So, coming out of ithaca after school got out, I was really lookin forward to flying on a jet rather that the usual prop plane to PHL.

My first Canadair experience was... = SUPERB.

The plane was so clean and QUITE... oh wait, let me make that clearer actually.

The plane was so clean and QUITE!!!!!!!

I can never do the props ever again on ITH-PHL now.

I bet I'm not the only one who clicked on this thinking it was a joke.

I guess I agree with you on CRJ rather than the dash or the others---certainly more quiet. I like that they've mixed some of them into the EWN-CLT route, though I wish they'd make them all.

That said, I avoid the CRJs (especially the mesa 900s) like the plague unless I don't have a reasonable choice. I hate being cramped up in those.

So, coming out of ithaca after school got out, I was really lookin forward to flying on a jet rather that the usual prop plane to PHL.

My first Canadair experience was... = SUPERB.

The plane was so clean and QUITE... oh wait, let me make that clearer actually.

The plane was so clean and QUITE!!!!!!!

I can never do the props ever again on ITH-PHL now.

No offense, I would think $150+K for a Cornell education would have taught basic spelling :D

Everything is relative. Going from a prop to an RJ -- life is good.

Going from an A320 to an RJ, on a 3-hour flight -- not so good.

Unfortunately, there has been much more of the latter in recent years.



The plane was so clean and QUITE... oh wait, let me make that clearer actually.

The plane was so clean and QUITE!!!!!!!
OK. . . OK. . . Quite what?

Quiet? ;)

I bet I'm not the only one who clicked on this thinking it was a joke.

I guess I agree with you on CRJ rather than the dash or the others---certainly more quiet. I like that they've mixed some of them into the EWN-CLT route, though I wish they'd make them all.

That said, I avoid the CRJs (especially the mesa 900s) like the plague unless I don't have a reasonable choice. I hate being cramped up in those.

As someone who as rode on the Dash-8 waaaaay too many times I know how nice it is to ride on a CRJ instead. That being said I HATE riding on a CRJ on a route that is serviced by mainline!!

How much time will pass before we see a thread from the OP stating the opposite sentiment? It's not an if, but when, and the when is right after the first experience stuck in one of those tiny seats sitting at the gate for 4+ hours for random reasons they never tell you and the AC is not running.

The CRJ superb? Based on what? The cleanliness of the plane and the engine noise relative to a turboprop? That would make just about any jet with a decent cleaning crew "superb." If you're worried about prop engine noise then consider buying earplugs. I've actually found they work on jets as well.

I'll agree that the plane is quite... Quite small, quite uncomfortable, quite difficult to fit a bag in the overhead. The windows are quite mis-aligned and it's quite difficult for a male of normal stature to use the lav. From a pax standpoint the E170 leads the pack in RJ's but I'd still hesitate calling it "superb."

May I suggest you revise your criteria?

OK. . . OK. . . Quite what?



Quite...Small
Quite...uncomfortable
Quite...cramped
Quite...noisy
Quite...dirty
Quite...icky

*smile*

The OP REALLY needs to get out more!!!!!!!!!

No offense, I would think $150+K for a Cornell education would have taught basic spelling :D
:D

WOW

I greatly prefer a Dash-8. They cleaned them up the past couple of months. The buzz is 'ambient noise' and helps me sleep. The Dash-8s are more reliable. We had an upgrade to PHL-SWF this year replacing 1 Dash-8 trip with a CRJ, and it just happened to be our regular flight. the CRJ broke down about 4 times so far this year (mechanical issues.) When we had mechanicals on the dashes, they'd go in 30 minutes. Someone in PHL knows how to fix them.

I used to get home CLT-ORF in a Dash-8 occasionally when the 737 was broken OR in bad weather. When there's an opening they can get a Dash-8 filled up and up in the sky more quickly.

Dash-8s are also safer. I looked at airdisaster.com a back in 2002 when I started flying them and there was 1 crash in 1979 in Thailand in a thunderstorm. One landed on top of a deer in 2003 I believe in CLT and the landing gear collapsed (nose) but no injuries.

Long live the Dash-8.

WOW

Long live the Dash-8.
Here Here!! ^

WOW



Dash-8s are also safer. I looked at airdisaster.com a back in 2002 when I started flying them and there was 1 crash in 1979 in Thailand in a thunderstorm. One landed on top of a deer in 2003 I believe in CLT and the landing gear collapsed (nose) but no injuries.

