Air Canada: Never Punctual
#16
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Why? Why? Zed! / Why? You? Elle! / Gee! Are You!
Programs: Irrelevant
Posts: 3,543
I've done about 60 segments this year. About 65/35 Air Canada / United.
Taking the airport out of the equation, I find it's a bit a joke whenever Air Canada publishes a departure time. I have yet to ever leave on time or early.
..........
I'm curious if I'm just an incredibly unlucky flyer or others also experience this.
Taking the airport out of the equation, I find it's a bit a joke whenever Air Canada publishes a departure time. I have yet to ever leave on time or early.
..........
I'm curious if I'm just an incredibly unlucky flyer or others also experience this.
There are several factors that are taken into account when departure/arrival times are established.
1. Push back from the gate
Most airlines consider a flight to be "on-time" if the push-back/arrival is within 15 minutes of the scheduled time. Based on that criteria, I'd say more than 95% of my flights are on-time. Most push back within a minute or two of scheduled departure and landing is within 10 minutes of scheduled landing times.
So, as you can see, departure/arrival is not as simple as it may appear.
I wouldn't say you're unlucky at all, I looked at the last four months worth of flight times for AC701 and the on-time arrival seems to be early is most cases. ^
Last edited by jaysona; May 26, 2016 at 9:16 am
#17
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: YYC
Posts: 23,803
As to AC on time performance, it had become bad a couple of years ago, but it seems to have gone significantly better lately. I don't recall any really bad experience in the last year or so. No missed connection, no significant delay as far as I am concerned.
#18
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: YVR
Programs: AC SE*2MM. SPG Plat life
Posts: 4,644
North American airlines ranked by average OTP for 2015
1. Hawaiian Airlines, 89.11%
2. Alaska Airlines, 86.38%
3. Westjet, 85.88%
4. Delta Air Lines, 84.46%
5. Southwest, 82.12%
6. Virgin America, 81.58%
7. American Airlines, 80.14%
8. Air Canada, 79.46%
9. United Airlines, 78.99%
10. JetBlue, 78.26%
For all four months of January, February,March, Apri in 2016 so far.
AC is behind AA,UA,DL for On Time Ranking for Main Line Flights , hovering around 74-75%
AC also has never managed to crack top half in rankings of global airlines for OTR this year.
Source: http://www.flightstats.com/company/m...orts/airlines/
1. Hawaiian Airlines, 89.11%
2. Alaska Airlines, 86.38%
3. Westjet, 85.88%
4. Delta Air Lines, 84.46%
5. Southwest, 82.12%
6. Virgin America, 81.58%
7. American Airlines, 80.14%
8. Air Canada, 79.46%
9. United Airlines, 78.99%
10. JetBlue, 78.26%
For all four months of January, February,March, Apri in 2016 so far.
AC is behind AA,UA,DL for On Time Ranking for Main Line Flights , hovering around 74-75%
AC also has never managed to crack top half in rankings of global airlines for OTR this year.
Source: http://www.flightstats.com/company/m...orts/airlines/
#19
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: YVR
Programs: AC SE*2MM. SPG Plat life
Posts: 4,644
#20
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: London & Sonoma CA
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Psychologically, push back is very important as passengers sense that it is something within the airline's control. If there's a huge queue at the end of the runway for take-off, or you have to circle for an age waiting to land, it's irritating (and stressful if you need to be somewhere) but people don't see it as the airline's fault.
#21
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC E50K (*G) WS Gold | SPG/Fairmont Plat Hilton/Hyatt Diamond Marriott Silver | National Exec Elite
Posts: 19,284
#22
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: YVR
Programs: AC SE*2MM. SPG Plat life
Posts: 4,644
Psychologically, push back is very important as passengers sense that it is something within the airline's control. If there's a huge queue at the end of the runway for take-off, or you have to circle for an age waiting to land, it's irritating (and stressful if you need to be somewhere) but people don't see it as the airline's fault.
Last edited by Wpgjetse; May 26, 2016 at 11:01 am
#23
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: YUL
Programs: AC SE (*A Gold), Bonvoy Platinum Elite, Hilton Gold, Amex Platinum / AP Reserve, NEXUS, Global Entry
Posts: 5,691
#24
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Posts: 12,068
#25
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: YOW
Programs: AC E75 / Marriott Titanium Elite
Posts: 952
Not sure there is much of a rationale for avoiding YYC in winter. Winter weather performance at YYC is surely much more reliable than most/all eastern airports given the relatively little amount of precipitation we get here. May well be better than YVR too. Of course deicing can become an issue, but that's not worse than most other Canadian airports.
As to AC on time performance, it had become bad a couple of years ago, but it seems to have gone significantly better lately. I don't recall any really bad experience in the last year or so. No missed connection, no significant delay as far as I am concerned.
