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FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides

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This is the ARCHIVE through 2015 for older posts from the MileSAAver / SAAver Award Availability - Help, Assistance & Discussion (consolidated) thread.

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Some of you might have found your thread merged into this "consolidated" thread. If your desire is to become thoroughly familiar with the knowledge that has been accumulated about the process for acquiring MileSAAver awards feel free to read this entire thread. If you only want the assistance from those who have the knowledge your request has been merged at the end. Feel free to wait for a forthcoming answer.

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Jun 8, 2012, 11:47 pm

#2146

Austinrunner

Suspended

Join Date: Jul 2003

Posts: 4,861

Pure speculation. And under no circumstances is AA is going lie in the reports it files with the SEC.

Jun 9, 2012, 5:20 am

#2147

Austinrunner

Suspended

Join Date: Jul 2003

Posts: 4,861

Quote:

Originally Posted by WyattEarp

As a financial employee hired on to help two large companies work through bankruptcy and I can say that from my experience 1) Short-term priorities during the BK process outweigh almost all long-term priorities even if it hacks off customers and key vendors. 2) Immediate cash outweighs increasing long-term liabilities. Bankruptcy Advisors want to prove to the Creditor groups and to the Bankruptcy Judge they can increase operating cash flow even if it is a short-term effect. I think this is one of the ways the highly compensated advisors validate their value.

As JohnAx countered Austinrunner's point that American does not believe award passengers take away seats from revenue passengers, "AA is working especially hard to make sure in the current climate to make sure that remains the case". Knowing the process, I concur. Simply put, award passengers provide little or no cash flow so they are not a priority in the short run. This was definitely the case during the United bankruptcy and I believe now the case with American. Find ways to increase revenue and don't give away as many seats regardless if they would go unused.

I think there is a deluge of anectodal evidence here that strongly suggests 2012 will be a terrible year for AAdvantage members. I know if American provides quantitative evidence about award use in public statements that it is most likely validated. Qualitative statements such as "does not believe" are not worth much and at best can be categorized as spin, marketing or whatever. My guess is American will not offer any quantitative statements about 2012 award use next year and offer some vague points that the AAdvantage program continued to be a leading airline customer-loyalty program in 2012....blah, blah, blah.

How does your post relate to your one-and-only previous one, here: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/18617350-post1936.html

The similar subject matter was noted on Traveling Better, here: http://www.travelingbetter.com/forum...&postcount=140

Jun 9, 2012, 5:50 am

#2148

Mountain Trader

Join Date: Feb 1999

Location: Denver CO

Posts: 3,682

While I enjoy Austinrunner's many contributions to FT, I found WyattEarp's thoughts interesting as well. AA goosing award availability to gain favor during its bankruptcy proceeding seems to me a very possible scenario, and thinking the Chapter filing has had no impact seems perhaps naive.

The link to JonNYC's post on his board brought back memories. Last winter I tried to sign-up over there. I went thru the process and got to the part where they said they needed to and would activate my new membership soon. Several attempted emails later, I was, and still am, waiting. Maybe I'll start over sometime.

Jun 9, 2012, 5:59 am

#2149

alien

Join Date: Mar 2003

Posts: 1,455

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mountain Trader

...The link to JonNYC's post on his board brought back memories. Last winter I tried to sign-up over there. I went thru the process and got to the part where they said they needed to and would activate my new membership soon. Several attempted emails later, I was, and still am, waiting. Maybe I'll start over sometime.

Not sure if you caught this thread over there. You may have been caught up in the effort being made to keep the site clean:

http://www.travelingbetter.com/forum...ead.php?t=2950

Jun 9, 2012, 6:07 pm

#2150

rkh29

Join Date: Apr 2006

Location: Washington state

Programs: AA LT Gold

Posts: 269

SEA to FRA still sucks

Checked again for April
SEA to FRA no saver coach and no business
FRA to SEA one saver coach and 6 business
Random seat check showed no seats taken
Yes, I know seat check/chart not always accurate.
Yes, I know there is a lot of days before April.
I also know this availability is drastically different from the past 3 years I got award for the period.

Jun 10, 2012, 2:19 am

#2151

Austinrunner

Suspended

Join Date: Jul 2003

Posts: 4,861

DFW -> FRA mileSAAver nonstop award availability in Y on AA for 1 person in April 2013
April 2, 30

DFW -> FRA mileSAAver award availability in Y on AA/BA for 1 person in April 2013
April 2, 4, 7, 11, 14, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30

DFW -> FRA mileSAAver award availability in J on AA/BA for 1 person in April 2013
April 2, 3, 4, 10, 11, 13, 15, 16, 17, 19, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 29

DFW -> FRA mileSAAver award availability in F on AA/BA for 1 person in April 2013
April 2, 7, 9, 16, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27

SEA -> DFW mileSAAver award availability in Y on AA/AS for 1 person in April 2013
April 15

SEA -> DFW mileSAAver award availability in J/F on AA/AS for 1 person in April 2013
April 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29

Last edited by Austinrunner; Jun 10, 2012 at 2:36 am

Jun 10, 2012, 5:10 am

#2152

Paulchili

Join Date: Dec 2006

Location: SF Bay Area

Programs: AA LT PLT 3 MM+, BA (very) Blue, CO nobody

Posts: 2,640

Quote:

Originally Posted by Austinrunner

How does this compare for availability for 2 people (especially In premium international cabins on AA metal)?
For example, on DFW - FRA, I see 0 J's and a single Y sAAver for the entire April 2013 - a far cry from the numbers you posted for that route (for 1 person and including BA)
It is widely acknowledged and accepted here that BA award availability is there (though shunned by most). Also AA metal for 1 person can be found; what is lacking, when compared to the previous years, is AA metal availability for long haul premium saaver awards for more that 1 person.

