Tim O'Brien

Has anyone experienced a restaurant increasing the tip?

We eat out most nights, and quite a few lunches each week, and over many years, last week we ate at an Italian restaurant in Montclair, NJ, we'd not been to before, and had one terrible main, and one equally terrible dessert, so i tipped just 10.5%. When i was reconciling my account online, i noticed the restaurant had unilaterally doubled the tip. there was just the two of us, no minimum 20% service charge for a group size etc.

i contacted amex online, and they asked for copies of the receipts, i had kept the invoice and the amex receipt. It's clearly fraudulent, and amex has asked me exactly what credit i'm wanting, i didn't specify the variation in the amount i tipped, and the amount the restaurant charged to amex, as they will be able to clearly see that, but i feel the restaurant has really done the wrong thing, i have never ever experienced, or at least, never noticed that, over all the years i've used cards to pay for meals at restaurants.

is it unreasonable to expect amex not to pay the restaurant anything and credit my account given it was a fraudulent action. I bet if i walked out with their silverware, or refused to pay them, they'd call the authorities to correct the situation, and i expect that would include more than just returning their silverware or paying for the meal, i expect there would be some punitives to learn the lesson not to do that again. When i noticed what they did, i felt like i had been violated, robbed, how many times have i not paid enough attention to statements, and how many times have i been done in this fashion.

Doc Savage

Since you agreed to pay the 10.5% tip, I'd go ahead and pay that. But I would involve law enforcement for the fraud perpetrated so they don't do it to anyone else. I'd let the owners know in no uncertain terms what happened in case they weren't in on it. Someone should be fired here.

Tim O'Brien

the owner i believe was fronting like in a Maitre D role. i'm sure amex will be dealing with the ownership, so if in the event it was a dishonest staff member, i expect they'll investigate internally and hopefully take action. I agreed to pay that 10.5% tip and the cost of the meal, but that was before i was defrauded.

i really hadn't considered going to law enforcement, the check was only USD70 inc tax, but take your point, i'm thinking amex will punish them by not paying them for that transaction. I will stand my ground with amex, and i expect they will do the right thing, but the suggestion of engaging law enforcement may be just enough for it to be dealt with adequately.

appreciate your thoughts, it really is an issue of principle, and doing what is required to mitigate the risk of them doing it again to some unsuspecting customer, for example, an elderly person may not look at the detail so much, i know i scan my amex statements, and see i've been to this restaurant or the supermarket etc, and i expect the figures to accurate.

krazykanuck

Once I was at a restaurant and they coded the tip as $30 on a $6 check. So naturally I called them on it and when I went back to the place, the manager was like "It's been finalized, so there's nothing I can do. File a dispute with your card company." Since I used my Amex of course I disputed it. They had it back to the original approved amount within a couple days.

theddo

You want a full refund and you want to file a police report, maybe advice people online against going there, too.

Often1

The chargeback procedure is not punitive, it is simply intended as a dispute resolution mechanism. OP bought and paid for a meal and then paid for a 10.5% tip. Anything over that ought to be credited to him.

If OP believes that the remainder of the debit ought to be refunded, that is between him and the merchange vendor (restaurant).

The restaurant may well choose to simply credit the entire amount and be done with this, but that is not OP's decision.

davie355

Yes, twice in the last year. At both places I had tipped at least 18%.

In one case the extra charge was $30. Chase refunded it overnight and never asked for my receipt, although I had submitted the breakdown of meal + tip + tax in the comments section of the online dispute form.

Tim O'Brien

yes, i have found amex to be very responsive on other issues, so don't anticipate any problems in this case, this one is definitely not a coding issue.

Tim O'Brien

the restaurant is La Couronne, Montclair, NJ, whilst Montclair actually has a good reputation for restaurants, this is not one of them, we were in the area as we were dropping our teenage son at a function, and had a few hours to kill, i come from a hospitality background, and pay attention to how busy a spot is, how it's managed, and the operational staff, presentation, all observable prior to committing to ordering a meal. i picked up some wine at a store, and asked the guy about restaurants in the area, he recommended it, whilst the decor was fine, i always get nervous when an Italian restaurant is operated by Albanians, or Mexicans for that matter, nothing against those two ethnic groups, just if they're Mexicans, i'd prefer to be eating Mexican.

We aren't too difficult to please, but out of four dishes served, two were literally unpalatable. I would strongly advise people not to eat at this spot for both the lack in food quality, and because of their dishonesty.

Tim O'Brien

i'll report back the outcome, and think i'll take the earlier advice too, that is, i will raise the prospect of contacting the police over it, and leave it up to amex or the restaurant to make the call re the full refund, the evidence is indisputable that they have fraudulently altered the tip, so i feel comfortable that they would choose to refund the total amount.

Tim O'Brien

i find it unbelievable that a restaurant would do it, glad it was resolved quickly for you with Chase, maybe i shld have used my CSP for the two points for dining. i would normally tip minimum 15% for just standard average service/meal, and upwards from there to reward exceptional service and quality.

miasmal

1. I've only had to dispute a tip charge once; with Amex they resolved it quickly. Be specific - you were charged $, the proper amount is $, please credit $, receipt available upon request. Don't get into the story like what you posted above, brevity is your friend.

2. Not that it should matter, but which Amex product did you use? Perhaps a Plat/Cent holder will be taken care of more expeditiously.

3. Knowing the Montclair area, there are many places to go near the university. Next time check Yelp or Tripadvisor.

4. Post your experience on Yelp or Tripadvisor. Stick to the facts, be brief again.

5. Tell the guy at the wine store how horrible his suggestion was

Amex For Children Of Africa

What I am most confused about is why someone would base their tip amount on whether they liked the food or not. If you didn't like the food, but the service was fine, you should be tipping the full amount. Those tips go no where near the kitchen. You mentioned nothing about bad service...

Doc Savage

There's been so much tip inflation lately.... 10% used to be considered just fine for decent service...

Often1

True. But, not relevant to the issue at hand. If the food is bad, send it back and deal with it on the spot. If the service is bad, that's a tip issue. But, nothing justifies the restaurant changing the tip.