As to AC on time performance, it had become bad a couple of years ago, but it seems to have gone significantly better lately. I don't recall any really bad experience in the last year or so. No missed connection, no significant delay as far as I am concerned.
#26
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: YYC
Posts: 23,803
I
I have found that eastern airports and YEG handle snow better than YYC. If I need to go to YVR or connect through YVR, I don't have much of a choice to avoid it so it really doesn't factor into my rules. Also anecdotal, but I find that poor weather in YYZ seems to be more predictable than YYC where it can be snowing unexpectedly anytime between September and the end of April.
I have found that eastern airports and YEG handle snow better than YYC. If I need to go to YVR or connect through YVR, I don't have much of a choice to avoid it so it really doesn't factor into my rules. Also anecdotal, but I find that poor weather in YYZ seems to be more predictable than YYC where it can be snowing unexpectedly anytime between September and the end of April.
#27
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Canada
Programs: UA*1K MM
Posts: 23,297
Yeah that sure explains AC being behind AA and DL - those carriers would never have any issues with weather in JFK,DTW or ORD.
#28
Join Date: May 2012
Location: BKK/SIN/YYZ/YUL
Programs: DL, AC, Bonvoy, Accor, Hilton
Posts: 2,918
Every AC TPAC I have been on for the past 2 years has arrived late. Typically 30-45 minutes late. It is particularly stressful when I have to transit to a domestic on my return. It's why I often cannot use the cheaper fares through YVR because the connection only allows 90 minutes.
I don't enjoy the AC customer response when my incoming late arrival means I miss a connection. With AC's SOP to overbook, I often cannot obtain a seamless remediation. (And yes, I know a few of you super dooper elites with your nexus and who are on 1st name basis with the staff are taken care of. Unfortunately I am just a fool who paid $5000+ for my ticket and is poorly treated by the airline when it is late.) This is why I have reduced my flying with AC this year.
I don't enjoy the AC customer response when my incoming late arrival means I miss a connection. With AC's SOP to overbook, I often cannot obtain a seamless remediation. (And yes, I know a few of you super dooper elites with your nexus and who are on 1st name basis with the staff are taken care of. Unfortunately I am just a fool who paid $5000+ for my ticket and is poorly treated by the airline when it is late.) This is why I have reduced my flying with AC this year.
#29
Join Date: May 2014
Location: DMV
Posts: 2,092
To be honest, not sure on time departure matters all that much. It's on time arrival that matters more.
All airlines pad their block times quite a bit (fair enough) to manage customers' expectations but more important to address airport and their own operational realities, and quite often, planes would rather sit at the gate instead of wasting gas to:
- Circle / stack if they know they will arrive ahead of schedule (for example, if there is a curfew at the arrival airport -- I once sat at SIN for 35 minutes because tailwinds were so good that we would have circled Switzerland 20 times before ZRH's night curfew would be over) or
- Taxi, waiting for a departure / arrival slot or gate.
All airlines pad their block times quite a bit (fair enough) to manage customers' expectations but more important to address airport and their own operational realities, and quite often, planes would rather sit at the gate instead of wasting gas to:
- Circle / stack if they know they will arrive ahead of schedule (for example, if there is a curfew at the arrival airport -- I once sat at SIN for 35 minutes because tailwinds were so good that we would have circled Switzerland 20 times before ZRH's night curfew would be over) or
- Taxi, waiting for a departure / arrival slot or gate.
I suppose it is "okay" in the sense that your connection will be timed on that so you're not going to miss your connection if they perform to their own expectations. However, it's still basically a trick. The airlines can give themselves As because they can decide how many points they need to get an A.
I can totally imagine that airline staff if not given proper incentives will abuse the 'padding' to take it easy if they're ahead of schedule. I am not sure if and how specific airlines track 'real' performance and reward staff that get the job done ahead of the padded 'estimated' time.
#30
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 2,494
Every AC TPAC I have been on for the past 2 years has arrived late. Typically 30-45 minutes late. It is particularly stressful when I have to transit to a domestic on my return. It's why I often cannot use the cheaper fares through YVR because the connection only allows 90 minutes.
I don't enjoy the AC customer response when my incoming late arrival means I miss a connection. With AC's SOP to overbook, I often cannot obtain a seamless remediation. (And yes, I know a few of you super dooper elites with your nexus and who are on 1st name basis with the staff are taken care of. Unfortunately I am just a fool who paid $5000+ for my ticket and is poorly treated by the airline when it is late.) This is why I have reduced my flying with AC this year.
I don't enjoy the AC customer response when my incoming late arrival means I miss a connection. With AC's SOP to overbook, I often cannot obtain a seamless remediation. (And yes, I know a few of you super dooper elites with your nexus and who are on 1st name basis with the staff are taken care of. Unfortunately I am just a fool who paid $5000+ for my ticket and is poorly treated by the airline when it is late.) This is why I have reduced my flying with AC this year.