I live in a semi-remote, semi-rural community. The county population is about 105,000. The largest town is no more than 25,000. But, an interstate runs through it, and there is a mall and 3 Walmarts and a fair number of chain and non-chain restaurants. There are quite a few motels. They aren't overly full except when the local track is hosting a semi-annual Nascar race.

Currently, the exit down from the mall is being developed. It will have a Best Buy, a Target, one or two more stores of equal size and prominence, and a bunch of smaller ones. The town has been courting Olive Garden as a tenant. We have plenty of competitors; Ruby Tuesday, Applebees, Logans, Red Lobster, O'Charleys, etc. In 4 years, I have seen no chain restaurant fold. The few good non-chains struggle for business. Several have closed in the last month, while you have to wait 2 hours on a Friday night for a table at Outback.

Olive Garden Corporate looks like it will pass unless they can get major concessions from the local government (free rent, subsidies, no property tax). A petition has been started by a local radio show to demonstrate just how much citizens want OG (I know there are many OG detractors on this board. Personally, I'm ok with the place and any further variety will please me).

I don't know if they can be swayed, even with petitions or concessions. But, I have an idea. AL is the fattest or 2nd fattest state in the union. I think OG is underestimating demand based on population. We're few, but the average citizen will not be satisfied with a single bowl of spaghetti. No, these bloated 'bamians will be ordering triple entrees with double dessert. And the bottomless salad will go untouched. They don't even need to stock the bowls.

I think we should get as many locals together for a photo shoot and send that to Olive Garden. They cannot fail to be impressed. I'm just worried that people won't see my suggestion in the light that's it's being made and will think that I'm just making fun of their obesity problem. And, I'm worried that I might get sat on.

Should I send a letter to the editor or keep my mouth shut?

Olive Garden is insult to Italian cuisine. Do what you can to get rid of them.

Olive Garden is insult to Italian cuisine. Do what you can to get rid of them.

Have you been there? It's good.

Nothing wrong with Olive Garden at all.

And yes I own shares of Darden.

Americans love to eat out and variety is some kind of spice.

Olive Garden is so well received that they can ask for and get all the concessions they are after.

Have you been there? It's good.

Their soup, salad and breadstick lunch can't be beat. ^

It's not like the OP lives in NYC; it's unlikely that his town will ever see (much less support) a decent real italian restaurant anyway.

There are entire states in the USA without a decent real italian restaurant - for them, Olive Garden is probably as good as it's gonna get.

I think Red Lobster and Olive Garden are owned by the same corporation....

Olive Garden is insult to Italian cuisine. Do what you can to get rid of them.

Couldn't agree more! Just because OG is the only Italian restaurant in many places, doesn't make it good. Sorry, BamaVol, but if I were you, I'd count my blessings that OG doesn't want to open there. With any luck, you might get a better Italian restaurant, maybe even one that isn't part of a chain.

Couldn't agree more! Just because OG is the only Italian restaurant in many places, doesn't make it good. Sorry, BamaVol, but if I were you, I'd count my blessings that OG doesn't want to open there. With any luck, you might get a better Italian restaurant, maybe even one that isn't part of a chain.

We've had 3 in 4 years. None lasted more than a year. I ate at one a month after it opened. The waiter was a 16 year old with a toothpick in his mouth! It took tremendous self-control not to slap it out of his face. The food was utter ..... I'm thinking of several problems.

1. Without the training you get from a corporate chain, most independents have no idea how to run a restaurant.

2. Local citizens are interested in quantity, not quality. All you can eat would go over well, but the only way to make money doing that here is to serve slop. Charging for quantity and quality is not an option due to the (generally) low incomes.

3. There are no local citizens of Italian heritage. One of my doctors (a fellow damn-yankee) says he's met one other It-Am besides me in 14 years of practice. He and I talk about delis and pizza when I have an appointment. We'd both frequent a good Italian restaurant, but it would take more than us to keep it going.

As I said, I don't have a problem with OG food, in fact I love the soup/salad/breadsticks lunch. And I grew up in a 2nd generation It-Am home, eating the family recipes hand written (some in Italian) my whole life and have generally lived in and around major cities (Boston, San Francisco, Denver) where good Italian food could be found. So, regardless of what your opinion of OG is, people here want one.

I just want to know how much hate mail I should expect when I point out the perpetual hunger that exists here, and the resulting average 44 inch waistline. Really.

People here are so fat ...

Ed: How fat are they?

They're so fat, that there's one small store for short and thin people. All the other stores sizes start at XL.

I think Red Lobster and Olive Garden are owned by the same corporation....Why does that NOT surprise me? :D

Olive Garden is insult to Italian cuisine. Do what you can to get rid of them.

Exactly, Sbarro's it ain't! :D

Currently, the exit down from the mall is being developed. It will have a Best Buy, a Target, one or two more stores of equal size and prominence, and a bunch of smaller ones. The town has been courting Olive Garden as a tenant. We have plenty of competitors; Ruby Tuesday, Applebees, Logans, Red Lobster, Ocharleys, etc. In 4 years, I have seen no chain restaurant fold. The few good non-chains struggle for business. Several have closed in the last month, while you have to wait 2 hours on a Friday night for a table at Outback.

?

You described I81 south of Wilkes-Barre Pa. They built this huge boxstore development and put one of every national chain restaurant in and around.

I used to frequent an independent beer-pub that in addition to brewing some really good beer, offered some pretty good meals. I remember an evening having a Cajun rib-eye, a fresh dinner salad and homemade garlic mash potatoes with a couple of good Stouts and the bill was less than $25 bucks. An equal meal at the Outback would have been closer to $35.

Unfortunately the place closed a few months after the mall was completed as they couldn't compete with Olive Garden and the rest.

I'm still searching for a good local restaurant in the area.

try courting mac grill or maggiano's.

Sounds like the perfect opportunity for a MR! :D

Around dinnertime, pick an airport (ATL or BHM) and catch a flight to a large city with lots of OG's! By the time you arrive, the waiting list should be reduced from 2 hours to 1 hour and you'll probably be famished! :)

OT - Check out the Community board - I just posted an ATL Do yesterday and would love to have you join us!

try courting mac grill or maggiano's.

I dunno...the guys that franchise the Macaroni Grills in Southern California really doesn't know what he's doing. The food is REALLY subpar, especially compared to the Macaroni Grills in the Chicagoland area. BUT, the Olive Gardens in the Chicagoland area totally SUCK, but they are VERY good out here in Southern California. Go figure. So in Illinois, go Mac Grill. In So Cal, fo OG.

As for people that hate the Italian franchises...have you been to more than one location? Just like any chain with more than one location, you can't judge the entire chain by just one experience. Like the people who say they went to Morton's and had the "worst steak ever..." I've been to many, many Morton's and have had many, many amazing steaks, and maybe one or two "okay" steaks. If I based all my opinions on the one or two "okay" steaks, I might have not gone back.

Off-Topic: My favorite dish at OG is the Chicken Marsala with angel hair pasta. At a Chicago suburb, they didn't heat through the sauce enough, SO IT WAS LIKE DRINKING BAD WINE with my chicken! I had to instruct them to reheat the sauce so that the alcohol burns off and the manager says, "But we've been doing it the other way for years!" Oy! No, not suppposed to get drunk off of the Chicken Marasala!!!

As for Maggiano's...great food consistantly in all locations that I've visited. Probably the safest bet. ;)

I think Red Lobster and Olive Garden are owned by the same corporation....

I can't see giving these guys huge breaks to come into a community but then again I can't see living in Alabama either...

from

http://www.redlobster.com/company/fact_sheet.asp

(Red Lobster is a)
Subsidiary of:
Darden Restaurants, Inc. of Orlando, Florida, which, through its subsidiaries, also operates Olive Garden, Bahama Breeze, Smokey Bones Barbeque & Grill and Seasons 52 restaurants.

try courting mac grill or maggiano's.

Don't take this the wrong way but y'all aren't the market for a MAGU (Maggiano's). They generally target upper-middle class markets (tyson's corner, buckhead, DFW metro) with a high-level disposable income. They are just arond the par of a Cheesecake Factory localle.

We've had 3 in 4 years. None lasted more than a year. I ate at one a month after it opened. The waiter was a 16 year old with a toothpick in his mouth! It took tremendous self-control not to slap it out of his face. The food was utter ..... I'm thinking of several problems.

1. Without the training you get from a corporate chain, most independents have no idea how to run a restaurant.

2. Local citizens are interested in quantity, not quality. All you can eat would go over well, but the only way to make money doing that here is to serve slop. Charging for quantity and quality is not an option due to the (generally) low incomes.

3. There are no local citizens of Italian heritage. One of my doctors (a fellow damn-yankee) says he's met one other It-Am besides me in 14 years of practice. He and I talk about delis and pizza when I have an appointment. We'd both frequent a good Italian restaurant, but it would take more than us to keep it going.

