Yes. There's really no rhyme or reason to it. In fact, it almost seems spiteful as if to say "ok, you spent your money with us but we're not going to value it".
I've been flying AS since 1972 and remain an original mileage plan member. If this policy goes into effect, I will consider other carriers even if it severely limits my options. It will certainly make me question giving further business to AS.
Programs: AS MVP (withering away due to insane fares), UA, AA, AGR, NPS passport, Costco Exec
Posts: 5,177
Agreed. When AS capped it at $250, most of my incentive for helping them reduce the liability on their books via the AS50 award went away. Now, the rest of it just disappeared.
I guess AS would rather me cause them to spend multiple thousands of dollars to book me on a seat in F on a partner than give them at least some revenue. I think they could have done something different and more creative to help reduce the cost of providing the AS50 without making them virtually worthless--maybe doing something like allowing mileage usage and even uncapping the discount but restricting AS50 awards to Bargain fares or lower. That way, they only get used when there is a chance the aircraft won't be full--in effect helping to sell a seat that would otherwise go unsold.
(To prevent people from flaming me that the best use of AS50 awards is to cheapen last-minute, expensive travel, maybe they could do a hybrid system, where AS50 awards on Bargain or Hot Deal awards are unrestricted (no caps, earning mileage) but AS50 awards redeemed on Value or higher fares are subject to the proposed changes (caps, no mileage).)
Location: NYC (CT suburbs), Gulf Stream, FL, and Seattle
Programs: CO Infinite Plat, AirTran Elite, AS MVPG, Delta GM, US PLat.
Posts: 2,918
First of all, these aren't free tickets. You paid for them when you bought the flights they were earned on. Customers are where they are in this program, because they have accepted these absurd changes in the program. Accelerated mileage requirements, virtual elimination of U seats on popular routes. What's this about a fuel sucharge on a free ticket? You got that seat because they couldn't sell it. That plane was leaving anyway. Why should you pay for fuel it was going to use, regardless. And the AS50, Capped at $250. With these fares, it is more aptly an AS20. As if that isn't enough, as has been pointed out, you can spend a grand, even with the use of it, and NO miles, while somebody on a $250 ticket gets it. Folks, that's just arrogance. These people think they can do anything, and as long as there is no push back, they will. You have choices. Make them. They will feel it, especially in this economy. If you don't, it will just keep coming. Alaska has had an extraordinarily supportive customer base, and this is how they show their appreciation. These latest changes, while being explained as "necessary" due to fuel and related costs, just don't stand the scrutiny. Loyalty programs are a marekting expense, not a line item. Pure and simple, this kind of stuff is greed and arrogance. If you like it, just keep doing nothing about it. You can be sure they will have more surprises for you.
Users of Alaska's premium Money and Miles program will earn half the miles they can earn now. The Money and Miles program gives frequent business travelers steep discounts on round-trip flights of at least 15,000 miles. Last week the airline said it wouldn't give those passengers any miles for discounted flights, but said it changed that Monday after complaints from customers.
Web site page on changes still shows no miles will be earned (checked Tuesday morning, 5:15 am PDT)
__________________ January came early!!!
Last edited by dave1013; Jul 29, 08 at 7:15 am.
Reason: added web site check
Accelerated mileage requirements, virtual elimination of U seats on popular routes. What's this about a fuel sucharge on a free ticket? You got that seat because they couldn't sell it. That plane was leaving anyway. Why should you pay for fuel it was going to use, regardless. And the AS50, Capped at $250. With these fares, it is more aptly an AS20. As if that isn't enough, as has been pointed out, you can spend a grand, even with the use of it, and NO miles, while somebody on a $250 ticket gets it. Folks, that's just arrogance. These people think they can do anything, and as long as there is no push back, they will. You have choices. Make them. They will feel it, especially in this economy. If you don't, it will just keep coming. Alaska has had an extraordinarily supportive customer base, and this is how they show their appreciation. These latest changes, while being explained as "necessary" due to fuel and related costs, just don't stand the scrutiny. Loyalty programs are a marekting expense, not a line item. Pure and simple, this kind of stuff is greed and arrogance. If you like it, just keep doing nothing about it. You can be sure they will have more surprises for you.
What's the factual basis for some of the above statements? I've been upgraded into U on almost every SEA-SFO and SEA-DEN flight I've taken in the past few weeks. Those routes are certainly popular, so that claim doesn't apply to all popular routes.
No fuel surcharge on award tickets has been proposed by AS.
And capping the AS50 at $250 is not new. The AS50 changes that are proposed have to do with mileage accrual.
If revolutionary fervor is going to be whipped up, might as well do so with the actual changes. No one needs to make stuff up just to slam the airline. There's plenty of legit stuff to discuss.
