F Lav Policy - Poorly Enforced Generally on AS?
May 12, 2014, 4:15 pm
#16
Join Date: Jan 2008
Programs: AS MVPG, CO, NW(now DL), Flying Blue
Posts: 6,554
I like to leave the seat forward and then when some one adds their full body weight the seat....hit the recline button
May 12, 2014, 4:31 pm
#17
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: JNU
Programs: HH D, AS MM/MVPG for life/AL, Awesome Wipes VIP Club, NEXUS, Hertz 5-Star Gold
Posts: 2,893
The FA's request that people in Coach use the lavatories in rear of plane
But I've heard from AS FA's that they can get in trouble ( written up) if they deny the "wrong" person use of the lav up front.
Remember you have everyone sitting in Coach from newbies to MVP G 75k'ers
But I've heard from AS FA's that they can get in trouble ( written up) if they deny the "wrong" person use of the lav up front.
Remember you have everyone sitting in Coach from newbies to MVP G 75k'ers
If trouble ensues and I was the FA getting in trouble for enforcing the policy that is part of the pre-departure recitation (i.e., "Please use the lavatories provided in your cabin. There is a lav in the first class cabin for F pax; the rest of you must use the ones in back or mid-cabin, as the case may be"), I would be filing a grievance with AFA stat.
Either everyone from Y gets turned around or they do away with the sham of lav-use enforcement. This mugwump approach that's in place now is not working at all.
Last edited by dave1013; May 12, 2014 at 6:03 pm Reason: Spelling
May 12, 2014, 5:21 pm
#18
Join Date: Jan 2008
Programs: AS MVPG, CO, NW(now DL), Flying Blue
Posts: 6,554
Granted there are all stripes of elite-ness sitting in Y on any given flight. But there's no expedient way for an FA to know someone's standing in the caste system. And for that reason, I would question the peril an FA would put him or herself in by turning an "intruder" around when they attempt to access the F lav. Sure, they could tell the "intruder" to wait while they looked up their status on the manifest. Or they could "card" the person. This takes their time away from other important duties.
If trouble ensues and I was the FA getting in trouble for enforcing the policy that is part of the pre-departure recitation (i.e., "Please use the lavatories provided in your cabin. There is a lav in the first class cabin for F pax; the rest of you must use the ones in back or mid-cabin, as the case may be"), I would be filing a grievance with AFA stat.
Either everyone from Y gets turned around or they do away with the sham of lav-use enforcement. This mugwump approach that's in place now is now working at all.
If trouble ensues and I was the FA getting in trouble for enforcing the policy that is part of the pre-departure recitation (i.e., "Please use the lavatories provided in your cabin. There is a lav in the first class cabin for F pax; the rest of you must use the ones in back or mid-cabin, as the case may be"), I would be filing a grievance with AFA stat.
Either everyone from Y gets turned around or they do away with the sham of lav-use enforcement. This mugwump approach that's in place now is now working at all.
May 12, 2014, 5:54 pm
#19
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: SEA
Programs: AS Million Miler since 2011, Lifetime MVPG
Posts: 853
.....you had a steady stream of Y passengers lining up either behind the curtain at row 5 or even standing at row 4 of F waiting for the forward lav to open up.
.....one flight attendant finally stood at the curtain saying "well now that all meal service is done, you can't come forward".
.....had already gotten used to busting through the curtain to come forward.
.....one flight attendant finally stood at the curtain saying "well now that all meal service is done, you can't come forward".
.....had already gotten used to busting through the curtain to come forward.
May 12, 2014, 5:54 pm
#20
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: MCI
Programs: DL FO
Posts: 280
Did not have this happen to me on AS, but on one of the last DL F flights I had, some thoughtless idiot kept using my seatback to pull himself up, and after the third time was a charm, he found himself flying back into his own seat when I pushed the button whilst he was pulling on my seat. He did not do that any times after that. When you have two herniated discs in your back, and you are finally comfortable and your seat suddenly shifts, it really hurts. So, people really need to learn a lesson about hurting other people and being retaliated against. I am not going to put up with it. And, no, even though I could use the extra help with the seatback, I push myself up from my seat using the armrest. It is just as easy as using the seatback.