As I said, I don't have a problem with OG food, in fact I love the soup/salad/breadsticks lunch. And I grew up in a 2nd generation It-Am home, eating the family recipes hand written (some in Italian) my whole life and have generally lived in and around major cities (Boston, San Francisco, Denver) where good Italian food could be found. So, regardless of what your opinion of OG is, people here want one.

I just want to know how much hate mail I should expect when I point out the perpetual hunger that exists here, and the resulting average 44 inch waistline. Really.

People here are so fat ...

Ed: How fat are they?

They're so fat, that there's one small store for short and thin people. All the other stores sizes start at XL.

Bama, I was ROTFLMAO reading your post! :D :D ^ ^

I didn't realize you're an It-Am. So am I and grwoing up on home made gravy and pasta (especially ravioli) I can't help but be super critical of Italian restaurants and food sold commercially. It still amazes me to this day that people eat spahetti-o's from a can. :eek:

Since you've got an Outback which is successful, I'd suggest putting your effort into getting their sister chain Carrabbas to put up a store. Much, much, much better than any OG I've ever eaten in, and cleaner than most.

Since you've got an Outback which is successful, I'd suggest putting your effort into getting their sister chain Carrabbas to put up a store. Much, much, much better than any OG I've ever eaten in, and cleaner than most.

One of my sons got food poisoning at Outback last month. I'd like to give them the ER bill, not a subsidy for another ptomaine palace.

One of my sons got food poisoning at Outback last month. I'd like to give them the ER bill, not a subsidy for another ptomaine palace.

I hope you let them know about it. I'm curious, what was their response if you did?

I hope you let them know about it. I'm curious, what was their response if you did?

I did this on the advice of one of the ER doctors. The response was that no one else had reported a problem, but they would look into it. I told them the date and time as well as what he ordered. I was interested in helping them prevent further problems. I did not ask for anything. I'm not a fan of their restaurants and my son still can't look at a steak 3-4 weeks later.

BamaVol,

When you figure out how to lure whoever you decide on, give us a call in south Baldwin County and let us know how you did it. We're short on Italian, Chinese and just about anything else that isn't fried. I'm not a big fan of OG, but would welcome one just for the variety and for the chance that it might encourage other places to open a store down here.

From several replies on this thread, I take this to mean that us dumb, fat, trailer trash in the South aren't fortunate enough to be able to eat out at an overpriced, snotty "real Italian" restaurant only found in such upscale locales as New York City? :rolleyes:

Gee, last time I ate at a "real Italian" restaurant in NYC, I got half the food for the same price as Olive Garden (leaving me hungry after my meal, and I'm not a fatass BTW) served by a Mexican. You snotty New Yorkers can keep your "real Italian" crappy restaurants.

From several replies on this thread, I take this to mean that us dumb, fat, trailer trash in the South aren't fortunate enough to be able to eat out at an overpriced, snotty "real Italian" restaurant only found in such upscale locales as New York City? :rolleyes:

Gee, last time I ate at a "real Italian" restaurant in NYC, I got half the food for the same price as Olive Garden (leaving me hungry after my meal, and I'm not a fatass BTW) served by a Mexican. You snotty New Yorkers can keep your "real Italian" crappy restaurants.

JS,
Don't let them get to you. All that snow makes them weird after a while... :)

Was in Greenville last week and ate at a Macaroni Grill out by the airport. Not one of the better MG meals I've had, but they could have been having a bad night. Also ate a nice piece of salmon at a place called "California something or other". Some nice choices for chains in Greenville. Any suggestions on local places there?

From several replies on this thread, I take this to mean that us dumb, fat, trailer trash in the South aren't fortunate enough to be able to eat out at an overpriced, snotty "real Italian" restaurant only found in such upscale locales as New York City? :rolleyes:

Gee, last time I ate at a "real Italian" restaurant in NYC, I got half the food for the same price as Olive Garden (leaving me hungry after my meal, and I'm not a fatass BTW) served by a Mexican. You snotty New Yorkers can keep your "real Italian" crappy restaurants.
I think you meant "we dumb, fat, trailer trash in the South." :confused:

Also, "Mexican-American."

Don't mention it. I'm glad to help. :)

I think you meant we dumb, fat, trailer trash in the South. :confused:

No, that's not what he meant... ^

How do you know it was a Mexican-American and not a Mexican?

I remember one year the Arizona Repulsive (oops.. I mean Republic) newspaper had OG as it's "best italian restaurant" in one year's "Best of Phoenix" issue. Oh please! I think we know how that listing got in there.

Anyway, if you want a better chain italian restaurant, Buca di Beppo is much better than OG.

To me, OG is as much of an italian restaurant as Pizza Hut is.

\rec

JS,
Don't let them get to you. All that snow makes them weird after a while... :)

Was in Greenville last week and ate at a Macaroni Grill out by the airport. Not one of the better MG meals I've had, but they could have been having a bad night. Also ate a nice piece of salmon at a place called "California something or other". Some nice choices for chains in Greenville. Any suggestions on local places there?

I have never eaten there. I have eaten at Carraba's on Woodruff Rd three times. It's delicious. One thing, though, and this is probably true of all restaurant of this type, but if you like mixed drinks, watch out -- they're around $7 each, and a double is double price. :td:

Personally, I prefer Waffle House. It's edible and cheap, and there are hundreds of locations, all open 24/7. :D

The waiter was a 16 year old with a toothpick in his mouth! It took tremendous self-control not to slap it out of his face.

Wise decision. I've learned never to slap someone in the face who's chewing on a toothpick unless I have a desire for a toothpick impaled in my palm. ;)

Don't take this the wrong way but y'all aren't the market for a MAGU (Maggiano's). They generally target upper-middle class markets (tyson's corner, buckhead, DFW metro) with a high-level disposable income. They are just arond the par of a Cheesecake Factory localle.


I agree. Maggiano's targets the Yuppie crowd and you're not likely to see a Maggiano's outside of a fairly major and upscale urban area.
Back to the topic, when Olive Garden first hit the scene many years ago, we'd visit quite often but finally burned out on the concept. Somebody dragged me into an OG a few months ago and I was pleasantly surprised with how much they've improved and upscaled their menu.
OG's still not a place I'll visit on a regular basis but I'll also not avoid it as I have in the past.

This is my first posting in this forum however my eye caught the Olive Garden in the title.

I absolutely adore the Olive Garden Salad dressing - truly the best dressing I have had anywhere. ^ ^ ^ ^ :)

As a restaurant I have found them very consistent and very reasonable. There are far worse places, especially chain restaurants I could name in the US.

Olive Garden is insult to Italian cuisine. Do what you can to get rid of them.The "italianity" of the Olive Garden is highly questionable IMHO, but I always found the food quite decent for a chain restaurant and I've never been disappointed.

Have you been there? It's good.
Yes, I've been there.

It's an insult to Italian food.

Or, it's Italian food for people who don't know what real Italian food tastes like :D :D :D

From several replies on this thread, I take this to mean that us dumb, fat, trailer trash in the South aren't fortunate enough to be able to eat out at an overpriced, snotty "real Italian" restaurant only found in such upscale locales as New York City? :rolleyes:

Gee, last time I ate at a "real Italian" restaurant in NYC, I got half the food for the same price as Olive Garden (leaving me hungry after my meal, and I'm not a fatass BTW) served by a Mexican. You snotty New Yorkers can keep your "real Italian" crappy restaurants.
Uhhh, no JS.

I'm a first generation Italian that knows what "real" Italian food tastes like. It doesn't have to be from a "snooty NYC" restaurant. A mom & pop shop can serve it up just fine. As a matter of fact, my local pizzaria often will cook up special dishes for me if I just ask. Sometimes I'm too lazy to cook it myself & they're more than happy to do it for me ^^

JS,
Don't let them get to you. All that snow makes them weird after a while... :)

Was in Greenville last week and ate at a Macaroni Grill out by the airport. Not one of the better MG meals I've had, but they could have been having a bad night. Also ate a nice piece of salmon at a place called "California something or other". Some nice choices for chains in Greenville. Any suggestions on local places there?

My how that area has changed! I lived in Simpsonville back in 1983-84 and the best you could hope for was Bennigans, I think out by the Mall. I've driven past that California whatever (it faces 85, right?) and I like the look of the building - that's not necessarily a sign of fine dining, but I'm more encouraged by that than a shack with an old coondog lying on the front steps. A guilty pleasure back in those days was lunch at The Clock (#?). I made it a point never to read the health inpection column in the paper, though. I worked in a plant with a cafeteria and it was there I first tried grits (horrifying the rest of the plant by pouring maple syrup on them) and stromboli (I kid you not) which has never been surpassed by any I've eaten since.

To take this one step further.. Most, if not all, chain Italian places as well as the local pizzarias do not server real Italian food. They serve a version of special holiday meals.

