Amex (USA) refuses to honor signup bonus [Consolidated]
Sep 18, 2016, 9:21 am
#376
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: MCO, YEG
Posts: 1,181
Strangely, they seem to become much better at sifting through them all after you have paid your annual fee and completed the spend for the card and are looking for your signing bonus. Then, they seem to have a very good system for finding any cards you have ever signed up for.
Oct 6, 2016, 3:50 pm
#378
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: HPN
Programs: not anymore! I'm FREE!
Posts: 3,459
So I am trying to decide what to do. I got a mailed PRG offer for 50k points. There is no language anywhere on it stating that those who have had the card before (as I have) are not eligible. To my mind, this means that I am eligible for the 50k points, as there is nothing telling me I'm not eligible.
Do I understand correctly that some people in my situation have applied, met the minimum spend, and then been denied the points? Did any of those people complain to the CFPB about the fraud Amex perpetrated on them, or seek redress in the courts?
Do I understand correctly that some people in my situation have applied, met the minimum spend, and then been denied the points? Did any of those people complain to the CFPB about the fraud Amex perpetrated on them, or seek redress in the courts?
Oct 6, 2016, 4:07 pm
#379
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,952
I don't think you will have a problem using a postal mail offer that is addressed to you. We have many reports from people who received targeted offers without exclusions and earned the bonus.
Problems are more likely to occur when offers are "found" online or people assume that a targeted offer doesn't include the exclusion, and they do not read carefully.
Problems are more likely to occur when offers are "found" online or people assume that a targeted offer doesn't include the exclusion, and they do not read carefully.
Oct 7, 2016, 8:57 am
#380
Join Date: Sep 2008
Programs: American AAdvantage
Posts: 1,045
Facebook Ad/Sponsored Post
The other day, I saw a Amex ad on Facebook for 50k/$3k offer to upgrade to the Platinum. Although I didn't complete the upgrade process, the page did continue to mention the offer after I entered my credentials.
Has anyone had success on upgrading to the Platinum and receiving the bonus? My concern is that Amex would accept my upgrade but later decide the 50k/$3k offer wasn't really meant for me.
Has anyone had success on upgrading to the Platinum and receiving the bonus? My concern is that Amex would accept my upgrade but later decide the 50k/$3k offer wasn't really meant for me.
Oct 15, 2016, 5:56 pm
#381
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Thousand Oaks, Ca., USA
Programs: AA Lifetime Plat; Bonvoy Titanium Lifetime Elite;Hyatt Globalist; HHonors Diamond; United Silver
Posts: 8,306
Here's what I've learned about Amex' backward computer systems.
The most critical transaction to getting your threshold bonus is ONLY the transaction that brings you OVER the threshold. So, theoretically if your threshold is $5000 and your spending is as follows:
1st Purchase $4999
2nd purchase $3.00 Apple store
3rd purchase $25
If you return the 2nd purchase -- YOU WILL LOSE THE THRESHOLD BONUS! The threshold is effectively attached to the purchase that brought you over the threshold. Their system does not recognize the fact that you had a subsequent purchase of $25 to bring you back over the threshold.
In addition, you should also keep in mind that during the course of reaching your threshold spending, Amex will NOT net out returns that occur during your efforts to reach the threshold.
SO, here's another spending scenario. In this scenario let's just pretend your spending threshold is only $1,000. Let's say you have the following spending within 1 month (ie within the typical 3 month threshold time period):
1st Purchase $500
2nd Purchase $250
RETURN/CREDIT of item 1 -- $500
3rd Purchase $275
Gross purchases: $1025
NET purchases (ie net of the return): $525
In this scenario -- you actually **would** receive the threshold points based on the 3rd purchase!!! So, DO NOT RETURN THAT item or you will then LOSE your threshold points. Also, you do NOT need to continue spending more $$ on the card (ie $475) because according to Amex you've spent $1025.
It appears that this Amex computer programming is the only way they could figure out how to prevent 'scammers' -- I suppose the alternative of calculating net purchases (and ensuring that certain credits -- ie payments) did not screw up their calculation -- was too difficult.
What all of this means is that for Amex to give you your threshold points after you returned that KEY purchase that brought you over the GROSS spending threshold, they need to send the issue to their IT department to "reassign" the designation to the item that, in fact, is the new item that had you cross the threshold.
