WEIGH IN: Leaving AC, Staying or ALREADY LEFT?
Oct 29, 2014, 7:26 am
#242
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: IAH
Programs: AC SE100K, AA Platinum, SPG Platinum, National Emerald Elite
Posts: 166
Given I need to research what FF program to switch to myself, I'll try to do a blog post detailing options and the +s / -s of various programs. There is so much to research that hopefully the knowledgeable members from this site can help correct and add to the post once it's done.
I suspect the main programs people are considering are WS, UA, LH, TK, SQ, OZ, and A3. Any others I should try to dig into?
I suspect the main programs people are considering are WS, UA, LH, TK, SQ, OZ, and A3. Any others I should try to dig into?
Oct 29, 2014, 10:07 am
#243
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: WAS
Programs: UA Silver, Marriott Titanium, Nexus, GE
Posts: 2,122
This is interesting, they don't specify (at least not that I saw on the chart) how exactly the upgrades work. I don't actually fly UA that much, but I do fly them to Colombia from Canada cuz it's almost always cheaper than AC.
Now I noticed as Premier Platinum I wouldn't be able to upgrade to South America...HOWEVER, if I route YVR-DEN-PTY-MDE best I can tell I can upgrade that.
Now I noticed as Premier Platinum I wouldn't be able to upgrade to South America...HOWEVER, if I route YVR-DEN-PTY-MDE best I can tell I can upgrade that.
The confusing bit you're finding is that all routes operated by COPA are indeed still eligible for the complimentary/regional upgrades, which is my guess why it works through PTY.
In general, J is often full domestically (plus Canada, and Central America) as there is an unlimited complimentary upgrade program. I have found it someone difficult to use my RPU's, FYI.
Oct 29, 2014, 12:11 pm
#244
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: YOW
Programs: AC SEMM; AA,DL, Hyatt and Starwood. Ex-status:SQ PPS,CSA,Hilton,AA,UA
Posts: 743
Staying.
I seem to be exactly in the target demographic for where AC wants to take SE, so it's hardly surprising the changes they have made actually increase my loyalty.
I fly long-haul paid J *A (AC and others) 60% of the time, short haul domestic or transborder Y 10% of the time (% is by mileage; often on small planes), and non *A 30%. So I don't much care about upgrades myself; I do like to upgrade my wife on her own occasional transatlantic trips (she's E and generally buys Flex). I invariably have lots of eUpgrades expire each year; I guess I'll now have fewer. I do care quite a bit about redeeming points, so YQ removal is a genuine improvement.
The way things used to be, I really didn't actively need to do anything to "show my loyalty". I just flew whatever was most convenient, and SE (and 1MM) was the result. With the increase in AC metal requirements, on longhaul I'll actually be incented to pay attention and preference AC flights - in particular, I'll connect on AC rather than UA,TK,LH etc. On shorthaul, I see very little relevant difference in service quality between AC,WS,Porter,UA,DL. The removal of the 500 mile minimum would have made me care even less; but the AC metal requirement will slightly make me preference AC. So in terms of influencing my behaviour: well played, AC.
This whole discussion has made me realize there are 2 very different SE subsegments. At work, it's people with similar patterns to me, where AC actually has significant share-of-wallet increase potential as a result of these changes due to the increased AC metal minimum. Here at FlyerTalk, it seems to be a mass exodus: it's primarily the SE subsegment that were actively shaping their economy-fare purchasing patterns and sometimes adding stops to their routings in order to guarantee status and capitalize on the currency of eUpgrades. Time will tell if the share-of-wallet losses in this subsegment are worth it (to AC) compared to the share-of-wallet gain from the 1st subsegment -- and whether AC's aspired reshaping of the market to force corporations to be more willing to pay J class fares will work.
(By the way, there's probably yet a 3rd important SE subsegment -- those who fly primarily on AC flight passes, where the ability to routinely upgrade up esp from a Latitude pass clearly did influence economics, both for purchasers and AC. Think the dynamics there will still need to be sorted out, and strongly suspect AC will need to change pass pricing.)