If Italians actually ate Lasagne, baked ziti, or Carbonara regularly, they would have the same high level of cholesterol and heart disease as Americans do.

At home we only ate those high fat & calorie laden foods on holidays - as in once or twice a year at Christmas & Easter.

JS,
Don't let them get to you. All that snow makes them weird after a while... :)

Was in Greenville last week and ate at a Macaroni Grill out by the airport. Not one of the better MG meals I've had, but they could have been having a bad night. Also ate a nice piece of salmon at a place called "California something or other". Some nice choices for chains in Greenville. Any suggestions on local places there?

I seem to remember that it's name is California Dreamin.

The Staxa____ family have a number of restaurants in the area which are pretty decent. Stax's Grill (in the same strip center as Toys 'R Us) was the one I ate at the most when I lived in the area. Stax's Peppermill is more upscale. Stax's Original is more downscale (meat 'n three, good breakfast). I never was a big fan of Stax's Omega.

Also, I really enjoyed the Peddler Steak House (part of a regional chain). Just be aware that the steak being cut in front of your is larger that it appears. If you want a 12 oz steak, tell them. Salad bar was limited but usually fresh. Also try the Texas toast.

I'm sorry to hear about the food poisoning, BamaVol; I know what that's like. I've gotten it twice after eating at Red Lobsters (different restaurants, different grilled meats). While I'm a fan of Outback, that chain seems to be one of the most consistent for undercooking their meats. I have ordered beef medium well (say an 8 on a 1 to 10 scale) on a number of occasions only to have it served medium rare (4) to medium (6); of course, ordering it well done usually results in a very overcooked piece of meat (say a 12). Until the state agencies who regulate restaurants require the use of temperature probes to determine at least minimal doneness, some unlucky souls are occasionally going to get hit with the consequences of undercooking in any of these restaurants who may be using inexperienced cooks. While I don't know that either your son's situation or mine were the result of undercooking, it wouldn't surprise me.

I'm sorry to hear about the food poisoning, BamaVol; I know what that's like. I've gotten it twice after eating at Red Lobsters (different restaurants, different grilled meats). While I'm a fan of Outback, that chain seems to be one of the most consistent for undercooking their meats. I have ordered beef medium well (say an 8 on a 1 to 10 scale) on a number of occasions only to have it served medium rare (4) to medium (6); of course, ordering it well done usually results in a very overcooked piece of meat (say a 12). Until the state agencies who regulate restaurants require the use of temperature probes to determine at least minimal doneness, some unlucky souls are occasionally going to get hit with the consequences of undercooking in any of these restaurants who may be using inexperienced cooks. While I don't know that either your son's situation or mine were the result of undercooking, it wouldn't surprise me.

TRRed,

Hard to prove anything, especially since I wasn't present for the meal. But, he and the others present said it was ordered medium and served very bloody.

His older brother has been a grill cook. I always defer to him on the grill. He tests doneness by pressing on the steak and is always correct, but has been doing this for several years. A probe thermometer would be a good substitute for experience I would imagine.

From several replies on this thread, I take this to mean that us dumb, fat, trailer trash in the South aren't fortunate enough to be able to eat out at an overpriced, snotty "real Italian" restaurant only found in such upscale locales as New York City? :rolleyes:

Gee, last time I ate at a "real Italian" restaurant in NYC, I got half the food for the same price as Olive Garden (leaving me hungry after my meal, and I'm not a fatass BTW) served by a Mexican. You snotty New Yorkers can keep your "real Italian" crappy restaurants.

Great Italian food does not need to come from an overpriced, snotty restaurant in Manhattan. Some of the best Italian food I've ever eaten, aside from Mom's of course, comes from small pizzerias where everything is made fresh and only when you order it.

JS, if all you're eating at is the overpriced, snotty Italian resturants when you come to the Metro NYC area, then you're missing out on quite a bit.

And I'll match any of what you refer to as our "crappy restaurants" against any other Italian restaurants in the country. That's my story, and I'm sticking to it. :D

I seem to remember that it's name is California Dreamin.

The Staxa____ family have a number of restaurants in the area which are pretty decent. Stax's Grill (in the same strip center as Toys 'R Us) was the one I ate at the most when I lived in the area. Stax's Peppermill is more upscale. Stax's Original is more downscale (meat 'n three, good breakfast). I never was a big fan of Stax's Omega.

Oh my goodness, I ate at Stax Peppermill one time (Pelham Rd & Haywood). It was, without a doubt, the most overpriced, disgusting and inedible snot-food "luxury" dining experience I have ever had. Horrible! :td:

From several replies on this thread, I take this to mean that us dumb, fat, trailer trash in the South aren't fortunate enough to be able to eat out at an overpriced, snotty "real Italian" restaurant only found in such upscale locales as New York City? :rolleyes:

Gee, last time I ate at a "real Italian" restaurant in NYC, I got half the food for the same price as Olive Garden (leaving me hungry after my meal, and I'm not a fatass BTW) served by a Mexican. You snotty New Yorkers can keep your "real Italian" crappy restaurants.

One other thing. The snotty, uptight New Yorkers that you and others run into are usually not native New Yorkers. They move there for the glamour, night life and the money. The city changes them. Native New Yorkers have grown up in that environment and are used to it, so they, shall I see we, don't get sucked into the "NYC" life.

And while I'm here, comparing Italian restaurants in NYC to Italian restaurants in some parts of the country is like comparing BBQ restaurants in some parts of the country to those in NYC. I've eaten in great BBQ places in Atlanta, Birmingham and Memphis, among others. I've also eaten in "Authentic Southern BBQ" restaurants in the NYC area, including my own suburb. And they all can't compare to those Southern BBQ places I've eaten at.

So you see, it goes both ways.

Uhhh, no JS.

I'm a first generation Italian that knows what "real" Italian food tastes like. It doesn't have to be from a "snooty NYC" restaurant. A mom & pop shop can serve it up just fine. As a matter of fact, my local pizzaria often will cook up special dishes for me if I just ask. Sometimes I'm too lazy to cook it myself & they're more than happy to do it for me ^^Outside of my travels to Italy, the best Italian food I've had has been in the family owned restaurants in Boston's North End. Without a doubt. ^

From several replies on this thread, I take this to mean that us dumb, fat, trailer trash in the South aren't fortunate enough to be able to eat out at an overpriced, snotty "real Italian" restaurant only found in such upscale locales as New York City? :rolleyes:Italian immigrants didn't settle in the south with or without your trailer trash with which you seem to identify.

For real Italian cuisine, you go where the Italian immigrants spread their roots--to New York (much of Brooklyn), Boston (the North End), Philly (south Philly), and Chicago. These areas I put in parentheses aren't exactly in the high-rent districts. :D So those of you with axes to grind against NYC and italian food, think again. Try a family owned restaurant in Bensonhurst. Ask anyone here who has been on dhammer's Brooklyn Reality Tour about authentic italian cuisine they enjoyed with Dan as their leader.

The best italian food I've had was in EZE.

Olive Garden is good comfort food. It along with Red Lobster is just good food for the general masses. Moderately priced, with large portions. I'm against giving *any* company special tax breaks just to come in. If they want to enter the marketplace, then let them compete on a level playing field with the other restaurants.

America does it's "thang" with most food that comes in. Chinese, Mexican and Italian are all changed to match what the locals want. Many people don't even know the truth behind many of the restaurants they go to. Thinking that Outback is a real Ozzie restaurant, or Carrabas is a family run restaurant.

One other thing. The snotty, uptight New Yorkers that you and others run into are usually not native New Yorkers. They move there for the glamour, night life and the money. The city changes them. Native New Yorkers have grown up in that environment and are used to it, so they, shall I see we, don't get sucked into the "NYC" life.

And while I'm here, comparing Italian restaurants in NYC to Italian restaurants in some parts of the country is like comparing BBQ restaurants in some parts of the country to those in NYC. I've eaten in great BBQ places in Atlanta, Birmingham and Memphis, among others. I've also eaten in "Authentic Southern BBQ" restaurants in the NYC area, including my own suburb. And they all can't compare to those Southern BBQ places I've eaten at.

So you see, it goes both ways.Many of us who know Italian food are indeed natives so whatever your views of "NYC" life is, those are your views. They may not reflect reality for a native. I find it bizarre that distinguishing Italian cuisine from chain cooking makes one snooty. Your view I guess.

That said, your comparison with barbeque is a good one. You can't find good bbq in New York. In fact, smoking pits aren't even legal in the city. So how can anything be authentic. Likewise, you aren't going to Olive Garden for any remote sense of authentic Italian cooking. In terms of "cuisine" it's on par with the likes of Applebee's. :D

It along with Red Lobster is just good food for the general masses. I've never been to a Red Lobster. So let me ask....given it's name, can I assume that one can order a boiled lobster by the pound (1 - 1 1/4 lbs, 1 1/4 - 1 1/2lbs, 1 1/2 - 2 lbs)? I would assume with lobster in it's name, this is a standard entree on the menu.