Last edited by Paulchili; Jun 10, 2012 at 6:05 am

Jun 10, 2012, 7:44 am

#2153

rkh29

Join Date: Apr 2006

Location: Washington state

Programs: AA LT Gold

Posts: 269

What's the point?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Austinrunner

My post dealt with current availability of saver awards not being available as in the past for SEA to FRA. The above is not helpful unless you are suggesting one could get SEA to FRA by calling. I was already aware of the above SEA to DFW and DFW to FRA and SEA to ORD and ORD to FRA. My disappointment is the current lack of SEA to FRA saverawards.

Jun 10, 2012, 1:16 pm

#2154

Austinrunner

Suspended

Join Date: Jul 2003

Posts: 4,861

Call AA to see if you can book SEA - FRA by segment. Might or might not work.

Paulchili, please do your own research and make your own points. I'm not your advocate or lawyer. OK?

Jun 10, 2012, 1:29 pm

#2155

sdsearch

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Jan 2005

Location: home = LAX

Posts: 25,932

Quote:

Originally Posted by WyattEarp

I think there is a deluge of anectodal evidence here that strongly suggests 2012 will be a terrible year for AAdvantage members.

I think it depends, though, on what kind of AAdvantage member you are. Not all AAdvantage members are even trying to outright redeem miles on AA flights this year. (Though, of course, that is what this specific thread is about.)

AAdvantage members who want to redeem on partner airlines are not necessarily finding the same thing. It depends in that case on the partner, not on AA. And most of the parnters are not in bankrupcy. So AAdvantage members who try to upgrade on partners may have a quite different view of AA than AAdvantage members who only try to redeem on AA itself.

AAdvantage members who want to upgrade (with 500-mile upgrades, mlies upgrades, or SWU aka eVIP upgrades) are in entirely different boat. It could well be that if premium cabin seats are going unsold without being available for miles redemption, they become more available for upgrades. Since people who upgrades actually paid money for some kind of seat already, keeping them happy (so that they'll very soon buy more paid seats) by upgrading them is in AA's short-term intereest, even as giving away award seats may not be. So AAdvantage members who try to upgrade may have a quite different view of AA than AAdvatnage members who tro do outright award redemptions (on AA).

It's thus not clear to me that you can take one issue (outright redemption on AA metal) that is causing problems for some AAdvantage members and extrapolate that to all AAdvantage members souring on AA because of this.

Jun 10, 2012, 10:31 pm

#2156

rkh29

Join Date: Apr 2006

Location: Washington state

Programs: AA LT Gold

Posts: 269

calling would not work

Quote:

Originally Posted by Austinrunner

Call AA to see if you can book SEA - FRA by segment. Might or might not work.

Actually, I am looking for saver Y, so nothing really works on AA metal even if SEA DFW and DFW FRA availability were combined into one award. Glad I had no trouble booking Oct flight last Nov.

Jun 11, 2012, 9:09 am

#2157

bostonoski

Join Date: Dec 2011

Location: TBD

Programs: AA since 1988 (ex-elite status); Alaska; Hilton Diamond

Posts: 497

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkh29

If you don't mind me adding, the availability posted in response to your issue was for ONE person, not two and many people have been having problems getting two awards. (Not to mention one of the "answers" to your post was Y awards on April 2 and 30 for one leg and 15 April for the other... huh?!?!)

On the other hand, I'm going to back you up to say that my problem also - looking only for ONE seat - has not ever been the int'l portion of the flight, but the domestic portion. If you have trouble from SEA to FRA, it's exactly like my issue. I could get BOS-LHR but wanted SFO-BOS with it and that was almost impossible. I had a June or July option for int'l and after months I settled on the 2nd leg happening in December.

In fact currently there are no Saavers at all in July for one seat on my route, no Saavers in August, but suddenly Sept has a lot more availability than it used to. I got lucky checking every day and back in May one seat finally opened when I could go (BOS>ORD>LAX>SFO!!!). But I have kept checking (out of interest and due to this thread), and from January thru May the availability was so slim it was simply laughable. Now they seem to have dumped in a bunch of September seats. [shrug]

Last edited by bostonoski; Jun 11, 2012 at 9:16 am Reason: clarification

Jun 11, 2012, 1:57 pm

#2158

Austinrunner

Suspended

Join Date: Jul 2003

Posts: 4,861

Quote:

Originally Posted by bostonoski

Now they seem to have dumped in a bunch of September seats. [shrug]

Yeah, that's just wrong of AA to make a bunch of award seats available in September. Isn't there a law against dumping?

Jun 11, 2012, 5:13 pm

#2159

richarddd

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: NYC

Posts: 6,423

Quote:

Originally Posted by bostonoski

Now they seem to have dumped in a bunch of September seats. [shrug]

Periodic dumping of inventory is a many years old tradition

Jun 13, 2012, 1:43 am

#2160

WyattEarp

Join Date: May 2012

Programs: American, United

Posts: 14

IMHO Bankruptcy Does Matter

Quote:

Originally Posted by Austinrunner

Yes, I am a new member/poster, but I don't think anything in my two posts contradict each other. After my first post which shared a concern about current award availability, I had a chance to follow some of the other members comments about the bankruptcy. I do not claim to have any experience with airline bankrupcties nor am I an AA insider, but rather was responding to Mountain Trader's posting based on my experience with two bankruptcy proceedings in two other industries. I hope I don't have to start every comment with IMHO.

I actually find Austinrunner's previous postings about quantitative stats publicly released by AA to be very enlightening. When the 2012 Aadvantage program is discussed publicly by AA in 2013, we will be able to see if quant stats will be offered.

Hopefully, AA will open up more International award seats as the year progresses and they see the light at the end of the BK.

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