Reasonable grounds means some reason, observation and would not include stopping 100% of everyone trying to board an international flight to induce self-incrimination and it borders on detention without cause banned in the Charter of Rights.
Do a lot of these suspects braced in the jetway actually confess? They must be total idiots.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon
Given this is the same crew that decided "oh, let's 'work to rule' and send EVERYONE with laptops to secondary" one night, I wouldn't put anything past them.
Simon
that's not work to rule.
work to rule is using stupid, but existent, rules to inconvenience the client in the hope of making a point.
last time i checked, there was no rule that an individual with a laptop has to go into secondary.
Quote:
Originally Posted by taupo
It would be too bad if he has gone. For the most part people did not attack him, when it did happen others defended him.
I would not be surprised if CBSA became aware of the thread and sent a subsequent email to all YYZ based CBSA personnel to cease and desist. What they don't realise, is that CBSAguy was an asset to them.
i would be surprised if CBSA intel actually has an internet connection in their offices.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CBSAguy
A tried and true method of developing reasonable grounds to suspect is by asking questions.
...and when that person uses the tried, tested, and true methods of using their charter right not to answer those questions................
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They have NO RIGHT to be asking all the questions. FULL STOP. If they were "working to rule", here are the rules. Quote these next time, and if they continue to hassle you, ask for a supervisor.
From: CIC Document ENF 4 -- Port of Entry Examinations 8.8. Basic questioning
Basic questioning should cover the following areas, as appropriate:
Issue Question Explanation
Identity What is your name? This will enable an officer to identify the person. The name should be verified against the referral card, identity documents and the airline ticket.
Citizenship Of what country are you a citizen?
The officer should ask this of each person being examined and ensure that the person's stated citizenship matches the identity document they present.
This response will help an officer determine passport and visa requirements. If satisfied that the person is a Canadian citizen, the officer should allow the person to enter Canada without further questioning.
AND FURTHER...
9.1. The right to come into Canada
A Canadian citizen within the meaning of sections 3 and 4 of the Citizenship Act has a right to enter and remain in Canada pursuant to section A19(1) of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act. 9.2. Examination of Canadian citizens
Subsection A15(1) provides for an officer to proceed with an examination where a person makes an application to the officer in accordance with the Act.
Subsection R28(b) provides that a person seeking to enter Canada is making an application.
Additionally, A18(1) requires every person seeking to enter Canada to appear for an examination to determine whether they have the right to enter Canada or may be authorized to enter and remain in Canada. This includes Canadian citizens.
An immigration officer will normally examine a Canadian citizen only when the PIL officer doubts the person’s citizenship. An officer at a port of entry should examine Canadian citizens as expeditiously as possible. Once an officer establishes that a person is a Canadian, the examination should end and the person should be allowed to enter Canada without further delay.
It is not appropriate for officers to elicit further personal information from a Canadian citizen.
Canadian citizens may be asked to willingly provide additional information if it will assist an officer in determining the admissibility of an accompanying foreign national.
They have NO RIGHT to be asking all the questions. FULL STOP. If they were "working to rule", here are the rules. Quote these next time, and if they continue to hassle you, ask for a supervisor.
From: CIC Document ENF 4 -- Port of Entry Examinations 8.8. Basic questioning
Basic questioning should cover the following areas, as appropriate:
Issue Question Explanation
Identity What is your name? This will enable an officer to identify the person. The name should be verified against the referral card, identity documents and the airline ticket.
Citizenship Of what country are you a citizen?
The officer should ask this of each person being examined and ensure that the person's stated citizenship matches the identity document they present.
This response will help an officer determine passport and visa requirements. If satisfied that the person is a Canadian citizen, the officer should allow the person to enter Canada without further questioning.
AND FURTHER...
9.1. The right to come into Canada
A Canadian citizen within the meaning of sections 3 and 4 of the Citizenship Act has a right to enter and remain in Canada pursuant to section A19(1) of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act. 9.2. Examination of Canadian citizens
Subsection A15(1) provides for an officer to proceed with an examination where a person makes an application to the officer in accordance with the Act.
Subsection R28(b) provides that a person seeking to enter Canada is making an application.
Additionally, A18(1) requires every person seeking to enter Canada to appear for an examination to determine whether they have the right to enter Canada or may be authorized to enter and remain in Canada. This includes Canadian citizens.
An immigration officer will normally examine a Canadian citizen only when the PIL officer doubts the person’s citizenship. An officer at a port of entry should examine Canadian citizens as expeditiously as possible. Once an officer establishes that a person is a Canadian, the examination should end and the person should be allowed to enter Canada without further delay.
It is not appropriate for officers to elicit further personal information from a Canadian citizen.
Canadian citizens may be asked to willingly provide additional information if it will assist an officer in determining the admissibility of an accompanying foreign national.