I've never been to a Red Lobster. So let me ask....given it's name, can I assume that one can order a boiled lobster by the pound (1 - 1 1/4 lbs, 1 1/4 - 1 1/2lbs, 1 1/2 - 2 lbs)? I would assume with lobster in it's name, this is a standard entree on the menu.

It's been a good 10 years, but I don't recall a live tank in the lobby. I may be wrong, but I think lobster there is limited to frozen tails. I'm pretty sure the shell was red, though. I doubt that the majority of customers go there to eat lobster anyway. At the local branch, I would guess that some form of shrimp dish is the most frequently ordered.

They bake a cheesy, garlic biscuit that I recall was the best thing I was served there.

Olive Garden is so well received that they can ask for and get
all the concessions they are after.

Corporate welfare is immoral. If Olive Garden is such a cash cow there's no possible justification for tax breaks. Sorry, but having more dining options in town is not sufficient reason.

Many of us who know Italian food are indeed natives so whatever your views of "NYC" life is, those are your views. They may not reflect reality for a native. I find it bizarre that distinguishing Italian cuisine from chain cooking makes one snooty. Your view I guess.

That said, your comparison with barbeque is a good one. You can't find good bbq in New York. In fact, smoking pits aren't even legal in the city. So how can anything be authentic. Likewise, you aren't going to Olive Garden for any remote sense of authentic Italian cooking. In terms of "cuisine" it's on par with the likes of Applebee's. :D

Analise, I think I may not be clear in what I'm trying to say. I am a native NYer, having been born and raised in Manhattan, and in the low rent area. Although I don't live there now, I am in a close enough suburb that I get into the city often. I agree with all that you've said. I was replying to JS's post about snotty, overpriced Italian restaurants in NYC. As far as I can see from reading your posts, we're on the same page. Especially with your tag line! ;)

Corporate welfare is immoral. If Olive Garden is such a cash cow there's no possible justification for tax breaks. Sorry, but having more dining options in town is not sufficient reason.

But, the citizenry wants Olive Garden. What difference does it make if we give them a tax break or take up a collection and mail them a check?

I realize it is anti-competitive and that does bother me, but OG isn't going to print special menus with lower prices for one restaurant that has a lower cost of doing business and they would have certain contractual obligations in exchange (like remaining open for a period without regard to profitability).
The government exists to serve the people. How better than to serve them dinner? :D

I fail to see the immorality.

Analise, I think I may not be clear in what I'm trying to say. I am a native NYer, having been born and raised in Manhattan, and in the low rent area. Although I don't live there now, I am in a close enough suburb that I get into the city often. I agree with all that you've said. I was replying to JS's post about snotty, overpriced Italian restaurants in NYC. As far as I can see from reading your posts, we're on the same page. Especially with your tag line! ;)Well that's different! Go Yankees!! I just had to wonder why certain people here assume that authentic italian cuisine has a direct correlation with expensive restaurant bills. Authentic doesn't mean more expensive.

I fail to see the immorality.I agree with you. If towns are willing to throw tax incentives at corporations to locate within their town limits, what company would say no to that? If companies demand them, if a town wants to pony up their residents tax dollars, don't blame the company. Blame the elected politicians. I don't see where morals come into play. Perhaps they see greater employment opportunities for their residents which in turn creates tax dollars. Perhaps they see tax revenues in the sales these restaurants make and thus money spent now will come back three-fold.

It's been a good 10 years, but I don't recall a live tank in the lobby. I may be wrong, but I think lobster there is limited to frozen tails....

Haven't been in a long while, but I do know that in the mid-90's there was still a lobster tank at the Red Lobster in south Indianapolis.

They bake a cheesy, garlic biscuit that I recall was the best thing I was served there.

It was yum indeed.

It's been a good 10 years, but I don't recall a live tank in the lobby. I may be wrong, but I think lobster there is limited to frozen tails. I'm pretty sure the shell was red, though. I doubt that the majority of customers go there to eat lobster anyway. At the local branch, I would guess that some form of shrimp dish is the most frequently ordered.

They bake a cheesy, garlic biscuit that I recall was the best thing I was served there.

Red Lobsters I've been to in North Carolina all have lobster tanks as well.

And yes, the cheesy garlic biscuits alone are enough reason to go there. :D

I just had to wonder why certain people here assume that authentic italian cuisine has a direct correlation with expensive restaurant bills. Authentic doesn't mean more expensive.

I was in little Italy in Cleveland last week and we ate at a small family style restaurant "Maxi's" ? There were nine of us and we ordered 6 or 7 apps 2 salads and 3 small Pies. Food was incredible and we had a ton left over. The food bill was approx $100 and the bar bill... well that's another story.

Since RL once had its biscuit recipe posted on its website (I don't see it there now), a Google search will probably turn it up. And I think I have seen some RL's recently with a lobster tank.

Bamavol - Why don't you take the initiative (or put your money where your mouth wants to be) and open your own restaurant using your own "authentic italian" recipes? OR...if OG is so bad and there is no other option eat at home! If your "small town with a race track" happens to be Talledega, you could always drive the short distance to BHM to Leonardo's. It is the best in the state by far and reasonably priced. Most of us patrons are of an acceptible weight and would probably not ruin your dining experience.

Bamavol - Why don't you take the initiative (or put your money where your mouth wants to be) and open your own restaurant using your own "authentic italian" recipes? OR...if OG is so bad and there is no other option eat at home! If your "small town with a race track" happens to be Talledega, you could always drive the short distance to BHM to Leonardo's. It is the best in the state by far and reasonably priced. Most of us patrons are of an acceptible weight and would probably not ruin your dining experience.

1. The town is Oxford, AL. It's about 20 miles from 'dega. I live in an unincorporated part of Calhoun county.

2. Successful independent restaurants in the area serve barbeque. I've seen a lot of independents open and close in 4 years, in part because the owners didn't understand the market. The only way I can demonstrate that I'm any smarter than those guys is by not opening an independent restaurant that doesn't sell barbeque.

3. I can cook good italian food at home. I share it with a few friends. I travel to places where I can get a decent Italian restaurant meal. I even enjoy an occasional lunch at the nearest Olive Garden in Douglasville, GA. I'm satisfied. My fellow Calhounians are much more deprived and are clamoring much louder than I for their OG.

4. I already drive to BHM once a month to shop at a decent grocery store. I enjoy a glass or 2 of Chianti with my italian food. So does Mrs BamaVol. That is incompatible with the drive home from BHM.

5. I love my neighbors but, for whatever reason, the average weight here is well above the US norm. It is a statewide phenomenon, but seems to be less widespread (pun intended) in BHM than the more rural parts of the state. What I do notice in BHM, as I wander around the Summit, are all the thin middle aged blondes with their noses in the air and a pinched look on their faces as if they perpetually smell something bad. I'd rather dine with the chubbies in Oxford.

...I've seen a lot of independents open and close in 4 years, in part because the owners didn't understand the market....

Some possible corroboration: Last fall I had lunch at an "Oriental Buffet" in Birmingham (which was unexpectedly decent!). Along with the things you'd expect there was also meatloaf, fried catfish, grits (for lunch?), and turnip greens.

Olive Garden is insult to Italian cuisine. Do what you can to get rid of them.

Fine upscale cuisine it ain't, but as chains go Olive Garden ain't bad. I swear I never saw as many food snobs as I've seen on FT. :D

Fine upscale cuisine it ain't, but as chains go Olive Garden ain't bad. I swear I never saw as many food snobs as I've seen on FT. :DAgain, what does "authentic" have to do with 'upscale'? The best Italian food you'll ever have outside of Italy will usually come from a Mom and Pop place in Bensonhurst, the North End or South Philly. Upscale, they're not. Authentic fine cooking with low down-to-earth prices is what they are known for.

What I do notice in BHM, as I wander around the Summit, are all the thin middle aged blondes with with their noses in the air and a pinched look on their faces as if they perpetually smell something bad. I'd rather dine with the chubbies in Oxford.

Now THAT's funny! The ones that migrated down here all live in Fairhope...my wife calls them The Mercedes Ladies.

Next time you're there, though, notice one other thing. They all have small mouths, and you know what they say... :D

What I do notice in BHM, as I wander around the Summit, are all the thin middle aged blondes with with their noses in the air and a pinched look on their faces as if they perpetually smell something bad. I'd rather dine with the chubbies in Oxford.

Now THAT's funny! The ones that migrated down here all live in Fairhope...my wife calls them The Mercedes Ladies.

Next time you're there, though, notice one other thing. They all have small mouths, and you know what they say... :D

My friend's family down on Ono Island call them the blue plates.

