Mess at DXB
Dec 28, 2015, 9:15 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Programs: AC 1MM/SE 100K, MR Lifetime Premiere Plat, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 145
Mess at DXB
For those of you thinking of trying out AC's product on YYZDXB...
The YYZ->DXB segment went fine. It was in fact one of the most impressive AC flights I've ever been on... not just because of the 787-900, but even the food was above par (in J). It almost felt like EK or SQ or CX... almost.
On the way back, we were quite worried that DXB would somehow screw it up...
First of all, AC departs from what can only be described as the most chaotic terminal DXB has. Compared to T3, where Emirates is, T1 looks like a _dump_. You'll basically be surrounded by the most no-name airline companies in the world and their incompetent staff. Plus the terminal is tiny and under construction.
Then, we get in line. There's a nice little sign that shows two priority lanes for boarding, one for SE 100K, and one for J/*G. The other 4 lanes are for economy. Of course, nobody actually pays attention to the sign. The SE line had 20 people in line. When I asked "are you SE?" I got back "of course, today we're all SE... they don't care".
I went to the ground staff, and I was told "oh yes, ignore the sign, AC makes us put it there but it's not used".
After about 45 minutes in line, it was clear that nothign was moving. It turns out that the check-in system was broken down, and they couldn't actually check-in anyone. Note that I knew this, not because it was announced, but because I lost patience and went to talk to the ground staff again. Some of us had to then manually inform everyone staying in line. People were yelling, upset, and angry, that nobody was officially making an announcement to tell people what was going on.
I kept going up and down to get more information, as it turned out, the local staff wanted to use their own check-in systems, but they don't have APIS support, and Canada Customs basically said "no way" to allowing random people to board a flight to canada without APIS going through. Basically, the staff there had no power, and 5 different "managers" were on the phone with AC back in Canada trying to find a way around this -- noting that the pilots had a 2 hour window before reaching their flight limit and grounding the plane for days.
Eventually they issued paper tickets for everyone (and of course, miles have not posted, and tons of data was lost), and manually called Canada Customs to validate each passport while people without Canadian passports were waiting in the boarding area. Once we all boarded, a few people actually had to be de-planed and their luggage thrown out, delaying things even more.
We landed about 3 hours late in YYZ, with tons of people missing their flights. Thankfully I called the concierge to get protected while we were still in DXB. Everyone else was told to "go to the connection desk upon landing". I hope they made it home for Xmas...
So short story: be careful. You'll be dealing with no AC personel whatsoever, with only a mobile phone as their connection to operations, and with no focus on customer service, all while waiting around in a hellhole of a terminal.
Now let's see how many months it'll take for the SE Desk to credit the 10K+ missing miles on a paper ticket issued with basically no connection to AC's systems.
The YYZ->DXB segment went fine. It was in fact one of the most impressive AC flights I've ever been on... not just because of the 787-900, but even the food was above par (in J). It almost felt like EK or SQ or CX... almost.
On the way back, we were quite worried that DXB would somehow screw it up...
First of all, AC departs from what can only be described as the most chaotic terminal DXB has. Compared to T3, where Emirates is, T1 looks like a _dump_. You'll basically be surrounded by the most no-name airline companies in the world and their incompetent staff. Plus the terminal is tiny and under construction.
Then, we get in line. There's a nice little sign that shows two priority lanes for boarding, one for SE 100K, and one for J/*G. The other 4 lanes are for economy. Of course, nobody actually pays attention to the sign. The SE line had 20 people in line. When I asked "are you SE?" I got back "of course, today we're all SE... they don't care".
I went to the ground staff, and I was told "oh yes, ignore the sign, AC makes us put it there but it's not used".
After about 45 minutes in line, it was clear that nothign was moving. It turns out that the check-in system was broken down, and they couldn't actually check-in anyone. Note that I knew this, not because it was announced, but because I lost patience and went to talk to the ground staff again. Some of us had to then manually inform everyone staying in line. People were yelling, upset, and angry, that nobody was officially making an announcement to tell people what was going on.
