OT: Are you on a "management consultant" TN?
Jun 17, 2007, 1:36 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2006
Programs: aeroplan
Posts: 88
OT: Are you on a "management consultant" TN?
Hello everyone,
I am wondering if you can assist me with a few questions I have relating to NAFTA's auspicious title of 'Management Consultant' and your experience getting it.
Last year when I went to the Rainbow Bridge to apply for a TN visa under "Management Consultant" title, I was heavily scrutinized by the INS officer on duty before finally getting the paper stamped. I am not certain if this was because I got the assistance of an immigration attorney per a friend's suggestion (I heard from few sources later that the officers don't like to see attorneys as it gives a notion it undermines their credibility??) or he was just in a bad mood, but it was a grueling 20 minutes of Spanish inquisition that I wish to avoid this time.
As far as what I do, I do exactly what a MC does, so am not too worried about a misfit job title or not being able to answer a certain question correctly. I have B.Sc degree from a Canadian university (not related to my field though) as well have letters from previous employees documented to show proof of my 5+ years of work experience.
Now that I have an offer from a new client in the US, I am contemplating on applying for my new TN at YYZ pre-clearance instead. I am wondering if YYZ is just as brutal? I’ve heard some horror stories of people getting yelled at for minor issues and people walking out in tears, so this is really freaking me out. I would appreciate if anyone out there can shed your experience, hopefully positive ones? I appreciate your time and thank you in advance.
I am wondering if you can assist me with a few questions I have relating to NAFTA's auspicious title of 'Management Consultant' and your experience getting it.
Last year when I went to the Rainbow Bridge to apply for a TN visa under "Management Consultant" title, I was heavily scrutinized by the INS officer on duty before finally getting the paper stamped. I am not certain if this was because I got the assistance of an immigration attorney per a friend's suggestion (I heard from few sources later that the officers don't like to see attorneys as it gives a notion it undermines their credibility??) or he was just in a bad mood, but it was a grueling 20 minutes of Spanish inquisition that I wish to avoid this time.
As far as what I do, I do exactly what a MC does, so am not too worried about a misfit job title or not being able to answer a certain question correctly. I have B.Sc degree from a Canadian university (not related to my field though) as well have letters from previous employees documented to show proof of my 5+ years of work experience.
Now that I have an offer from a new client in the US, I am contemplating on applying for my new TN at YYZ pre-clearance instead. I am wondering if YYZ is just as brutal? I’ve heard some horror stories of people getting yelled at for minor issues and people walking out in tears, so this is really freaking me out. I would appreciate if anyone out there can shed your experience, hopefully positive ones? I appreciate your time and thank you in advance.
Jun 17, 2007, 1:56 pm
#2
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: USA
Programs: UA/CO(1K-PLT), AA(PLT), QR, EK, Marriott(PLT), Hilton(DMND)
Posts: 9,538
Most american consular or immigration officials posted outside the u.s. like shouting at people they are supposed to be serving. Unfortunately, punching them in the face is not an option for most people so I'm afraid you are probably going to have to grin and bear it. Have fun dealing with them.
Jun 17, 2007, 3:47 pm
#3
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC*SE 2MM, Asia Miles, SPG Gold (life), HH Gold, Golden Circle Jade
Posts: 1,068
They will always heavily scrutinize you when you apply for this. They're very skeptical of it. Sometimes they will reject you for no apparent good reason. Be prepared, go very early, and our experience is that it works best at airports (vs land crossings).
Jun 17, 2007, 6:30 pm
#4
Join Date: Jan 2004
Programs: Inventor of the "Eskimojito" featuring Canadian Mint/Buquebus Rowing Team
Posts: 2,894
I have had a management consultant TN for the last couple of years. I had trouble the first time around, due to a cranky immigration officer. The second time around it took 5 minutes and was a breeze. The bad news is that now I obviously have something on my immigration file that causes me to be pulled aside for secondary interviews frequently. The management consultant category is one that they really will grill you on. Just be sure you have all of your documents in order. They also will ask for original diplomas occasionally too (once I was told a photocopy wasn't good enough).
Some advice I was given that's been helpful is to be straightforward and honest, but never to offer any extra information. I still break out into a cold sweat every time I stand in the line. I have to cross on Tuesday and I'm already worried about it!
Some advice I was given that's been helpful is to be straightforward and honest, but never to offer any extra information. I still break out into a cold sweat every time I stand in the line. I have to cross on Tuesday and I'm already worried about it!
Jun 18, 2007, 3:55 am
#5
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Toronto, Canada
Programs: AC*SE; AC 2MM; Marriott Platinum Elite
Posts: 621
I have had TN's for the last 12 years - the first 7 as a Systems Analyst and the last 5 as a Management Consultant.
The only thing I can assure you of is that there is largely no consistency to anything related to the application/approval process. It's more dependent on the personality/mood/experience of the officer dealing with your application.
I also lead a team of approx. 10 consultants - all with TN's. I am responsible for prepping them (along with our lawyers) on the process and they also come back with unbelievable stories of inconsistency.