May 12, 2014, 6:03 pm
#21
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 229
It's not a fun job playing lav police, believe me.
We do our best...we make the announcements as required and try to keep the forward lav available for the FC customers. But if the carts are out in the aisle and every seat is full (like normally to/from HI) there isn't much alternative for the folks in Y that have to 'go'. We make them wait at the curtain (yeah, if there is one...see the other thread on that) and if a FC passenger gets up and takes cuts while they're waiting behind them then that's perfectly fine by me. Y passengers on my flights are not lined up in the FC cabin but back at row 6. And they will have to wait if a FC passenger shows an intention to want to use the lav or gets out of their seat ahead of that waiting Y pax.
Once the carts are out of the aisle I will stop people and ask them to go to the rear that attempt to use it. But then it's a split second decision at times...are they elderly or infirm? A small child? I'll let them use it. But if you're an able-bodied adult or over 10 years old it's to the back for you.
We do our best...we make the announcements as required and try to keep the forward lav available for the FC customers. But if the carts are out in the aisle and every seat is full (like normally to/from HI) there isn't much alternative for the folks in Y that have to 'go'. We make them wait at the curtain (yeah, if there is one...see the other thread on that) and if a FC passenger gets up and takes cuts while they're waiting behind them then that's perfectly fine by me. Y passengers on my flights are not lined up in the FC cabin but back at row 6. And they will have to wait if a FC passenger shows an intention to want to use the lav or gets out of their seat ahead of that waiting Y pax.
Once the carts are out of the aisle I will stop people and ask them to go to the rear that attempt to use it. But then it's a split second decision at times...are they elderly or infirm? A small child? I'll let them use it. But if you're an able-bodied adult or over 10 years old it's to the back for you.
May 12, 2014, 6:09 pm
#22
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 39
As a FA, I'll chime in on this issue. The front lav issue continues to be as much of a hassle for us as it is for those sitting in FC. We know you hate the constant back and forth of folks from Y, waiting for the lav and the constant interruptions. If it were up to me there would be a mid-lav on every aircraft, but we all know it's not. Management has spoken, mid lavs are not being installed on future a/c and even the few a/c with them are being retrofit to take them out. Believe me when I say we FAs aren't happy with this decision either.
The challenge on our long haul flights is that we do a lot of service...typical trans-con includes: passing out entertainment players, 3 full beverage carts, one pick up cart, as well as a water service and drinks by request. Our passengers expect this level of service and most FAs are happy to provide this level of service. Three beverage services plus water plus whatever else folks have brought with them requires bathroom breaks...and whatever we give out we have to pick up....so there we are in the aisle again. What to do? Cut back on the service?
When I am the FC attendant, I try very hard to keep the flow of people to the FC lav to a minimum, but it's not always possible. Children & elderly are always welcome to come forward and when the carts are in the aisle, I still try to make sure FC has priority. Once the main cabin service is complete I routinely make an announcement to please use the lavs in the back....but you all know nobody listens. I try to tell folks individually but that's where the trouble starts. Rows 6-8 are full of Golds who missed the FC seat, they want to come forward.... non-status fliers see this and assume they can come forward too. It's a battle on every flight and one honestly, I can't win.
Would love suggestions or better yet, let Brad & Ben know your thoughts! Until then we try our best!
The challenge on our long haul flights is that we do a lot of service...typical trans-con includes: passing out entertainment players, 3 full beverage carts, one pick up cart, as well as a water service and drinks by request. Our passengers expect this level of service and most FAs are happy to provide this level of service. Three beverage services plus water plus whatever else folks have brought with them requires bathroom breaks...and whatever we give out we have to pick up....so there we are in the aisle again. What to do? Cut back on the service?
When I am the FC attendant, I try very hard to keep the flow of people to the FC lav to a minimum, but it's not always possible. Children & elderly are always welcome to come forward and when the carts are in the aisle, I still try to make sure FC has priority. Once the main cabin service is complete I routinely make an announcement to please use the lavs in the back....but you all know nobody listens. I try to tell folks individually but that's where the trouble starts. Rows 6-8 are full of Golds who missed the FC seat, they want to come forward.... non-status fliers see this and assume they can come forward too. It's a battle on every flight and one honestly, I can't win.
