Travel Photography - GPS for D5000

Probably like most people on this forum we travel quite a bit and I'm thinking of getting GPS unit for our Nikon.

I have a couple of questions, are they really useful or just another toy and can any one recomend a brand or brands?

thanks

Just be aware that if the GPS had been off, it takes 2-3 minutes to acquire satellite lock.

I think it is useful taking landscape shots on a tripod. By the time you get everything setup, the GPS would have achieved a location lock. If you keep it on all the time, it would be ready to shoot and record the data. The GPS will reduce camera main battery charge level when on.

Almost useless for action shots where the camera, GPS get turned on and off and moved quite a bit.

I meant to make a GPS for my D200. Acquired the 10 pin pigtail, Garmin GPS board, a hotshoe mount. Due to the above reasons, this project is still in the parts bin. I already carry a Garmin eTrex or Quest on all my trips.

Just be aware that if the GPS had been off, it takes 2-3 minutes to acquire satellite lock.

only if the gps has been off for a few days.

normally, a hot start is 1-2 seconds and a warm start is about 15-30 seconds. there is also no need to turn off the gps, as most of them will last most of the day, if not longer (some are rated 18 or more hours). for a short photo outing of a few hours, just leave it on.

having a gps attached to the camera and directly write the latitude/longitude is extremely useful. the alternative is use a gps that saves a track log and then later match up the time stamps and add the location data but that is a pain.

Thanks,

I had been thinking about GPS tracker but it looked a little painful. Are you aware of any brands other than Nikon?

only if the gps has been off for a few days.

normally, a hot start is 1-2 seconds and a warm start is about 15-30 seconds. there is also no need to turn off the gps, as most of them will last most of the day, if not longer (some are rated 18 or more hours). for a short photo outing of a few hours, just leave it on.

having a gps attached to the camera and directly write the latitude/longitude is extremely useful. the alternative is use a gps that saves a track log and then later match up the time stamps and add the location data but that is a pain.

Nothing to do with the off time interval. Has to do with the fact that you moved it while off. The GPS remembers the last location. Once it is moved while off, it has to look for the satellites again. "Cold", "warm" start is not the fact that the electronics need warming up, it's the fact that it needs to look for the satellites. That is why the factory car GPS comes on so quickly because it is always on while the car is on. I finally wired my aftermarket GPS' to the car ignition so that they are always on while the car is on.

It is true many GPS' including my Garmin eTrex will run a long time on batteries. The D5000 GPS unit must spec how long the battery can run the GPS and whether it turns off the GPS after some interval. I will be upset if the GPS drains the camera battery when I want to take a picture.

Carrying a GPS and place markers after the shot seemed a more practical way.

Nothing to do with the off time interval. Has to do with the fact that you moved it while off. The GPS remembers the last location. Once it is moved while off, it has to look for the satellites again. "Cold", "warm" start is not the fact that the electronics need warming up, it's the fact that it needs to look for the satellites. That is why the factory car GPS comes on so quickly because it is always on while the car is on. I finally wired my aftermarket GPS' to the car ignition so that they are always on while the car is on.

it has everything to do with how long the gps has been off. in order to obtain a location fix, the gps device needs valid almanac and ephemeris data which is only valid for a certain period of time. after that, the gps will need to download it again.

if the gps briefly loses the signal, such as going into and out of a tunnel, or it is turned off and back on within a few minutes, the data is 'hot' and the gps can obtain a lock almost instantly. there is no reason it needs to wait for new data.

if the gps has been off for a few hours, the gps will probably need to re-download the ephemeris, which is sent every thirty seconds (the almanac data lasts for several weeks). that is considered a warm start and should be on the order of 15-30 seconds for a fix, possibly a little more if it doesn't receive a valid ephemeris the first time. that can happen if the gps is moving while trying to obtain a fix and the signal is momentarily blocked by a tree or building, for example.

if the gps has been off for several days or the gps has moved a significant distance (on the order of 100 miles or more), the the gps will need a complete update to obtain a fix, and that will take a couple of minutes, possibly longer.

some gps chipsets, notably the sirf star iii, are very sensitive and can obtain a fix much faster than older chipsets. i've heard of gps units with the sirf star iii chipset working inside of steel frame buildings and in the basement of a house.

there is also assisted gps, which many cellphones have, where the gps gets the initial location and ephemeris data off the cellular network and then the gps can quickly obtain an exact fix directly from the gps satellites.

lastly, there is a camera gps device that does not need any lock whatsoever. it sits in the hot shoe and saves the raw gps data being transmitted at that point in time every time a photo is taken (which it detects from the flash contacts in the hotshoe). after copying the images to the computer, the included software analyzes the raw data, correlates it with the known locations of the gps satellites and generates a latitude/longitude for when the photo was taken. the only drawback is that since it fits in the hotshoe, it precludes using a flash unless there is another flash connector on the camera.

I had been thinking about GPS tracker but it looked a little painful. Are you aware of any brands other than Nikon?

any gps that outputs an nmea data stream should work.

the only issue is nikon's proprietary connector on the camera. there are third party cables that are much less expensive than nikon's cable, as well as pinouts available on line if you want to make your own.

