Jan 7, 2019, 9:29 pm
Last edit by: JDiver
FAQ: What's a Systemwide Upgrade SWU (ex-VIP / VIPOW / "eVIP") 2017 on
Please read this wiki for important information not documented elsewhere.
NOTE: As of January 2017
"The way your upgrade request is prioritized is you'll be listed according to your elite status level followed by (the type of upgrade - SWU and Upgrade Award, aka miles + copay), the number of EQD (Elite Qualifying Dollars) earned in the (rolling) last 12 months."
Upgrades are prioritized first by the following elite status levels:
Concierge Key SM . (up to 120 hours out)
Executive Platinum (up to 100 hours out)
Platinum Pro . . . . (up to 72 hours out)
Platinum . . . . . . . (up to 48 hours out)
Gold . . . . . . . . . . (up to 24 hours out)
After status tier, upgrades are prioritized by the type of upgrade (SWU and miles + copay before 500 Mile e-upgrades /UDU; your last 12 months' Elite Qualifying Dollar spend on AA. See FAQ: Earning EQD / Elite Qualifying Dollars on AA and partner airlines (2017 on) (EQD will include the EQD offset one might earn from spend on their Barclaycard Aviator Red or Silver card, as announced elsewhere in this forum.)
Date of request has no bearing on upgrade priority other than after all other priorities have been met and there’s a highly unlikely tie.
From AA.com... "Before you get to the airport, requests for systemwide and mileage award upgrades are processed independently from 500-mile upgrade requests.
At the airport, upgrades requested will be prioritized in this order: See: https://www.aa.com/i18n/aadvantage-p...am-updates.jsp
Systemwide Upgrade FAQ:
Q. What are Systemwide Upgrades, exactly?
Electronic Systemwide Upgrades, abbreviated SWU, also previously referred to as eVIPs or VIPs, are electronic instruments earned as stated previously. SWU generally allow the owner to upgrade up to three segments, more or less in the same direction, on any flights AA flies with their own aircraft (not valid on partners or codeshares - must be marketed and operated by AA), on most paid, published fares to the next class of service. (Successful upgrades on a single SWU include EZE-MIA-JFK-LHR, NRT-LAX-DFW-LHR.)
Q. When do SWU clear?
Upgrades can clear immediately if the appropriate inventory is available (e.g., Coach to Business (and domestic First on two class aircraft) requires "C" class to be available, Business to First requires "A" class to be available). Otherwise, SWU may be waitlisted in priority of AAdvantage status, followed by last 12 months EQD spend (and within those, by fare class if they are full fare Y). SWU and EXP UDU have the same priority once the flight and associated upgrade / PALL list has passed to airport control.
Q. Can I use SWU on codeshares operated by AA?
No. (Though 001 AA ticketing is not a requirement), the flight must be marketed and operated by AA.
Q. Are any fare classes ineligible / invalid for SWU upgrades?
Some government and consolidator fares may not be upgraded; Basic Economy flights may not be upgraded. Award flights may not be upgraded with SWU. See post #683 by JonNYC:
[quote]Invalid (for SWU upgrade)
*The reason for not allowing SWU / eVIP upgrades to be used in conjunction with a military/government fare is not based on the fare level (although they are discounted), but rather it is based on the full flexibility those fares provide. Military/government fares provide a huge benefit to the customer already in that they can be booked at the last minute and canceled or changed with no advance notice and no penalties. As such, they are not allowed to be used in conjunction with a SWU.
Can I still make use if my SWU and credit the flight(s) to another airline?
You are not supposed to. If switching from AAdvantage to another scheme's FFN, please be aware: Benefitting from a privilege granted for your AAdvantage status and changing your FFN to earn on another airline is generally prohibited by AAdvantage Terms and Conditions. Doing so might risk that benefit (e.g. upgrade).
From the AAdvantage Terms and Conditions (link)
Q. Can I see SWU eligible flights on aa.com? If not, where?
aa.com will also reflect if a SWU can be used as you book - not that there is availability. One can see required inventory (A or C) using ExpertFlyer or other tools.
Q. What is the priority order for SWU wait list clearing?
Priority for wait listing is based first on AAdvantage status of requestor, then by rolling EQD earning during las 12 months; within those criteria, full fare (J or Y) trumps discounted fares.