So, in the first example above, let's look at that third purchase (again, let's assume all of these happen within the three months):
1st Purchase $4999
2nd purchase $3.00 Apple store
RETURN $3.00 APPLE STORE purchase
3rd purchase $25.00
Based on the scenario above, your KEY purchase was the $3.00 apple store purchase -- because it was RETURNED, you are now SCREWED! So, what an Amex supervisor has to do is to contact their IT department to reassign the threshold from the Apple Store purchase (ie #2) to the 3rd purchase (ie the $25.00). This is a manual process that effectively triggers an audit of your purchases -- the supervisor will now look at every transaction and calculate your true (ie NET) spending to determine if and WHEN you met the spending threshold. They created this safeguard to prevent fraudulent points schemers, so they will scrutinize your account to determine if you are "worthy" of the threshold points -- FOR real this time, and not based on their screwed up IT logic. If you are entitled to the points, the IT department will attach the threshold points to the qualifying purchase within 6-8 weeks of that purchase date. So, be prepared to be patient.
The lesson for everyone is:
#1. Be mindful of your GROSS spending
#2 DO NOT RETURN the critical purchase that pushes you across your GROSS spending threshold (ie what Amex believes is your real threshold).
#3 If you do end up breaking rule#2.... be patient.... but persistent (assuming you legitimately are entitled to the threshold points)
The most critical transaction to getting your threshold bonus is ONLY the transaction that brings you OVER the threshold. So, theoretically if your threshold is $5000 and your spending is as follows:
1st Purchase $4999
2nd purchase $3.00 Apple store
3rd purchase $25
If you return the 2nd purchase -- YOU WILL LOSE THE THRESHOLD BONUS! The threshold is effectively attached to the purchase that brought you over the threshold. Their system does not recognize the fact that you had a subsequent purchase of $25 to bring you back over the threshold.
In addition, you should also keep in mind that during the course of reaching your threshold spending, Amex will NOT net out returns that occur during your efforts to reach the threshold.
SO, here's another spending scenario. In this scenario let's just pretend your spending threshold is only $1,000. Let's say you have the following spending within 1 month (ie within the typical 3 month threshold time period):
1st Purchase $500
2nd Purchase $250
RETURN/CREDIT of item 1 -- $500
3rd Purchase $275
Gross purchases: $1025
NET purchases (ie net of the return): $525
In this scenario -- you actually **would** receive the threshold points based on the 3rd purchase!!! So, DO NOT RETURN THAT item or you will then LOSE your threshold points. Also, you do NOT need to continue spending more $$ on the card (ie $475) because according to Amex you've spent $1025.
It appears that this Amex computer programming is the only way they could figure out how to prevent 'scammers' -- I suppose the alternative of calculating net purchases (and ensuring that certain credits -- ie payments) did not screw up their calculation -- was too difficult.
What all of this means is that for Amex to give you your threshold points after you returned that KEY purchase that brought you over the GROSS spending threshold, they need to send the issue to their IT department to "reassign" the designation to the item that, in fact, is the new item that had you cross the threshold.
So, in the first example above, let's look at that third purchase (again, let's assume all of these happen within the three months):
1st Purchase $4999
2nd purchase $3.00 Apple store
RETURN $3.00 APPLE STORE purchase
3rd purchase $25.00
Based on the scenario above, your KEY purchase was the $3.00 apple store purchase -- because it was RETURNED, you are now SCREWED! So, what an Amex supervisor has to do is to contact their IT department to reassign the threshold from the Apple Store purchase (ie #2) to the 3rd purchase (ie the $25.00). This is a manual process that effectively triggers an audit of your purchases -- the supervisor will now look at every transaction and calculate your true (ie NET) spending to determine if and WHEN you met the spending threshold. They created this safeguard to prevent fraudulent points schemers, so they will scrutinize your account to determine if you are "worthy" of the threshold points -- FOR real this time, and not based on their screwed up IT logic. If you are entitled to the points, the IT department will attach the threshold points to the qualifying purchase within 6-8 weeks of that purchase date. So, be prepared to be patient.
The lesson for everyone is:
#1. Be mindful of your GROSS spending
#2 DO NOT RETURN the critical purchase that pushes you across your GROSS spending threshold (ie what Amex believes is your real threshold).