Last edited by Seattlenerd; Jul 29, 08 at 7:30 am.
I've been flying AS since 1972 and remain an original mileage plan member. If this policy goes into effect, I will consider other carriers even if it severely limits my options. It will certainly make me question giving further business to AS.
I'm sorry, but these type of hysterics aren't going to work.
You should always fly the carrier that makes the most sense - whether that be the best price or schedule. Airlines are not under the delusion that frequent flier programs will create blind loyalty (though they sometimes will). Threatening to go to avoid AS, particularly if you're in Alaska, SEA or another market dominated by AS is somewhat of an empty threat.
Stick with a rational, well-thought out argument. It will carry a lot more weight.
Well, in a lot of ways, Southwest makes the most sense. The worse AS makes the first class experience, and the more expensive the premium, the less I'm inclined to pay more to fly them. Even earning 50% miles on the AS50 award will probably not get me MVP Gold renewal, and once that is gone I start paying change fees and stop getting upgrades and it's all over.
Just had a long talk with AS MP customer rep. There has been a lot of registered complaints about the new rules for the AS50. Management is seriously considering taking another look at that program and may revise its original November 1 rules.
One thought that has been considered by Alaska is to allow 50% of the miles flown for the new AS50. To me, this is better than nothing and might be a compromise...afterall, if we are getting 50% off on the fare...perhaps 50% for the miles flown would be fair.
The customer rep indicated that they are registering the complaints and appreciate the input from all their frequent flyers.
Also, I discussed the "segment flown" credit someone brought up here earlier. Under the new rules as they now stand, if you earn no miles, you DO NOT get credit for segments.
If anyone else has spoken with Milage Plan directly, I would like to hear your update on these issues too.
Good point sxf24. I sometimes get carried away over what seem to be irrational decisions by "bean counters". Been in higher education over 35 years so have certainly seen my share.
Just had a long talk with AS MP customer rep. There has been a lot of registered complaints about the new rules for the AS50. Management is seriously considering taking another look at that program and may revise its original November 1 rules.
One thought that has been considered by Alaska is to allow 50% of the miles flown for the new AS50. To me, this is better than nothing and might be a compromise...afterall, if we are getting 50% off on the fare...perhaps 50% for the miles flown would be fair.
The customer rep indicated that they are registering the complaints and appreciate the input from all their frequent flyers.
Also, I discussed the "segment flown" credit someone brought up here earlier. Under the new rules as they now stand, if you earn no miles, you DO NOT get credit for segments.
If anyone else has spoken with Milage Plan directly, I would like to hear your update on these issues too.
50% of the fare? If I buy a F for 1000$ after the discount and miles removed from my account, I'm thinking I deserve all the base miles that I would have accrued on buying the same fare in Y in using miles or coupons to upgrade.
Money and Miles Award Changes The AS50 Money and Miles award will continue to offer a 50 percent discount up to $250 for 15,000 miles round-trip; however, these awards will earn 50% of the mileage they earn today. These miles and 100% of the segments flown will count toward MVP/MVP Gold qualification. The change will apply to all Money and Miles awards booked on or after November 1, 2008.
Programs: Various bits of plastic with names of noble metals on them
Posts: 1,977
Well, that's better news. Good that Alaska is listening to feedback- even if I'd rather get ALL the mileage on an AS50.
I have to agree with QuietLion w/r/t as to what makes the most sense if you're going to be flying coach for the least cost (because most F in the US doesn't carry enough of a premium to pay for it, with the exception of VX...). If I'm in coach with no status, WN is arguably the best experience- no change fees, no charges for second bag, best on-time and good safety record, and so on, even though I have lousy luck flying on them (their SEA-LAS ontime sucks during the times where I usually fly them, and I've had multiple instances where passengers were removed from the plane for being too drunk).
Quote:
50% of the fare? If I buy a F for 1000$ after the discount and miles removed from my account, I'm thinking I deserve all the base miles that I would have accrued on buying the same fare in Y in using miles or coupons to upgrade.
Well, paid F gets 1.5 miles of mileage per mile flown, so 50% of that is 75%. But yeah, it does kind of create a perverse incentive that means F+AS50 is worth less in mileage than Y + coupon, or a U fare, or waiting until the 72/24 hour mark. Outside of the routes where U availability never shows up...
Well, that's better news. Good that Alaska is listening to feedback- even if I'd rather get ALL the mileage on an AS50.
I think its good news and from most perspectives, quite fair.
Award tickets have never earned miles or segments so it makes sense that 1/2 price award tickets would earn 50% of the total miles. A slightly better compromise would be to grant 100% EQMs while keeping 50% redeemable miles.
January came early!!! 