NOTE: once the booking goes to airport control you may have to request your SWU request be reactivated. Those travel companions previously prioritized by the sponsor's status no longer revert to their own status at airport control.
Q. How do I know if my SWU request has been waitlisted?
You can see it online only 2-3 days prior to your depature. It will say "Systemwide Upgrade Requested". Otherwise, there is no way to know unless you call AA again and ask. In AA app you can see upgrade waiting list from 4 hours prior to the departure. Thank you (link) MrJBoy for clarifying).
If my SWU clears on AA but the flights is cancelled or delayed, and I get put on another AA or partner flight, will my Upgrade be preserved / honored?
On AA and Joint Business Venture partners (AY, BA, IB, JL, QF), AA will attempt to honor the upgrade. On other airline partners it is unlikely.
Q. Can I gift SWUs to others, and will my or their status apply?
You may certainly gift SWU to others. They will have to provide you their information, including PNR, and you will have to call it in. Your status can carry over to one treeling companion (on your itinerary) until the SWU passes to airport control; otherwise, SWU priority will depend on the user's AAdvantage status followed by date of upgrade request.
Q. What if I apply a SWU to a traveling companion?
That traveling companion "borrows" your status in terms of priority on the upgrade waitlist until the waitlisted passes to airport control.
Q. Can I sell or purchase SWUs to / from others (e.g. on eBay or CraigsList)?
While SWU may be gifted to others, AAdvantage rules prohibit selling / purchasing, trading or bartering various instruments, including SWU. A sold SWU will, if caught by AA Corporate Security AAdvantage Fraud (and they actively seek these out), cause SWU / upgrade cancellation at minimum and may even include closing the seller's account with forfeiture of miles, upgrade instruments and even elite status.
Further useful details about using SWU
. . . . ● Four SWUs are earned by Executive Platinum AAdvantage members when they cross the threshold to EXP, and their expiration is essentially the same as the earned status - January 31 of the ensuing status year (e.g. earn May 5 2017, the status and SWUs are good through 31 Jan 2019).
. . . . ● Two SWUs are earned by Executive Platinum AAdvantage members when they cross the 150,000 and 200,000 EQ EQ Miles; their expiration is essentially the same as the earned status as described above. (Further increments of 50,000 EQM past 200,000 earn no more SWU.)
. . . . ● Two SWUs (more) are earned by Concierge Key members.
. . . . ● Four SWUs are earned by those crossing Million Miler thresholds of 2MM and every Million Miles milestone thereafter.
. . . . ● SWUs may be transferred or gifted (not bargained, bartered or sold) to anyone the owner chooses - the owner must authorize the transfer and provide at minimum the designated person's name, frequent flyer #, and PNR. Note fees and taxes may be due, such as APD / Air Passenger Duty due for flights originating in the UK (or with connections exceeding 23:59).
. . . . ● AA tends to protect passengers granted upgrades with SWUs if IROPS move them to other oneworld flights, particularly JBV partners (AA, AY, BA, IB, JL, preserving already granted upgrades (not waitlisted).
. . . . ● N.B. AA will no longer attach expiring (31 Jan 2017 or -18) SWUs to be attached to existing upgrade inventory 1 Feb and after unless one is a very high value customer; AA now has software in place to prevent this, but if you consider yourself a high value customer, you can ask. Speculatively, EXP through 31 Jan 2018 with Concierge Key and / or 4 or 5 Helix / "Eagles" rating and lots of D and above revenue. See FAQ: New changes 90%+ eliminate post-expiration SWU use (Jun 2014)
. . . . ● If you don't want to wait list your SWU so that it automatically encumbered when a domestic segment becomes available for upgrade, but only want the domestic segments to clear if the international segment clears, ask the AA EP agent to waitlist the international portion but "DSR" the domestic segments; that way, the domestic segments will only clear if the international segment clears.
. . . . ● SWU application can include co-terminals: JonNYC, post #601: "This is the current list of MAC airports, and, as far as I understand it, are generally recognized for revenue tickets including SWU application to same: . . . . ● UK Air Passenger Duty / APD for LHR/UK departures: (Often incorrectly called "Luxury tax"): Departing from the UK (or on a layover of 24:00 or longer via the U.K.), you'll be charged the full APD (the lowest cabin class - usually economy - pays only half APD). This applies for upgrades to business only. Upgrading business to first doesn't incur this, (since your business ticket already included the full APD). This does not apply TO the U.K. or to connecting in under 24:00 in the U.K. Other airports may impose other taxes, e.g. HKG is USD $2.80.
