Is this one of those things that we should be making a fuss about? It seems to me that all the FT'ers are saying they are going to contact US.

Would it make a difference if we wrote or called on this one? Thanks.

Yes and Yes.

Yes and Yes.

Anybody want to post a form letter for this? I figure since US uses form letters for us, we can use one for them.

Someone at CCY did the math. The number of Silvers is huge. To have 40% of the plane "pre-board" all at once is absurd. We've all seen this problem at PHL, DCA, CLT and elsewhere. I really don't see the issue as Silvers will still get on first if their upgrade has cleared and if not they will still get on ahead of the general boarding. But, as they say at the Olympics, if it's that important - go fo the Gold! ;)

I am soooooooooooooo close for Gold but don't know if that is even worth it. I am sure that there are more surprises to come.

I really don't see the issue as Silvers will still get on first if their upgrade has cleared and if not they will still get on ahead of the general boarding.

What annoys me is that someone who chose to go with a DM credit card has the same status as a Silver...It takes nothing to "earn" status as a DM Credit Card holder, yet they lump the two together....it devalues the status I've earned as a Silver as far as I'm concerned.

What annoys me is that someone who chose to go with a DM credit card has the same status as a Silver...It takes nothing to "earn" status as a DM Credit Card holder, yet they lump the two together....it devalues the status I've earned as a Silver as far as I'm concerned.

Actually, from a certain POV, that someone with the credit card is probably worth more to the airline than Joe Silver without a credit card.

They make good money on the credit card deal.

They consistently lose money selling seats on airplanes ;)

If you read the promo material for the DM Signature Visa Card, they're basically comping the cardholder a Silver DM level membership.

Considering how much flying I'm doing this year I might upgrade my DM Visa card to Signature level in February...

For Pete's Sake, give it a rest. Heaven forbid a SP spend 2 less minutes on the aircraft or waiting in the jetway!

For those concerned, I'd definitely write USAirways. As an almost Silver, for me since we are losing preboarding (and given the other uncertainties with US) I've given up on getting Silver. I'm crediting the rest of my flights to UA this year. Won't have enough to make status, but what's the point with US anymore?

For Pete's Sake, give it a rest. Heaven forbid a SP spend 2 less minutes on the aircraft or waiting in the jetway!

I don't really care about that. I hang out in the terminal as long as I possibly can. My concern is what's next?

since we are losing preboarding

you're still boarding before non-status passengers. i bet there is still plenty of overhead space left when zone 2 boards.

you're still boarding before non-status passengers. i bet there is still plenty of overhead space left when zone 2 boards.

I wonder how this policy change will work when boarding at Paris CDG :cool:

But seriously I'm not sure how this will work since Bank of America is pushing those $90 cards like crazy and this will only be pushed more once the BOA signs go up in NY and Boston.

I think this is the only airline credit card that offers this benefit if I'm not mistaken.

I think this is the only airline credit card that offers this benefit if I'm not mistaken.

American Express Centurion ($2,500 vs $90) offers Gold! For its price it should offer diamonds!!!!

I think Zone boarding will speed things up a lot. There will not be the big rush at the gate and realistically I will get on the plane before the vast majority anyhow. Silver status is nice but you basically get it for flying a coast to coast or 2 and a trip overseas....so for 3 flights minimum and about $1500 in fares you get "elite status". Don't get me wrong - I love it, but I understand the airline is not necessarily going to give me the world. I'm interested to see if the boarding goes faster with this new system & the on time performance therefore improved...if so, then great!

I am soooooooooooooo close for Gold but don't know if that is even worth it. I am sure that there are more surprises to come.

After a MR to SFO this weekend, I'll be in Gold, so it won't affect me past this weekend (until 2006 or the rules change again). I'll sit this one out too and wait for the next change to come along.

Someone at CCY did the math. The number of Silvers is huge. To have 40% of the plane "pre-board" all at once is absurd. We've all seen this problem at PHL, DCA, CLT and elsewhere. I really don't see the issue as Silvers will still get on first if their upgrade has cleared and if not they will still get on ahead of the general boarding. But, as they say at the Olympics, if it's that important - go fo the Gold! ;)

The issue is the slippery slope theory. It's just a different way to knock back on some loyal flyers. But unlike two years ago when they tried to do it to all of us all at once, they're doing it now one segment at a time. When they safely get away with this, they'll find other ways to reduce benefits for others. Don't be surprised if they next reduce the Gold Preferred mileage bonus to 50% instead of 100%, and Silver to 25%. The Crystal City Creeps are starting another round of looking at loyal flyers as the enemy.

And no one at CCY is doing the math. If they were, don't you think they would have thought twice about allowing the pre-board privilege to a card-holder? If there's issues with 40% of folks pre-boarding, US did it to themselves.

The way I see it, all Silvers should pay the annual fee for the card, put their loyalty with another airline, and then when they're forced to fly US, at least they'll board in group 2. May I also suggest that they put their carry-on in the overhead lengthwise (i.e., the wrong way) as protest to the CCY marketing clowns.

Time to stick a fork in their .... They deserve it.

It's about time that US implimented such sensible boarding rules. The chaos that ensues many times during "preboarding" is uncalled for. Hopefully the GA's will enforce this rule.

The chaos that ensues many times during "preboarding" is uncalled for.

The chaos is not caused by Silvers. The chaos, when it exists at all, is caused by non-frequent flyers, who don't know how to board quickly.

I don't get it. If you're silver you fly US what? Once a month at best? And being not quite as preferred as Chairman's but still far more preferred than Ma & Pa Neverfly is somehow a slap in the face? Is it a slap in the face when a Gold Preferred has a better shot at an upgrade too?

Granted the wording should have been gentler -- I'd have used enough weasel words that you'd have never known it was happening ;) They really shouldn't have promised specific groups to anyone. They should have just left it as being generally prioritized based on status. Then we could spend a couple of years trying to figure out the secret rules.

As a silver myself, I say give it a rest. My main concern is boarding while there is still enough space in the overheads, not with being the first to surprise the FAs with the news that boarding has started. Zone 2 should be plenty early for goal 1.

SEVERAL THINGS . . . .