I seem to be exactly in the target demographic for where AC wants to take SE, so it's hardly surprising the changes they have made actually increase my loyalty.
I fly long-haul paid J *A (AC and others) 60% of the time, short haul domestic or transborder Y 10% of the time (% is by mileage; often on small planes), and non *A 30%. So I don't much care about upgrades myself; I do like to upgrade my wife on her own occasional transatlantic trips (she's E and generally buys Flex). I invariably have lots of eUpgrades expire each year; I guess I'll now have fewer. I do care quite a bit about redeeming points, so YQ removal is a genuine improvement.
The way things used to be, I really didn't actively need to do anything to "show my loyalty". I just flew whatever was most convenient, and SE (and 1MM) was the result. With the increase in AC metal requirements, on longhaul I'll actually be incented to pay attention and preference AC flights - in particular, I'll connect on AC rather than UA,TK,LH etc. On shorthaul, I see very little relevant difference in service quality between AC,WS,Porter,UA,DL. The removal of the 500 mile minimum would have made me care even less; but the AC metal requirement will slightly make me preference AC. So in terms of influencing my behaviour: well played, AC.
This whole discussion has made me realize there are 2 very different SE subsegments. At work, it's people with similar patterns to me, where AC actually has significant share-of-wallet increase potential as a result of these changes due to the increased AC metal minimum. Here at FlyerTalk, it seems to be a mass exodus: it's primarily the SE subsegment that were actively shaping their economy-fare purchasing patterns and sometimes adding stops to their routings in order to guarantee status and capitalize on the currency of eUpgrades. Time will tell if the share-of-wallet losses in this subsegment are worth it (to AC) compared to the share-of-wallet gain from the 1st subsegment -- and whether AC's aspired reshaping of the market to force corporations to be more willing to pay J class fares will work.
(By the way, there's probably yet a 3rd important SE subsegment -- those who fly primarily on AC flight passes, where the ability to routinely upgrade up esp from a Latitude pass clearly did influence economics, both for purchasers and AC. Think the dynamics there will still need to be sorted out, and strongly suspect AC will need to change pass pricing.)
Oct 29, 2014, 1:21 pm
#245
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Toronto
Programs: AC*SE100K 1MM, Little Lebowski Urban Achiever
Posts: 735
Staying.
I seem to be exactly in the target demographic for where AC wants to take SE, so it's hardly surprising the changes they have made actually increase my loyalty.
(By the way, there's probably yet a 3rd important SE subsegment -- those who fly primarily on AC flight passes, where the ability to routinely upgrade up esp from a Latitude pass clearly did influence economics, both for purchasers and AC. Think the dynamics there will still need to be sorted out, and strongly suspect AC will need to change pass pricing.)
I seem to be exactly in the target demographic for where AC wants to take SE, so it's hardly surprising the changes they have made actually increase my loyalty.
(By the way, there's probably yet a 3rd important SE subsegment -- those who fly primarily on AC flight passes, where the ability to routinely upgrade up esp from a Latitude pass clearly did influence economics, both for purchasers and AC. Think the dynamics there will still need to be sorted out, and strongly suspect AC will need to change pass pricing.)
I am one that does a significant portion of my flying on FP's, (I'm on my third NA wide, and still have some segments from a latitude Europe). While I'm not saying I will never buy another one if they save me money, there is almost always a fare available from AA/US that is lower than the $650 a pop on the NA FP. I do paid J to Asia, and try and upgrade to Europe. Overall, it just looks like AA fits me better now. I will be MM in a couple of weeks, so will likely still fly AC when I need to (direct flights to specific locations), but no longer makes sense to try and get SE every year.