. . . . ● Through (two flights with the same flight number, or through flights with stops) flights pose challenges insofar as upgrade availability must exist on all sectors. You may have to call AA to use a SWU on through flights.
Updated 30 Aug 2017 - JDiver
A. Not for most. The option was possible due to software limitations. New software, AAcoRN, put into place 26 June 2014, will prevent this from occurring for "unqualified" members; only "qualified" members will be allowed to encumber SWU past their expiry date in the future. (See post #1)
Q. How do I know if I am a "qualified" member?
A. You can try to call and encumber expiring SWU past their expiry. If you are not allowed to, you aren't.
Q. So, exactly who does AA consider "qualified"?
A. A very high value AAdvantage member, as measured by the internal "Helix" system, which assigns an "Eagles" ranking from 1 to 5 (the more, the better).
Q. I've never heard of this. When did it start?
A. AA's rating system was originally based on three colors, green, yellow and red, which changed to 1-3 Eagles and was later expanded to 1-5 Eagles.
Q. How are Eagles scores assigned? Are they static, or do they change?
A. It has been said spend and fare classes (think lots of annual travel in fare classes of D and above) may affect your Eagles score, as well as OSO and negative incidents you have experienced that might result in your moving your custom to another airline. It is also said your Helix score is updated periodically, perhaps even nightly.
Q. How can I find out my Helix score / how many Eagles I have?
A. You can't. AA employees are not empowered to discuss the Helix system with customers. If you normally get extra SWU once you've made EP, are allowed to extend SWU use and find EP desk agents are willing to bend rules for you often, speculative, you might have 4-5 Eagles rating.
Q. So, this is a hidden tier higher than Executive Platinum?
A. No, because it doesn't give you privileges beyond EP beyond those mentioned, e.g. courtesy Club membership or additional priority for boarding or upgrades, like Concierge Key may.
Q. Do others than Executive Platinum have Helix / Eagles scores?
A. It can be safely assumed all AAdvantage members have such scores.
For further information, see discussions on:
JonNYC's Traveing Better
The Boarding Area
Thanks to JonNYC for most of the information available to the public on this topic.
Updated 6 Oct 2016 - JDiver
Please read this wiki for important information not documented elsewhere.
The current thread can be reached here.
NOTE: CHANGES
NOTE: Upgrade waitlist priority is 1) Status, followed by 2) Rolling EQD earning for last 365 days as of 20 May 2017. Link to FT thread.
(No further SWUs are forthcoming at 250,000 EQM or after, though CK often have access to two more.)
Remember: EQM earning will vary from 0 to 3.0 EQM per base mile, based on eligible fare class and marketing airline, on EQM earning fares.
NOTE: Upgrade waitlist priority is 1) Status, followed by 2) Rolling EQD earning for last 365 days as of 20 May 2017. Link to FT thread.
- Executive Platinum members automatically earn four SWU when they earn 100,000 EQM (these expire at the end of the following status year).
- Executive Platinum members will automatically earn two further SWU at 150,000 and 200,000 EQM
Remember: EQM earning will vary from 0 to 3.0 EQM per base mile, based on eligible fare class and marketing airline, on EQM earning fares.
"The way your upgrade request is prioritized is you'll be listed according to your elite status level followed by (the type of upgrade - SWU and Upgrade Award, aka miles + copay), the number of EQD (Elite Qualifying Dollars) earned in the (rolling) last 12 months."
Upgrades are prioritized first by the following elite status levels:
Concierge Key SM . (up to 120 hours out)
Executive Platinum (up to 100 hours out)
Platinum Pro . . . . (up to 72 hours out)
Platinum . . . . . . . (up to 48 hours out)
Gold . . . . . . . . . . (up to 24 hours out)
After status tier, upgrades are prioritized by the type of upgrade (SWU and miles + copay before 500 Mile e-upgrades /UDU; your last 12 months' Elite Qualifying Dollar spend on AA. See FAQ: Earning EQD / Elite Qualifying Dollars on AA and partner airlines (2017 on) (EQD will include the EQD offset one might earn from spend on their Barclaycard Aviator Red or Silver card, as announced elsewhere in this forum.)