Would love suggestions or better yet, let Brad & Ben know your thoughts! Until then we try our best!
May 12, 2014, 6:25 pm
#23
Join Date: Jan 2008
Programs: AS MVPG, CO, NW(now DL), Flying Blue
Posts: 6,554
As a FA, I'll chime in on this issue. The front lav issue continues to be as much of a hassle for us as it is for those sitting in FC. We know you hate the constant back and forth of folks from Y, waiting for the lav and the constant interruptions. If it were up to me there would be a mid-lav on every aircraft, but we all know it's not. Management has spoken, mid lavs are not being installed on future a/c and even the few a/c with them are being retrofit to take them out. Believe me when I say we FAs aren't happy with this decision either.
The challenge on our long haul flights is that we do a lot of service...typical trans-con includes: passing out entertainment players, 3 full beverage carts, one pick up cart, as well as a water service and drinks by request. Our passengers expect this level of service and most FAs are happy to provide this level of service. Three beverage services plus water plus whatever else folks have brought with them requires bathroom breaks...and whatever we give out we have to pick up....so there we are in the aisle again. What to do? Cut back on the service?
When I am the FC attendant, I try very hard to keep the flow of people to the FC lav to a minimum, but it's not always possible. Children & elderly are always welcome to come forward and when the carts are in the aisle, I still try to make sure FC has priority. Once the main cabin service is complete I routinely make an announcement to please use the lavs in the back....but you all know nobody listens. I try to tell folks individually but that's where the trouble starts. Rows 6-8 are full of Golds who missed the FC seat, they want to come forward.... non-status fliers see this and assume they can come forward too. It's a battle on every flight and one honestly, I can't win.
Would love suggestions or better yet, let Brad & Brandon know your thoughts! Until then we try our best!
The challenge on our long haul flights is that we do a lot of service...typical trans-con includes: passing out entertainment players, 3 full beverage carts, one pick up cart, as well as a water service and drinks by request. Our passengers expect this level of service and most FAs are happy to provide this level of service. Three beverage services plus water plus whatever else folks have brought with them requires bathroom breaks...and whatever we give out we have to pick up....so there we are in the aisle again. What to do? Cut back on the service?
When I am the FC attendant, I try very hard to keep the flow of people to the FC lav to a minimum, but it's not always possible. Children & elderly are always welcome to come forward and when the carts are in the aisle, I still try to make sure FC has priority. Once the main cabin service is complete I routinely make an announcement to please use the lavs in the back....but you all know nobody listens. I try to tell folks individually but that's where the trouble starts. Rows 6-8 are full of Golds who missed the FC seat, they want to come forward.... non-status fliers see this and assume they can come forward too. It's a battle on every flight and one honestly, I can't win.
Would love suggestions or better yet, let Brad & Brandon know your thoughts! Until then we try our best!
Last edited by ANC; May 12, 2014 at 6:39 pm
May 12, 2014, 6:45 pm
#26
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: YVR
Posts: 625
As a FA, I'll chime in on this issue. The front lav issue continues to be as much of a hassle for us as it is for those sitting in FC. We know you hate the constant back and forth of folks from Y, waiting for the lav and the constant interruptions. If it were up to me there would be a mid-lav on every aircraft, but we all know it's not. Management has spoken, mid lavs are not being installed on future a/c and even the few a/c with them are being retrofit to take them out. Believe me when I say we FAs aren't happy with this decision either.
The challenge on our long haul flights is that we do a lot of service...typical trans-con includes: passing out entertainment players, 3 full beverage carts, one pick up cart, as well as a water service and drinks by request. Our passengers expect this level of service and most FAs are happy to provide this level of service. Three beverage services plus water plus whatever else folks have brought with them requires bathroom breaks...and whatever we give out we have to pick up....so there we are in the aisle again. What to do? Cut back on the service?
When I am the FC attendant, I try very hard to keep the flow of people to the FC lav to a minimum, but it's not always possible. Children & elderly are always welcome to come forward and when the carts are in the aisle, I still try to make sure FC has priority. Once the main cabin service is complete I routinely make an announcement to please use the lavs in the back....but you all know nobody listens. I try to tell folks individually but that's where the trouble starts. Rows 6-8 are full of Golds who missed the FC seat, they want to come forward.... non-status fliers see this and assume they can come forward too. It's a battle on every flight and one honestly, I can't win.