Now somewhere earlier someone suggested Bucca de Pepa as a place to get a good Italian meal from a chain. Bucca is good if you go with a group of 4 or more. It isn't really a good place to go if you are alone or with one other. The meals are just too big, and if I ate one whole "meal" there on a regular basis I would definately be a customer of size.

I don't have a problem with the chain restraunts or as I call them institutionalized slow food. The advantage they have is that I usually know what I am getting when I order the meal. It is the familiarity that makes them work. However, for a chain to work it is necessary to reduce the meals to the lowest common denominator. Thus you trade "authenticity" for consistency. Sure you can usually find a better local restraunt in almost any place, but sometimes when you are on the road in a strange place you don't want to risk it.

Olive Garden is insult to Italian cuisine. Do what you can to get rid of them.

Hear Hear!

- HF

To take this one step further.. Most, if not all, chain Italian places as well as the local pizzarias do not server real Italian food. They serve a version of special holiday meals.

If Italians actually ate Lasagne, baked ziti, or Carbonara regularly, they would have the same high level of cholesterol and heart disease as Americans do.

At home we only ate those high fat & calorie laden foods on holidays - as in once or twice a year at Christmas & Easter.

Fine with me, since I eat out at a "fake" Italian restaurant as often as there are holidays. @:-)

Olive Garden is great for the soup, salad & breadsticks.

Olive Garden certainly is not what I consider to be Italian food. Of course, I'm from Utica, New York (central New York area), where there are family-owned Italian restaurants on every corner, so I know what Italian food is suppose to be. I live in a small rural city at present, and they do not have an Olive Garden, but I know many people who are dying for one to locate here. These people, of course, are the ones who go to Ponderosa for a great steak dinner. There are a few family-owned Italian restaurants; some are okay and some aren't, but nothing like what I can get in my hometown.

Last time I went (actually it was take out) to Olive Garden was this past Valentine's Day

I can make better pasta than they do, but my wife didn't want to deal with a dirty kitchen (I am a rather messy cook :o)

The salad, dressing and breadsticks are good, pasta is OK, but I ordered dessert.

BIG MISTAKE

Their desserts taste like cold lard, very tasteless, and just plain awful

Next year I am cooking and hiring Merry Maids instead ;)

Olive Garden is great for the soup, salad & breadsticks.


^ I love their salads! I often eat at OG for lunch but mainly stick with soup and salad. It is not a restaurant I would choose for dinner. Those of you in NYC also need to remember that good Italian restaurants in many areas are few and far between if they even exist. Which might be the case here.

Olive Garden is insult to Italian cuisine. Do what you can to get rid of them.

Who cares? If you don't like it, then don't go. But dont' be a food snob with the hordes who do like it, even if you don't approve.

True Chinese food bears no resemblance to what is offered here. Americans buy what Americans like, and if it ain't exactly authentic.

It's clear that the community wants it and likes it, and is willing to pay for it. That means JOBS and all of the goodies associated with it.

BIG MISTAKE

Their desserts taste like cold lard, very tasteless, and just plain awful



What did you order? Last visit, Mrs BamaVol ordered some sort of lemon cake. I snuck a bite and thought it was pretty good. I don't know that I've had anything else off their dessert menu.

What did you order? Last visit, Mrs BamaVol ordered some sort of lemon cake. I snuck a bite and thought it was pretty good. I don't know that I've had anything else off their dessert menu.
Chocolate Lasagna

Who cares? If you don't like it, then don't go. But dont' be a food snob with the hordes who do like it, even if you don't approve.Sorry, but I can give my opinion just like Mary2e, tonypct, rec, and HobokenFlyer have. No TOS rules were broken. ^

True Chinese food bears no resemblance to what is offered here.Speak for your own experience not everybody else. I don't know where you live but one can get the most authentic, and inexpensive Chinese food right in Flushing. I forgot....only "snobs" take the 7 to Flushing. :D

It's clear that the community wants it and likes it, and is willing to pay for it. That means JOBS and all of the goodies associated with it.If you read all of my posts instead of a scattered few, you would know that I'm one of several here who questions why anyone would think that a community's offering tax incentives to any business can be deemed "immoral". If the town can make more tax revenue via incentive, more power to them.

Olive Garden is great for the soup, salad & breadsticks.

Olive Garden certainly is not what I consider to be Italian food. Of course, I'm from Utica, New York (central New York area), where there are family-owned Italian restaurants on every corner, so I know what Italian food is suppose to be. I live in a small rural city at present, and they do not have an Olive Garden, but I know many people who are dying for one to locate here. These people, of course, are the ones who go to Ponderosa for a great steak dinner. There are a few family-owned Italian restaurants; some are okay and some aren't, but nothing like what I can get in my hometown.

It's got to be the water, Cookie. :D

Who cares? If you don't like it, then don't go. But dont' be a food snob with the hordes who do like it, even if you don't approve.

True Chinese food bears no resemblance to what is offered here. Americans buy what Americans like, and if it ain't exactly authentic.

It's clear that the community wants it and likes it, and is willing to pay for it. That means JOBS and all of the goodies associated with it.

rrz518, if I started a thread and stated that I just had the best BBQ I've ever eaten, right here in NYC, I think I'd get a ton of "food snobs" from the south and midwest who would jump all over me. And they would be right to do so, even if I did like the BBQ in NYC.

I love eating at Olive Garden. The soup and salad deal is the best. Service varies. Was there this past Sat and my 2nd bowl of minestrone soup had hardly anything in it for the 1st time. Experience mostly good. Best tiramisu as well. Some may not agreee but that's okay. Hope Olive Garden and your city can work something out.

Olive Garden is insult to Italian cuisine. Do what you can to get rid of them.


Well said !!! I dispise them as well.

Who cares? If you don't like it, then don't go. But dont' be a food snob with the hordes who do like it, even if you don't approve.

True Chinese food bears no resemblance to what is offered here. Americans buy what Americans like, and if it ain't exactly authentic.

It's clear that the community wants it and likes it, and is willing to pay for it. That means JOBS and all of the goodies associated with it.

Hehehe. I think it's funny all the "foodies" out there will won't mind going to a P.F.Chang's, but won't step foot in an Olive Garden. To me, it's the same...Americanized ethnic food. And I'm a genuine HKG-born-naturalized-American, so I know the difference between real Chinese/Asian and Americanized versions. But guess what? I like it all...just like millions of other average Joe Shmoes. It doesn't have to be authentic to be tasty. Trust me, the majority of P.F.Chang fans won't want to eat fish cheeks, bird's nest, chicken feet, pork feet or beef tendons...that's about as authentic as it gets (and also pretty tasty if you ask me)! :D

Hehehe. I think it's funny all the "foodies" out there will won't mind going to a P.F.Chang's, but won't step foot in an Olive Garden. To me, it's the same...Americanized ethnic food. And I'm a genuine HKG-born-naturalized-American, so I know the difference between real Chinese/Asian and Americanized versions. But guess what? I like it all...just like millions of other average Joe Shmoes. It doesn't have to be authentic to be tasty. Trust me, the majority of P.F.Chang fans won't want to eat fish cheeks, bird's nest, chicken feet, pork feet or beef tendons...that's about as authentic as it gets (and also pretty tasty if you ask me)! :DI can't speak about PF Chang's as I've never been there. I assume it's an expensive chain restaurant? Money has never been a variable in this very interesting thread.

Hehehe. I think it's funny all the "foodies" out there will won't mind going to a P.F.Chang's, but won't step foot in an Olive Garden. To me, it's the same...Americanized ethnic food. And I'm a genuine HKG-born-naturalized-American, so I know the difference between real Chinese/Asian and Americanized versions. But guess what? I like it all...just like millions of other average Joe Shmoes. It doesn't have to be authentic to be tasty. Trust me, the majority of P.F.Chang fans won't want to eat fish cheeks, bird's nest, chicken feet, pork feet or beef tendons...that's about as authentic as it gets (and also pretty tasty if you ask me)! :D

As someone who grew up eating macaroni & Grandmom's sunday gravy, I find Olive Garden a culinary wasteland. However when I have talked to friends of Chinese descent they find Pei-Wei or PF Changs an abomination and I'm sure if any of my Mexican friends went to a Chi-Chi's they would be equally unimpressed.

But for those who do not have their preferences fixed by earlier experiences with these kinds of food - especailly when they are accompanied by memories of specail times with family and friends (I have given up eating red sauces in restaurants because they always fall short of my Grandmothers) - these restaurants offer a chance for some exposure to a different cuisine and can easily become personal favorites.

One quick note on Italian restaurants - I often find the experience and food is inversely related to price (and snootiness). I can not tell you how many times I have gone to some "hot" yuppy Italian restaurant - OC is littered with them - and been disappointed. My best Italian meals have invariably been at family run restaurants - usually run by someone of Italian heritage - where a full meal could be had for less then $10/person.

