Last seat redemption for F award on AF
#16
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,794
If by "borrow" you mean having someone give you their Flying Blue login details, then I think you are on to a non-starter. Sharing of login details is not allowed and never a good idea. You would have to be the one to take the risk (not the "volunteer") and hope that whoever you transferred your hundreds of thousands of Amex MR points to would book the ticket that you wanted in your name.
But this is all rather academic. Very few of us think that there will ever be a redemption F seat available again for this particular flight. If you cancel your revenue booking, you probably will not end up travelling at all on this flight (unless you later buy the same seat back at a much higher price).
But this is all rather academic. Very few of us think that there will ever be a redemption F seat available again for this particular flight. If you cancel your revenue booking, you probably will not end up travelling at all on this flight (unless you later buy the same seat back at a much higher price).
#17
Join Date: May 2010
Programs: Delta Silver, HH Gold, Accor Gold, IHG Platinum
Posts: 5,338
Apparently, AF has decided to cancel all flights in F booked by non-Elite members. PAX are not happy. http://boardingarea.com/onemileatati...award-tickets/
#18
FlyerTalk Evangelist, Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere between 0 and 13,000 metres high
Programs: AF/KL Life Plat, BA GGL+GfL, ALL Plat, Hilton Diam, Marriott Gold, blablablah, etc
Posts: 30,353
Apparently, AF has decided to cancel all flights in F booked by non-Elite members. PAX are not happy. http://boardingarea.com/onemileatati...award-tickets/
That said, what is an "award booking service"??? Don't tell me some people charge money to book award seats? It sounds most dodgy to me.
#19
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,232
What counts - when booked or when traveled ?
What happens in the following scenario - I am ELITE, book an F class award then lose my elite status after the the qualifying year ends. Technically, I booked while an ELITE but will travel as a NON-ELITE.
?????
?????
#20
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: GLA
Programs: AF/KL FB Plat 4L, VA Vel Silver, BA EC, LH M&M
Posts: 1,825
I would not expect a problem in this case. Otherwise this would mean that honouring a ticket would be conditional on the passenger achieving a certain amount of level miles. Not even AF would come up with such a weird idea.
#21
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: The World! Home Base = DCA/IAD
Programs: HHonors, Hyatt GP, Marriott, Varying Levels w/ UA /AF /DL /SQ /AA
Posts: 2,664
Not dodgy at all. Also, if they don't find what you're looking for, you don't pay anything.
Inside Flyer (the paper magazine, not sure about whether or not they had it online) recently had a rundown of some of the offerings out there, along with the prices. Something to look into if time is tight (whether you're busy or coming up to a deadline) and if the prices work for you.
#23
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,550
#25
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: The World! Home Base = DCA/IAD
Programs: HHonors, Hyatt GP, Marriott, Varying Levels w/ UA /AF /DL /SQ /AA
Posts: 2,664
Then again, some people also use financial apps like Mint and Check (formerly PageOnce), which require IDs and PWs for banking details and the like, so I suppose it really comes down to who people feel they can trust.
With the award services, one could probably get the award flight information and book it themselves, but I don't know that for sure, you'd have to ask the various booking services.
Last edited by TravelinWilly; Feb 11, 2014 at 4:57 pm Reason: Edited to CMA. :)
#26
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,550
In Europe, giving away your banking passwords would make you solely liable for the consequences if any fraudulent transactions appeared on your account.
Whatever about the US, I can't imagine many European FFPs being enthusiastic about their members sharing login details with third parties.
Whatever about the US, I can't imagine many European FFPs being enthusiastic about their members sharing login details with third parties.
#27
FlyerTalk Evangelist, Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere between 0 and 13,000 metres high
Programs: AF/KL Life Plat, BA GGL+GfL, ALL Plat, Hilton Diam, Marriott Gold, blablablah, etc
Posts: 30,353
In Europe, giving away your banking passwords would make you solely liable for the consequences if any fraudulent transactions appeared on your account.
Whatever about the US, I can't imagine many European FFPs being enthusiastic about their members sharing login details with third parties.