I am disgusted with this news not because of the fact that silvers board after the other Preferreds, but because they are degrading silver status to the level of a credit card holder! We're worth what a measly credit card is! First free status for joining the club, now this!! It's just a mark of disgrace to have to board as part of "zone 2." I'm sure bin space will still be available, but my grife is that my loyalty has been degraded to that of a credit card holder.

And Secondly: I am tired of posters saying that Silver status is SO easy to achieve. Fly a few transcons, here and there. Maybe a transatlantic or two, and you got it. Maybe for some. But there are a few of us that qualified for 2004 status in the 2003 calendar year by flying SEGMENTS. Shuttle fares, at the very lowest, priced at $280+, 12+ times last year. Looking at US3's as if they ALL got their status as a reward from a transcon or two is ignorant, and to those of us who didn't qualify this way, is just not fair.

SEVERAL THINGS . . . .
And Secondly: I am tired of posters saying that Silver status is SO easy to achieve. Fly a few transcons, here and there. Maybe a transatlantic or two, and you got it. Maybe for some. But there are a few of us that qualified for 2004 status in the 2003 calendar year by flying SEGMENTS. Shuttle fares, at the very lowest, priced at $280+, 12+ times last year. Looking at US3's as if they ALL got their status as a reward from a transcon or two is ignorant, and to those of us who didn't qualify this way, is just not fair.

Agreed-
To those of us that frequent US for East Coast service it does require several more segments (and $) to achieve Silver. What I am most concerned about is how this extra "semi-elite" step in the boarding process will be treated. I worry that GAs might rush through this extra step and that it could just create more confusion at the podium.

I'm a little surprised at the Golds and CPs that so readily say this is no big deal. I guess that's just an easy attitude when something does not affect one directly. Some years I'm Gold, some others Silver. I would care about this issue even if I happened to be Gold this year, as I would know that it would affect me one way or another.

Agreed-
I'm a little surprised at the Golds and CPs that so readily say this is no big deal. I guess that's just an easy attitude when something does not affect one directly. Some years I'm Gold, some others Silver. I would care about this issue even if I happened to be Gold this year, as I would know that it would affect me one way or another.

I'm a Gold who does care about it and will let US know directly what I think. And I agree with you that it's surprising that there doesn't seem to be much rallying from other US2s and US1s. I haven't forgotten that it was the "mass quantities" of US3s who also rallied to save the whole DM program when it was in danger of being watered down for everyone. And most of the perks that would have been lost would have been devastating most to CP and GP.

There is no reason why US1s and 2s should not be rallying now to put a stop to this. CP and GP get the upgrades these days...and not much for the SPs. I have no problem doing what I can to help keep the few perks that SPs still have. US is going to go gunning for the GPs next and I hope the SPs will stand tight with me then. But that's only going to happen if we ALL stick together.

There's a very good reason why Golds and CPs aren't rallying to keep Silvers in the crowd.

The crowds at the gate are out of control.

It makes sense to re-prioritize the the boarding groups.

Like it or not Silvers are a lower priority than Golds.

If they were taking away pre-boarding I'd be all over them on your behalf. After all, I too may be Silver again some day. But they aren't -- they're making a reasonable and long overdue change.

Some airlines board exit rows prior to F -- does that upset me? No. It makes sense (they do it so that they can give the safety briefing and adjust seating if need be.)

Someone at CCY did the math. The number of Silvers is huge. To have 40% of the plane "pre-board" all at once is absurd.

Maybe they should make silver harder to get.

No, if you board at a hub/focus city, most travelers have some status and therefore crowd the gate excessively. Try a PIT/PHL/CLT flight.....80% of the cabin has status.

Non Frequent Flyers ususally sit and wait for their row to be called.

The chaos is not caused by Silvers. The chaos, when it exists at all, is caused by non-frequent flyers, who don't know how to board quickly.

I earned Silver the hard way this year. Last year I was gold. I don't have the money or the time for transatlantic flights to earn Silver the easy way.

I am more concerned about what happens next. I guess when something happens to the Gold and CP members then you will look to the SP for support.

But then again instead of sticking with US us lowly silvers should move to another airline. I have been here for US through thick and thin. I don't like the elitist attitude I am starting to see here.

So some people are saying no big deal, and maybe it isn't?

The 40% of people on the plane (quoted in an earlier thread) still are choosing to fly USAir and paying for the privilege.

As the benefits fly away, as they may do, why should those 40% of people choose to fly USAir? I go between Silver and Gold each year, choosing to fly USAir because of the status potential and the benefits that come with it.

Many of the trips that I take could easily be taken on different, perhaps better, airlines, but I take close to 100% of my flights on USAir.

Take away the benefits of the preferred flier and those fliers may go elsewhere, plus I suspect many people have the credit card anyhow and will get the few benefits that way.

I don't doubt that many of the flights that people on this board take are full of preferred fliers, business people flying business routes at peak periods.

Most of my flights don't fall into this category --
Is there still a huge rush at the gate? Yes.
Are all the people trying to get on the plane preferreds? No (I always sneak a peek at boarding passes of people around me...sad, but true)
Do the gate agents do anything? Rarely.

I am not saying that they necessarily should, it is probably easier to let a passenger on than make them block the entrance to the plane, but will this change make anything better? Not likely. Will it make people consider flying on other airlines...perhaps.

Just have to add my $.02. This credit card has really caused a lot of headaches. Maybe not for US (although hopefully they heard a lot of grief when they changed their mind about giving 15K preferred instead of 10K for the $25K spending). I am a DM Sig Visa card holder and I was shocked when they offered priority boarding and access to elite check-in counters. When I was a US3 I thought the best "perks" were the shorter elite check-in line, the elite security line in PHL and the ability to board early and get overhead space. The upgrades if they happened were an extra bonus. I can find some agreement with many of the posters about this topic. I do believe it is a slap in the face for US3's to be lumped together with credit card holders. Even with 10K preferred from just using the card it really doesn't take too much flying to make Silver. I think US went too far in offering the extras to Sig Visa holders. It think the card is a good value just for the $99 companion cert, the single use club pass, and the extra miles. Maybe there are too many elites in hub cities (as a PHL flyer I certainly see it). I also really like the idea of zone boarding. Perhaps the system needs to be refined. Maybe US2's and US3's should be zone 2, or maybe credit card members need to become zone 3 and general boarding zone 4.... I don't have all the answers. Or maybe US should drop some of the perks for the Visa like early boarding..... Just food for thought.