One other note -

OC's rule of restaurants when traveling:

North East - Eat Italian or Jewish
West Coast - Chinese or Mexican
Northwest - Asian or Seafood
Texas - Steaks or BBQ
Southeast - BBQ

Always avoid:

North east - Mexican
South - Italian or Jewish
West Coast - Italian - particularly pizza (CPK gets a pass because it does'nt even try to be authentic)
Texas - Chinese

One other note -

OC's rule of restaurants when traveling:

North East - Eat Italian or Jewish
West Coast - Chinese or Mexican
Northwest - Asian or Seafood
Texas - Steaks, BBQ or Mexican
Southeast - BBQ

Always avoid:

North east - Mexican
South - Italian or Jewish
West Coast - Italian - particularly pizza (CPK gets a pass because it does'nt even try to be authentic)
Texas - Chinese


You forgot one in Texas, at least, far west Texas ;)

Incredibly enough there is excellent Chinese food in Juarez

If you avoid Chinese in Texas, you can be missing out. When the long railroad line was built through the wilds of west Texas from Abileneto El Paso, little towns sprang up all along the way. Lots of the laborers building that railroad were Chinese and ended up staying in those towns and starting restaurants that can be remarkably decent.

And Fried Ravioli when in the St. Louis area. ^ ^

One other note -

OC's rule of restaurants when traveling:

North East - Eat Italian or Jewish
West Coast - Chinese or Mexican
Northwest - Asian or Seafood
Texas - Steaks or BBQ
Southeast - BBQ

Always avoid:

North east - Mexican
South - Italian or Jewish
West Coast - Italian - particularly pizza (CPK gets a pass because it does'nt even try to be authentic)
Texas - Chinese

[QUOTE=Analise]Sorry, but I can give my opinion just like Mary2e, tonypct, rec, and HobokenFlyer have. No TOS rules were broken. ^

Speak for your own experience not everybody else. I don't know where you live but one can get the most authentic, and inexpensive Chinese food right in Flushing. I forgot....only "snobs" take the 7 to Flushing. :D

QUOTE]

No TOS, but you have insulted many many people who might happen to like Olive Garden, and the countless who work there or have any interest in it's success.

I have yet to see a "1000 year old egg" anywhere in Flushing.....

[moderator hat on]

Everyone, let's keep this focused (or as focused as this thread seems to be) on Olive Garden etc., and et al, and refrain from discussing individual posters? OK?

Thanks :)

cblaisd
Senior Moderator

[/hat off]

I can't speak about PF Chang's as I've never been there. I assume it's an expensive chain restaurant? Money has never been a variable in this very interesting thread.

P.F.Changs is about as expensive as Olive Garden. As I've stated previously, it's Americanized Chinese/Asian food...never mentioned money or expenses. Dishes range between $10 to $15 for most items, maybe $20 for seafood.

Have you been there? It's good.

If you are coming to the Gayla in Palm Springs, please do not say this out loud! :D

Dissed by Olive Garden? Lucky you.

I wish my area had been so fortunate. Why couldn't we have a CPK instead?

I remember one year the Arizona Repulsive (oops.. I mean Republic) newspaper had OG as it's "best italian restaurant" in one year's "Best of Phoenix" issue. Oh please! I think we know how that listing got in there.

I don't think that's a problem unique to Phoenix. It is more a problem with the lack of taste/sophistication/etc. of the voters.

Here in San Antonio, Outback typically places first as the best steakhouse in the annual Express-News readers' choice awards, ahead of Ruth's Chris and much superior non-chain steakhouses.

Which really goes to show that you should take newspaper "best of" ratings with a grain of salt.

Olive Garden has great breadsticks. The chicken alfredo pizza is not bad. But as for the other entrees, you can do just as well by microwaving your own packaged Italian food.

Olive Garden is like TGI Fridays for pasta or "Italian" food.

I don't think it's snobby to think that a chain that serves 10s of thousands of people every day all over the country makes good Italian food. They're too busy responding to focus groups and surveys to actually pay attention to what is "italian food"

That said, the last (and final) time I was at Olive Garden, the dumb-a&& waiter didn't bother to serve our salad or bread until we finished our entrees. No thanks, I'll try somewhere else next time.

I spent my last two years on the road doing my bit for 9/11. Military towns are not exactly culinary Meccas. In fact, OG was usually the best the locale had to offer. Noe, almost a year after I am starting to recover my health.

Well, the postscript to the original post is that Olive Garden announced last week that they will build in Oxford, Al. No further details were available at the time, but a location and schedule will be announced at a later date.

Whatever your opinion of Olive Garden, you will agree that the citizens will have what they want, and deserve. I project no near-term weight losses for the average Oxford-Anniston resident.

Well, good for you. ^

buon appetito!

I have yet to see a "1000 year old egg" anywhere in Flushing.....

I am certain you can find 1000 year eggs (leather/skin egg if translated literally) in all three of the Chinese/Asian neighborhoods in New York (Chinatown, Flushing and 8th Avenue in Brooklyn).

I project no near-term weight losses for the average Oxford-Anniston resident.
Maybe so for the average resident, how's your own personal weight loss project? Better than mine I hope.
I'm currently in the process of shedding pounds. Like anything worthwhile, mostly it just takes determination. But, I don't have to like it.

If you live on Long Island or in the city and think that Olive garden is good there is something very wrong with you. The one time I went there was in Arizona, and I thought that I was going to throw up!. The food is nasty!!!!!!!

For me I will never eat Italian out of Little Italy, Italy, or Long Island.

thank you very much :-)

If you live on Long Island or in the city and think that Olive garden is good there is something very wrong with you. The one time I went there was in Arizona, and I thought that I was going to throw up!. The food is nasty!!!!!!!

For me I will never eat Italian out of Little Italy, Italy, or Long Island.

thank you very much :-)
I agree with your sentiments regarding OG. But don't forget South Philly either. Great Italian food there as well. :D

Bet you can believe Waffle House didn't pass up either one of those exits. :rolleyes:

Bet you can believe Waffle House didn't pass up either one of those exits. :rolleyes:
There's some flashbacks I could have done without. :mad:

The waitress dropping ashes from her cigarette while taking my order in Columbia, SC. :barf: :gag:

If you live on Long Island or in the city and think that Olive garden is good there is something very wrong with you. The one time I went there was in Arizona, and I thought that I was going to throw up!. The food is nasty!!!!!!!

For me I will never eat Italian out of Little Italy, Italy, or Long Island.

thank you very much :-)

Couldn't agree more, deltajfk. But I would also add Arthur Avenue in the Bronx to your list of places at which to eat Italian.

Maybe so for the average resident, how's your own personal weight loss project? Better than mine I hope.

Why, thanks for asking. I dropped 38 pounds as of this morning, going from 209 to 171. The loss has dropped off after the first 6 months and I've only lost about 5 in the last 3 months. All well and good, as I have replaced most of my wardrobe and cannot afford to do that again soon. My blood pressure is back within normal limits and I feel good; better than James Brown.

I don't mean to be harsh, but if you've already got a large number of unremarkable chain restaurants, is it really worth putting in effort to beg one more to come to town?

Why not go support some of your locally owned businesses? They're almost always better.

I don't mean to be harsh, but if you've already got a large number of unremarkable chain restaurants, is it really worth putting in effort to beg one more to come to town?

Why not go support some of your locally owned businesses? They're almost always better.

That's not harsh (for OMNI). I ask the locals all the time how they can allow good local establishments to go belly-up while they line up nightly to partake of such standard fare, often waiting over an hour on a Friday or Saturday night for Logan's Roadhouse or O'Charley's. Part of it is location: the chains have the deep pockets to afford the primo spots on the busy highways while the independents are stuck with the old buildings in a deteriorating, dangerous after dark, downtown. They are also forced to charge a premium because their volume is lower. They also cannot guarantee comparable incomes to servers while they get established. And, unfortunately many here are seduced by the quantity of food as opposed to quality. Ryan's and the asian buffet equivalent restaurants will never fail for lack of business here.

I do support local independent restuarants and I'm always pleased when another opens, but they're usually out of business in under 2 years. This entire story has really been about giving the people what they want, not what I want. Oh well, if fine dining was all I cared about, I'd have left here for another place 3 years ago.

And to all the posters whose contribution here is to paint OG as the foulest curse ever perpetuated on the American public, you are either incredible snobs, liars or given to hyperbole. It is simply bland food in an italian-american style served in large quantities at reasonable prices. You jetsetters need to stop searching for the ultimate experience on a daily basis, come back to earth for a while where we peons have to occasionally plunge our toilets, wash dishes and help the kids with homework. Then you can appreciate that an occasional night out at a mediocre restaurant with friends or family can be an enjoyable event.

Couldn't agree more, deltajfk. But I would also add Arthur Avenue in the Bronx to your list of places at which to eat Italian.