This again? Really?
The manual you are quoting is a CIC manual and relates ONLY to the immigration portion of the examination.
Unless you have successfully completed the CBSA Port of Entry Recruit Training program, read the Customs enforcement and traveller processing manuals as well as the Customs Act, IRPA, Health of Animals Act, Plant Protection Act, and Quarantine Act in their entirety, stop speaking with such authority on this topic.
Unless you have successfully completed the CBSA Port of Entry Recruit Training program, read the Customs enforcement and traveller processing manuals as well as the Customs Act, IRPA, Health of Animals Act, Plant Protection Act, and Quarantine Act in their entirety
Oops, looks like you forgot the Seeds Act, Canada Grain Act, Fertilizers Act, Feeds Act, Fish Inspection Act, Meat Inspection Act, Plant Breeders' Rights Act, and many others: http://www.infosource.gc.ca/inst/bsf/fed03_e.asp
Oops, looks like you forgot the Seeds Act, Canada Grain Act, Fertilizers Act, Feeds Act, Fish Inspection Act, Meat Inspection Act, Plant Breeders' Rights Act, and many others: http://www.infosource.gc.ca/inst/bsf/fed03_e.asp
Indeed. And many more. Though, I must admit, the Plant Breeders' Rights Act is a new one on me. Probably applies more to commercial operations. I'll have to give it a read, though.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CBSAguy
This again? Really?
The manual you are quoting is a CIC manual and relates ONLY to the immigration portion of the examination.
Unless you have successfully completed the CBSA Port of Entry Recruit Training program, read the Customs enforcement and traveller processing manuals as well as the Customs Act, IRPA, Health of Animals Act, Plant Protection Act, and Quarantine Act in their entirety, stop speaking with such authority on this topic.
Quite simply, you are wrong.
As well as the How To Let Power Go To Your Head Act, How To Be A Rude ....... Act, and many others. In fact, the long list of regulations you SUPPOSEDLY enforce listed at http://www.infosource.gc.ca/inst/bsf/fed03_e.asp, only points out the fact we live in an over-regulated police state. About the only saving grace is that you and your colleagues haven't read or understand the tonnes of crap as evidenced by the inconsistent and incompetent application we see everyday.
As well as the How To Let Power Go To Your Head Act, How To Be A Rude ....... Act, and many others. In fact, the long list of regulations you SUPPOSEDLY enforce listed at http://www.infosource.gc.ca/inst/bsf/fed03_e.asp, only points out the fact we live in an over-regulated police state. About the only saving grace is that you and your colleagues haven't read or understand the tonnes of crap as evidenced by the inconsistent and incompetent application we see everyday.
What crawled up your .a$$? I would rather be asked an essay of questions and have a more controlled border. If you really dont want to talk join CANPASS, great option for those of us who dont enjoy standing in a line.
Maybe you should move somewhere like mexico, I wasnt asked a single question and only had to push a button to get in a week ago. Thats horrible border control if you ask me. Hopefully Canada gets more uptight about who they let in.
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Slightly OT...
... but last week I had the dreaded RR ( I think it was anyway) on my Nexus Card. As I learned when I arrived at the T1 US customs booth (prior to baggage drop off, where you hand in your customs card), this meant secondary inspection.
Relatively painless - just asked to see my Nexus card, and passport - then sent me on my way.
What crawled up your .a$$? I would rather be asked an essay of questions and have a more controlled border. If you really dont want to talk join CANPASS, great option for those of us who dont enjoy standing in a line.
Maybe you should move somewhere like mexico, I wasnt asked a single question and only had to push a button to get in a week ago. Thats horrible border control if you ask me. Hopefully Canada gets more uptight about who they let in.
Mr. Baxter, if that is indeed who you are, you are not even 20yrs old and apparently you have great experience of borders, immigration and customs around the world that qualifies you to make such statements. If you were a bit older and travelled more in other countries you would know that Canada stands out in the world for not only having rude, intrusive, nosy border agents fishing for incriminating information from bona fide citizens but also a record for letting in a succession of Nazis after WW2, African warlords, bogus economic refugees from the Caribbean and numerous other types that are rejected by most other countries. However, our border people make it a point to grill our own citizens when they want to re-enter their own country. That is what people are complaining about on this thread.
If you bought stuff, say in the US, and you're over your exemption limit, is the value of goods (for paying GST + PST) calculated with any state tax paid or without?
Ie. Shirt bought @ $59.99 + $5.10 tax... Is the value of goods $59.99 or $65.09?
If you bought stuff, say in the US, and you're over your exemption limit, is the value of goods (for paying GST + PST) calculated with any state tax paid or without?
I believe you're supposed to declare the value including any VAT, sales tax, etc. It's less clear to me what happens if you receive a tax rebate.