While we are on the topic of the Sig Visa -- what was the answer about the 15K preferred at RoachFest? I have yet to receive a satisfactory answer from US or BOA.

SEVERAL THINGS . . . .

Shuttle fares, at the very lowest, priced at $280+, 12+ times last year.

Actually, the lowest Shuttle fares are about $140 RT including taxes.

IMHO the SW Cattle Car mentality has swept the entire industry, not just US.

I've noticed that once a gate agent even hints at calling the flight, the crowd forms at the door. As a SP (until the weekend comes and goes, then GP!), it seems that I can walk ahead of this huddling mass and step on the plane before them while they stand there and wait like lemmings waiting to jump.

Well, I'm a CP with a credit card so I should board ahead of everyone!!
And when my kids were smaller I would be a CP with a credit card, and children under 2 so theoretically I should board ahead of the crew.

US 3's--lighten up, there will still be room in the overhead!!

I am a DM Sig Visa card holder and I was shocked when they offered priority boarding and access to elite check-in counters. When I was a US3 I thought the best "perks" were the shorter elite check-in line, the elite security line in PHL and the ability to board early and get overhead space. The upgrades if they happened were an extra bonus.

While we are on the topic of the Sig Visa -- what was the answer about the 15K preferred at RoachFest? I have yet to receive a satisfactory answer from US or BOA.

I agree with you, dukeman... I always kept at least US3/SP just for the use of elite checkin and early boarding. Upgrades were nice if/when I got lucky (which seemed to be fairly regular). Now it seems the only difference between US3 and the SIG status is the upgrades. My wife is a card holder with my SIG account... I'm going to see if I can talk her into trying to "use" it to preboard and/or checkin when she's travelling without me next week and see what happens (then again, she's the type who won't do it because it might be the wrong thing to do).

On the 15K... the ruling I got was that if you spent the $25K between the time of the offer and the sending of the "we screwed up" notice, they did credit the miles if you asked. I pushed the issue and got the extra 5K preferred... I wouldn't be doing a MR this weekend to make Gold without that credit. ;) Hey, there's a slogan... "The BOA US Signature card... don't make a MR without it." :p Only thing was it took close to 2 months from the time they told me I could get it until those miles posted (in fact it was the day before RF).

This CP happens to think that it would be just fine if CPs were culled from the herd by adding seperate zones for wheelchairs, F, CP & GP.

I don't think that it's "elitist" or a slippery slope. I think that it's sensible.

I also think that it would be very sensible to let the computers shuffle things around to suit the need -- Thursday evening in a hub is very different from Wednesday morning at MCO.

As to the 40% number being kicked around -- it started with geo1005 saying:

Someone at CCY did the math. The number of Silvers is huge. To have 40% of the plane "pre-board" all at once is absurd.

I'd hate to be accused of putting words in anyone's mouth but I think that means 1) 40% is an example -- not a real number and 2) 40% is all of the preferreds boarding a particular flight -- not just the silvers nor that silvers are 40% of US preferred membership.

Change is hard and they certainly sowed the seeds of distrust on Black Tuesday but as changes go I think this is a good thing.

Oh yeah...

I do think that it smacks of elitism to be sneering at "mere credit card" holders.

I agree with you, dukeman... I always kept at least US3/SP just for the use of elite checkin and early boarding. Upgrades were nice if/when I got lucky (which seemed to be fairly regular). Now it seems the only difference between US3 and the SIG status is the upgrades. My wife is a card holder with my SIG account... I'm going to see if I can talk her into trying to "use" it to preboard and/or checkin when she's travelling without me next week and see what happens (then again, she's the type who won't do it because it might be the wrong thing to do).

On the 15K... the ruling I got was that if you spent the $25K between the time of the offer and the sending of the "we screwed up" notice, they did credit the miles if you asked. I pushed the issue and got the extra 5K preferred... I wouldn't be doing a MR this weekend to make Gold without that credit. ;) Hey, there's a slogan... "The BOA US Signature card... don't make a MR without it." :p Only thing was it took close to 2 months from the time they told me I could get it until those miles posted (in fact it was the day before RF).

jimcfus,
My wife won't use the card either for boarding (and I don't blame her). I am thinking about a 2nd Visa in her name to get her the 10K preferred if she doesn't make US3 this year. As for the timing of the $25K -- we hit too late -- Mrs. Dukeman didn't spend enought (just kidding). Actually, we've been using AMEX whenever possible just for the flexibility of the miles. I guess learning from this I should have used the US Visa to $25K early in the year and then stopped using it. I'll probably do it in 2005 and then in June US will offer a bonus for use in the 2nd half of the year. We just can't win with these folks. But I do hope that someone in CCY realizes that there are some unhappy people as a result of all the "perks" they offer credit card holders. There are no other cards that offer these benefits. No one else even offers EQMs....They were already differentiating themselves. Marketing went too far.

Tom's correct - the 40% figure I tossed out was not based on any fact other than that we've all experienced the rush to the door of several dozen Preferreds at once.

My wife and I are Silvers transitioning to gold this year, and given this new zoning change, I'm glad that we "go for the gold" as another poster says.

I basically agree with Tom and other posters about the differentiation scheme chosen by US. I recall a February PHL-PBI flight this year in which at least 4/5ths of the folks have status ( and most had to be SP ). You can imagine how muddled the boarding process was. So I'll accept that US implements this plan in an effort to assure on-time departures and improved service for all pax. I guess that we'll each have to accept this when we fly US.

From a practical viewpoint, I share the concern of pinhole who worries about how the GAs will handle the new boarding process. So long as they are mindful of the needs and concerns of all 3 levels of preferreds and ensure that they allow proper coordination of queuing for the SPs, then I think that most folks will get boarded quickly and still find overheads ( which is admittedly a big headache on some flights and one reason to pursue preferred status ).

