JAL Mileage Bank - Uncompetitive Fare (C/J-Class) ex-TPE to SFO/LAX

Having traveled on average 6 round-trips TPE-NRT-SFO every year, I've always found the JL C product to be quite good, especially with a reasonble fare of around US$2,500.

However, as of Oct. 1, JL raised the fares to US$4,500 RT!! When I was trying to book it last week, I was shocked! Call the ticketing desk and it has confirmed the change to be more "competitive".....

At the same time, CX has reduced its TPE-HKG-SFO and TPE-HKG-LAX fares in "I" class to about US$2,200!!! Even AA has a special "I" fare for US$2,600...

Being encouraged by travel policy to choose the lowest-fare when possible, I've booked my next two RT on CX...... really wanted to book JL and help its business (hopefully every little bit helps, given its financial situation).....but for over US$2,000 I cannot justify.... sigh.

It is really bad news to budget business travellers and may not be good to JAL, either. In the past, I was willing to pay a little more than full Y to fly JAL business on this route. It looks like CX will get more of my business from now on.

In my opinion, it is fair to raise the fare to be on par with peer competitors. However, JAL's one tier business class fare basically drives high end budget travellers to CX and Korean carriers. It is equivalent to zero out all long haul business class inventory from the other Asia cities.

Nowadays many airlines allocate inventory based on end city-pairs rather than segments. Discount fares are available on thru-fare only. For example, JL2 (NRT-SFO) inventory can vary based on departure city.
If departing from NRT, inventory is allocated as C9 D5
If departing from TPE, inventory is reduced to C4 D2

The strategy is to make sure enough inventory is reserved for higher revenue customers originating from NRT and fill the remaining seats with customers originating from somewhere else. Since JAL's business product is slightly behind CX and Korean carriers, JAL may consider lowering business fares a little to lure budget-sensitive customers with differentiation incentive.

If JAL can fill the remaining business class seats with some customers paying a little more than full Y fare, I think JAL can reduce fixed cost per customer and certainly improve the bottom line.

My recent experince within the past 6 months flying with CX and JAL: CX flights were packed in every class long before departure date. JAL flights were only packed in coach and Y+. There are still many seats available in business and first within the week of departure. Airline seats are like perishable goods. Revenus is going going gone when departure date approaches.

One other thing I think JAL should pay attention to is the timing to purge unticketed reservation on business and first class, especially intra-Asia flights. Often time I wanted to purchase JAL business but inventory was zero-out and then wide-open on the week of departure. JAL should check who or which travel agent has practice to hold large number of reservations and release them later.

Totally agree with turbojet. Moreover, I flew last week intra-Asia on JL and CX and noticed that both flights were fully booked, but with a slight difference. JL was oversold in Y and C cabin mainly with JL elites OP UG while CX C cabin was mainly with biz class ticketed customers. Checked on seatcounter the inventory and noticed that JL is really struggling in marketing their premium cabins.
I am not surprised about JLs new pricing on the web, it might hit them hard if not changing to more competitive fares.

I too was planning to use an ex-TPE fare for US travel. I recorded TPE-BOS one-way previously at $1714, now $2846. Similar increases for round trips.

I too may now take CX instead. Disappointing. I'll be traveling with someone else, and JL would have offered better seating as well as a more direct routing.

The dramatic price increase came as quite a surprise to me. The old fares had been stable for some time, and I did not see this coming. Indeed, I had booked nonrefundable connecting travel with an eye to connecting on JL from TPE.

Totally agree with turbojet. Moreover, I flew last week intra-Asia on JL and CX and noticed that both flights were fully booked, but with a slight difference. JL was oversold in Y and C cabin mainly with JL elites OP UG while CX C cabin was mainly with biz class ticketed customers. Checked on seatcounter the inventory and noticed that JL is really struggling in marketing their premium cabins.

How can you tell someone is an op-up vs paid C class customer?

How can you tell someone is an op-up vs paid C class customer?

1) By checking inventory on C/D: CX had all seats C0D0 3 days before departure. JL was C9D9 1 day before departure.
2) By asking the check in agent if they were upgrading (I am Emerald and get OP UG from time to time). JL agent informed that only JL elites are being upgraded. They had about 10 seats available, but not for OW elites.

Sometimes is simpler than you think, just ask.

1) By checking inventory on C/D: CX had all seats C0D0 3 days before departure. JL was C9D9 1 day before departure.
2) By asking the check in agent if they were upgrading (I am Emerald and get OP UG from time to time). JL agent informed that only JL elites are being upgraded. They had about 10 seats available, but not for OW elites.

Sometimes is simpler than you think, just ask.