Long live the Dash-8.
Not counting the deer of course... :D

Heinrich is correct -- from a comfort perspective, the DH8 is a superior craft. Now, if one if flying more than, say, 400 miles, the RJ becomes the vehicle of choice due to speed.

However, the roominess of the DH8 is significant when compared to the tight quarters of the RJ.

Oh, how I long for the days when 737s flew all the routes!!!! :(

I bet I'm not the only one who clicked on this thinking it was a joke.


HA! Verbatim what I was thinking.

However, as other posters stated, it's relative. If you've only been on the Dash-8 and God forbid the Beech 1900 it's like stumbling in to Valhalla. If you've only been an Airbus it's like stumbling in to the River Styx.

If I could choose between the EMB and the CRJ, I'd pick the EMB every time.

...God forbid the Beech 1900 it's like stumbling in to Valhalla.

Am I the only one that finds the B1900 fairly comfortable for short haul trips? The seats are actually wider than some mainline first clas...

fixing a double post

First i guess i apologize for not living up to the your expectation of Cornell education, one mistake, copy and paste hurts - like my CS professor said. repeated bugs.

Back to CRJ impression, I've done rather long flights on both A320s and CRJs and I understand people would prefer 320s over CRJs hands down.

But I guess the one I was on ITH-PHL.. this one was just really too clean. it was spotless - FAs were amazing and the air smelled better really. There was no dirty marks on the overhead or the seats and i was really surprised.

I dont know how I'm supposed to explain the "superb" QUIETNESS of the aircraft, but it really was so much quieter than the DASHs and bigger planes like 320s i thought. really, really. i swear.

If I could choose between the EMB and the CRJ, I'd pick the EMB every time.

The EMB-170 is as good as mainline with bigger windows IMHO. In fact I'd prefer an EMB 170 over a 737-300/400 any day.

I dont know how I'm supposed to explain the "superb" QUIETNESS of the aircraft, but it really was so much quieter than the DASHs and bigger planes like 320s i thought. really, really. i swear.
Let me try.....

It really boils down to two factors when comparing jet to jet - where you sit and size.

The further forward you sit, the quieter. Sit in F/C on the 320 vs last row in the CRJ, and the CRJ will be louder - you're sitting right between the engines back there. Behind the wing is much louder on the 320 - you're behind the engines. You'd have to hang onto the tail of the CRJ to get behind it's engines.

The bigger the airplane, the more power required (bigger engines). Making more power makes more noise, pure and simple.

On the Dash, it's the props that make most of the noise (plus the vibrations they set up in the cabin). Since the props are pretty far forward relative to the cabin, it's hard to excape that noise - unlike the CRJ with the engines at the rear.

Jim

First i guess i apologize for not living up to the your expectation of Cornell education, one mistake, copy and paste hurts - like my CS professor said. repeated bugs.

Back to CRJ impression, I've done rather long flights on both A320s and CRJs and I understand people would prefer 320s over CRJs hands down.

But I guess the one I was on ITH-PHL.. this one was just really too clean. it was spotless - FAs were amazing and the air smelled better really. There was no dirty marks on the overhead or the seats and i was really surprised.

I dont know how I'm supposed to explain the "superb" QUIETNESS of the aircraft, but it really was so much quieter than the DASHs and bigger planes like 320s i thought. really, really. i swear.

The dash's have been cleaned and buffed very thoroughly in the last 2 months. They almost look new inside. I seem to be the only one who'se noticed here, and I've mentioned it in several threads but it's true ^ :D

Am I the only one that finds the B1900 fairly comfortable for short haul trips? The seats are actually wider than some mainline first clas...
I think that plane should be blown from the face of the earth....having to walk bent over to get to your seat, then need a shoe horn to get into it, try to get a laptop bag under the seat...then unless it's a totally clear day, to bounce and sway to your destination. And I used to pay $600-$700 to fly that plane....they should have been paying me.

I agree though that the Dash 8 is very comfortable. Lots of space and a smooth ride. My all time favorite though is the Dornier. I miss that plane.

WOW

I greatly prefer a Dash-8. They cleaned them up the past couple of months. The buzz is 'ambient noise' and helps me sleep. The Dash-8s are more reliable. We had an upgrade to PHL-SWF this year replacing 1 Dash-8 trip with a CRJ, and it just happened to be our regular flight. the CRJ broke down about 4 times so far this year (mechanical issues.) When we had mechanicals on the dashes, they'd go in 30 minutes. Someone in PHL knows how to fix them.

