Alitalia to sell SH business?

Old Jan 20, 2017, 5:18 am
  #1  
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Alitalia to sell SH business?

One of the options being considered...

http://www.independent.ie/business/r...-35381722.html
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Old Jan 20, 2017, 6:21 am
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Thanks for sharing this - the rumour was also reported from Corriere della Sera days ago.

It is very unlikely that any solution going forward will get rid of the cancer which has always been affecting Alitalia -

  • The political complexity (alias involvement) behind the airline;
  • The power of the trade unions, which historically rests on two solid pillars being strong membership and significant links to political parties.

Robust influence from the above mentioned factors has always prevented any concrete plan of development (and many have tried so far, including AF a decade ago, with a plan which was eventually stopped by good-old Silvio).

Italy is amongst the most important (if not the most important) European markets for all the big players (a swift look at the number of daily services operated by LH, BA, AF, KL and the likes from major and even minor Italian airports is enough to form an idea) and, shamefully, AZ has not been able to make the most of it (apart from a short period of time when MXP was their main hub and they had over 200 aircraft operating a more than decent network).

G

Last edited by AlicorporateUK; Jan 20, 2017 at 6:26 am
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Old Jan 20, 2017, 7:29 am
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Originally Posted by AlicorporateUK
Italy is amongst the most important (if not the most important) European markets for all the big players (a swift look at the number of daily services operated by LH, BA, AF, KL and the likes from major and even minor Italian airports is enough to form an idea)
That's quite a bold claim to make!

Forgive me, but I thought it was well known that the UK is, and always has been, by far the "biggest" aviation market in Europe

Of course, Brexit could dent the UK's figures quite considerably as it could suddenly find itself scrambling to restore access to certain markets that it will no longer have access to via air treaties signed by the EU.

The latest figures I could find, from 2013, show that Italy is in 5th place in the EU (6th/7th in Europe if we were to include Turkey and/or Russia!) with slightly more than half the number of air passengers that the UK has.
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Old Jan 20, 2017, 7:35 am
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I guess what he was trying to say in a clunky way is Italy is the largest market in Europe that doesn't have a hub for IAG/LH Group/AFKLM in it
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Old Jan 20, 2017, 7:36 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28
That's quite a bold claim to make!

Forgive me, but I thought it was well known that the UK is, and always has been, by far the "biggest" aviation market in the EU (6th/7th in Europe if we were to include Turkey and/or Russia!)

The latest figures I could find, from 2013, show that Italy is in 5th place with a little more than half the air passengers that the UK has.
Yes indeed I didn't make myself clear - amongst the most important in terms of passengers on a country-to-country basis and indeed Italy figures amongst the top -

http://www.anna.aero/2016/11/16/bigg...1617-revealed/

But I think I saw a better table somewhere else (IATA website, possibly), showing the top 10 in Europe (amongst those, DE-IT, UK-IT, FR-IT).

G
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Old Jan 20, 2017, 7:40 am
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Originally Posted by ajeleonard
I guess what he was trying to say in a clunky way is Italy is the largest market in Europe that doesn't have a hub for IAG/LH Group/AFKLM in it
That seems a rather contrived qualifier, too.

The US*, Germany and France would all probably be bigger markets for IAG than Italy.
The US*, UK, Spain and France would all probably be bigger markets for LH than Italy.
The US*, UK, Spain and Germany would all probably be bigger markets for AFKL than Italy.

*I know the US is not in Europe, but I don't see why, when discussing global airlines, we need to limit ourselves to discussion of European countries.
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Old Jan 20, 2017, 7:44 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28
That seems a rather contrived qualifier, too.

The US*, Germany and France would all probably be bigger markets for IAG than Italy.
The US*, UK, Spain and France would all probably be bigger markets for LH than Italy.
The US*, UK, Spain and Germany would all probably be bigger markets for AFKL than Italy.

*I know the US is not in Europe, but I don't see why, when discussing global airlines, we need to limit ourselves to discussion of European countries.
It'd be interesting to see some figures, I remember seeing some statistics somewhere showing Italy being amongst the top 3 markets for LH group as a whole but, again, it was confined to Europe.

G
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Old Jan 20, 2017, 7:46 am
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Additionally, LCC penetration in Italy is above the European average - and above 50% - and this can be seen as an indicator of the low margins and high price sensitivity of the market. It's not an easy place to operate as a high-cost carrier

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Old Jan 20, 2017, 7:55 am
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Some other statistics concerning LH at FRA, where Italy is indeed the 3rd market in terms of number of seats after Germany and the US.

http://www.anna.aero/2015/09/29/luft...rankfurt-base/

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Old Jan 20, 2017, 7:58 am
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And that's BA -

LGW
http://www.anna.aero/2016/02/16/brit...-50-once-more/

LHR (ASK)
http://www.anna.aero/2014/03/13/brit...rica-and-asia/

G
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Old Jan 20, 2017, 8:09 am
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Originally Posted by AlicorporateUK
Some other statistics concerning LH at FRA, where Italy is indeed the 3rd market in terms of number of seats after Germany and the US.
From MUC, Italy is the second largest market by number of seats (after Germany), but 6th in terms of ASKs.

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Old Jan 24, 2017, 4:20 am
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Etihad's Chief Executive and Chief Financial Officer have today resigned. They will be leaving by the second half of the year.

It is almost certain that they were "encouraged" to leave as a result of the failures surrounding the airline investments - notably Alitalia and airberlin.

There could be quite a lot of blowback for Alitalia from all of this....
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Old Jan 25, 2017, 10:15 pm
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I wonder who would buy AZ short haul business for anything other than LIN slots (FCO is not slot-controlled, right? They shouldn't be as they have at least 3 usable runways.)
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Old Jan 26, 2017, 1:10 am
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Originally Posted by Reuters
]Ryanair (RYA.I) is in talks about providing connecting flights to AlItalia's long-haul services and has raised objections with German authorities about a Lufthansa-Air Berlin tie-up, as it tries to ease its expansion in continental Europe.

But it is unlikely to look to acquisitions to fuel that growth due to inefficiencies at rivals and the fact most have Airbus (AIR.PA) fleets, rather than Boeing (BA.N) planes as used by Ryanair, CEO Michael O'Leary told Reuters in an interview.

Ryanair is currently in talks with AlItalia about providing feeder flights to its long-haul hubs in a deal that could help the Italian flag carrier curb losses on short-haul flights.

"We can help them by offering them cheap feed, low-cost feed into their hubs ... but that means taking out aircraft, people, and that's very difficult politically in Italy," O'Leary said. "We are still talking to them."
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