Until this zone boarding scheme appears, I was indifferent to the VISA card boarding perk. I accept it as a reality because as others point out, the VISA card is a revenue stream to US, and $$ are what US needs to keep flying as a major that can continue to offer perks and status to all of its loyal flyers.

But I do feel that given the new zone rules, that US should first differentiate pax by status and then factor in the VISA pax. I sympathize with those SP folks who feel let down and who have worked hard to become SP. It's important that US be clear about where it stands in regard to status versus credit card pax. Perhaps the best solution would be to allow the VISA folks to queue at the preferred check-in counter, but to queue SPs ahead of these folks at the gate. Hopefully US might examine ideas like this as the new process goes live and they work the kinks out it.

My greatest concern is that given the present economic and market problems confronting US and all of the majors, US might one day be compelled to re-evaluate the DM program and devalue portions of it. I myself can put up with zone boarding, but I'm not so sure that I would sit back and watch US tinker with the SP 50% FF mile bonus and GP's 100% bump. THIS and UGs are the key aspects of DM and status that I believe we preferreds should all be keeping our eyes on very closely.

In the meantime, if the US FT board here can come up with some sort of consensus about zone boarding it would be nice for all of us who are preferreds to contact US and weigh in with this consensus.

Barry

There is a simple solution: Death to all Signature card holders! :D

(Unless they also have REAL Preferred status) ;)

I predict that Zone boarding will be implemented smoothly - your BP will say Zone 1, Zone 2 or Zone 3, and it will be obvious to all whether it's your turn or not. In my opinion this will make the GA's job easier and not more difficult.

Am I correct in assuming that US Silvers will no longer get Group 1 boarding on United flights? It's been awhile (I'm really not flying on any airline much this year) but when I flew UA last year I generally could count on an E+ seat and boarding in Group 1.

If US Silvers still get the nice treatment on UA, I think I know of a way to deal with this development... ;)

I am shocked that other GPs and CPs are so non-chalantly throwing away the case that the Silver Preferreds have here. Will we be so callous when US comes after the golds?

US has already gone after the E bucket. I am on ANOTHER F7 P7 A7 E0 flight. :mad:

Now US is going after the silvers. What's ironic is that UA will give higher boarding priority to Silvers than US will. :rolleyes: Silvers should fly UA and stick US with the mileage liability. You guys are probably spending more time in US Y Class :td: than you have before) . At lease US Silvers can get E+ seating on UA.

Neo, we've already identified a drift between the have and have-nots (in terms of Roachfest information) in other threads. Now we'll have the like-Silver-being-later vs the this-sucks-for-Silver crowd. Boy, USAirways is real good at using divide and conquer with us!

I predict that Zone boarding will be implemented smoothly - your BP will say Zone 1, Zone 2 or Zone 3, and it will be obvious to all whether it's your turn or not. In my opinion this will make the GA's job easier and not more difficult.

Am I correct in assuming that US Silvers will no longer get Group 1 boarding on United flights? It's been awhile (I'm really not flying on any airline much this year) but when I flew UA last year I generally could count on an E+ seat and boarding in Group 1.

If US Silvers still get the nice treatment on UA, I think I know of a way to deal with this development... ;)

I am Silver and flew United in May 04 and had a E+ seat. I was lumped into Group 2. It worked very smoothly and there was plenty of overhead space. I didn't mind it at all and therefore not worried about this new procedure.

However, I am concerned that I am being lumped into a zone with cc holders. I earned my status d*mn it (contrary to what some cps may think, it can be tough) and therefore should not be lumped in with someone paying $90. I have paid far more in tickets (like the $650 ticket I just booked to YYZ!) and deserve a little more respect. I'm not being elitist but I don't want to be devalued.

CC users earn their status too. They do it the old fashioned way -- by paying for it. There's nothing wrong with that. IMHO the CC people are, essentially, comped silvers. There's nothing wrong with that either.

As for "going after" the golds next (or the CPs for that matter) I'll say it again:

Fine. Good idea. I encourage it. Pick break points that make the process manageable and then enforce them. Turn back people who are out of turn. Don't just have them step aside clogging access either -- have them move far enough out of the way to be useful.

Rather than pick static groupings and reinforce this aura of entitlement to a particular boarding group do it dynamically. If there are 6 preferreds of all stripes on a flight then board them all together. If there are 60 then board them F, CP, GP, SP.

I'm really, really tired of politely holding back on the fringes of the crush, F boarding pass in hand while 30 or so persons of who think they're entitled to be first in line ignore the announcements about "extra assistance" blocking access for wheelchairs and canes and then further blocking the way when F is called (and it is often called exclusive of CP, GP, SP etc.) It's just ridiculous to finally get to the gate when the agent is now calling for rows 10 and higher.

I was only slightly kidding about using a cattle prod earlier in the thread.

Putting a big fat number on the BP should help. It seems to work for other airlines using such a system that I've flown.

Elitist my butt. The elitists are showing their true colors every time they insist that CC holders should be a sub-class. I've been a silver and there's a pretty good chance that I'll be one again. I am a silver on other airlines. Tiered boarding groups are a good idea and as "takeaways" go it's minor. Way back when when I first became aware of being silver I expected that that was how it would work.

This change doesn't even begin to compare to the degradation of onboard service or any of a thousand other injuries that we would all be better off spending our energies on.

For those of you who are so insistent that this must not be allowed to stand -- what is your alternative solution to the gate crush problem? What constructive suggestions do you have to offer for streamlining the boarding process?

I think that the solution is clear -- MORE ZONES.

Zone 1: First and CP
Zone 2: GP, SP, All UA Elites, *G
Zone 3: Visa Cardholders, Full Fare Pax
Zone 4: Remaining pax

This does a number of things. First, it gives an additional benefit to CP flyers who have certainly earned their status, and it distinguishes them from the *A elites. Next, it puts the remaining elites in one bucket, INCLUDING SP people like me who despite what you may think have spent many hours with my ... in an airline seat. Finally, it rewards customers who have bought the full fare tickets while still giving the credit card holders a form of pre-boarding.