Whatever about the US, I can't imagine many European FFPs being enthusiastic about their members sharing login details with third parties.
1.3.8 Any person whose membership application has been accepted by the Company shall obtain an individual account, membership number and a PIN allowing access to the Internet and any other services described in the FB Communication. The membership number will be required for any inquiry concerning the account. The PIN will always be communicated to the Member and only to the Member. The Member is responsible for the usage of his PIN and shall not disclose the PIN to any third party.
Several other European FFPs have similar clauses.
#28
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: The World! Home Base = DCA/IAD
Programs: HHonors, Hyatt GP, Marriott, Varying Levels w/ UA /AF /DL /SQ /AA
Posts: 2,664
Okay, I'm now taking this just about as far OT as I can go, apologies to FB members, these are the last comments I'll make on this matter on this board... But in my defense, it all started innocently.
Interestingly, in the USA United, American, and Delta all, have enjoined aggregating websites (e.g., awardwallet.com, amongst others, who allow for "one stop shopping" of mileage balances, status levels, etc. for airlines, hotels, rental car companies, credit cards, etc.) from scraping their systems for data, meaning that subscribers to those various sites could no longer rely on mileage updates through the use of such sites. One of the sites came up with a workaround for United (they had members create email accounts that are associated with the website, and then go to ual.com and change the email on file to the new site email, so once a month when UA sends out balance emails, the site will update member accounts).
American relented with awardwallet.com, and my understanding is that now they allow it, so they know that people are putting in their AA FF#s and PWs. And I suspect that they're okay with it, presumably after looking at the site's policies for storing data, encryption, etc. I can't prove it, though, as I really don't have a clue as to how any of those sites really work.
I would think that European carriers could just as easily stop third party sites from such activity if they wanted to, and the fact that they haven't stopped them leads me to suspect that they're okay with it. And the same would go for financial institutions that allow mint.com etc. to aggregate financial data. It is within their power to curtail such use.
Interestingly, AF's FB is available on awardwallet.com, amongst other aggregating sites (I just looked, they list out who's supported), so either they're not aware of it, or they tacitly approve of it, T&C wording (which is often times there as a broad protection for the FFP) to the contrary or not. Lufthansa and BA and SQ and TG and QF (and the list is quite long...) are also "participants" in such sites. I'm not saying that's good, I'm just saying what is.
Okay, back to our regularly-scheduled programming...
In Europe, giving away your banking passwords would make you solely liable for the consequences if any fraudulent transactions appeared on your account.
Whatever about the US, I can't imagine many European FFPs being enthusiastic about their members sharing login details with third parties.
Whatever about the US, I can't imagine many European FFPs being enthusiastic about their members sharing login details with third parties.
American relented with awardwallet.com, and my understanding is that now they allow it, so they know that people are putting in their AA FF#s and PWs. And I suspect that they're okay with it, presumably after looking at the site's policies for storing data, encryption, etc. I can't prove it, though, as I really don't have a clue as to how any of those sites really work.
I would think that European carriers could just as easily stop third party sites from such activity if they wanted to, and the fact that they haven't stopped them leads me to suspect that they're okay with it. And the same would go for financial institutions that allow mint.com etc. to aggregate financial data. It is within their power to curtail such use.
It's actually formally in breach of FB T&C:
1.3.8 Any person whose membership application has been accepted by the Company shall obtain an individual account, membership number and a PIN allowing access to the Internet and any other services described in the FB Communication. The membership number will be required for any inquiry concerning the account. The PIN will always be communicated to the Member and only to the Member. The Member is responsible for the usage of his PIN and shall not disclose the PIN to any third party.
Several other European FFPs have similar clauses.
1.3.8 Any person whose membership application has been accepted by the Company shall obtain an individual account, membership number and a PIN allowing access to the Internet and any other services described in the FB Communication. The membership number will be required for any inquiry concerning the account. The PIN will always be communicated to the Member and only to the Member. The Member is responsible for the usage of his PIN and shall not disclose the PIN to any third party.