Oct 29, 2014, 2:05 pm
#246
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Canada
Programs: UA*1K MM
Posts: 23,293
Rankourabu, in your personal opinion does this sound like the right choice for me? With the eUPgrades I would earn I'd get to upgrade lets say 30% of the year, but the flight's im on are only 1 hour anyway. I'm much more tempted to try and upgrade a 24 hour fly day on UA/CM YVR-IAH-PTY-MDE. Am I missing a crucial piece of info? I gotta do some reading on the RPUs but I feel like this might be a good option for me. Not only that but it seems to take much fewer points for rewards for the most part and I like the option to pay as well (even though it's not as economically responsible).
Northern South America has changed recently. It was previously eligible for both complimentary upgrades and the use of the regionals (RPU's). It's now a route that requires GPU's, which are the global upgrades only issued to 1K's and GS.
The confusing bit you're finding is that all routes operated by COPA are indeed still eligible for the complimentary/regional upgrades, which is my guess why it works through PTY.
In general, J is often full domestically (plus Canada, and Central America) as there is an unlimited complimentary upgrade program. I have found it someone difficult to use my RPU's, FYI.
The confusing bit you're finding is that all routes operated by COPA are indeed still eligible for the complimentary/regional upgrades, which is my guess why it works through PTY.
In general, J is often full domestically (plus Canada, and Central America) as there is an unlimited complimentary upgrade program. I have found it someone difficult to use my RPU's, FYI.
But you can still use RPUs and get free upgrades on Copa.
As a Platinum, you should not expect the free automatic upgrades apart from transborder, and Copa routes, anything hub to hub especially, forget it.
I always use my RPUs on those impossible routes, like EWR-LAX, or IAD-HNL and have never failed to use one, upgrading weeks in advance.
As for requests, its automatic, or you do it online if you upgrade using an RPU.
You can see where you stand on the upgrade list online, or on the app - its totally transparent.
The big change is the way redeemable miles will be awarded on United 016 tickets, and United metal - it will basically be a multiplier. Its good for shorthaul flyers on expensive OPM tickets.
Oct 29, 2014, 8:44 pm
#247
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Programs: United MileagePlus Silver, Nexus, Global Entry
Posts: 8,798
Flew IAH -> DFW today on United. Base fare economy ticket.
Got to the airport early, so ran up to the gate where the previous flight was departing and said "Any chance of a standby?"
"Sure!" the gate agent says and gives me a new boarding pass. Moments later I was onboard.
Guess who just earned my another rung on my loyalty ladder?
Got to the airport early, so ran up to the gate where the previous flight was departing and said "Any chance of a standby?"
"Sure!" the gate agent says and gives me a new boarding pass. Moments later I was onboard.
Guess who just earned my another rung on my loyalty ladder?
Oct 29, 2014, 10:34 pm
#248
Join Date: Jan 2007
Programs: No single airline or hotel chain is of much use to me anymore.
Posts: 3,278
Already Gone
I flew LAX-YYC and LAX-YVR regularly, sometimes several times a week, but between the elimination of the evening departure to YYC and the Rouging of both, Air Canada no longer provides a service of any interest to me.
Although I haven't really shifted per say, I fly whoever makes sense in a given situation. This year I have flown Alaska, Delta, United and WestJet on these routes. If WestJet stepped up with a useful LAX-YYC schedule I might form some loyalty in that direction.
I'm going to Hong Kong and Shenzhen in the new year. Air Canada via YVR is not in the running.
I flew LAX-YYC and LAX-YVR regularly, sometimes several times a week, but between the elimination of the evening departure to YYC and the Rouging of both, Air Canada no longer provides a service of any interest to me.
Although I haven't really shifted per say, I fly whoever makes sense in a given situation. This year I have flown Alaska, Delta, United and WestJet on these routes. If WestJet stepped up with a useful LAX-YYC schedule I might form some loyalty in that direction.
I'm going to Hong Kong and Shenzhen in the new year. Air Canada via YVR is not in the running.
Oct 29, 2014, 10:48 pm
#249
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: YYC; would like to return to living in SIN (or PER)
Programs: SQ KF, QFF
Posts: 287
Left Altitude last year due to the 2014 changes and a change in role at work (concentrating more on local clients) that eliminated the base mileage I used to depend on to hit status.