Date of request has no bearing on upgrade priority other than after all other priorities have been met and there’s a highly unlikely tie.
From AA.com... "Before you get to the airport, requests for systemwide and mileage award upgrades are processed independently from 500-mile upgrade requests.
At the airport, upgrades requested will be prioritized in this order:
- Status tier
[^]Rolling 12 month EQD - Systemwide and mileage + copay upgrades
- 500-mile upgrades on purchased tickets
- 500-mile upgrades on award tickets"
Systemwide Upgrade FAQ:
Q. What are Systemwide Upgrades, exactly?
Electronic Systemwide Upgrades, abbreviated SWU, also previously referred to as eVIPs or VIPs, are electronic instruments earned as stated previously. SWU generally allow the owner to upgrade up to three segments, more or less in the same direction, on any flights AA flies with their own aircraft (not valid on partners or codeshares - must be marketed and operated by AA), on most paid, published fares to the next class of service. (Successful upgrades on a single SWU include EZE-MIA-JFK-LHR, NRT-LAX-DFW-LHR.)
Q. When do SWU clear?
Upgrades can clear immediately if the appropriate inventory is available (e.g., Coach to Business (and domestic First on two class aircraft) requires "C" class to be available, Business to First requires "A" class to be available). Otherwise, SWU may be waitlisted in priority of AAdvantage status, followed by last 12 months EQD spend (and within those, by fare class if they are full fare Y). SWU and EXP UDU have the same priority once the flight and associated upgrade / PALL list has passed to airport control.
Q. Can I use SWU on codeshares operated by AA?
No. (Though 001 AA ticketing is not a requirement), the flight must be marketed and operated by AA.
Q. Are any fare classes ineligible / invalid for SWU upgrades?
Some government and consolidator fares may not be upgraded; Basic Economy flights may not be upgraded. Award flights may not be upgraded with SWU. See post #683 by JonNYC:
[quote]Invalid (for SWU upgrade)
- Basic Economy tickets, regardless of status level
- Military fares*
- Government fares*
- Agency/industry discounts
- Employee travel booked in E
- AAdvantage/promotion free or companion tickets
- Ticket designators that require a certificate (CEN20, etc.) - contact MSD to verify
- MSD Site products (ticket designator SITE)
- CAT25/CAT25 Group Fares for MCLA
- Charter flights
- Infant tickets
- Purchased extra seats (one passenger)
- Opaque fares
- Award tickets
Can I still make use if my SWU and credit the flight(s) to another airline?
You are not supposed to. If switching from AAdvantage to another scheme's FFN, please be aware: Benefitting from a privilege granted for your AAdvantage status and changing your FFN to earn on another airline is generally prohibited by AAdvantage Terms and Conditions. Doing so might risk that benefit (e.g. upgrade).
From the AAdvantage Terms and Conditions (link)
Q. Can I see SWU eligible flights on aa.com? If not, where?
aa.com will also reflect if a SWU can be used as you book - not that there is availability. One can see required inventory (A or C) using ExpertFlyer or other tools.
Q. What is the priority order for SWU wait list clearing?
Priority for wait listing is based first on AAdvantage status of requestor, then by rolling EQD earning during las 12 months; within those criteria, full fare (J or Y) trumps discounted fares.
NOTE: once the booking goes to airport control you may have to request your SWU request be reactivated. Those travel companions previously prioritized by the sponsor's status no longer revert to their own status at airport control.
Q. How do I know if my SWU request has been waitlisted?
You can see it online only 2-3 days prior to your depature. It will say "Systemwide Upgrade Requested". Otherwise, there is no way to know unless you call AA again and ask. In AA app you can see upgrade waiting list from 4 hours prior to the departure. Thank you (link) MrJBoy for clarifying).
If my SWU clears on AA but the flights is cancelled or delayed, and I get put on another AA or partner flight, will my Upgrade be preserved / honored?
On AA and Joint Business Venture partners (AY, BA, IB, JL, QF), AA will attempt to honor the upgrade. On other airline partners it is unlikely.
Q. Can I gift SWUs to others, and will my or their status apply?
You may certainly gift SWU to others. They will have to provide you their information, including PNR, and you will have to call it in. Your status can carry over to one treeling companion (on your itinerary) until the SWU passes to airport control; otherwise, SWU priority will depend on the user's AAdvantage status followed by date of upgrade request.