To me as a silver, the practical effect isn't much. A lot of the time the CP's and Gold's are in first, and board early anyway, or I'm in first and I board early. Usually the "preferred" boarding consists of silvers anyway, or the unlucky gold. Haven't noticed the dividend mile card thing. Also, I take a bunch of shuttles and everybody usually boards there by row, not status. For transcons, I often choose United because of no connections, free movies and food, and E+ with seat blocking versus sweating out the silver upgrade.

But what scares me is that they simply want to speed up boarding time at any cost. In that case, it would make more sense to board last row windows first, then middle's, then aisles, and move forward. First class would board last, and all elites would no longer have boarding priority. Before you think that is funny, my last flight on Malaysian boarded similar to this, with first class last.

It would decrease boarding time, therefore making flights more efficient. It would be zero-dollar way to increase efficiency (although how much is debatable). But its a real possibility, so all elites should really worry about this new change for Silvers. And truly, that Dividend Miles card is looking more and more like a Silver alternative.

I generally like the group idea, if it does nothing other than shorten the pre-board announcement (I keep waiting for them to add left-handed to the list). I'd instead rather see it as:

Group 0: Needs Assistance, very small children
Group 1: FC & Exit Rows (a portion of your elites and anyone who paid F)
Group 2: All elites from US/UA/*A
Group 3: Visa Sig card & "high" Y rows
Group 4: Middle Y rows
Group 5: Front Y rows

That seems like it would keep everyone happy and expedite the process overall. Thoughts? (If it's a major issue they could split Group 3 into two, but I don't see there being that many Visa holders that aren't also CP/GP/SP.)

...it would make more sense to board last row windows first, then middle's, then aisles, and move forward.

This does not work. You end up with a family of four who fly very infrequently and they end up jamming up the process by scratching their heads wondering why Mr. Jones in a window (a zone 3) boards before Mrs. Jones in the middle seat (zone 4) who boards before the little baby Joneses (zone 5?) who are seated in the aisle.

This is all really silly IMHO - they have obviously done the math at CCY (I am giving them credit here) and are giving zone 1 to the right crowd. Zone 2 still gives the same availability as far as overhead space in the coach bins is concerned, etc. What the hell is the big deal? This is NOT a dilution of benefits, it's an attempt to speed up boarding and get the damn flight out on time. If you are Silver and your upgrade clears you are a zone-1 anyway. If not, then numerically they've sped up the process by putting the FC and US 1 + 2's on first followed by the US3's and the yippy-skippy Signature card holders.


I've seen a LOT of flights where the Preferreds made up over half of the flight. But I've never seen a flight were the Signature card hloders mobbed the gate the way the Preferreds (mostly silvers) will slam a gate on a friday from PIT to DCA....

Depending on the max credit allowed on the dm sig card and depending on how much B of A pays for miles from us one could argue that us could possible make more money off a high spending card holder per year that off even a GP that travels on lower fares...
-howie

Group 0: Needs Assistance, very small children
Group 1: FC & Exit Rows (a portion of your elites and anyone who paid F)
Group 2: All elites from US/UA/*A
Group 3: Visa Sig card & "high" Y rows
Group 4: Middle Y rows
Group 5: Front Y rows



This seems very fair.

Rather than pick static groupings and reinforce this aura of entitlement to a particular boarding group do it dynamically. If there are 6 preferreds of all stripes on a flight then board them all together. If there are 60 then board them F, CP, GP, SP.

This seems like a sound plan, also.

Frankly, it won't make much difference to me personally, since I'm usually the last one to board anyway. When I'm with Mr. Macska (gold), he & the bags get on first, while I prefer to wait until the last minute. When I'm alone, I'm salivating by the GA desk hoping my upgrade as a lowly silver goes through. My concern is with what's next.

Zone 1: pilots
Zone 2: air marshalls
Zone 3: off-duty air marshalls
Zone 4: unaccompanied infants under 6 months
Zone 5: individuals requiring a wheelchair
Zone 6: CP & F
Zone 7: individuals requiring a wheelchair who will make a miraculous recovery en route (seems to happen all the time on WN)
Zone 8: GPs who have Signature Visa Cards

etc.

I'm holding out for:

Mr. Bascom, your seat is ready. Please proceed through the doorway marked C17.

You forgot to include somewhere in a high zone:

Zone 1: Deadheading US pilots and FA's commuting back to their base.

You can't fly back to PIT without a bunch of these people heading home. Soon they'll need special flights to haul their employees back to base!


Zone 1: pilots
Zone 2: air marshalls
Zone 3: off-duty air marshalls
Zone 4: unaccompanied infants under 6 months
Zone 5: individuals requiring a wheelchair
Zone 6: CP & F
Zone 7: individuals requiring a wheelchair who will make a miraculous recovery en route (seems to happen all the time on WN)
Zone 8: GPs who have Signature Visa Cards

etc.
:D :D :D

Mr. Bascom, your seat is ready. Please proceed through the doorway marked C17.

:D

I'm holding out for:

Mr. Bascom, your seat is ready. Please proceed through the doorway marked C17.

But, Mr. Bascom, please take seat 21A, since due to a bug in the upgrade program, we sold your FC seat which you did have, but then lost due to the bug, to a Sig cardholder. :p

Flight today from PHL-CLT operated same as before. Group numbers were on the BP, but the agent just started the spiel about people who need assistance and the everyone stood up and started to board.
CLT-CHA actually mentioned they were using group numbers and called groups 1&2 at the same time. So no need for silvers to worry. Then of course it was an express flight so maybe mainline will be different...

But, Mr. Bascom, please take seat 21A, since due to a bug in the upgrade program, we sold your FC seat which you did have, but then lost due to the bug, to a Sig cardholder. :p

I ashamed of you. In a case like that you should know that all the aisle and window seats would already be taken. I'd obviously be relegated to 21B or 21E...

BTW, I'm a Sig card holder so I should have immunity from this predicted bug ;)

Actually, the lowest Shuttle fares are about $140 RT including taxes.