Thanks, I will give it a try. :-)

Now somewhere earlier someone suggested Bucca de Pepa

If your talking about Bucca di Beppo (and maybe there are two chains with similar names, i dont' know), that certainly is a place to find the It. Am. stereotypes that the tri staters claim so desperately to have monopolied.

The strangest part about the place is that its not only the hard-to-take-after-awhile pastas with cheese and tomato sauce, but they've got marginally insulting pictures of enormous southern Italians as their main decor theme.

I would feel uncomfortable if i went to an Alabamian restaurant and found pictures of fat people with nascar hats on, Bucca di Beppo makes me feel a similar way.

The reason that we quit going to OG was the service was so bad on more than one occasion I do like their salad, soup and breadsticks the best of most others. Johnny Carinos, IMHO, is better and more enjoyable. I agree with the statements that all of these places ( OG, JC, MG, PFCh, etc.) are americanized both in taste and in quanity. BTW, do love those cheese biscuits at RL .

Another big generic crappy restaurant isn't coming to your town? Have a party. Go spend some money at a real restaurant. The only letter you should be writing should be happy that your little stretch of franchiseland is not going to be getting an OG.

I would feel uncomfortable if i went to an Alabamian restaurant and found pictures of fat people with nascar hats on, Bucca di Beppo makes me feel a similar way.


Hehehe, I just reread this and got a chuckle. No need for pictures, there's a mirror here and there on the walls.

Update: OG is almost finished and will probably open within a month or so. We have also acquired a Longhorn, although we already seem to have plenty of chain steak restaurants. There is also a Maggie Moos. I'm sure I'll stop by when the weather warms back up. The biggest victims of this retail expansion are sure to be the locally owned stores. The big winner will be the cardio floor at the regional medical center.

BamaVol,

Wow! You guys are getting seriously mainstream. We've had a bunch of franchises open up in Spanish Fort, just up the road. OG, Logan's, Fire Mountain (I hear that one is especially awful).

We don't need them to support our regional cardio center. We've got Lambert's!!! :D

PS: WTH is a Maggie Moos???

Hehehe, I just reread this and got a chuckle. No need for pictures, there's a mirror here and there on the walls.

Update: OG is almost finished and will probably open within a month or so. We have also acquired a Longhorn, although we already seem to have plenty of chain steak restaurants. There is also a Maggie Moos. I'm sure I'll stop by when the weather warms back up. The biggest victims of this retail expansion are sure to be the locally owned stores. The big winner will be the cardio floor at the regional medical center.

Here in Tulsa it is the same way. Everyone flocks to the new restaurants and leaves the locals behind, even though the authentic ones are so much better.:rolleyes: People are weird...

BamaVol,

Wow! You guys are getting seriously mainstream. We've had a bunch of franchises open up in Spanish Fort, just up the road. OG, Logan's, Fire Mountain (I hear that one is especially awful).

We don't need them to support our regional cardio center. We've got Lambert's!!! :D

PS: WTH is a Maggie Moos???

Maggie Moos is an ice cream parlor. It's funny, when I got here almost 5 years ago, the Dairy Queen had just shut down. An Edy's franchise opened in the mall and was gone in under a year. There's a Baskin Robins that was closed before I even got here. There are 2 TCBY's that have outlived them and no other frozen confection in a cup or cone option in town. Don't rednecks like ice cream?

Here in Tulsa it is the same way. Everyone flocks to the new restaurants and leaves the locals behind, even though the authentic ones are so much better.:rolleyes: People are weird...

I guess most people don't want to eat outside the box. :D

If you avoid Chinese in Texas, you can be missing out. When the long railroad line was built through the wilds of west Texas from Abileneto El Paso

A new restaurant opened, called Paco Wong's, you can tell the Chinese Mexican heritage in the name :D

And it is pretty good, a little pricey, but going to a restaurant with white linens, well dressed waiters and good service does have it's price

A new restaurant opened, called Paco Wong's, you can tell the Chinese Mexican heritage in the name :D

And it is pretty good, a little pricey, but going to a restaurant with white linens, well dressed waiters and good service does have it's price

How much did you know about it before you went? A ChinaMex name on a restaurant would concern me. I'd be expecting fast food, not white linen, since most chinese and mexican restaurants in my experience are not fancy, good food in many, but not fancy.

I'll go to Olive Garden if I have to as a last resort. For the most part the food is passable. I have had better Italian including at another but smaller chain: Bertucci's. Service is good (the one in Jersey City Newport is very good and rarely crowded) and I like the seasonal specials.

I have also had great Italian at little restaurants around the world including Astoria Queens, Simply Pasta in Manhattan, NYC and in London (one was a small hole in the wall place I can't remember... the other was this local chain which had great garlic butter spagetti... can't think of the name.)

There's also the Old Spagetti Factory... where a few years ago a number of Flyertalkers had a great opening weekend dinner in Toronto.

The service at Olive Garden would sour tomato sauce. My WORST experience was at the Oliver Garden in Times Square about ten years ago.

Went there and after being seated waited 20 minutes for service. The waiter gave no smile or greeting and just said "Ready to order?"

I placed my order which included a COke (ok, the place doesn't serve Pepsi and I was working so no alcohol.) I got a water with no ice. Waited another 20 mintues for the food which was served cold with the salad and the breadsticks which were stale.

I never got my Coke. I asked THREE Times and ended up being charged for it.

When the bill came we argued over the Coke and I refused to pay until it was taken off. The waiter said he would bring the Coke then. I said i was done and didn't want it. Fifteen minutes later it was taken off and the waiter threw the bill cover on the table and walked off. Signing the bill I rounded out the amount to an even number so the tip ended up being seven cents (yes, 7 cents.) I gave the guy something for basically showing up.

As I walked out the waiter came running after me screaming "You insult me with seven cents! I have three children and my wife is pregnant and I work hard."

I said "next time when someone orders a Coke bring a COke." He cursed me in a foreign language and called me selfish.

I wrote to Olive Garden corporate and got a free gift certificate (remember no gift cards 10 years ago.) I used it at an Olive Garden in Secaucus which was a little better than NYC.

Bertucci's is ok, I might wind up at one once a year. It's not gourmet, it's not authentic, but as food it's passable. As the Checker's TV commercial says, "Ya Gotta Eat!" (and, strictly speaking, what they serve qualifies as food so it satisfies the bare minimum requirements... ;) )

Olive Garden is the worst dining I have experienced.... About 3 years ago I went to one, terrible service and terrible decor and terrible food - a Zagat trifecta of lousy. I didn't like Olive Garden in high school (when I shouldn't even have known better!) and I won't go near one today.

Sure, I'm a food snob at times (my wife is a chef and we travel to some of the best restaurants in the world) but we do eat at chains and really actually enjoy it much of the time... Maggiano's isn't fine dining but we like it :) I rather dig the buffalo meatloaf at Ted Turner's chain... Once in awhile we might pop into an AppleRubyBenniTGI's. And I like a Bloomin' Onion as much as the next guy.

But Olive Garden? Fuggetaboutit.

Funny this post got bumped right now. Last night The Adorable Francisco wanted to try Olive Garden since they are advertising on TV non-stop. Off we went about 8:30, parking lot full, huge throng of people standing around outside. They told me it would be an hour and forty-five minutes for a table. Meanwhile there was an independent Italian place not 50 yards away across the parking lot that was nearly empty. We went there instead and had a marvelous meal.

I just don't understand people sometimes.

I can sympathize with BV. I moved seven months ago from an area just like he described but to the northwest of Atlanta (think north of Kennesaw, but south of Calhoun... Usher was just in the county court for his speeding ticket). Population is booming in the area because it's becoming an outer ex-urb of Atlanta. Fortunately, there are local Italian places there and it wasn't too bad. Unfortunately, they're mostly deserted. For some reason, natives of the area don't want to figure out what the dish is (even if described in front of them). They want to eat what they hear about in the media (especially since OG is relentless in advertising).

Maggiano's isn't fine dining but we like it :) I rather dig the buffalo meatloaf at Ted Turner's chain... Once in awhile we might pop into an AppleRubyBenniTGI's. And I like a Bloomin' Onion as much as the next guy.

I'm going to a Maggiano's for the first time next weekend for a birthday dinner, and I do hope it's better than Olive Garden! Of course they don't have ads on TV 24/7 like Olive Garden, which I consider a good sign. :)

And I like the Ted Turner chain restaurant. Amazing onion rings and mashed potatoes (oh, and bison ;)).

I'm going to a Maggiano's for the first time next weekend for a birthday dinner, and I do hope it's better than Olive Garden!
It is! :D

Okay - a little OG/Red Lobster background info.

They are owned by the same entity, Darden.

My first restaurant gig was for Red Lobster. An Olive Garden was right next door. We often shared products when one was running low. It's all the same stuff.