Q. What if I apply a SWU to a traveling companion?
That traveling companion "borrows" your status in terms of priority on the upgrade waitlist until the waitlisted passes to airport control.
Q. Can I sell or purchase SWUs to / from others (e.g. on eBay or CraigsList)?
While SWU may be gifted to others, AAdvantage rules prohibit selling / purchasing, trading or bartering various instruments, including SWU. A sold SWU will, if caught by AA Corporate Security AAdvantage Fraud (and they actively seek these out), cause SWU / upgrade cancellation at minimum and may even include closing the seller's account with forfeiture of miles, upgrade instruments and even elite status.
Further useful details about using SWU
. . . . ● Four SWUs are earned by Executive Platinum AAdvantage members when they cross the threshold to EXP, and their expiration is essentially the same as the earned status - January 31 of the ensuing status year (e.g. earn May 5 2017, the status and SWUs are good through 31 Jan 2019).
. . . . ● Two SWUs are earned by Executive Platinum AAdvantage members when they cross the 150,000 and 200,000 EQ EQ Miles; their expiration is essentially the same as the earned status as described above. (Further increments of 50,000 EQM past 200,000 earn no more SWU.)
. . . . ● Two SWUs (more) are earned by Concierge Key members.
. . . . ● Four SWUs are earned by those crossing Million Miler thresholds of 2MM and every Million Miles milestone thereafter.
. . . . ● SWUs may be transferred or gifted (not bargained, bartered or sold) to anyone the owner chooses - the owner must authorize the transfer and provide at minimum the designated person's name, frequent flyer #, and PNR. Note fees and taxes may be due, such as APD / Air Passenger Duty due for flights originating in the UK (or with connections exceeding 23:59).
. . . . ● AA tends to protect passengers granted upgrades with SWUs if IROPS move them to other oneworld flights, particularly JBV partners (AA, AY, BA, IB, JL, preserving already granted upgrades (not waitlisted).
. . . . ● N.B. AA will no longer attach expiring (31 Jan 2017 or -18) SWUs to be attached to existing upgrade inventory 1 Feb and after unless one is a very high value customer; AA now has software in place to prevent this, but if you consider yourself a high value customer, you can ask. Speculatively, EXP through 31 Jan 2018 with Concierge Key and / or 4 or 5 Helix / "Eagles" rating and lots of D and above revenue. See FAQ: New changes 90%+ eliminate post-expiration SWU use (Jun 2014)
. . . . ● If you don't want to wait list your SWU so that it automatically encumbered when a domestic segment becomes available for upgrade, but only want the domestic segments to clear if the international segment clears, ask the AA EP agent to waitlist the international portion but "DSR" the domestic segments; that way, the domestic segments will only clear if the international segment clears.
. . . . ● SWU application can include co-terminals: JonNYC, post #601: "This is the current list of MAC airports, and, as far as I understand it, are generally recognized for revenue tickets including SWU application to same:
- WAS (DCA, IAD)
- DFW (DFW, DAL)
- HOU (HOU, IAH)
- NYC (JFK, LGA) (I think there is a separate rule that says EWR is always part of NYC for this purpose as well)
- LON (LGW, LHR, STN)
- SLU (UVF, SLU)
- TYO (HND, NRT)"
. . . . ● Through (two flights with the same flight number, or through flights with stops) flights pose challenges insofar as upgrade availability must exist on all sectors. You may have to call AA to use a SWU on through flights.
Suggested reading:
aa.com: SYSTEMWIDE UPGRADES AND FAQS
FlyerTalk: Upgrades / SWUs / eVIPs and UK APD / Air Passenger Duty questions
New *internal* changes will 90%+ eliminate post-expiration use of SWUs by JonNYC
This post in the thread entitled "Reversing Use of SWU. Is this possible?" (it is not. AA no longer allows cancelling a SWU and substituting "stickers".)
aa.com: SYSTEMWIDE UPGRADES AND FAQS
FlyerTalk: Upgrades / SWUs / eVIPs and UK APD / Air Passenger Duty questions
New *internal* changes will 90%+ eliminate post-expiration use of SWUs by JonNYC
This post in the thread entitled "Reversing Use of SWU. Is this possible?" (it is not. AA no longer allows cancelling a SWU and substituting "stickers".)