Agree sometimes it's simpler if you just ask. And it's NICE that they only upgrade JAL elites :p

A C0D0 inventory on CX flight 3 days before departure doesn't mean there's no op-ups. There are cases they block out the seats for last minute elite bookings (they guarantee a seat as part of their benefits) and there are cases which the waiting list clear in matters of minutes on a completely sold out CX flight. Moreover CX is doing op-ups at online check-in too. They could have assigned the empty C seats for online op-ups before the online check-in opens at 48 hours before departure. The only way to verify the C cabin is mainly occupied by paid C customers is as you suggested: ask CX :)

And there are quite a number of people on CX forum getting op-up strike recently. Doesn't look like JAL is the only one who have problem advertising their premium cabin. But seems like JAL is in worse shape though because there are quite a number of upgrades using the super discounted upgrades in C already and they still have problem finding enough paid C customers.

By the way which flight is this? I assume you are on a 767-200 or 737-800 flight, otherwise 10 op-up in C is hardly majority of the full C cabin.

This is really a serious concern for JL....Premium Loads....

Took the following JL flights last week:

SFO-NRT: J class ~60% full on the 777 (had an empty seat beside me);
NRT-TPE: J class ~40% full on the 767;
NRT-GUM: J class ~20% full on the 747 (was in the F cabin and had an empty seat beside me);
GUM-NRT: J class ~3% full on the 767! (I was the ONLY passenger in J out of 30 seats!)
NRT-TPE: J class ~10% full on the 747 (was in the F cabin and had an empty seat beside me).

In contrast, last week on the following CX flights:

TPE-FUK: J class ~70% full on the 330 (empty seat beside me);
NRT-TPE: J class 100% full on the 330;
TPE-HKG: J class ~90% full on the 777 (no empty seat beside me);
HKG-SFO: J class 100% full on the 747.

It does appear that JL loads are in general lighter than those of CX's based on my flight observations.......especially the long sectors!! CX has been sold out in J AND F SFO-HKG and HKG-SFO on many dates!!!

If JL doesn't address premium ticket pricing to be more competitive with other carriers, it's financial situation may not improve soon..... :(

This is really a serious concern for JL....Premium Loads....

Took the following JL flights last week:

SFO-NRT: J class ~60% full on the 777 (had an empty seat beside me);
NRT-TPE: J class ~40% full on the 767;
NRT-GUM: J class ~20% full on the 747 (was in the F cabin and had an empty seat beside me);
GUM-NRT: J class ~3% full on the 767! (I was the ONLY passenger in J out of 30 seats!)
NRT-TPE: J class ~10% full on the 747 (was in the F cabin and had an empty seat beside me).

In contrast, last week on the following CX flights:

TPE-FUK: J class ~70% full on the 330 (empty seat beside me);
NRT-TPE: J class 100% full on the 330;
TPE-HKG: J class ~90% full on the 777 (no empty seat beside me);
HKG-SFO: J class 100% full on the 747.

It does appear that JL loads are in general lighter than those of CX's based on my flight observations.......especially the long sectors!! CX has been sold out in J AND F SFO-HKG and HKG-SFO on many dates!!!

If JL doesn't address premium ticket pricing to be more competitive with other carriers, it's financial situation may not improve soon..... :(

At least JL is environmental friendly...CO2 reduction is their policy:rolleyes:

At least JL is environmental friendly...CO2 reduction is their policy:rolleyes:

Or CX is doing tons of op-ups :rolleyes:

CX forum: Is anybody else hitting op-up home runs lately? (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cathay-pacific-asia-miles/989437-anybody-else-hitting-op-up-home-runs-lately.html)

This is really a serious concern for JL....Premium Loads....

Took the following JL flights last week:

SFO-NRT: J class ~60% full on the 777 (had an empty seat beside me);
NRT-TPE: J class ~40% full on the 767;
NRT-GUM: J class ~20% full on the 747 (was in the F cabin and had an empty seat beside me);
GUM-NRT: J class ~3% full on the 767! (I was the ONLY passenger in J out of 30 seats!)
NRT-TPE: J class ~10% full on the 747 (was in the F cabin and had an empty seat beside me).

In contrast, last week on the following CX flights:

TPE-FUK: J class ~70% full on the 330 (empty seat beside me);
NRT-TPE: J class 100% full on the 330;
TPE-HKG: J class ~90% full on the 777 (no empty seat beside me);
HKG-SFO: J class 100% full on the 747.

It does appear that JL loads are in general lighter than those of CX's based on my flight observations.......especially the long sectors!! CX has been sold out in J AND F SFO-HKG and HKG-SFO on many dates!!!

If JL doesn't address premium ticket pricing to be more competitive with other carriers, it's financial situation may not improve soon..... :(

There is nothing premium about flying on CX plane via that hole that is TPE....it wastes time and is a convenience for CX only! No wonder they have to offer cheap fares on the via TPE routes.