I kept going up and down to get more information, as it turned out, the local staff wanted to use their own check-in systems, but they don't have APIS support, and Canada Customs basically said "no way" to allowing random people to board a flight to canada without APIS going through. Basically, the staff there had no power, and 5 different "managers" were on the phone with AC back in Canada trying to find a way around this -- noting that the pilots had a 2 hour window before reaching their flight limit and grounding the plane for days.
Eventually they issued paper tickets for everyone (and of course, miles have not posted, and tons of data was lost), and manually called Canada Customs to validate each passport while people without Canadian passports were waiting in the boarding area. Once we all boarded, a few people actually had to be de-planed and their luggage thrown out, delaying things even more.
We landed about 3 hours late in YYZ, with tons of people missing their flights. Thankfully I called the concierge to get protected while we were still in DXB. Everyone else was told to "go to the connection desk upon landing". I hope they made it home for Xmas...
So short story: be careful. You'll be dealing with no AC personel whatsoever, with only a mobile phone as their connection to operations, and with no focus on customer service, all while waiting around in a hellhole of a terminal.
Now let's see how many months it'll take for the SE Desk to credit the 10K+ missing miles on a paper ticket issued with basically no connection to AC's systems.
Last edited by tcook052; Dec 28, 2015 at 9:51 am
Dec 28, 2015, 10:01 am
#3
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: YOW
Programs: AC SE, FOTSG Platinum
Posts: 5,725
For those of you thinking of trying out AC's product on YYZDXB...
The YYZ->DXB segment went fine. It was in fact one of the most impressive AC flights I've ever been on... not just because of the 787-900, but even the food was above par (in J). It almost felt like EK or SQ or CX... almost.
On the way back, we were quite worried that DXB would somehow screw it up...
First of all, AC departs from what can only be described as the most chaotic terminal DXB has. Compared to T3, where Emirates is, T1 looks like a _dump_. You'll basically be surrounded by the most no-name airline companies in the world and their incompetent staff. Plus the terminal is tiny and under construction.
Then, we get in line. There's a nice little sign that shows two priority lanes for boarding, one for SE 100K, and one for J/*G. The other 4 lanes are for economy. Of course, nobody actually pays attention to the sign. The SE line had 20 people in line. When I asked "are you SE?" I got back "of course, today we're all SE... they don't care".
I went to the ground staff, and I was told "oh yes, ignore the sign, AC makes us put it there but it's not used".
The YYZ->DXB segment went fine. It was in fact one of the most impressive AC flights I've ever been on... not just because of the 787-900, but even the food was above par (in J). It almost felt like EK or SQ or CX... almost.
On the way back, we were quite worried that DXB would somehow screw it up...
First of all, AC departs from what can only be described as the most chaotic terminal DXB has. Compared to T3, where Emirates is, T1 looks like a _dump_. You'll basically be surrounded by the most no-name airline companies in the world and their incompetent staff. Plus the terminal is tiny and under construction.
Then, we get in line. There's a nice little sign that shows two priority lanes for boarding, one for SE 100K, and one for J/*G. The other 4 lanes are for economy. Of course, nobody actually pays attention to the sign. The SE line had 20 people in line. When I asked "are you SE?" I got back "of course, today we're all SE... they don't care".
I went to the ground staff, and I was told "oh yes, ignore the sign, AC makes us put it there but it's not used".
Dec 28, 2015, 10:22 am
#4
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ontario, CAN
Posts: 5,813
For those of you thinking of trying out AC's product on YYZDXB...
The YYZ->DXB segment went fine. It was in fact one of the most impressive AC flights I've ever been on... not just because of the 787-900, but even the food was above par (in J). It almost felt like EK or SQ or CX... almost.