Updated 30 Aug 2017 - JDiver
MODERATOR NOTE
Posts prior to 2016 may be read here: ARCHIVE: SWU / VIP / eVIP Systemwide Upgrade questions
NOTE: This thread is for the discussion of the mechanics of AA systemwide upgrades. For "chance of upgrade clearing" questions, please use this thread: 2015 Chances of Upgrade Clearing and Upgrade Availability Discussion (consolidated)
Please note there is a separate thread discussing lost / missing/ misappropriated SWUs:
Missing / someone else used / unauthorized use my SWU / VIP / eVIP (merged)
American AAdvantage Forum Moderator Team
Posts prior to 2016 may be read here: ARCHIVE: SWU / VIP / eVIP Systemwide Upgrade questions
NOTE: This thread is for the discussion of the mechanics of AA systemwide upgrades. For "chance of upgrade clearing" questions, please use this thread: 2015 Chances of Upgrade Clearing and Upgrade Availability Discussion (consolidated)
Please note there is a separate thread discussing lost / missing/ misappropriated SWUs:
Missing / someone else used / unauthorized use my SWU / VIP / eVIP (merged)
American AAdvantage Forum Moderator Team
FAQ: Internal IT changes eliminate 90+% of post-expiry SWU use 26 Jun 2014
Q. I've been able to encumber expiring SWU past their expiration date if I find the proper upgrade inventory available prior to that date. Is this feature still available to Executive Platinum members?A. Not for most. The option was possible due to software limitations. New software, AAcoRN, put into place 26 June 2014, will prevent this from occurring for "unqualified" members; only "qualified" members will be allowed to encumber SWU past their expiry date in the future. (See post #1)
Q. How do I know if I am a "qualified" member?
A. You can try to call and encumber expiring SWU past their expiry. If you are not allowed to, you aren't.
Q. So, exactly who does AA consider "qualified"?
A. A very high value AAdvantage member, as measured by the internal "Helix" system, which assigns an "Eagles" ranking from 1 to 5 (the more, the better).
Q. I've never heard of this. When did it start?
A. AA's rating system was originally based on three colors, green, yellow and red, which changed to 1-3 Eagles and was later expanded to 1-5 Eagles.
Q. How are Eagles scores assigned? Are they static, or do they change?
A. It has been said spend and fare classes (think lots of annual travel in fare classes of D and above) may affect your Eagles score, as well as OSO and negative incidents you have experienced that might result in your moving your custom to another airline. It is also said your Helix score is updated periodically, perhaps even nightly.
Q. How can I find out my Helix score / how many Eagles I have?
A. You can't. AA employees are not empowered to discuss the Helix system with customers. If you normally get extra SWU once you've made EP, are allowed to extend SWU use and find EP desk agents are willing to bend rules for you often, speculative, you might have 4-5 Eagles rating.
Q. So, this is a hidden tier higher than Executive Platinum?
A. No, because it doesn't give you privileges beyond EP beyond those mentioned, e.g. courtesy Club membership or additional priority for boarding or upgrades, like Concierge Key may.
Q. Do others than Executive Platinum have Helix / Eagles scores?
A. It can be safely assumed all AAdvantage members have such scores.
For further information, see discussions on:
JonNYC's Traveing Better
The Boarding Area
Thanks to JonNYC for most of the information available to the public on this topic.
Updated 6 Oct 2016 - JDiver
ARCHIVE: 2017 FAQ: What's a Systemwide Upgrade / SWU / eVIP / VIP? master thread
Jun 15, 2017, 6:26 am
#421
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: CMH, sometimes AVP, formerly down the Shore
Programs: UA 1K/3MM, AA EXP/3MM, DL MM, former fan of TWA
Posts: 1,854
Thanks for the help with my question regarding a single SWU spanning a stopover. I took your advice and questioned AA's "no" answer by reading the section from aa.com. That caused them to research it further. One part that I found interesting is that they came back on the phone to tell me that "as long as the fare rules permit a stopover, it will be allowed... but we need to research whether the fare allows a stopover." That took them an additional ten minutes.
At this point, it seems as though my request was accepted - we'll see what happens if/when one of the waitlists clear. Thanks again for your help!