The only thing I can assure you of is that there is largely no consistency to anything related to the application/approval process. It's more dependent on the personality/mood/experience of the officer dealing with your application.
I also lead a team of approx. 10 consultants - all with TN's. I am responsible for prepping them (along with our lawyers) on the process and they also come back with unbelievable stories of inconsistency.
Jun 18, 2007, 11:14 am
#6
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Victoria BC
Programs: AC *50K MM; WS Platinum; Marriott Lifetime Titanium Elite
Posts: 811
I haven't figured it out!
It's nuts - it really depends on the luck of the draw i.e. which officer you are lucky enough to get and whether or not s/he has had a good day. I have had my TN (as a management consultant) for 5 years now, and I almost didn't get my last one. I did everything I've always done - identical paperwork, same approach - but this time I was yelled at, in public. Absolutely mortifying, coupled with the fear that I was not going to get it this time! About twenty minutes into the ordeal, I realized that what the officer really needed from me was an acknowledgement that he was in the position of power; I was too busy trying to prove that I had everything he needed which was the wrong approach because I was making him defensive and intensifying the confrontation. Once I responded to that need, things started smoothing out. It ended well about 40 minutes later, but I am not looking forward to next year!
Jun 18, 2007, 7:28 pm
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2006
Programs: aeroplan
Posts: 88
Has anyone renewed your TN through mail instead? My recruiter is willing to do this but I will need to foot any addional cost. I am wondering if someone can recommend me decent immigration lawyers that are also affordable and have a good knowlege of TNs?
Jun 18, 2007, 7:52 pm
#8
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2006
Programs: aeroplan
Posts: 88
was this at YYZ or land crossing?
It's nuts - it really depends on the luck of the draw i.e. which officer you are lucky enough to get and whether or not s/he has had a good day. I have had my TN (as a management consultant) for 5 years now, and I almost didn't get my last one. I did everything I've always done - identical paperwork, same approach - but this time I was yelled at, in public. Absolutely mortifying, coupled with the fear that I was not going to get it this time! About twenty minutes into the ordeal, I realized that what the officer really needed from me was an acknowledgement that he was in the position of power; I was too busy trying to prove that I had everything he needed which was the wrong approach because I was making him defensive and intensifying the confrontation. Once I responded to that need, things started smoothing out. It ended well about 40 minutes later, but I am not looking forward to next year!
Jun 19, 2007, 12:51 am
#9
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Victoria BC
Programs: AC *50K MM; WS Platinum; Marriott Lifetime Titanium Elite
Posts: 811
Jun 19, 2007, 1:21 am
#10
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Seattle, Seoul, temporarily Shanghai
Programs: UA, AA, KE, OZ Hyatt Platinum, Int Ambassador,
Posts: 215
Unfortunately, with those officers, its usually a hit or miss.
I just had the most nastiest encounter with an immigration officer at the airport and the best thing to do is just be pleasant.
I just had the most nastiest encounter with an immigration officer at the airport and the best thing to do is just be pleasant.
Jun 20, 2007, 12:12 pm
#11
Join Date: May 2005
Location: CBR
Programs: Virgin Australia, United, Delta, Qantas, Air Canada
Posts: 148
Just a follow-up on something I saw in this thread, do you need to bring your actual diploma when you try to get the TN or is a transcript saying that you received the degree good enough?
Jun 20, 2007, 6:26 pm
#12
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: YHZ
Programs: AC-SE MM, Bonvoy Lifetime Gold, Avis President's Club
Posts: 298
I think this is not typical, but if you really want to make sure there is no delay....
Jun 20, 2007, 7:13 pm
#13
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: YOW
Programs: AC down to Orange lol, Marriott Silver?
Posts: 3,217
I typically bring both the original degree and certificates (or certified copies) plus a set of regular copies. They see the original and keep the regular copies.
Jun 21, 2007, 1:32 pm
#14
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: YOW
Programs: AC down to Orange lol, Marriott Silver?
Posts: 3,217
The actual regulation is the degree. I lost the actual degree certificate for my MBA in one of my moves and the business school in France do not issue new ones. What they did is give me letter certifying that I have an MBA with their stamp on their letterhead and I have used that with my Canadian degree.
Jun 21, 2007, 7:05 pm
#15
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Programs: AC MM and 75K; Marriott Platinum; minor status on others
Posts: 100
I've also had an MC TN for many years - processed almost every year at my home airport YVR.
The Homeland Security staff at YVR have always been very reasonable and professional with me - as soon as they see that my paperwork is all in order and they see my history with the TN. I've had a couple negative experiences just crossing at YYZ, with a YVR-issued TN.
I've been told a couple of times that they get some pretty far-fetched applications - from people who clearly have absolutely no idea what an MC really does - and this makes them poke extra hard at MC applicants.
The Homeland Security staff at YVR have always been very reasonable and professional with me - as soon as they see that my paperwork is all in order and they see my history with the TN. I've had a couple negative experiences just crossing at YYZ, with a YVR-issued TN.
I've been told a couple of times that they get some pretty far-fetched applications - from people who clearly have absolutely no idea what an MC really does - and this makes them poke extra hard at MC applicants.