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Old Dec 3, 12, 5:21 am   #1
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ANA to withdraw from NRT-ICN route from Mar 31 2013

http://www.ana.co.jp/eng/aboutana/pr.../121203-2.html

decline in business passengers is cited as the main reason
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Old Dec 3, 12, 8:28 am   #2
 
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Both surprising and not surprising:

Not surprising because all the point-to-point business passengers use GMP-HND. In fact, the ICN route has been all-Y for a long time.

Surprising because it basically means they are going to give up selling connections to US/Europe not served from HND, unless they completely open up the codeshares even to discounted tickets. HND-NRT transfer would only be worth it on a very heavy discount taking into account non-transfer of bags and long journey time between the airports.

Either way, the route has served me well during the peak of my NH travel to/from ICN-LHR and it will be strange to see it go after all this time.
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Old Dec 3, 12, 11:02 am   #3
 
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It's not a complete loss at least. Asiana and United still fly the route.
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Old Dec 3, 12, 6:04 pm   #4
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I would imagine they would simply rely on their codeshares with OZ for these flights. Most passengers flying discounted fares are likely already using OZ or KE, or perhaps an LCC.
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Old Dec 3, 12, 6:17 pm   #5
 
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Yeah, I don't see why you would fly a one-class A320 to stay on ANA metal when OZ, KE, and UA all use proper long-haul aircraft...
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Old Dec 3, 12, 7:39 pm   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joejones View Post
Yeah, I don't see why you would fly a one-class A320 to stay on ANA metal when OZ, KE, and UA all use proper long-haul aircraft...
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Originally Posted by JALPak View Post
decline in business passengers is cited as the main reason
No wonder there was a decline in business passengers... I'm sure NH will blame high personnel and fuel costs for the suspension.
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Old Dec 3, 12, 7:43 pm   #7
 
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So will ANA increase frequency on HND-GMP, or are they completely giving up on the discount Y pax? I'm surprised they only had one flight per day between ICN and NRT.

Maybe ANA can one day offer a NRT-GMP flight, much like KE and OZ offer a HND-ICN flight, in order to find a niche on this competitive route.
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Old Dec 3, 12, 8:40 pm   #8
 
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I think the frequencies are "set in stone" on the HND-GMP route at 3 per carrier and NH is already using some of its highest-density international equipment on the route.

This whole issue should become moot in a few years' time as more international slots become available at HND, including daytime long-haul flights.
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Old Dec 3, 12, 9:20 pm   #9
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Originally Posted by armagebedar View Post
No wonder there was a decline in business passengers... I'm sure NH will blame high personnel and fuel costs for the suspension.
Business passengers travel in Y too as opposed to Business Class passengers
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Old Dec 3, 12, 11:22 pm   #10
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Originally Posted by joejones View Post
I think the frequencies are "set in stone" on the HND-GMP route at 3 per carrier and NH is already using some of its highest-density international equipment on the route.

This whole issue should become moot in a few years' time as more international slots become available at HND, including daytime long-haul flights.
This is due mainly to slot restrictions at HND, right? I believe there is an open skies treaty between Korea and Japan (hence NH's suspension of NRT-ICN).

KE is also using 747s and A380s so there is certainly a lot of capacity around.
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Old Dec 4, 12, 2:04 am   #11
 
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HND and GMP are both excluded from the current version of the Korea-Japan open skies agreement, from what I understand. It's possible that HND will be covered at some point in the near future, but not yet.
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Old Dec 4, 12, 8:11 am   #12
 
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They abandoned it because a lot of people were flying to ICN to go abroad. Sometimes it was cheaper to fly out of ICN to the US or Europe instead of conveniently flying out of NRT.
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Old Dec 4, 12, 8:55 pm   #13
 
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Why would you fly through NRT to get to ICN or vice-versa and if you're going direct Tokyo to Seoul why would you go through NRT or ICN.
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Old Dec 4, 12, 9:06 pm   #14
 
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Originally Posted by 5khours View Post
Why would you fly through NRT to get to ICN or vice-versa and if you're going direct Tokyo to Seoul why would you go through NRT or ICN.
Ask KE how they manage to fill an A380 on this route. While you're at it, try to figure out why they still fly ICN-NRT-LAX (that one puzzles the heck out of me).
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Old Dec 4, 12, 9:13 pm   #15
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Originally Posted by 5khours View Post
Why would you fly through NRT to get to ICN or vice-versa and if you're going direct Tokyo to Seoul why would you go through NRT or ICN.
I am because I want to fly NH from NRT to SFO but cannot get it on miles for the dates I want to go. Not willing to fly on US legacy carriers using miles, and wanting the nearest equivalent f NH's service and hardware, OZ is the next best choice but requires me to transit ICN.

As for direct Tokyo-Seoul, I would rather use NRT every day due to HND being such an intolerably limp attempt at a comfortable airport. And this despite it being 20 mins door to door to HND for me. Just a personal preference though. Logic for the business traveler dictates HND.
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