At this point, it seems as though my request was accepted - we'll see what happens if/when one of the waitlists clear. Thanks again for your help!
Jun 15, 2017, 9:36 am
#423
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: South Florida
Programs: AA LTG (EXP), Hilton Silver (Dia), Marriott LTP (PP), SPG LTG (P) > MPG LTPP
Posts: 11,329
Thanks for the help with my question regarding a single SWU spanning a stopover. I took your advice and questioned AA's "no" answer by reading the section from aa.com. That caused them to research it further. One part that I found interesting is that they came back on the phone to tell me that "as long as the fare rules permit a stopover, it will be allowed... but we need to research whether the fare allows a stopover." That took them an additional ten minutes.
At this point, it seems as though my request was accepted - we'll see what happens if/when one of the waitlists clear. Thanks again for your help!
At this point, it seems as though my request was accepted - we'll see what happens if/when one of the waitlists clear. Thanks again for your help!
When I'm checking fares and look at multi-city fares, I often get a bogus amount until I submit for payment.
Jun 16, 2017, 7:39 pm
#424
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,727
EVIP from Y to PE or J?
Apologies if this has been answered elsewhere, but what is AA's policy now on upgrading Y fares using EVIPs? If the EVIP clears, does one get allocated a PE seat (obviously where PE is offered) or does one still get a business seat?
Jun 16, 2017, 7:51 pm
#425
Moderator: American AAdvantage
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NorCal - SMF area
Programs: AA LT Plat; HH LT Diamond, Maître-plongeur des Muccis
Posts: 62,948
At this time all Economy and Premium Economy SWU clear to Business class. (The only PEY is offered on the 787-9, though that will be changing in the future - see http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/ameri...eb-2017-a.html.)
Jun 17, 2017, 3:04 pm
#426
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: CMH, sometimes AVP, formerly down the Shore
Programs: UA 1K/3MM, AA EXP/3MM, DL MM, former fan of TWA
Posts: 1,854
Thanks for the help with my question regarding a single SWU spanning a stopover. I took your advice and questioned AA's "no" answer by reading the section from aa.com. That caused them to research it further. One part that I found interesting is that they came back on the phone to tell me that "as long as the fare rules permit a stopover, it will be allowed... but we need to research whether the fare allows a stopover." That took them an additional ten minutes.
Flights are GRUxMIAxJFK, then stopover, then JFK-LHR. The stopover is rather long - 6 months - but it is a stopover as defined in the rules. So I ask to apply a SWU.
Agent: "No that won't work, it is on a different day."
I try to explain what a stopover is, and she claims that a stopover is when you connect "within 12 hours". Never mind that she doesn't even get the definition of an international connection right, but she is persistent that a SWU (and she even called it an eVIP at one point, so I guess she has been around for a while) cannot work when you have days between the segments. In this case, my request for her to check the rules was met with a comment that, "The computer won't accept it, so it doesn't matter."
My goodness... what has this airline turned into? I guess I am probably not surprised, but just bitterly, bitterly disappointed that AA has fallen so far.
Jun 17, 2017, 4:10 pm
#427
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AA EXP, IHG Diamond, IC Amb
Posts: 5,510
Flying LAX-LHR next week, ticketed and SWU applied 9-23-2017.
Went down to J2 about a week ago....but is now back at J7....and EXP Line says over 10 seats available for sale still.
Cannot believe they do this waitlist crap for this long and still make us hold our breath the few days before departure....
If this doesn't clear then I lose the SWU as its about to expire.
Went down to J2 about a week ago....but is now back at J7....and EXP Line says over 10 seats available for sale still.
Cannot believe they do this waitlist crap for this long and still make us hold our breath the few days before departure....
If this doesn't clear then I lose the SWU as its about to expire.
Jun 17, 2017, 4:14 pm
#428
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: FIND ME ON TWITTER FOR THE LATEST
Posts: 27,730
Apologies for quoting my own post, but I had yet another experience today on the same topic.... namely, whether a SWU can span a stopover. Before starting, I asked the agent whether a SWU can work across a stopover and the answer was, "As long as the fare rules allow it." Great! So I ask her to pull up the reservation.
Flights are GRUxMIAxJFK, then stopover, then JFK-LHR. The stopover is rather long - 6 months - but it is a stopover as defined in the rules. So I ask to apply a SWU.