#3 If you do end up breaking rule#2.... be patient.... but persistent (assuming you legitimately are entitled to the threshold points)
Mar 2, 2017, 2:47 pm
#382
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: SFO/OAK, LAX, TPE
Programs: Hilton Diamond, Hertz PC, DL Gold
Posts: 134
Here's what I've learned about Amex' backward computer systems.
The most critical transaction to getting your threshold bonus is ONLY the transaction that brings you OVER the threshold. So, theoretically if your threshold is $5000 and your spending is as follows:
1st Purchase $4999
2nd purchase $3.00 Apple store
3rd purchase $25
If you return the 2nd purchase -- YOU WILL LOSE THE THRESHOLD BONUS! The threshold is effectively attached to the purchase that brought you over the threshold. Their system does not recognize the fact that you had a subsequent purchase of $25 to bring you back over the threshold.
In addition, you should also keep in mind that during the course of reaching your threshold spending, Amex will NOT net out returns that occur during your efforts to reach the threshold.
SO, here's another spending scenario. In this scenario let's just pretend your spending threshold is only $1,000. Let's say you have the following spending within 1 month (ie within the typical 3 month threshold time period):
1st Purchase $500
2nd Purchase $250
RETURN/CREDIT of item 1 -- $500
3rd Purchase $275
Gross purchases: $1025
NET purchases (ie net of the return): $525
In this scenario -- you actually **would** receive the threshold points based on the 3rd purchase!!! So, DO NOT RETURN THAT item or you will then LOSE your threshold points. Also, you do NOT need to continue spending more $$ on the card (ie $475) because according to Amex you've spent $1025.
It appears that this Amex computer programming is the only way they could figure out how to prevent 'scammers' -- I suppose the alternative of calculating net purchases (and ensuring that certain credits -- ie payments) did not screw up their calculation -- was too difficult.
What all of this means is that for Amex to give you your threshold points after you returned that KEY purchase that brought you over the GROSS spending threshold, they need to send the issue to their IT department to "reassign" the designation to the item that, in fact, is the new item that had you cross the threshold.
So, in the first example above, let's look at that third purchase (again, let's assume all of these happen within the three months):
1st Purchase $4999
2nd purchase $3.00 Apple store
RETURN $3.00 APPLE STORE purchase
3rd purchase $25.00
Based on the scenario above, your KEY purchase was the $3.00 apple store purchase -- because it was RETURNED, you are now SCREWED! So, what an Amex supervisor has to do is to contact their IT department to reassign the threshold from the Apple Store purchase (ie #2) to the 3rd purchase (ie the $25.00). This is a manual process that effectively triggers an audit of your purchases -- the supervisor will now look at every transaction and calculate your true (ie NET) spending to determine if and WHEN you met the spending threshold. They created this safeguard to prevent fraudulent points schemers, so they will scrutinize your account to determine if you are "worthy" of the threshold points -- FOR real this time, and not based on their screwed up IT logic. If you are entitled to the points, the IT department will attach the threshold points to the qualifying purchase within 6-8 weeks of that purchase date. So, be prepared to be patient.
The lesson for everyone is:
#1. Be mindful of your GROSS spending
#2 DO NOT RETURN the critical purchase that pushes you across your GROSS spending threshold (ie what Amex believes is your real threshold).
#3 If you do end up breaking rule#2.... be patient.... but persistent (assuming you legitimately are entitled to the threshold points)
The most critical transaction to getting your threshold bonus is ONLY the transaction that brings you OVER the threshold. So, theoretically if your threshold is $5000 and your spending is as follows:
1st Purchase $4999
2nd purchase $3.00 Apple store
3rd purchase $25
If you return the 2nd purchase -- YOU WILL LOSE THE THRESHOLD BONUS! The threshold is effectively attached to the purchase that brought you over the threshold. Their system does not recognize the fact that you had a subsequent purchase of $25 to bring you back over the threshold.
In addition, you should also keep in mind that during the course of reaching your threshold spending, Amex will NOT net out returns that occur during your efforts to reach the threshold.