A subsequent move to PER (and then again to SIN after that didn't pan out) meant that I'd be unlikely to hit the AC metal requirements for 2015 even if the rest of the program had improved from 2014 - as it is, I'm being proved right.
A subsequent move to PER (and then again to SIN after that didn't pan out) meant that I'd be unlikely to hit the AC metal requirements for 2015 even if the rest of the program had improved from 2014 - as it is, I'm being proved right.
Oct 29, 2014, 11:19 pm
#250
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE
Posts: 545
Staying, but diversifying.
Just applies for WS Gold. Will apply for either BAEC or AA too.
But I'll probably requalify as SE nonetheless, as my flight patterns just shifted from a segment runner to a monthly last-minute TATL crossing.
And my next trip will be WS. No incentive to buy a new FP for this year until eUps roll over (and I guess they won't at all)
Just applies for WS Gold. Will apply for either BAEC or AA too.
But I'll probably requalify as SE nonetheless, as my flight patterns just shifted from a segment runner to a monthly last-minute TATL crossing.
And my next trip will be WS. No incentive to buy a new FP for this year until eUps roll over (and I guess they won't at all)
Oct 30, 2014, 4:56 am
#251
Suspended
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 4,153
Staying.
I seem to be exactly in the target demographic for where AC wants to take SE, so it's hardly surprising the changes they have made actually increase my loyalty.
I fly long-haul paid J *A (AC and others) 60% of the time, short haul domestic or transborder Y 10% of the time (% is by mileage; often on small planes), and non *A 30%. So I don't much care about upgrades myself; I do like to upgrade my wife on her own occasional transatlantic trips (she's E and generally buys Flex). I invariably have lots of eUpgrades expire each year; I guess I'll now have fewer. I do care quite a bit about redeeming points, so YQ removal is a genuine improvement.
The way things used to be, I really didn't actively need to do anything to "show my loyalty". I just flew whatever was most convenient, and SE (and 1MM) was the result. With the increase in AC metal requirements, on longhaul I'll actually be incented to pay attention and preference AC flights - in particular, I'll connect on AC rather than UA,TK,LH etc. On shorthaul, I see very little relevant difference in service quality between AC,WS,Porter,UA,DL. The removal of the 500 mile minimum would have made me care even less; but the AC metal requirement will slightly make me preference AC. So in terms of influencing my behaviour: well played, AC.
This whole discussion has made me realize there are 2 very different SE subsegments. At work, it's people with similar patterns to me, where AC actually has significant share-of-wallet increase potential as a result of these changes due to the increased AC metal minimum. Here at FlyerTalk, it seems to be a mass exodus: it's primarily the SE subsegment that were actively shaping their economy-fare purchasing patterns and sometimes adding stops to their routings in order to guarantee status and capitalize on the currency of eUpgrades. Time will tell if the share-of-wallet losses in this subsegment are worth it (to AC) compared to the share-of-wallet gain from the 1st subsegment -- and whether AC's aspired reshaping of the market to force corporations to be more willing to pay J class fares will work.
(By the way, there's probably yet a 3rd important SE subsegment -- those who fly primarily on AC flight passes, where the ability to routinely upgrade up esp from a Latitude pass clearly did influence economics, both for purchasers and AC. Think the dynamics there will still need to be sorted out, and strongly suspect AC will need to change pass pricing.)
I seem to be exactly in the target demographic for where AC wants to take SE, so it's hardly surprising the changes they have made actually increase my loyalty.
I fly long-haul paid J *A (AC and others) 60% of the time, short haul domestic or transborder Y 10% of the time (% is by mileage; often on small planes), and non *A 30%. So I don't much care about upgrades myself; I do like to upgrade my wife on her own occasional transatlantic trips (she's E and generally buys Flex). I invariably have lots of eUpgrades expire each year; I guess I'll now have fewer. I do care quite a bit about redeeming points, so YQ removal is a genuine improvement.