Reread my orignal posted sentence. Then reread it again. You should see the words "last year" somewhere in there. I was referring to qualification in 2003, for program year 2004. Last year, shuttle fares, from DCA-BOS, were consistently priced at the lowest, around $280 R/T + taxes, etc. I know that now, after Flyi and the implementation of the "transformation plan," fares are much lower. DCA-BOS is $140 R/T and I've seen DCA-LGA priced at $118 R/T, which is a nice, and needed change. Charging $300 for a 300 mile shuttle flight is out of line.

I prefer alphabetically...starting with the D's of course.

But what scares me is that they simply want to speed up boarding time at any cost. In that case, it would make more sense to board last row windows first, then middle's, then aisles, and move forward. First class would board last, and all elites would no longer have boarding priority. Before you think that is funny, my last flight on Malaysian boarded similar to this, with first class last.

It should scare you. This is what Delta has done with Song, and the most desirable seats for us are in zone 6, the last to board. This presents a real challenge when we need an overhead, since there is no underseat storage for these exit row seats and many of the FAs care not a whit about helping. I actively hate waiting at a baggage carousel for luggage that I have no problem taking on a conventional flight, and Song requires this.
Delta has declared Song to be a "Medallion Free Zone," in many ways actively discouraging its Medallion flyers from using it, which will drive us over to US when the LGA-FLL service starts.

As a silver who flies US a few times a year when I am in the PHL area for business I truly do not mind boarding after Golds and CPs.

Granted, I might be a little concerned if the flight was like 40% Golds and CP and thus the overhead bins were full at this point but, in general I have no real issues with boarding after those who fly US a whole heck of a lot more than I do.

Dan

This is NOT a dilution of benefits, it's an attempt to speed up boarding and get the damn flight out on time.

Wrong.

If anyone wants to get any flight out on time then they'd call out every-single-row starting from the back (that, and not hubbing in Chicago).

By separating out (F+CP+GP) and (SP+BofA Visa) they are pandering to the (CP/GP's) who (I guess) were feeling increasingly uncomfortable at being hearded into the planes with the great unwashed (and apparently increasing number) of SP's and BofA cardholders.

And for those of you writing boarding order-lists in hardcover, remember the human-factors issue. Enforcing (and orchestrating) these boarding lists falls to them, and brings additional opportunities for conflict between them and obstinate pax who don't want to follow the list.

By the way, where exactly is this new boarding-order thing published or announced?

Why is this such a big issue? UA has used this procedure for quite some time. I welcome some sanity to the "cattle call" boarding that has been the norm.

SP's have unlimited upgrades (if available) now. This was a CP benefit ONLY prior to the change. So you have to board after CP/GP......the addition of upgrade benefits should easily offset the degradation in boarding order.

I think the idea of zone boarding is long overdue. They have been doing it at AA for a while and at UA since maybe last year. But neither do it quite like this. It was designed to speed up boarding and will do so. But something more like AA or UA would have been preferred to the way US is doing it. At AA and UA they board people needing help, then first class (and UGS in the case of United). They then board all preferreds. I think in the case of AA they board the back seats in coach with the preferreds but Im not positive about that. Then they board zones based on seating, back to front. It really does speed things up.

I think the problem is the credit card issue. It isnt like it is a real expensive card or anything. There are going to be a lot of them. And it basically does mean that if you have the card why bother with silver. I very much think that all silvers should board at the same time as other FFs or at least before card holders. That said, from a practical standpoint it doesnt matter, there will still be overhead space. But this is just another example of a slap in the face to some good customers by US.


On a not completely related note concerning the card holders, I have seen, as have others, that some of the people have no idea what the benefits of the card really are and think it means they board before anyone so they charge to the front of the line and cut in. That has probably led to some general annoyance with the concept of the card. What will be interesting is if some wank with the card decides that the new boarding doesnt satisfy what the ads for the card promised when he payed his money for the card.

As it is now - it seems like half the time 50% of the plane is in the 1st/CP/GP/SP group (plus the United premier members). Its obviously just a way to thin it out a bit.

Hell - why not go in 4 groups - FC, CP, GP, SP? That'd be a little too much, but seems like a reasonable progression. They had to draw the line somewhere and it was SP. I still don't see what the big deal is as the SPers will still have plenty of overhead room before the rest of the passengers get on. Although I know there are plenty of people who hover right in front of the gate door so they can be the first on the plane anyways....so obviously some people are overly concerned about this.

I have not yet read any of the five pages of comments on this...way too much work, stress and travel. I was DFW-PHL this morning, and we didn't board by zone. It was business as usual.

On another note, first class on this flight was only half full. I was down and back to JAX on Monday, and the same story. Six out of 12 FC seats were empty. Wasted opportunitites, methinks. :confused:

There is a simple solution: Death to all Signature card holders! :D

(Unless they also have REAL Preferred status) ;)


LOL :cool:

Zone 7: individuals requiring a wheelchair who will make a miraculous recovery en route (seems to happen all the time on WN)

etc.


The honest truth! This was really on an episode of "Airline." An old bat requested a wheelchair because she thought it would get her on and off the plane first! :p

I have noOn another note, first class on this flight was only half full. I was down and back to JAX on Monday, and the same story. Six out of 12 FC seats were empty. Wasted opportunitites, methinks. :confused:

I'm amazed at the number of Preferreds (non-Flyertalkers of course ;)) who aren't even aware of the unlimited upgrade benefit.

My mother is a US3 as well as a Gold Medallion on DL. Until I told her last month, she had no idea she could upgrade on US Airways flights. Not that it matters all that much for her since she flies mostly short hops, but I'm shocked she didn't know.

And a couple of months ago on the SAN-CLT redeye, the gate agent actually decided to come on board the plane and pull a Silver and her companion out of coach...politely lecturing them in the process about the e-upgrade process. F was only about 3/4 full even though the GAs sold a few upgrades at the gate to non-status folks.

My first flight with boarding zones today on USAirways Express, announce "I'll preboard wheelchairs and those of you who are Preferred." Everyone gets up, I don't cause I don't care anymore, and in the end he never does announce 'General Boarding'.. the whole plane at least officially preboards :)

Not too big a deal on a 70% full express flight, I suppose

Two extremes of boarding announcements.