I used to get home CLT-ORF in a Dash-8 occasionally when the 737 was broken OR in bad weather. When there's an opening they can get a Dash-8 filled up and up in the sky more quickly.

Dash-8s are also safer. I looked at airdisaster.com a back in 2002 when I started flying them and there was 1 crash in 1979 in Thailand in a thunderstorm. One landed on top of a deer in 2003 I believe in CLT and the landing gear collapsed (nose) but no injuries.

Long live the Dash-8.

The CRJ is my absolute last choice in regional aircraft. :td:

I would so much rather have an ERJ or even a prop before I'd want to sit in a Cramped Regional Jet.

RJ's should be banned from ever being made, let alone making people sit in them.

Was on a CR65 (I think it was labelled as a 700) this morning CHS-DCA and boy are those seats uncomfortable!

The Dash-8 is an upgrade compared to the awful CRJ (200/700/900/etc). If time permits, I will pass on the CRJ non-stop and connect to fly on a mainline aircraft + ERJ-145 or Dash-8.

CRJ-700s are at least decent if you can snag the exit rows...plenty of legroom, just the cramped seats (then again, I'm a small guy so not a big deal). Nonetheless, give me a Dash over a CRJ-200 any day...heck, I've gone out of my way before to take a connection through CLT (where I had to take a 15 minute CRJ flight to get too) to avoid a 2 hour CRJ flight to BOS, since I at least had mainline on the longer segment.

I just rode a CRJ-200 (Air Wisc) PIT-PVD and an EMB-170 (Republic) PVD-PIT this weekend. It was my first time on the EMB (don't get out much anymore ;)) and maybe second time on the CRJ, but maybe even first, can't remember.

CRJ was not impressive at all. It probably didn't help that I sat in row 1 with the tray tables in the armrest. I was in the aisle, 1C, and I kept leaning into the aisle because the seat felt so narrow. I have broad shoulders, so I felt like I was intruding into the other seat.

The EMB on the other hand felt spacious. Now this time I was seated with a companion, so intrusion wasn't as big of an issue, but even so the legroom (row 17, just an ordinary row) and seat width felt particularly spacious, even moreso than many mainline planes.

(We also had a leadfoot pilot on that flight; we got out of PVD 10 minutes early and touched down at PIT a full half hour early! Holy crap! Seems like a lot of padding for such a short flight. Also parked next to Piedmont heritage livery A319 at PIT early this afternoon.)

I have fond-ish memories of the Dash-8 as well, but comparing the last time I flew one a few years back to the CRJ-200, well, I'm not sure the Dash is actually *more* comfortable. Maybe no less comfy, though. What I remember most is that we came into BOS on the Dash, I was sitting in the back, and I had a particularly unobstructed view out the window due to the high wing. Pretty cool.

Also parked next to Piedmont heritage livery A319 at PIT early this afternoon.


I was out working in the yard this afternoon and looked up and saw the Piedmont plane coming in for a landing at PIT. It's really cool seeing those planes around......saw the Allegheny one parked at a gate a couple weeks ago, that brought back memories.

On reading the headline and the original post, I both empathized and foresaw the storm of responses it created. A couple things to keep in mind...

1. The folks at ... have not figured out that ITH is in their "low cost" route network (if such a thing exists). As of a month or two ago - you know, back when there was a website where you could search by price / fare class - the lowest r/t fare ITH - LGA was $450 and ITH - PHL was $550. With that pricing in mind, needless to say, load factors are loooowwww on US flights in/out of ITH. (With the exception of Cornell or Ithaca College graduation, orientation, parent's weekend, height of the recruiting season, etc. - basically the times that would bring pax with absolutely no price elasticity of demand, unlike, oh, your average college student who makes up 1/2 the population of the county. But I digress...) The CRJ's comfort level is pretty reasonable when there's only 12 pax on board. If only that low load were enough to get the FA out of the jump seat and their InStyle magazine to serve a beverage... if only GalleyWench worked for Air Wiskey (although I'm sure she's thrilled she doesn't).