The YYZ->DXB segment went fine. It was in fact one of the most impressive AC flights I've ever been on... not just because of the 787-900, but even the food was above par (in J). It almost felt like EK or SQ or CX... almost.
Agree though, the 787 is an incredible aircraft. Very impressive.
Gee, almost as if Terminal comparison of YYZ:AC=DXB:EK.
Amazing
After about 45 minutes in line, it was clear that nothign was moving. It turns out that the check-in system was broken down, and they couldn't actually check-in anyone. Note that I knew this, not because it was announced, but because I lost patience and went to talk to the ground staff again. Some of us had to then manually inform everyone staying in line. People were yelling, upset, and angry, that nobody was officially making an announcement to tell people what was going on.
Dec 28, 2015, 10:55 am
#6
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Programs: AC 1MM/SE 100K, MR Lifetime Premiere Plat, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 145
A local SEA resident calling it -900
Agree though, the 787 is an incredible aircraft. Very impressive.
My AC flight exDXB-T1 last month was gated between CX and SQ
Gee, almost as if Terminal comparison of YYZ:AC=DXB:EK.
Amazing
Agree here. Boarding area for AC in DXB is weak. Can't hear announcements. Lines might flow into other lines for different gates. Aren't many 100 seaters in DXB - Every line seems to stretch forever.
Agree though, the 787 is an incredible aircraft. Very impressive.
My AC flight exDXB-T1 last month was gated between CX and SQ
Gee, almost as if Terminal comparison of YYZ:AC=DXB:EK.
Amazing
Agree here. Boarding area for AC in DXB is weak. Can't hear announcements. Lines might flow into other lines for different gates. Aren't many 100 seaters in DXB - Every line seems to stretch forever.
What bothered me most is that they didn't *make* announcements. It was the usual behavior of "we don't really work here and this is IRROPS and we don't know what we can say until we have a solution from AC so we'll just be quiet."
Dec 28, 2015, 12:21 pm
#8
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: YYZ/YUL
Programs: UA 1K, AC nadda, DL, WS-Nadda
Posts: 1,476
Almost like my CA experience last year DXB to PEK. Terminals were working so no passport issues. But everything else sounds the same. The lounge access was to a no name lounge, where all the third world airlines I never heard of sent their pax as well. In the end did the long walk to the LH Lounge which was small but at least quiet.
Dec 28, 2015, 12:44 pm
#9
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 2,916
For example, if EK (in another terminal) is operating smoothly, then what's the problem in AC's terminal? Is it because of a lack of training? Or is it lack of support/supervision (which would also be a lack of training)... Has any side taken any steps to fix the issue should be what everyone is asking.
You'd think that if it was an issue of sabotage, that it's really only hurting the countries there. If I know I'm going to be stuck waiting at the airport for a long period of time because the check-in terminals are FUBAR, that's less time that I could spend enjoying the surrounding area. And if this is a regular occurance, ugh....
I've considered taking trips using EK/EY/QR based on their hospitality reputation.... but the thing that kills me (at least) is the fact that there are stupid long connection times. As an example, If I take AC/SQ or CX, I can usually get to Singapore within 20 to hours (not counting IRROPS)... if I were to re-route via the ME airports, travel time increases to 30+ (again, not counting IRROPS). If it's just a few hours different, fine. But I've seen 36+ hour layovers. If the flight from the ME (whichever airport) to SG is cancelled, I could see my plans getting messed up and the knock on inconvenience to others growing. But if I go via an Asia country (especially via HK), if I miss one flight, there will usually be one within 2-3 I can take.
Dec 28, 2015, 1:10 pm
#10
Join Date: Sep 2013
Programs: AC SE100K, AA EXP, SPG Plt, HH Dmnd
Posts: 1,507
So here's a question... is this a "sabotage" from the ME3/their backers or is it really AC's fault? Or the airport itself?