Several other European FFPs have similar clauses.
Okay, back to our regularly-scheduled programming...
#29
FlyerTalk Evangelist, Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere between 0 and 13,000 metres high
Programs: AF/KL Life Plat, BA GGL+GfL, ALL Plat, Hilton Diam, Marriott Gold, blablablah, etc
Posts: 30,353
Okay, I'm now taking this just about as far OT as I can go, apologies to FB members, these are the last comments I'll make on this matter on this board... But in my defense, it all started innocently.
Interestingly, in the USA United, American, and Delta all, have enjoined aggregating websites (e.g., awardwallet.com, amongst others, who allow for "one stop shopping" of mileage balances, status levels, etc. for airlines, hotels, rental car companies, credit cards, etc.) from scraping their systems for data, meaning that subscribers to those various sites could no longer rely on mileage updates through the use of such sites. One of the sites came up with a workaround for United (they had members create email accounts that are associated with the website, and then go to ual.com and change the email on file to the new site email, so once a month when UA sends out balance emails, the site will update member accounts).
American relented with awardwallet.com, and my understanding is that now they allow it, so they know that people are putting in their AA FF#s and PWs. And I suspect that they're okay with it, presumably after looking at the site's policies for storing data, encryption, etc. I can't prove it, though, as I really don't have a clue as to how any of those sites really work.
I would think that European carriers could just as easily stop third party sites from such activity if they wanted to, and the fact that they haven't stopped them leads me to suspect that they're okay with it. And the same would go for financial institutions that allow mint.com etc. to aggregate financial data. It is within their power to curtail such use.
Interestingly, AF's FB is available on awardwallet.com, amongst other aggregating sites (I just looked, they list out who's supported), so either they're not aware of it, or they tacitly approve of it, T&C wording (which is often times there as a broad protection for the FFP) to the contrary or not. Lufthansa and BA and SQ and TG and QF (and the list is quite long...) are also "participants" in such sites. I'm not saying that's good, I'm just saying what is.
Okay, back to our regularly-scheduled programming...
Interestingly, in the USA United, American, and Delta all, have enjoined aggregating websites (e.g., awardwallet.com, amongst others, who allow for "one stop shopping" of mileage balances, status levels, etc. for airlines, hotels, rental car companies, credit cards, etc.) from scraping their systems for data, meaning that subscribers to those various sites could no longer rely on mileage updates through the use of such sites. One of the sites came up with a workaround for United (they had members create email accounts that are associated with the website, and then go to ual.com and change the email on file to the new site email, so once a month when UA sends out balance emails, the site will update member accounts).
American relented with awardwallet.com, and my understanding is that now they allow it, so they know that people are putting in their AA FF#s and PWs. And I suspect that they're okay with it, presumably after looking at the site's policies for storing data, encryption, etc. I can't prove it, though, as I really don't have a clue as to how any of those sites really work.
I would think that European carriers could just as easily stop third party sites from such activity if they wanted to, and the fact that they haven't stopped them leads me to suspect that they're okay with it. And the same would go for financial institutions that allow mint.com etc. to aggregate financial data. It is within their power to curtail such use.
Interestingly, AF's FB is available on awardwallet.com, amongst other aggregating sites (I just looked, they list out who's supported), so either they're not aware of it, or they tacitly approve of it, T&C wording (which is often times there as a broad protection for the FFP) to the contrary or not. Lufthansa and BA and SQ and TG and QF (and the list is quite long...) are also "participants" in such sites. I'm not saying that's good, I'm just saying what is.
Okay, back to our regularly-scheduled programming...
What I think, on the other hand, is that breaching the T&Cs makes one very vulnerable if anything goes wrong. The moment a security breach happens and a booking takes place that should not (e.g. some smart a** gets access to the system and trades someone else's miles for cash) the airlines will go for the 'easiest solution' which will be to say that the account owner breached his/her T&Cs and delete the accounts. If no such 'funny' thing happens, I don't think there will be any consequences.