cattp

I was planning to book Business Class from CDG-NRT outbound on AF and NGO-ICN-CDG on Korean Air all under one multi-destination booking but they wanted 3,075 eur for that routing under one booking. But if I book AMS-CDG-NRT and NGO-ICN-CDG-AMS it is 1980 eur. How can it be so much cheaper by adding segments on like that, I would be saving them money by going from CDG, since I am from UK and don't want to pay exorbitant taxes and fares. So is there any way around this or am I gonna have to just take the extra segment?

Goldorak

Different markets, different pricing. Only incentive to attract connecting pax is to have attractive fares. Otherwise you take the non-stop from your departure point.

HasteFlier

Indeed, as Goldorak says, it's a matter of markets.

If NGO-ICN-CDG-AMS was the same price as NGO-ICN-AMS (for example - not sure if KE or OZ fly it), no one would fly the long route - hence, it's logical to have a lower price, since it's an inferior product in schedule terms.
This is something you'll see in most cases. For example, in my experience, it's almost always cheaper to fly NCE-CDG-Anywhere AF goes, than to fly CDG-that same anywhere. The same applies to BA connecting in LHR, or any other airline.

Then, on many cases, airlines cannot fill a direct long-haul route with higher-paying direct pax, hence the need to fill part of the plane with lower-paying connecting passengers.

As prices are generally calculated on the base of the market, and due to the previous explanations, I'm afraid you have no way around it...

irishguy28

Because, as you have just demonstrated so well, even when offered a discount of €1095 to take an even more circuitous route, you still want to take the more direct one.

This is a bad example given that none of your flights are actually direct, non-stop flights. But people are willing to pay a premium for direct, hassle-free, no-change-needed flights. Therefore, when an airline has an indirect routing it can offer, they have to offer it at a (large) discount. But only to some people, such as you. For those people searching for an alternate route serviced by one/some of your flights - say, the ICN-CDG or NRT-CDG route [so: for people flying from Seoul or Tokyo direct to Paris] - they will be paying FAR MORE than what you are paying on your NGO-ICN-CDG-AMS ticket.

NickB

While this is true, nonetheless, this is not the key determinant of fares, at least not directly. The dominance of a carrier at an airport together with the general level of fares that the particular market can afford are, it seems to me, far, far more significant price determinants than the direct or indirect nature of the routing. Of course, the two are not unrelated: because people tend to prefer direct flights, airlines that offer direct flights will normally be in a dominant position on the relevant market. However, it is the latter which is the main determinant, not the former.
For instance, you do not normally pay lower prices on a long-haul itinerary on AF because you start in NCE, MRS or TLS (indirect flights) compared to CDG (direct flight). You do not normally pay lower fares on BA when starting from NCL, EDI or MAN (indirect) rather than LHR (direct). You tend to pay higher fares on AF from FR origins because AF is the dominant carrier in France. Ditto for BA in GB.

On the second key determinant (what the market will generally bear), some markets are more easy or difficult to sell from than others. IME, for instance, business class fares are rarely quite as heavily discounted ex-France as they can occasionally be from a number of other origins, such as Italy, the Netherlands, Belgium, etc... I do not really know why this is so. Perhaps there is less demand from the premium leisure market ex-FR than is the case from some other origins and there would be a greater risk of cannibalising higher business class fares than elsewhere.
While you do occasionally come across some very good business class fares from France, IME this tends to be less often than from Italy or Germany, for instance.

irishguy28

While this is true, it's also not particularly relevant to the case the OP highlighted; NGO-ICN-CDG-AMS contains no domestic sectors; so the "domestic sector doesn't affect price" rule is not in play here.

AlicorporateUK

When, for a period of time, I was based in Warsaw-Poland, I noticed that J fares (on AF-KL-DL-AZ) were (in normal circumstances, with no sales involved etc.), significantly cheaper than those originating from other Countries. I always thought (as a person with a limited to very poor knowledge within this field) that this had either to do with prices being aligned to the local's average living standards, relatively poor market demand or to face the main carrier (LOT, and Star Alliance, overall) offering reasonably cheap J fares all-year-round.

G

sbams

If you are from the UK you may want to search for fares originating in the UK, but then via AMS or CDG (for example), as opposed to BA direct routes. The taxes are often negated by the incentive of lower fares for circuitous connections (as many others have described).

In any case, if you are originating in the UK you will have to reach CDG or AMS in some way to take advantage of the routings in your post.

cattp

From my local airport BHX, on KLM/AF it's still a lot more (over a thousand I think?), I don't know why but that's why I'd just take a cheap flight across to AMS from the UK on CityJet,easyJet,KLM,BA (Whoever is cheapest) and start my itinerary from there. AMS always seems consistently cheap for nearly everything I search, and when leaving longhaul I check nearly all Euro airports.

irishguy28

I'd love to know what routes you search!

It's been so long since I bought a longhaul ticket departing from AMS - it's usually cheaper to depart from nearly anywhere else! (I'm off to Oslo again this week to start another trip! If you want to stick with KLM, you should start from Belgium...)

christravelblog

This is mainly to get people from other countries not fly their national airlines. So getting people from all over europe to AMS/CDG and then the longhaul.

AF/KL had ,still have i think (see premium fair thread in mileage runs) for 999 euro bizz from MAD/BCN to Various China destinations. To add a AMS-MAD/BCN flight of 99 euro would make it 1098 euro in bizz to china.... a direct flight could be well over 2000 euro.

it is Always wise to check around for local promotion and fares.

myself i'm not direct located near AMS in the Netherlands, so i Always check Belgium & Germany airports to start my trip.

Henry III

Slightly OT but, for your records (if you keep such things), I recently bought a very decent price L/H ticket ex AMS: AMS-AKL round-trip, business class ... £1,700! [Typical 'low' prices for EUR-AKL in biz were showing around £2,400.]

It's not actually on KLM: it's a CI ticket, via TPE, with technical stops in BKK and SYD/BNE. I was surprised, actually, as I usually expect L/H biz prices to be lowest from 'connecting' airports such as BRU and DUS.

-- Henry

AJCNL

That is extremely cheap, at that price I would consider it though added to the two tech stops the transfer in TPE is rather long isn't it, or are you stopping over? CI and CZ seem to vie to be the cheapest on the Kangaroo route ex AMS.

Henry III

The tech stops are a bit of a pain - but, hey, at that price, what the heck! I assume we'll be forced off/on the plane at BKK (~1h 45m stops), but that gives me (hopefully) a chance for some nicotine uptake (); probably no chance of that, though, at the Ozzie stops.

I get 10 hour and 15 hour layovers in TPE (both during the daytime): this suits me, as I get a chance to go into town and have a wee look around (and sample some local cuisine); and also a good break of a long trip (I'm not that bothered about overall journey time).

-- Henry

AJCNL

Absolutely no chance of a smoke at Australian airports!!

CZ gives a free day room for a stopover of more than 8 hours, I guess CI don't?

If you feel like reporting back on the experience I'd be interested to hear, they are high on my list for a C class award ticket on that route.