SO, here's another spending scenario. In this scenario let's just pretend your spending threshold is only $1,000. Let's say you have the following spending within 1 month (ie within the typical 3 month threshold time period):
1st Purchase $500
2nd Purchase $250
RETURN/CREDIT of item 1 -- $500
3rd Purchase $275
Gross purchases: $1025
NET purchases (ie net of the return): $525
In this scenario -- you actually **would** receive the threshold points based on the 3rd purchase!!! So, DO NOT RETURN THAT item or you will then LOSE your threshold points. Also, you do NOT need to continue spending more $$ on the card (ie $475) because according to Amex you've spent $1025.
It appears that this Amex computer programming is the only way they could figure out how to prevent 'scammers' -- I suppose the alternative of calculating net purchases (and ensuring that certain credits -- ie payments) did not screw up their calculation -- was too difficult.
What all of this means is that for Amex to give you your threshold points after you returned that KEY purchase that brought you over the GROSS spending threshold, they need to send the issue to their IT department to "reassign" the designation to the item that, in fact, is the new item that had you cross the threshold.
So, in the first example above, let's look at that third purchase (again, let's assume all of these happen within the three months):
1st Purchase $4999
2nd purchase $3.00 Apple store
RETURN $3.00 APPLE STORE purchase
3rd purchase $25.00
Based on the scenario above, your KEY purchase was the $3.00 apple store purchase -- because it was RETURNED, you are now SCREWED! So, what an Amex supervisor has to do is to contact their IT department to reassign the threshold from the Apple Store purchase (ie #2) to the 3rd purchase (ie the $25.00). This is a manual process that effectively triggers an audit of your purchases -- the supervisor will now look at every transaction and calculate your true (ie NET) spending to determine if and WHEN you met the spending threshold. They created this safeguard to prevent fraudulent points schemers, so they will scrutinize your account to determine if you are "worthy" of the threshold points -- FOR real this time, and not based on their screwed up IT logic. If you are entitled to the points, the IT department will attach the threshold points to the qualifying purchase within 6-8 weeks of that purchase date. So, be prepared to be patient.
The lesson for everyone is:
#1. Be mindful of your GROSS spending
#2 DO NOT RETURN the critical purchase that pushes you across your GROSS spending threshold (ie what Amex believes is your real threshold).
#3 If you do end up breaking rule#2.... be patient.... but persistent (assuming you legitimately are entitled to the threshold points)
Thankfully, the threshold charge for me is a different one.
Mar 2, 2017, 7:10 pm
#383
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Monterey, CA
Programs: UA Gold, United Presidential Card, Amex Platinum, Marriott Gold, Hilton Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 58
Yes indeed! Amex is indeed fraudulent
So I am trying to decide what to do. I got a mailed PRG offer for 50k points. There is no language anywhere on it stating that those who have had the card before (as I have) are not eligible. To my mind, this means that I am eligible for the 50k points, as there is nothing telling me I'm not eligible.
Do I understand correctly that some people in my situation have applied, met the minimum spend, and then been denied the points? Did any of those people complain to the CFPB about the fraud Amex perpetrated on them, or seek redress in the courts?
Do I understand correctly that some people in my situation have applied, met the minimum spend, and then been denied the points? Did any of those people complain to the CFPB about the fraud Amex perpetrated on them, or seek redress in the courts?
We've lacked the energy to complain to the CFPB, but just don't give Amex our business any longer.
Apr 25, 2017, 9:56 am
#384
formerly mattrendell27
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: DFW
Posts: 162
Wife was approved for Green card through incognito offer for 25k MR with $1k spend about a month ago. First statement recently closed on 4/15. On 4/20 she made a $1003 purchase and usually we find that the sign up bonus posts with the charge or sometimes the next day. This is not her first MR earning card, i.e. she has an established MR account.
It still hasn't posted. Anyone find it sometimes takes longer? Or is it possible that something went wrong with the tracking of the incognito offer? I feel like I read a couple cases of that a long time ago.
It still hasn't posted. Anyone find it sometimes takes longer? Or is it possible that something went wrong with the tracking of the incognito offer? I feel like I read a couple cases of that a long time ago.
Apr 25, 2017, 10:01 am
#385
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 698
Wife was approved for Green card through incognito offer for 25k MR with $1k spend about a month ago. First statement recently closed on 4/15. On 4/20 she made a $1003 purchase and usually we find that the sign up bonus posts with the charge or sometimes the next day. This is not her first MR earning card, i.e. she has an established MR account.