The way things used to be, I really didn't actively need to do anything to "show my loyalty". I just flew whatever was most convenient, and SE (and 1MM) was the result. With the increase in AC metal requirements, on longhaul I'll actually be incented to pay attention and preference AC flights - in particular, I'll connect on AC rather than UA,TK,LH etc. On shorthaul, I see very little relevant difference in service quality between AC,WS,Porter,UA,DL. The removal of the 500 mile minimum would have made me care even less; but the AC metal requirement will slightly make me preference AC. So in terms of influencing my behaviour: well played, AC.
This whole discussion has made me realize there are 2 very different SE subsegments. At work, it's people with similar patterns to me, where AC actually has significant share-of-wallet increase potential as a result of these changes due to the increased AC metal minimum. Here at FlyerTalk, it seems to be a mass exodus: it's primarily the SE subsegment that were actively shaping their economy-fare purchasing patterns and sometimes adding stops to their routings in order to guarantee status and capitalize on the currency of eUpgrades. Time will tell if the share-of-wallet losses in this subsegment are worth it (to AC) compared to the share-of-wallet gain from the 1st subsegment -- and whether AC's aspired reshaping of the market to force corporations to be more willing to pay J class fares will work.
(By the way, there's probably yet a 3rd important SE subsegment -- those who fly primarily on AC flight passes, where the ability to routinely upgrade up esp from a Latitude pass clearly did influence economics, both for purchasers and AC. Think the dynamics there will still need to be sorted out, and strongly suspect AC will need to change pass pricing.)
This is all good and rational. However when the president of AC insults his Super Elites and Elites (their description) as cheap charity cases, am not inclined to give them any more money than is necessary. Shame on them for acting in such buffoon headed way on this board and shows the general arrogance in the AC executive suites.
Oct 30, 2014, 6:02 am
#252
Suspended
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC E50K (*G) WS Gold | SPG/Fairmont Plat Hilton/Hyatt Diamond Marriott Silver | National Exec Elite
Posts: 19,284
This is all good and rational. However when the president of AC insults his Super Elites and Elites (their description) as cheap charity cases, am not inclined to give them any more money than is necessary. Shame on them for acting in such buffoon headed way on this board and shows the general arrogance in the AC executive suites.
"Buffoon headed way....general arrogance..." - those are personal insults and not permitted on FT.
Oct 30, 2014, 6:34 am
#253
Formerly known as tireman77
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 5,489
This is all good and rational. However when the president of AC insults his Super Elites and Elites (their description) as cheap charity cases, am not inclined to give them any more money than is necessary. Shame on them for acting in such buffoon headed way on this board and shows the general arrogance in the AC executive suites.
Either move on or move out.
There's a whole thread on that issue (which I believe you started) and if you wish to keep toiling your disdain about that comment, please keep those comments to that thread.
Oct 30, 2014, 10:11 am
#254
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: YOW
Programs: AC SEMM; AA,DL, Hyatt and Starwood. Ex-status:SQ PPS,CSA,Hilton,AA,UA
Posts: 743
This is all good and rational. However when the president of AC insults his Super Elites and Elites (their description) as cheap charity cases, am not inclined to give them any more money than is necessary. Shame on them for acting in such buffoon headed way on this board and shows the general arrogance in the AC executive suites.
At first, I thought it was a case of emotional overreaction, something all of us have done. However, in spite of a number of people gently telling you to move on, you continue to not let go. It means that either you have lost your sense of proportion about this issue, or potentially that you are deliberately trying to further by continued repetition a biased narrative as part of some personal campaign on your part. I recognize that as one random FTer, I have no particular authority here, but would ask you to heed the combined voices you see here now and please stop.
Oct 30, 2014, 2:21 pm
#255
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: YYZ
Programs: Aeroplan 35K
Posts: 86
Leaving after my last flight this weekend (LHR-YYZ-SFO return) which will put me over 75K (not that there is much left in next year's program).
As I'm London based, I'm moving it all to BA...should have done it a while ago...
As I'm London based, I'm moving it all to BA...should have done it a while ago...