMV chips inside them instead of relying on this inefficient method of "preventing fraud."

It is not that simple to implement the smartchip card.

There was a lengthy thread in Other Credit Card forum a while back on WHY the smartchip card is not implemented in US - for a starter, the costs involved would be in the billions - yes, billions - because all the existing processing mechanisms must be replaced - given Visa and MC are OPEN Network, there are many players in the processing field.

You would be surprised to find out, between the time you swiped your card on the machine, to the authorization hits your card, there might be 3 or more companies involved during that few seconds...

On top of that, the smartchip card isn't that much more secured. A friend could not buy his train ticket in some station in Scandinavia the past summer. The attendant insisted he to punch a PIN and of course there was no PIN. He ended up punching in a made-up PIN, and the transaction went thru! So how secured it could be?

Similar incidents happened in Japan. You can punch in 9999 at the JR vending machine and the ticket spitted out!

You can get around that once every 15 day restriction by using your bank's online billpay. Instead of logging into Citicard.com and setting up to deduct from my bank's account, I log into bankofamerica.com and have BofA send an electronic check to Citibank. This way, I can maximize the use of miles and using the credit card as a middle man to payoff everything the next day I put a charge on it. $5 at Starbucks on Tuesday, pay off $5 from BofA to Citicard on Wednesday. At the end of the month, I carry a zero balance and carry no interest. And within Citibank's system I'm shown as a deadbeat who pays off everything each month :D

Do you realize you do NOT incur any interest anyway, if you just pay off your statement balance BEFORE OR ON THE DUE DATE, which normally is 21 to 25 days AFTER statement close, and can be as many as 55 days AFTER you charged it?!

The interests are always ACCRUED, but WAIVED, as long as you pay off the balance on the previous statement BY THE DUE DATE.

You can literally pay Citi card online before 5PM on the due day and you are still good, 0 interest, ever.

You essentially get a free float, even at this current pitiful interest rate environment, if you have a large spending each month, and have a 1.5% MMA, you still add a few bucks into your pocket each month... versus you pay your bill in such tedious fashion.:rolleyes:

Yea, I hear you but wouldn't you think the fraud dept would look into it a bit. Perhaps they could see that I bought 3 tickets on my credit card and then spent money in that particular place a few weeks later?

The alert is automatically generated by the computer system. Then when you call back and talk to a rep at the Fraud Alert Dept it is when the verification would be done.

I have a strange charge pattern on my Citi PPE card because it currently enjoys a 3% retention bonus, doubled it with the flight pt to turn into a 6% rebate card. So every single dollar got put on that card, from $5000 charge to below $1 at drugstore. I got a fraud alert on a $4.66 charge at a grocery store and a 0.36 charge at a Walgreen.

I called back and told the lady she would see there were lots of Walgreen charges below $1.00 because I was experimenting something with Walgreen "deals" but I wanted to keep track of every single transaction I did at Walgreen - what could be better to use a Citicard that gives me an annual report? The woman laughed and noted my card.
Problem solved.

The really funny thing is, the $5000 and subsequent similar charges never triggers Citi's Fraud Alert call, while the first similar charge on my Schwab Visa prompted a Human to call. :D (Once the Schwab rep was satisfied, subsequent similar charges do not trigger any call from them.)

Once you understand the mechanism, you would just roll with it without much stress or gripe. ;)

I think it's b/c it's a business card. Last year when they wouldn't put through a purchase at a mechanic in Australia by phone I used the card in a supermarket to check. It went through for a purchase of less than $20. Strange....

This time when my card didn't work at a store I asked what the problem was, they said the register/computer/whatever didn't tell them. So that's why I didn't even think to assume it was a fraud thing. Luckily my husband came down to meet me and used his card which worked.

I just really wondered if anyone would have fallen for their 10k mile offer. Doesn't seem like anyone would have.