Would love suggestions or better yet, let Brad & Ben know your thoughts! Until then we try our best!
The challenge on our long haul flights is that we do a lot of service...typical trans-con includes: passing out entertainment players, 3 full beverage carts, one pick up cart, as well as a water service and drinks by request. Our passengers expect this level of service and most FAs are happy to provide this level of service. Three beverage services plus water plus whatever else folks have brought with them requires bathroom breaks...and whatever we give out we have to pick up....so there we are in the aisle again. What to do? Cut back on the service?
When I am the FC attendant, I try very hard to keep the flow of people to the FC lav to a minimum, but it's not always possible. Children & elderly are always welcome to come forward and when the carts are in the aisle, I still try to make sure FC has priority. Once the main cabin service is complete I routinely make an announcement to please use the lavs in the back....but you all know nobody listens. I try to tell folks individually but that's where the trouble starts. Rows 6-8 are full of Golds who missed the FC seat, they want to come forward.... non-status fliers see this and assume they can come forward too. It's a battle on every flight and one honestly, I can't win.
Would love suggestions or better yet, let Brad & Ben know your thoughts! Until then we try our best!
May 12, 2014, 6:48 pm
#27
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Atherton, CA
Programs: UA 1K, AA EXP; Owner, Green Bay Packers
Posts: 21,690
May 12, 2014, 7:03 pm
#28
Join Date: Jan 2008
Programs: AS MVPG, CO, NW(now DL), Flying Blue
Posts: 6,554
well I agree but too bad the same amount of respect and courtesy isnt shown by the passengers on board when it comes to the rules and regulations. Boarding orders are....ignored....carry on baggage rules.....are ignored. Seat belt signs are....ignored. Lavatory cabin rules are....IGNORED. I agree FAs on AS do a great job but at what point does the lack of respect of other passengers trump the flights other passengers. Sure like I said an upgraded elite we are used to the potty parade and it wont ever go away. What about the ma and pa kettle who just threw down $4000 for a paid F Hawaii trip or threw down 80K o 90K miles for an F trip to Hawaii(which took them 10 years to acquire the miles)? If they are having to compete and battle with coach passengers to get into the front lavatory in essence they are being partly ripped off
Last edited by ANC; May 12, 2014 at 7:13 pm
May 12, 2014, 7:07 pm
#29
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 5,956
Not true. I mean, true maybe that the FA did say that they could get in trouble but if you politely enforce the companies policy then you can not get in trouble - regardless of who it is. I've asked 75K's from the exit row to please go to the back when there are no carts in the aisle. They don't generally appreciate it but I'm polite and am just reminding them of the policy. If they take issue with the policy then I let them know that they should contact Alaska's Customer Care and address their concern with them. To be honest, I will do whatever I'm told. If I get a bulletin that says the curtain is coming down and anyone can use whichever lav they prefer regardless of their seat assignment then I won't bat an eye if the Y customers have a steady line for the forward lav. At this point, however, the policy is that you use the lav in your own cabin. Alaska made the policy and it's part of the FA's job to enforce it. Some do a better job than others.
May 12, 2014, 7:20 pm
#30
Join Date: Jan 2008
Programs: AS MVPG, CO, NW(now DL), Flying Blue
Posts: 6,554
Not true. I mean, true maybe that the FA did say that they could get in trouble but if you politely enforce the companies policy then you can not get in trouble - regardless of who it is. I've asked 75K's from the exit row to please go to the back when there are no carts in the aisle. They don't generally appreciate it but I'm polite and am just reminding them of the policy. If they take issue with the policy then I let them know that they should contact Alaska's Customer Care and address their concern with them. To be honest, I will do whatever I'm told. If I get a bulletin that says the curtain is coming down and anyone can use whichever lav they prefer regardless of their seat assignment then I won't bat an eye if the Y customers have a steady line for the forward lav. At this point, however, the policy is that you use the lav in your own cabin. Alaska made the policy and it's part of the FA's job to enforce it. Some do a better job than others.