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if the gps has been off for a few hours, the gps will probably need to re-download the ephemeris, which is sent every thirty seconds (the almanac data lasts for several weeks). that is considered a warm start and should be on the order of 15-30 seconds for a fix, possibly a little more if it doesn't receive a valid ephemeris the first time. that can happen if the gps is moving while trying to obtain a fix and the signal is momentarily blocked by a tree or building, for example.

if the gps has been off for several days or the gps has moved a significant distance (on the order of 100 miles or more), the the gps will need a complete update to obtain a fix, and that will take a couple of minutes, possibly longer.....
ephemeris data is considered good for up to 30 days.

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some gps chipsets, notably the sirf star iii, are very sensitive and can get a fix much faster than older chipsets. i've heard of gps units with the sirf star iii chipset working inside of steel frame buildings and in the basement of a house.
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Everything is a trade off. The more sensitive the chipset, the more power it uses and shorter battery life. That is why the "H" versions in the Garmin eTrex series have shorter battery life than non-"H" versions. I opt for long battery life and bought the non"H" version.

In any case, I was considering to add a switch and a battery so the GPS can run on a 9V battery or on the camera battery via the 10 pin socket.

In the current design, one can't just turn on the camera, take a shot and expect the GPS data to be in the EXIF. As it is, reviewers will criticize a camera whether the turn on to first shot be a second or 1.5sec. In comparison, it's an eternaty for the GPS to get a fix from off.

ephemeris data is considered good for up to 30 days.

nope, ephemeris is valid for a couple of hours. the almanac is valid for months.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_to_first_fix

Everything is a trade off. The more sensitive the chipset, the more power it uses and shorter battery life. That is why the "H" versions in the Garmin eTrex series have shorter battery life than non-"H" versions. I opt for long battery life and bought the non"H" version.

not necessarily. recent gps chips are more power efficient than the older ones and a gps for a camera doesn't need a battery hungry colour screen or a fast cpu to calculate routes.

In the current design, one can't just turn on the camera, take a shot and expect the GPS data to be in the EXIF. As it is, reviewers will criticize a camera whether the turn on to first shot be a second or 1.5sec. In comparison, it's an eternaty for the GPS to get a fix from off.

as i said before, it's not an eternity. or, just leave it on all day. with battery life in excess of 12-18 hours, the battery should last for even the longest photo excursions.

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there is also assisted gps, which many cellphones have, where the gps gets the initial location and ephemeris data off the cellular network and then the gps can quickly obtain an exact fix directly from the gps satellites.
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Then I'll just say to my wife: "honey, never mind that, it's just cellphone bill for my new camera." The Crater Lake shot turn out to be in the middle of the lake because there weren't three basestations near by.:D

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as i said before, it's not an eternity. or, just leave it on all day. with battery life in excess of 12-18 hours, the battery should last for even the longest photo excursions.

Sure, you can leave your camera on all day with the GPS on. Half way thru the shooting, dang, need to change the battery. Missed the shot of your life, but you got your GPS data. Nice scenario ehh.:)

There are quite a few cameras out now. "Hey, Nikon, did you use that SiRF Star III latest low power chip in that P6000 so that I can keep it on all day?"

No, I like GPS. I usually have my P5000 and the Garmin eTrex with me. Just not quite sure I am ready for the P6000 yet. I will eventually finish the GPS for the D200.

Thanks,

I had been thinking about GPS tracker but it looked a little painful. Are you aware of any brands other than Nikon?

Sorry to get off track. Here are the parts I selected for my project:

Garmin GPS 15L (https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?cID=158&pID=161) (3.3-5V version)
Stellardesign MC-35 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260298892545) equiv. cable assembly
Antenna
Hot shoe mount
Misc hardware (small box, switch, battery terminals, 5V regulator)

Notes:
The Garmin GPS 15H will run on 9V battery directly but won't run on the camera battery via the 10 pin connector. The GPS 15L will run on the camera battery directly but need a 5V regulator to run on 9V battery.

The Garmin GPS 15 calls for an amplified antenna with coax but most antenna is too bulky for a neat on camera use. So I wanted to try a non-amplified antenna with a short lead. Some GPS boards have antennae mounted already.

In the end, buying Nikon's widget is probably cheaper.

Some day, the camera GPS will have a rotating antenna for portrait mode and it will say; "lost satellite reception".:eek:

Here is some real life expereiences with a camera GPS.
...when you are outdoors, it takes about 10-40 seconds to lock on (depending if you were close to where you were when you turned it off). Indoors, it can take about a minute. I can't really complain when it isn't a dedicated GPS device. ...
To SirJman,

If you had the camera off, went somewhere within let's say 10km of where you had the camera last on, then turn the camera back on; how long does it take the GPS to be ready?

Same scenario but that you stepped off the plane and turn the camera on; how long does it take the GPS to be ready?

Interesting thread.
How accurate do you want your data. I tend to remember the area I have taken the photo in, so it all seems a bit excessive to me!?

Interesting thread.
How accurate do you want your data. I tend to remember the area I have taken the photo in, so it all seems a bit excessive to me!?

I think a lot of people are trying to find the spots for Ansel Adam's shots. But most are not that meaningful. The current GPS after Selective Availability turn off are pretty accurate.