And just where does this food come from, you ask? Well, they share a foodservice distributor (Martin-Brauer) with the world's most favorite fast food chain, McDonald's. If that's not a sign of quality, I don't know what is!!

Okay - a little OG/Red Lobster background info.

They are owned by the same entity, Darden.

My first restaurant gig was for Red Lobster. An Olive Garden was right next door. We often shared products when one was running low. It's all the same stuff.

And just where does this food come from, you ask? Well, they share a foodservice distributor (Martin-Brauer) with the world's most favorite fast food chain, McDonald's. If that's not a sign of quality, I don't know what is!!

Are you saying McDonalds is inauthentic? :eek:

And Darden also owns Bahama Breeze, which I like, weirdly. I went to the one in Austin a couple of times and didn't know it was a chain.

They told me it would be an hour and forty-five minutes for a table. Meanwhile there was an independent Italian place not 50 yards away across the parking lot that was nearly empty.
Personally I would never wait that long at any restaurant, unless it was some kind of emergency (i.e. no other food available :eek:), but waiting 1:45h to eat at the Olive Garden (or any other chain restaurant) is just plain unbelievable, even more so considering the better alternative across the parking lot.

Personally I would never wait that long at any restaurant, unless it was some kind of emergency (i.e. no other food available :eek:), but waiting 1:45h to eat at the Olive Garden (or any other chain restaurant) is just plain unbelievable, even more so considering the better alternative across the parking lot.

This thread is a hoot. I am convinced that Olive Garden purposefully makes people wait longer to get seated than necessary. I say this because on several occasions (at various times of the day and week) they have made me wait 10-20 minutes before being seated, but when they take my party into the dining room it is practically empty and wait staff are standing about. I believe they think that by forcing the customer to wait, even for a few minutes, it helps to psychologically heighten their experience at the restaurant.

This thread is a hoot. I am convinced that Olive Garden purposefully makes people wait longer to get seated than necessary. I say this because on several occasions (at various times of the day and week) they have made me wait 10-20 minutes before being seated, but when they take my party into the dining room it is practically empty and wait staff are standing about. I believe they think that by forcing the customer to wait, even for a few minutes, it helps to psychologically heighten their experience at the restaurant.

There's another chain down here called O'Charley's, which is basically a lunch place. Our local O'C does the same thing. I can look into the dining area and see lots of empty tables and they still make us wait a few minutes. Every time it happens I send a nasty email to corporate and every time they send me a $25 cert. Lot of free lunches...that I have to wait 5 minutes for. :rolleyes:

There's another chain down here called O'Charley's, which is basically a lunch place. Our local O'C does the same thing. I can look into the dining area and see lots of empty tables and they still make us wait a few minutes. Every time it happens I send a nasty email to corporate and every time they send me a $25 cert. Lot of free lunches...that I have to wait 5 minutes for. :rolleyes:

O' Charley's is famous for doing this.

O' Charley's is famous for doing this.

I've given up on the local O'Charley's. It does a big dinner and lunch - it's at the foot of the Interstate ramp. Service is poor, food is bland. I'd try one elsewhere if choices were severely limited.

There's another chain down here called O'Charley's, which is basically a lunch place. Our local O'C does the same thing. I can look into the dining area and see lots of empty tables and they still make us wait a few minutes. Every time it happens I send a nasty email to corporate and every time they send me a $25 cert. Lot of free lunches...that I have to wait 5 minutes for. :rolleyes:

Hmm...seems like I'll have to try this at an O'Charley's near me! :D

And Darden also owns Bahama Breeze, which I like, weirdly. I went to the one in Austin a couple of times and didn't know it was a chain.
Darden also owns Seasons 52, which I adore.

What I've noticed, in Orlando, the quality of the food coming from Darden Restaurants tends to be better than what I've experienced in other cities. Maybe it has something to do with their corporate offices being located in Orlando.

As far as chain italian goes, I prefer Carabba's much more than OG

What I've noticed, in Orlando, the quality of the food coming from Darden Restaurants tends to be better than what I've experienced in other cities. Maybe it has something to do with their corporate offices being located in Orlando.

Probably. They were founded here, so they gotta keep up appearances. I wouldn't know, 'cause I'd never step foot in one.

Too often those chain restaurants are a training ground for new line cooks and have a >150% turnover rate, so you're constantly having to beat into a new cook's head what should be such elemantary concepts such as it is not okay to handle raw chicken with your bare hands just before you plate up some cooked food. That comes from years of experience in all aspects of many different chain rest's.

I don't mean to be churlish but where I come from there's a Fish and Chip shop and a Chinese takeaway and,er ...that's it.
Entertainment on a Saturday night is an all-night cigarette machine,competitive street vomiting and staring at the changing traffic lights.
On the other hand we don't suffer from chronic obesity and chafing thighs !

I don't mean to be churlish but where I come from there's a Fish and Chip shop and a Chinese takeaway and,er ...that's it.
Entertainment on a Saturday night is an all-night cigarette machine,competitive street vomiting and staring at the changing traffic lights.
On the other hand we don't suffer from chronic obesity and chafing thighs !


So, you're getting an Olive Garden soon?

So, you're getting an Olive Garden soon?

Definitely not.
The locals saw an episode of Will and Grace where they took the piss out of Olive Garden.
Even we know when something is unfashionable and we still wear wellington boots to the pub !

Olive Garden is really good. Their breadsticks are the best. They were very warm and smothered in garlic butter. Great!
At the Olive Garden we went to, we got seated straight away, and the waitress wasn't all that rude. She came over whenever we needed her, and she asked how our meal was. It was fresh, hot, and delicious.
I'd go there again.

Only people who spend as much time eating airline food as the people do here could possibly defend Olive Garden. This reminds me of a friend's girlfriend who tried to argue that the food at Acapulco's is better than the food in Mexico.

Yeah, right...

Definitely not.
The locals saw an episode of Will and Grace where they took the piss out of Olive Garden.
Even we know when something is unfashionable and we still wear wellington boots to the pub !

If there's a mat in front of the pub to wipe the sh*t off your wellies, you're light years ahead of us. :D Southerners (US) are accustomed to being mocked in the mass media, and we wear it as a badge of honor. If anything we did became generally fashionable, we'd find a way to make it less so.

Couldn't agree more! Just because OG is the only Italian restaurant in many places, doesn't make it good.
Agreed. OG is only average at it's best. At least from my experience.

This thread is so entertaining - I just wasted the first 1/2 hour of work reading through it.
I'm so glad I live in NYC where I can eat cheap Afghan like I did last night, expensive Italian like I will tonight, and pick something else for tomorrow (cheap or expensive, Italian, French, or whatever).

I also love the "snooty NY" thing that gets thrown around - here and in other forums. If people think NY is a snooty place - good. Hopefully that image keeps people away - the City is too crowded anyway.

Without threads like this I would be clueless about Olive Garden and other American chains.

And references like this quote from Lisa Simpson (to Homer) would make no sense:

"And you take me places you hate, like museums, plays and The Olive Garden."

:D

Hmm...do you recall which episode that quote came from? :) I watch the animated series routinely and can't remember hearing that quote.

Hmm...do you recall which episode that quote came from? :) I watch the animated series routinely and can't remember hearing that quote.

I think it was the one where Homer is sent to Rock Camp as a treat by the family. It was on British TV (Channel 4) recently.

I see. Thanks!

Entertainment on a Saturday night is an all-night cigarette machine,competitive street vomiting and staring at the changing traffic lights.
Wow.. that's quite possibly the funniest thing I've ever read.

Down the road from me in Delaware... we have... in a row on a single pad, TGI Fridays, Lone Star, Olive Garden and "The Lob" (i'll get to the lob in a second).

I drove down there thurs night to head towards downtown Wilmington and they were PACKED. Like 7pm and the parking lot was jammed.

Further down is the Romano's Macaroni Grille and Chilis, Applebee's, Bennigan's ... I grew up in CA and Macaroni grilles are everywhere. I never went, once. What am I missing?

FWIW, there are a lot of local diners, bbq and pizza/steak joints around there as well.

"The Lob" - ok.. my brother lives in Manhattan and anyone who spent more than 2 minutes on the island knows that Manhattan has some of the best food on earth. Quality, style etc. It's all really good.

Manhattan has one Red Lobster, in Times Square. In the center they have this gigantic rotating lobster. I can't make this up.

So my brother's birthday, every year, is spent at "The Lob" as he calls it, to coincide with "Shrimpfest" - the all you can eat, moderately priced and even more moderately tasting shrimp deal.

It's the only time his girlfriend lets him go to Red Lobster - he's done it for ~6 years now for his birthday.

I agree with your sentiments regarding OG. But don't forget South Philly either. Great Italian food there as well. :D

Some of South Phil's Italian joints can be some of the most underrated eating experiences anywhere.

Much better priced than Manhattan and just as good.