2. While the 190 air miles from ITH - PHL isn't much on paper, the lineups getting in to PHL can add a lot to the flight time. While it's hard to imagine being in a hurry to savor the joys that are the F'd terminal at PHL, faster transit is still better. Most importantly, though, is that it seems that the Dash's get regularly shunted into low-altitude holding patterns, while if there are inbound delays in a CRJ those are enjoyed at significantly higher (and smoother) altitudes. I'm not all that queasy a guy usually but on several occasions in the last year there were a lot of green faces coming off of the flight after having spent lots of time in a lazy racetrack pattern 5,000 ft above south Jersey.

3. As far as the spelling thing is concerned... all I can say is that Cornell is an idiosyncratic place, as Fly747First has shown us on many occasions. We do have a swim test requirement for graduation, but fortunately for the OP, no spelling test. That said, we do have what is inarguably the best Ag school in the Ivy League.

I greatly prefer a Dash-8. ... The buzz is 'ambient noise' and helps me sleep.

Seriously? On every Dash-8 I've been on out of ROA, the "buzz" has been near deafening -- the noise plus the shaking is enough to give me a real headache even on just the short hop down to CLT. I'm about to where I'd rather drive to CLT, and I avoid the ROA-PHL segment on a Dash-8 at almost any cost.

The RJs are still a bit cramped, but for me they offer far more pleasant a trip, especially the 900s with the higher windows.

(all fresh in my mind from flying ROA-CLT-MDT-CLT-ROA this weekend on a mix of both).

.

On the Dash, it's the props that make most of the noise (plus the vibrations they set up in the cabin). Since the props are pretty far forward relative to the cabin, it's hard to excape that noise - unlike the CRJ with the engines at the rear.

Jim

If you ever fly AC to some odscure part of Canada then you'll ride on a Dash 8 that is maintained as it should be. I was on 3 different ones recently and they were quiet and I was in the seat next to the engine.

Also the Dash seat is 1" wider than a regular US Coach seat on a 737. When the Dash has all the noise dampening stuff working it's a great little plane.

2. While the 190 air miles from ITH - PHL isn't much on paper, the lineups getting in to PHL can add a lot to the flight time.
Off topic, but I suspect it's further than that in flying miles - especially in the CRJ. You probably start out heading south (or even somewhat southwest), make periodic left turns, and end up about 20 miles northwest of PHL heading due east. All due to the greater NYC airport's arrival/departure corridores from/to the west.

I know that on the ALB-PHL route we start out almost due west, making those left turns till ending up in the PHL area heading east. And never above 16,000 ft.

Now back to the regularly scheduled programming.....

Jim

If you ever fly AC to some odscure part of Canada then you'll ride on a Dash 8 that is maintained as it should be. I was on 3 different ones recently and they were quiet and I was in the seat next to the engine.

Also the Dash seat is 1" wider than a regular US Coach seat on a 737. When the Dash has all the noise dampening stuff working it's a great little plane.

I agree, PineyBob. Personally, I prefer even our Dash-8's to the CRJ (distance permitting), but that's probably the result of a few years spent with the big old prop on a Pratt & Whitney R1830 turning just behind the cockpit window, so the noise/vibration doesn't bother me.

Jim

Couple of problems.

1. Drawing a conclusion from a sample size of 1.

2. Post hoc.

On its face, the CRJ was a great idea. Reducing travel time from the outposts of the world to hubs with increased speed was a great concept.

BUT, once they decided that just because a CRJ has the range to do ABE->ATL, that it was a bright idea to do so, DL decided to throw me back to US as a customer. At 6'2" and a big frame, 2 hours in a CRJ ... well, I'd rather be poked in the eye with a sharp stick. Put me on the 319 to CLT, then CLT to wherever. I'll come back late evening on the 319. I'll adjust my flying to avoid the CRJ

My tolerance for the CRJ maxes out at about 1.5 hours. ABE->CVG was OK, but when DL drastically reduced the CVG schedule, color this flyer outtathere.

The Dash's speed limits its useful range from the hubs, which is the factor that makes commuter flights tolerable, short duration. The braintrust that decided that CRJ's should do flights that push over 2 hours ... should be sentenced to do transcons in them, 3 hours at a time, for as long as it takes for them to change their mind.