It still hasn't posted. Anyone find it sometimes takes longer? Or is it possible that something went wrong with the tracking of the incognito offer? I feel like I read a couple cases of that a long time ago.
It still hasn't posted. Anyone find it sometimes takes longer? Or is it possible that something went wrong with the tracking of the incognito offer? I feel like I read a couple cases of that a long time ago.
Apr 25, 2017, 10:10 am
#386
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,952
My hypothesis is that this inconsistency is an artifact of batch processing. If a qualifying transaction isn't picked up on the first pass the system may not look again at transactions from that date until they run a different type of sweep.
Apr 25, 2017, 10:17 am
#387
formerly mattrendell27
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: DFW
Posts: 162
True and true. There is no reliable pattern of new account bonus posting. It can happen immediately, or the points may go pending, or may post at the maximum time stated in the offer terms, or they may never post.
My hypothesis is that this inconsistency is an artifact of batch processing. If a qualifying transaction isn't picked up on the first pass the system may not look again at transactions from that date until they run a different type of sweep.
My hypothesis is that this inconsistency is an artifact of batch processing. If a qualifying transaction isn't picked up on the first pass the system may not look again at transactions from that date until they run a different type of sweep.
Jun 9, 2017, 7:07 am
#388
Join Date: Apr 2004
Programs: Emirates Gold, United Silver, HH Diamond, Marriott Titanium, Hyatt Discoverist, Delta Gold
Posts: 299
Deceptive AMEX welcome bonus practice
My wife applied and was accepted for the AMEX $550 Platinum card with the 60000 MR point bonus after a 3 month spend of $5000. She received a mailer RSVP code and POID code with without the disqualifying welcome bonus language that disqualifies the bonus with a previously held same card . She had the same Platinum AMEX card and cancelled it two years ago. Just to be sure that she would be eligible for the welcome bonus, we asked the AMEX agents to double check her eligibility. Two AMEX reps and one supervisor stated that she was eligible while two other supervisors stated that she was not eligible. The last supervisor stated that the mailer was a genetic letter that was mailed out to the masses. This was an outright lie as the letter was a targeted offer addressed to my wife personally and had specific RSVP and POID codes. She also stated that the AMEX rep stated the terms and conditions of the welcome bonus verbally during the disclosure statements that would disqualify her if she had the card previously. This was another lie as no such language was communicated to her. The supervisor then stated that she would file an internal investigation to determine her eligibility but the result of the investigation would not be known to us. She stated that if she received the welcome bonus after the spend requirements, then she was eligible and if she did not receive the bonus, then she was not eligible. What a crock! I told her to cancel the application.
Unfortunately, it appears that reps and supervisors interpret the welcome bonus language differently. How can the consumer make an informed decision to apply for a card when a flashy mailer is received promising a welcome bonus but fails to mention that previous card holders are a disqualified.? This practice is a bait and switch at worst or at least deceptive in nature at the least.
My plan is to contact AMEX one more time to see if they will honor the terms and agreements of the offer. If they fail to do so, I plan to seek out an attorney. I also plan to file a complaint with the FCPB. AMEX picked the wrong person to mess with!
Unfortunately, it appears that reps and supervisors interpret the welcome bonus language differently. How can the consumer make an informed decision to apply for a card when a flashy mailer is received promising a welcome bonus but fails to mention that previous card holders are a disqualified.? This practice is a bait and switch at worst or at least deceptive in nature at the least.
My plan is to contact AMEX one more time to see if they will honor the terms and agreements of the offer. If they fail to do so, I plan to seek out an attorney. I also plan to file a complaint with the FCPB. AMEX picked the wrong person to mess with!
Jun 9, 2017, 7:22 am
#389
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,952
If the exclusion does not appear in the written offer it does not apply. Many people receive targeted offers without the exclusion and receive another bonus. I do not understand why you are even asking, but nothing that customer service might tell you is binding. If you have a written offer that's all you need.
Most false statements are mistakes, not lies.
Most false statements are mistakes, not lies.
Jun 9, 2017, 10:12 am
#390
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Kansas City, MO
Programs: AA Gold
Posts: 3,648
This has happened to me and is why I will never have another AX card ever again. They are a very dishonorable company. I am so glad Costco dropped them which was the only reason I kept AX over the years.