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ANA ATI application with UA approved by DOT

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ANA ATI application with UA approved by DOT

   
Old Oct 6, 2010, 4:24 pm
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ANA ATI application with UA tentatively approved by DOT
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp...86d3a44fbb.e01

Japan Airlines, which is in the midst of painful restructuring, is part of the oneworld alliance with American Airlines. All Nippon Airways is a member of the Star Alliance with newly merged United Airlines and Continental Airlines.

The Department of Transportation said it has agreed to grant anti-trust exemptions to the two alliances, contingent on the final signature of the open-skies agreement.
Last edited by JALPak; Oct 6, 2010 at 4:32 pm
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Old Oct 22, 2010, 5:36 am
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MLIT approved NH/UA ATI application today. US DOT will finalize the approval after signing the Open Skies deal next week.
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Old Oct 23, 2010, 5:46 pm
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Originally Posted by JALPak
MLIT approved NH/UA ATI application today. US DOT will finalize the approval after signing the Open Skies deal next week.
Now that the approvals are imminent, the bigger question is how will it impact the NH-UA relationship on their TPAC operation?

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Old Oct 24, 2010, 12:08 am
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Hopefully better reciprocal mileage benefits!

the value of 1 AMC mile =/= the value of 1 MP mile

If I fly ANA, I still want 100% miles in MP, and as a UA *G, I would love the 100% bonus.
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Old Oct 24, 2010, 12:59 am
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And how would this affect NH's elites and the AMC program.
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Old Oct 24, 2010, 4:35 am
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Originally Posted by LAX
Now that the approvals are imminent, the bigger question is how will it impact the NH-UA relationship on their TPAC operation?

LAX
There will be revenue sharing on all routes......good for the airlines/capacity control not so good for FF!
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Old Oct 24, 2010, 5:15 am
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Originally Posted by Q Shoe Guy
There will be revenue sharing on all routes......good for the airlines/capacity control not so good for FF!
All US-Asia routes to be specific. But I agree ATI gives more pricing powers to the airlines and we end up paying for more. Maybe it's good for people living in non-hub cities and don't care on which airline they fly on
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Old Oct 24, 2010, 6:15 pm
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Originally Posted by JALPak
All US-Asia routes to be specific. But I agree ATI gives more pricing powers to the airlines and we end up paying for more. Maybe it's good for people living in non-hub cities and don't care on which airline they fly on
Have we seen price increases on the US-European routes where UA & LH have had an ATI for many years? Any spike in fares after it had been expanded to include AC & CO recently?

Besides, while it's relative small sampling, NH was always pretty expensive the last few times I needed to fly to Asia the last few years anyways. May it will bring up UA's fares?

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Old Oct 24, 2010, 7:26 pm
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Originally Posted by LAX
Have we seen price increases on the US-European routes where UA & LH have had an ATI for many years? Any spike in fares after it had been expanded to include AC & CO recently?

Besides, while it's relative small sampling, NH was always pretty expensive the last few times I needed to fly to Asia the last few years anyways. May it will bring up UA's fares?

LAX
All you need to do is check out the relative airlines 3rd quarter financials to see that the ATI is working well for them (AC has yet to release it's 3rd quarter). The fares have certainly not come down and they have really managed their capacity well. LH(group)/UA/AC all share equally in the ATI for TATL. You will see the same thing happen with the TPAC , better capacity control etc. Prices will follow northward!
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Old Oct 24, 2010, 8:32 pm
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Originally Posted by Q Shoe Guy
All you need to do is check out the relative airlines 3rd quarter financials to see that the ATI is working well for them (AC has yet to release it's 3rd quarter). The fares have certainly not come down and they have really managed their capacity well. LH(group)/UA/AC all share equally in the ATI for TATL. You will see the same thing happen with the TPAC , better capacity control etc. Prices will follow northward!
Thanks for the info. Less competition in general translate into higher fares. However, if we are taking one less competitor out of the equation on US-Asia routes, there are still plenty of others "fighting for the same pax." For some nonstop routes to Japan, there is probably bigger impact because the pool of players is significantly smaller to begin with.

BTW, with the transatlantic ATI where fares have not gone down, were you referring to fares on *A carriers only or over other non-*A carriers as well?

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Old Oct 24, 2010, 9:15 pm
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With these new agreements and recent mergers in the US, there will effectively be only 3 airlines competing in the US-Japan nonstop market (UANH, AAJL, and DL), compared to 7 airlines only a couple of years ago (JL, NH, UA, AA, NW, DL, and CO).

(...unless you include SQ and KE's respective flights to LAX, but I don't think those really count.)

As others have said, fares will rise. Get ready to mortgage your house the next time you fly TPAC...
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Old Oct 24, 2010, 10:06 pm
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Originally Posted by Unimatrix One
With these new agreements and recent mergers in the US, there will effectively be only 3 airlines competing in the US-Japan nonstop market (UANH, AAJL, and DL), compared to 7 airlines only a couple of years ago (JL, NH, UA, AA, NW, DL, and CO).

(...unless you include SQ and KE's respective flights to LAX, but I don't think those really count.)

As others have said, fares will rise. Get ready to mortgage your house the next time you fly TPAC...
To Japan, yes, unless one is willing to connect. To the rest of Asia, there are still plenty of carriers (to the general public that is not "tied down" to an alliance) to choose from. I am not trying to argue that that ATI is good for fares in general, but in terms of scheduling, connections, FFP benefits, etc., it may not necessarily be bad.

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Old Oct 24, 2010, 11:05 pm
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Originally Posted by LAX
Thanks for the info. Less competition in general translate into higher fares. However, if we are taking one less competitor out of the equation on US-Asia routes, there are still plenty of others "fighting for the same pax." For some nonstop routes to Japan, there is probably bigger impact because the pool of players is significantly smaller to begin with.

BTW, with the transatlantic ATI where fares have not gone down, were you referring to fares on *A carriers only or over other non-*A carriers as well?

LAX
I was pointing out that the *A carriers on the TATL that have reported their 3rd quarter have all seen a rise in yield. There have been even larger increases on the TPAC....so even without this marriage the big players were seeing increasing yields. It also helps that JL has been in disarray and cutting capacity!
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Old Nov 10, 2010, 4:05 pm
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US DOT grants the FINAL approval on ANA/UA ATI application today. So no more barriers and they can now coordinate on schedules and fares legally
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Old Nov 11, 2010, 5:12 am
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Originally Posted by JALPak
US DOT grants the FINAL approval on ANA/UA ATI application today. So no more barriers and they can now coordinate on schedules and fares legally
I am excited to see what changes are install for us.
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