First from a US GA in CLT last week.
"We would like to begin by preboarding those needing assistance, families with small children, our first class cabin, our chairmans preferred, Gold preferred, silver preferred, star alliance gold including United premier executive 1ks and premier executives and our visa signature card holders. After that we will board the remainder of the aircraft if there is anyone left."

Second, from a UA flight in ORD last year.
"Prior to general boarding by rows we would like to preboard those passengers in first class and our 1K, premier executive and premier mileage plus members. If you are not aware that you are currently in one of those groups it is very unlikely that you are so please stay away from the gate so that those people may board."

Two extremes of boarding announcements.

First from a US GA in CLT last week.
"We would like to begin by preboarding those needing assistance, families with small children, our first class cabin, our chairmans preferred, Gold preferred, silver preferred, star alliance gold including United premier executive 1ks and premier executives and our visa signature card holders. After that we will board the remainder of the aircraft if there is anyone left."
."

Gadget that was actually pretty funny. And yet so true. Actually had a good laugh on that one.

There is a simple solution: Death to all Signature card holders!

(Unless they also have REAL Preferred status)

I'm a Sig card holder. No other status. I fly once a year internationally.
:( :p
Should I feel bad about this?

FYI:

Zone boarding has replaced sequential row boarding on all US Airways and US Airways Express flights, with the exception of Shuttle. Zones are assigned based on your Dividend Miles tier level and/or seat number and appear on your boarding pass near your seat assignment. Zone boarding allows for faster boarding and even more reliable on-time performance. Find out more at
http://www.usairways.com/zoneboarding

I'm a Sig card holder. No other status. I fly once a year internationally.
:( :p
Should I feel bad about this?

LOLOL!!! Barbie you are a trip. Your in Envoy Class anyhow so this won't make a difference in your boarding anyhow :)

Troy

LOLOL!!! Barbie you are a trip. Your in Envoy Class anyhow so this won't make a difference in your boarding anyhow :)

Troy
I know, Troy, but this thread (and I read nearly ALL of it) is trying to take the wind out of my 'excitement' sails!

Anyway, I had to add my 2 cents. :D

I know, Troy, but this thread (and I read nearly ALL of it) is trying to take the wind out of my 'excitement' sails!



Oh Barbie, Barbie, Barbie: we in Envoy don't worry about the ills of the Silver. Come on now, dear. :D

Some of us care about SPs. As they have pointed out, they were among those who complained when BBB tried to make only high price fares count for mileage accumulation. We have to stick together in this, you remember what Ben Franklin said about hanging together......

I'm a Sig card holder. No other status. I fly once a year internationally. :( :p Should I feel bad about this?


Nope. And I'll be in Heidelburg later this year so maybe I shold buy you a drink... :D

Some of us care about SPs. As they have pointed out, they were among those who complained when BBB tried to make only high price fares count for mileage accumulation. We have to stick together in this, you remember what Ben Franklin said about hanging together......

I care, I care! It was only in humor. Sorry.

Sorry everyone, I was kidding too. I do care about the Silvers, but Im not upset at anyone. Not even that Signature card holder and his wife that cut in from of me as I was boarding at CLT last Sunday. It was hard to stay annoyed at them when I saw what a big hurry they were in to get to their coach seats ;)

Your right. We should all stick together and support the Silvers....I had a good laugh though.

I am obviously missing something.... what exactly are Silvers loosing over evryone else? They still board before regular passengers so there is NO loss of overhead space... and they still get to their coach seat before the other passengers.... if their upgrade clears they are a zone 1 anyway...


what's the issue?

I am obviously missing something.... what exactly are Silvers loosing over evryone else? They still board before regular passengers so there is NO loss of overhead space... and they still get to their coach seat before the other passengers.... if their upgrade clears they are a zone 1 anyway...


what's the issue?

The issue seems to be, who gets to be first in line. Funny, I seem to remember that issue when I was in First Grade.

I guess everyone wants to feel a bit special, hence the "Club" and its various levels. Don't loose site of your PAX humanity though. Under it all, we are all PAX. What truely seperates us is how intelligently we deal with situations, bad and good.
IMHO I think US Airways is mearly trying to solve the 'cattle call' problems of crowding the gateway and how do you prevent someone from thinking they are more 'special' than someone else? Maybe the GA's should issue little stars to put on your shirts to identify all the special people? :D
OK, lets keep this light and good natured.
Let's see if Zones work. Give it all a chance. OK? ^
And no Sig Card bashing? :p

And I'll be in Heidelburg later this year so maybe I shold buy you a drink... :D


Geo, I live in Weststadt, very near Altstadt (the lovely Old Town). Just give a Hollar and I will show you some very nice little places to have a drink. I love my "home town"! ;)

LOLOL!!! Barbie you are a trip. :)

Troy

And BTW, Troy, I am flying to Spain (Jerez) in 2 weeks! :D Also a new experience for me, sunny Spain!
We are doing the 'cheap seats" on Ryanair (12 Euro one way w/o taxes) And of COURSE I charged it to my Sig Card to get DM's! ^

Maybe one day we'll get to Barcelona?

Took flights from CAK-PIT and PIT-SFO (now) yesterday. They did the zone board in CAK, but did zones 1 & 2 together. I was the only one (currently a zone 2 person as a SP) to board. I went out on the plane, and I think it was a good couple of minutes before anyone else came out.

In PIT, it seemed to be well ordered. I didn't see the gate rush as in the past, then again, they didn't do it by zone... they just called specials, FC and preferreds, just as before.

Took flights from CAK-PIT and PIT-SFO (now) yesterday. They did the zone board in CAK, but did zones 1 & 2 together. I was the only one (currently a zone 2 person as a SP) to board. I went out on the plane, and I think it was a good couple of minutes before anyone else came out.

In PIT, it seemed to be well ordered. I didn't see the gate rush as in the past, then again, they didn't do it by zone... they just called specials, FC and preferreds, just as before.

Similar experience here on Friday. On MCO-PIT it was done as before (they were more worried about the War of the Standbys at the Gate Desk trying to get out of Orlando, as this was one of the last flights to go before Frances), and on PIT-PHL, a 737-300, they just called Zones 1 and 2 together.

I don't really care about that. I hang out in the terminal as long as I possibly can. My concern is what's next?