For example, if EK (in another terminal) is operating smoothly, then what's the problem in AC's terminal? Is it because of a lack of training? Or is it lack of support/supervision (which would also be a lack of training)... Has any side taken any steps to fix the issue should be what everyone is asking.
You'd think that if it was an issue of sabotage, that it's really only hurting the countries there. If I know I'm going to be stuck waiting at the airport for a long period of time because the check-in terminals are FUBAR, that's less time that I could spend enjoying the surrounding area. And if this is a regular occurance, ugh....
I've considered taking trips using EK/EY/QR based on their hospitality reputation.... but the thing that kills me (at least) is the fact that there are stupid long connection times. As an example, If I take AC/SQ or CX, I can usually get to Singapore within 20 to hours (not counting IRROPS)... if I were to re-route via the ME airports, travel time increases to 30+ (again, not counting IRROPS). If it's just a few hours different, fine. But I've seen 36+ hour layovers. If the flight from the ME (whichever airport) to SG is cancelled, I could see my plans getting messed up and the knock on inconvenience to others growing. But if I go via an Asia country (especially via HK), if I miss one flight, there will usually be one within 2-3 I can take.
For example, if EK (in another terminal) is operating smoothly, then what's the problem in AC's terminal? Is it because of a lack of training? Or is it lack of support/supervision (which would also be a lack of training)... Has any side taken any steps to fix the issue should be what everyone is asking.
You'd think that if it was an issue of sabotage, that it's really only hurting the countries there. If I know I'm going to be stuck waiting at the airport for a long period of time because the check-in terminals are FUBAR, that's less time that I could spend enjoying the surrounding area. And if this is a regular occurance, ugh....
I've considered taking trips using EK/EY/QR based on their hospitality reputation.... but the thing that kills me (at least) is the fact that there are stupid long connection times. As an example, If I take AC/SQ or CX, I can usually get to Singapore within 20 to hours (not counting IRROPS)... if I were to re-route via the ME airports, travel time increases to 30+ (again, not counting IRROPS). If it's just a few hours different, fine. But I've seen 36+ hour layovers. If the flight from the ME (whichever airport) to SG is cancelled, I could see my plans getting messed up and the knock on inconvenience to others growing. But if I go via an Asia country (especially via HK), if I miss one flight, there will usually be one within 2-3 I can take.
"We want this to be seamless so the growth plans of Emirates can be satisfied," Mr. Griffiths added.
Dec 28, 2015, 1:17 pm
#11
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC E50K (*Gold), DL, CZ
Posts: 1,252
+1. Having just arrived on AC57 this morning, I observed similar events as most of the posters so far.
- Long waits to enter and exit the customs facilities. Even our crew managed to finish their duties and make their way downstairs while the passengers were still stuck in line. The local officials finally made a "special" channel for Canadian passport holders.
Seriously, slowest staff ever.
- Concourse D for international flights not flown by EK is not in operation yet. Naturally, I saw 3 EK 777s parked at the gates for testing purposes, I'm assuming.
- We deplaned and boarded at C5 on AC56/57, respectively. It was one of the furthest gates, required lots of walking, and was far from the LH lounge.
I agree with StuckInYYZ about potential "sabotage", and in fact, made the same comment to my sister about this gong show.
Certainly not the best impression for visitors to make, and if DXB officials wanted a world-class airport, I certainly did not experience that.
- Long waits to enter and exit the customs facilities. Even our crew managed to finish their duties and make their way downstairs while the passengers were still stuck in line. The local officials finally made a "special" channel for Canadian passport holders.
Seriously, slowest staff ever.- Concourse D for international flights not flown by EK is not in operation yet. Naturally, I saw 3 EK 777s parked at the gates for testing purposes, I'm assuming.
- We deplaned and boarded at C5 on AC56/57, respectively. It was one of the furthest gates, required lots of walking, and was far from the LH lounge.
I agree with StuckInYYZ about potential "sabotage", and in fact, made the same comment to my sister about this gong show.