Agent: "No that won't work, it is on a different day."
I try to explain what a stopover is...
Flights are GRUxMIAxJFK, then stopover, then JFK-LHR. The stopover is rather long - 6 months - but it is a stopover as defined in the rules. So I ask to apply a SWU.
Agent: "No that won't work, it is on a different day."
I try to explain what a stopover is...
Only thing is since that agent was SO clueless, no reason to push it with her no even consider anything she said as being relevant, correct or determinative. Just highly, highly, highly annoying.
SO, I'd HUCA, maybe even waiting till Monday to do so.
Jun 17, 2017, 4:46 pm
#429
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: PHL
Programs: AA Executive Platinum; Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,662
Flying LAX-LHR next week, ticketed and SWU applied 9-23-2017.
Went down to J2 about a week ago....but is now back at J7....and EXP Line says over 10 seats available for sale still.
Cannot believe they do this waitlist crap for this long and still make us hold our breath the few days before departure....
If this doesn't clear then I lose the SWU as its about to expire.
Went down to J2 about a week ago....but is now back at J7....and EXP Line says over 10 seats available for sale still.
Cannot believe they do this waitlist crap for this long and still make us hold our breath the few days before departure....
If this doesn't clear then I lose the SWU as its about to expire.
Jun 18, 2017, 7:11 am
#430
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: PHL
Programs: AA ExP, Marriott Amb, National EAE, Hilton Diamond, SPG Plat (RIP), US CP (RIP)
Posts: 2,379
Flying LAX-LHR next week, ticketed and SWU applied 9-23-2017.
Went down to J2 about a week ago....but is now back at J7....and EXP Line says over 10 seats available for sale still.
Cannot believe they do this waitlist crap for this long and still make us hold our breath the few days before departure....
If this doesn't clear then I lose the SWU as its about to expire.
Went down to J2 about a week ago....but is now back at J7....and EXP Line says over 10 seats available for sale still.
Cannot believe they do this waitlist crap for this long and still make us hold our breath the few days before departure....
If this doesn't clear then I lose the SWU as its about to expire.
I'm confused. Perhaps you could clarify.
Jun 18, 2017, 8:01 am
#431
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: PHL
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, AA Gold, FB Gold, ITA Volare Executive
Posts: 3,294
Maybe what 355F1 means is that by the time (end of September 2017) that they learn that the SWU is not going to stick, there are only 4 months left to expiration and not really enough time to plan a trip to use it.
As ever, people come to FT with different travel plans, needs, etc. For those traveling longhaul routinely on business, right up until the end there will always be an occasion to make good use of an SWU. For those of us who plan international travel, particularly with a partner, that travel is less frequent and the desirability often coincides with the ability to plan on taking the flying part of the trip in J or F. I have mentioned this elsewhere, so probably shouldn't beat it into the ground, but the growing uncertainty attached to the use of an SWU lowered their value to me/us, even if the loss was only psychological, since this year we did manage to clear day ahead and/or minutes ahead at the gate.
As ever, people come to FT with different travel plans, needs, etc. For those traveling longhaul routinely on business, right up until the end there will always be an occasion to make good use of an SWU. For those of us who plan international travel, particularly with a partner, that travel is less frequent and the desirability often coincides with the ability to plan on taking the flying part of the trip in J or F. I have mentioned this elsewhere, so probably shouldn't beat it into the ground, but the growing uncertainty attached to the use of an SWU lowered their value to me/us, even if the loss was only psychological, since this year we did manage to clear day ahead and/or minutes ahead at the gate.
Jun 18, 2017, 6:24 pm
#432
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2001
Location: LAX; AA EXP, MM; HH Gold
Posts: 31,789
They posted "Cannot believe they do this waitlist crap for this long and still make us hold our breath the few days before departure." Almost nine months on the waitlist can make anyone angry.
Jun 18, 2017, 8:58 pm
#433
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,966
I can find SWU availability but the prices are crazy for economy. 2600 to fly Y from SFO-PHL-LHR. Might as well just buy a business ticket. SFO-LAX-TYO is $3000 in Y. January and Feb 2018 so it's not like it's high season.
Jun 18, 2017, 9:13 pm
#434
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: FIND ME ON TWITTER FOR THE LATEST
Posts: 27,730