I'll tell you what's next. Chapter 11 and no those aren't Roman numerals as in "two" but "eleven". This has nothing to do with boarding and everything to do with a complete and total loss of any and all benefits since you can't have a frequent flier program, DM or otherwise, without an airline.

Don't get me wrong, I want to see US survive. I like their strong presence on the east coast and their Caribbean routes but I'm a realist.

I'll tell you what's next. Chapter 11 and no those aren't Roman numerals as in "two" but "eleven". This has nothing to do with boarding and everything to do with a complete and total loss of any and all benefits since you can't have a frequent flier program, DM or otherwise, without an airline.

Don't get me wrong, I want to see US survive. I like their strong presence on the east coast and their Caribbean routes but I'm a realist.

Just out of idle curiosity, what in the **** does this have to do with the new zone boarding procedure?

GAs in SFO made a good point... the programmers need to make the zone info on the BPs more prominent and easy to read, ala UAs "you don't need glasses to read it" zone indication.

They had to instruct people on the announcements exactly where to look on their BP for it (lower right hand corner).

Just out of idle curiosity, what in the **** does this have to do with the new zone boarding procedure?


LOL!

GAs in SFO made a good point... the programmers need to make the zone info on the BPs more prominent and easy to read, ala UAs "you don't need glasses to read it" zone indication.


Did someone say glasses on the US forum??

OH--those kind of glasses. Rats. :D

Did someone say glasses on the US forum??

OH--those kind of glasses. Rats. :D

Does that go with the plastic "silverware"? :p

Is this one of those things that we should be making a fuss about? It seems to me that all the FT'ers are saying they are going to contact US.

Would it make a difference if we wrote or called on this one? Thanks. :td: :td: :td: :td: Yes every one should write US Air on the new ZONE - Silver should be first. Do it today . James D

tell them . Silver should be in the first call. Do it today. James D. :td:

I still don't get this credit card thing. What's next...."now boarding..all Sam's Club members"?

The guy with the AMEX Centurion card doesn't get the credit card thing? :cool:

I still don't get this credit card thing. What's next...."now boarding..all Sam's Club members"?

You really should know better than to give these people ideas. Although now that you mention it, I do have a library card and the business card of the manager of a hostess shot bar in Rappongi, I wonder if either of those will let me preboard?

Bascom, don't be a wiseguy. All Centurion gets you is automatic Gold without flying the miles. Nobody at Amex ever said anything about getting on the plane. Now Gadget understands the meaning of "premium seating" if he's hanging in Rappongi.

FWIW, on flights to and fro SJU this weekend, both Zones 1 and 2 were called to board at the same time.

PIT-STL -- Zones 1 and 2 called to board together only one person boarded (not me, I always board last on RJs)

To/From CUN, Zone 1 boarded first, PHL-DCA, Zone 1&2. I was traveling with a signature card holder and under her name on the boarding pass has Signature instead of Dividend Miles.

To/From CUN, Zone 1 boarded first, PHL-DCA, Zone 1&2. I was traveling with a signature card holder and under her name on the boarding pass has Signature instead of Dividend Miles.

Just out of curiosity was her cardholder status already in the system or did she have to show the card and the GA manually adds the status?

Just out of curiosity was her cardholder status already in the system or did she have to show the card and the GA manually adds the status?


It was all automatic. She has never showed any agent of US Airways her card.

Another point, our records were linked but when we were flying on a RJ, she was seated in Zone 2 and I was in Zone 1, however there were no problems with her boarding with me.

Oversold 733 yesterday CLT-ORD and both zones boarded together.

I guess there are worse things than zone boarding:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=355804

:td: :td: :td: :td: Yes every one should write US Air on the new ZONE - Silver should be first. Do it today . James D

Given how many preferred members tend to heard around the gate right before boarding - I already know the answer to this but....is it that big of a deal to be forced to board in Zone 2 vs. Zone 1? I mean, it got to the point with the old system where half the plane was sometimes boarding in that first group of preferred members...they needed to break it down a bit. So you have to wait a few extra minutes to board...the overheads aren't gonna be filled up that quick (with at least 5 zones) and if you're not sitting in FC, its not like they're gonna bring you a drink or anything while everyone else boards.

Whine Whine Whine

Given how many preferred members tend to heard around the gate right before boarding - I already know the answer to this but....is it that big of a deal to be forced to board in Zone 2 vs. Zone 1? I mean, it got to the point with the old system where half the plane was sometimes boarding in that first group of preferred members...they needed to break it down a bit. So you have to wait a few extra minutes to board...the overheads aren't gonna be filled up that quick (with at least 5 zones) and if you're not sitting in FC, its not like they're gonna bring you a drink or anything while everyone else boards.

Whine Whine Whine


Agreed! In Orwellian speak Silvers are more equal than Ma and Pa "I Travel Once A Year" but not as equal as GP or CP. Besides, isn't everyone who flies US SP? With the Sig Card promotion and all the other promotions US has run I'm sure the whole plane boards in Group 2.

Let me guess, neither of you are SP. I worked hard to earn my SP status. I did it the old fashioned way by taking lots of flights.

I can understand it boards the plane quicker and it won't be that long for me to board but where does it stop?

I am sure US has other things in mind, should I help support you when it happens?

Let me guess, neither of you are SP. I worked hard to earn my SP status. I did it the old fashioned way by taking lots of flights.

I can understand it boards the plane quicker and it won't be that long for me to board but where does it stop?

I am sure US has other things in mind, should I help support you when it happens?



You're right, I'm not SP, I'm 1P with United and hence *G. There is no doubt that US has diluted SP to the point everyone has it so its almost useless. This is certainly the fault of management and their promotions (Sig Card and the Fly 3 promo in the spring). I feel for the people who really earned but the flip side is management tried everything they could to juice business in the short term and prevent the Ch 11 filing. One of the results of that attempt was an increase in SP members BUT you still get to board before the plebians.

Zones should be refined even FURTHER:

Z1: Need assistance in boarding
Z2: 1st Class Cabin and CP
Z3: Gold Preferred
Z4: Silver Preferred
Z5: Steerage

If you don't like your zone, either fly more or buy a FC ticket!