Certainly not the best impression for visitors to make, and if DXB officials wanted a world-class airport, I certainly did not experience that.
Dec 28, 2015, 4:30 pm
#12
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Programs: AC 1MM/SE 100K, MR Lifetime Premiere Plat, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 145
So here's a question... is this a "sabotage" from the ME3/their backers or is it really AC's fault? Or the airport itself?
For example, if EK (in another terminal) is operating smoothly, then what's the problem in AC's terminal? Is it because of a lack of training? Or is it lack of support/supervision (which would also be a lack of training)... Has any side taken any steps to fix the issue should be what everyone is asking.
You'd think that if it was an issue of sabotage, that it's really only hurting the countries there. If I know I'm going to be stuck waiting at the airport for a long period of time because the check-in terminals are FUBAR, that's less time that I could spend enjoying the surrounding area. And if this is a regular occurance, ugh....
I've considered taking trips using EK/EY/QR based on their hospitality reputation.... but the thing that kills me (at least) is the fact that there are stupid long connection times. As an example, If I take AC/SQ or CX, I can usually get to Singapore within 20 to hours (not counting IRROPS)... if I were to re-route via the ME airports, travel time increases to 30+ (again, not counting IRROPS). If it's just a few hours different, fine. But I've seen 36+ hour layovers. If the flight from the ME (whichever airport) to SG is cancelled, I could see my plans getting messed up and the knock on inconvenience to others growing. But if I go via an Asia country (especially via HK), if I miss one flight, there will usually be one within 2-3 I can take.
For example, if EK (in another terminal) is operating smoothly, then what's the problem in AC's terminal? Is it because of a lack of training? Or is it lack of support/supervision (which would also be a lack of training)... Has any side taken any steps to fix the issue should be what everyone is asking.
You'd think that if it was an issue of sabotage, that it's really only hurting the countries there. If I know I'm going to be stuck waiting at the airport for a long period of time because the check-in terminals are FUBAR, that's less time that I could spend enjoying the surrounding area. And if this is a regular occurance, ugh....
I've considered taking trips using EK/EY/QR based on their hospitality reputation.... but the thing that kills me (at least) is the fact that there are stupid long connection times. As an example, If I take AC/SQ or CX, I can usually get to Singapore within 20 to hours (not counting IRROPS)... if I were to re-route via the ME airports, travel time increases to 30+ (again, not counting IRROPS). If it's just a few hours different, fine. But I've seen 36+ hour layovers. If the flight from the ME (whichever airport) to SG is cancelled, I could see my plans getting messed up and the knock on inconvenience to others growing. But if I go via an Asia country (especially via HK), if I miss one flight, there will usually be one within 2-3 I can take.
Dec 28, 2015, 4:42 pm
#13
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Canada
Programs: UA*1K MM
Posts: 23,297
Pretty standard handling by outsourced agents at an AC outstation during IRROPS. You think AC employees have no power to use thinking and decision making, try outsourced agent
Terminal 1 is a joke, the LH lounge is a joke. Maybe one day AC will wave the white flag to EK and 'partner' with them like QF had to (or die on longhauls), and then they ll get a gate at T3
Although personally I believe AC is more of a DXBT2 airline than T1
Terminal 1 is a joke, the LH lounge is a joke. Maybe one day AC will wave the white flag to EK and 'partner' with them like QF had to (or die on longhauls), and then they ll get a gate at T3
Although personally I believe AC is more of a DXBT2 airline than T1
Dec 28, 2015, 5:06 pm
#14
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
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Posts: 38,186
The airports are part of the consortium that is the airlines and airports, so of course non-E3 airlines get the worst facilities. However, on any new route at such an airport, AC should have its own manager even if all the other staff are contacted from the airport authority or other third party.
Dec 28, 2015, 5:22 pm
#15
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC E50K (*Gold), DL, CZ
Posts: 1,252