When faced with extended CRJ flights, I decided to switch airlines instead. I'd even prefer a Dash into PHL ... but the 319 is going to keep me with US. If I had to ... 1 hour 30 minutes ABE->CLT on a CRJ would be tolerable, but I get off the 319 a happier camper

Maybe it was just that it was quicker for me to get out of Ithaca :D

Q200s, anyone? If only the Sandcastle had the foresight and balls to be the first major airline to make a major re-commitment to the turboprop after coming down from regional jet psychosis...

I agree, PineyBob. Personally, I prefer even our Dash-8's to the CRJ (distance permitting), but that's probably the result of a few years spent with the big old prop on a Pratt & Whitney R1830 turning just behind the cockpit window, so the noise/vibration doesn't bother me.

Jim

I find the Dash-8s to be more comfortable, but I feel safer in the CRJ's. There's something about all that prop noise that makes me really nervous.

Maybe it was just that it was quicker for me to get out of Ithaca :D

But you're leaving during SUMMER, the only time of the year when the weather in Ithaca is fantastic!

the dash 8's are nice. however, i have flown on the j41's from IAD-TYS, and i will say i am happy to fly a CRJ to TYS from IAD or DCA then a j41. now, MSP? that's a different story. the j41 made the trip one hour and 55 minutes. the CRJ makes it an hour flight. so i will back the OP up on the short hops with a CRJ. anything over an hour though is personal preference.

But you're leaving during SUMMER, the only time of the year when the weather in Ithaca is fantastic!


SHHHHH!!! Don't tell anyone... it's the townies' practical joke on the students to have this place to ourselves once the weather is nice...

Am I the only one that finds the B1900 fairly comfortable for short haul trips? The seats are actually wider than some mainline first clas...

Clearly you haven't landed sideways at PWM in a 1900 during a snowstorm--my last 1900 flight 4 years ago!!

When you are on short final and hear comments from the flight deck (after wheels down) like, "Where's the runway" and "Hang on" it makes you opt for a little larger airframe....

Lots of space and a smooth ride. My all time favorite though is the Dornier. I miss that plane.

I miss the Dorniers really bad too. What nice comfy planes they were; they were much more comfortable than the CRJs that plague CAK and CLE now. I'd rather have the Dashes and Dorniers than the CRJs. Personally, I prefer any EMB to a CRJ, at least as US has configured them. I got off a CRJ-701 just two hours ago and even though I was in the exit row, it took a little while to feel comfortable again after the ride. This from a relatively short ride from CLT to CLE. :(

Btw, I clicked on this thread thinking it was a joke too. :P

the dash 8's are nice. however, i have flown on the j41's from IAD-TYS, and i will say i am happy to fly a CRJ to TYS from IAD or DCA then a j41. now, MSP? that's a different story. the j41 made the trip one hour and 55 minutes. the CRJ makes it an hour flight. so i will back the OP up on the short hops with a CRJ. anything over an hour though is personal preference.

You might feel safer but you're not. Not too much is safer than a Dash-8. Check airdisaster.com if you have the time. Maybe later this week I'll take the time to do some research and post some stats.

As much as I despise the CRJ's (and I will be on one this afternoon with predicted thunderstorms en route), my single worst flying experience from a comfort perspective was spent last summer on a Saab, flying from IAD to PIT.
To start, it was easily 90 plus degrees in there on boarding...and the a/c maybe lowered the temperature to 80 during the flight.

I'm 6'4" and there was no human way possible to fit my legs properly in front of me.
Literally the entire flight was spent sitting sideways....with my legs jutting into the aisle.
Getting up was pure agony (you can't stand straight up), and although it was a short flight in duration, I felt like I left body parts on that plane. :td:

As much as I despise the CRJ's (and I will be on one this afternoon with predicted thunderstorms en route), my single worst flying experience from a comfort perspective was spent last summer on a Saab, flying from IAD to PIT.
To start, it was easily 90 plus degrees in there on boarding...and the a/c maybe lowered the temperature to 80 during the flight.

I'm 6'4" and there was no human way possible to fit my legs properly in front of me.
Literally the entire flight was spent sitting sideways....with my legs jutting into the aisle.
Getting up was pure agony (you can't stand straight up), and although it was a short flight in duration, I felt like I left body parts on that plane. :td:
Ditto on the A/C - I took a PHL-RIC yesterday morning when it was 90+ in Philly and the flight was almost intolerable. The FA looked like she was going to pass out while doing the departure announcements.

Ventilation on the CRJ's always seems to be better; I guess because they're newer and A/C's are more efficient?