Dr. gives medical assistance in-flight; any airline compensation?
Jul 14, 2014, 5:45 am
#31
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: YYG
Programs: airlines and hotels and rental cars - oh my!
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Reality is, you rendered assistance to a fellow passenger, not to Air Canada.
Although a note of appreciation would have been a nice gesture, Air Canada owes you nothing and an expectation of compensation is indeed unreasonable.
The passenger you assisted, however, might owe you a steak dinner or a nice bottle of wine. Of course, that's up to them to make the effort to thank you. Some people will, some won't.
Although a note of appreciation would have been a nice gesture, Air Canada owes you nothing and an expectation of compensation is indeed unreasonable.
The passenger you assisted, however, might owe you a steak dinner or a nice bottle of wine. Of course, that's up to them to make the effort to thank you. Some people will, some won't.
Jul 14, 2014, 11:29 am
#32
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
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Reality is, you rendered assistance to a fellow passenger, not to Air Canada.
Although a note of appreciation would have been a nice gesture, Air Canada owes you nothing and an expectation of compensation is indeed unreasonable.
The passenger you assisted, however, might owe you a steak dinner or a nice bottle of wine. Of course, that's up to them to make the effort to thank you. Some people will, some won't.
Although a note of appreciation would have been a nice gesture, Air Canada owes you nothing and an expectation of compensation is indeed unreasonable.
The passenger you assisted, however, might owe you a steak dinner or a nice bottle of wine. Of course, that's up to them to make the effort to thank you. Some people will, some won't.
By preventing a diversion, Air Canada saved a ton of money.
Now, I'm not saying anyone owes anything, but if the passengers owes the doctor a steak dinner, AC owes something too.
And seriously...I've received thousands of miles for saying "I had a great SD on this flight who was very attentive to service. I never had to ask for a refill." If that's worthy of miles, then this certainly is.
Jul 14, 2014, 1:38 pm
#33
Join Date: Dec 2010
Programs: Aeroplan
Posts: 1,022
I'm not sure I agree.
By preventing a diversion, Air Canada saved a ton of money.
Now, I'm not saying anyone owes anything, but if the passengers owes the doctor a steak dinner, AC owes something too.
And seriously...I've received thousands of miles for saying "I had a great SD on this flight who was very attentive to service. I never had to ask for a refill." If that's worthy of miles, then this certainly is.
By preventing a diversion, Air Canada saved a ton of money.
Now, I'm not saying anyone owes anything, but if the passengers owes the doctor a steak dinner, AC owes something too.
And seriously...I've received thousands of miles for saying "I had a great SD on this flight who was very attentive to service. I never had to ask for a refill." If that's worthy of miles, then this certainly is.
Jul 19, 2014, 12:28 pm
#34
Join Date: Apr 2013
Programs: Yes, I belong.
Posts: 361
Now imagine that in the second hour of the flight you hear the "is there a physician..." call over the intercom, and from that moment on you start managing a medical situation on board until you land, i.e. for 8+ hours, if you count the paperwork on the ground. Depending on the condition of the patient, you are now spending this time either in the seat next to the patient (statistically more often in Y than F), or if things turn for the worse on the floor of the galley.
Hard to imagine? Not really. Simmilar scenarios happened to people I know on quite a few flights.
Of course, you could have simply told the crew to land the thing at the nearest airport, so you can handover the patient to EMTs, hence shortening your involvement to 1-2 hours... but you didn't, and you stuck through, and in the process you helped the flight get to its destination, saving the airline (tens of?) thousands of dollars, not to mention helping it maintain customer satisfaction.
What? Still nothing due in recompense?
Hard to imagine? Not really. Simmilar scenarios happened to people I know on quite a few flights.
Of course, you could have simply told the crew to land the thing at the nearest airport, so you can handover the patient to EMTs, hence shortening your involvement to 1-2 hours... but you didn't, and you stuck through, and in the process you helped the flight get to its destination, saving the airline (tens of?) thousands of dollars, not to mention helping it maintain customer satisfaction.
What? Still nothing due in recompense?
As to limiting your involvement to 1-2 hours by recommending the aircraft divert? Sure, you could do that. But this seems like a "me first", knee jerk response. How long will the diversion take? How many hours will you and your loved one be on the ground? What meetings/vacation will you miss? Now, how about the 100s of other PAX? Their time isn't valuable too?
Jul 20, 2014, 5:28 am
#35
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: YYZ
Posts: 1,674
As to limiting your involvement to 1-2 hours by recommending the aircraft divert? Sure, you could do that. But this seems like a "me first", knee jerk response. How long will the diversion take? How many hours will you and your loved one be on the ground? What meetings/vacation will you miss? Now, how about the 100s of other PAX? Their time isn't valuable too?
By the way, there are other airlines that have programs for at least symbolically rewarding physicians that rendered assistance. LH is one example.
Jul 20, 2014, 8:00 am
#36
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: YVR
Programs: OZ Diamond, Jiffypark Manhattan Gold
Posts: 4,485
This is sticky...I'm quick to think "hey jerkoff, just be nice and use your skills without expecting something". I think as a society we're trending a bit too much towards the "what's in it for me" side of things. But then I look at the other side and you think "well what's the downside for me, litigation, physical harm etc?".
That said, I think once you've made the decision to be helpful, you've made the right decision and not to expect anything. If AC truly has a policy, then by all means, email/call, but if they don't I'd love a letter of thanks but I wouldn't expect it.
My other thought is think of the other side of this...when you get really good service from an FA, do you ALWAYS fill out that comment card (or whatever it is, I've heard of it, never done it). Because for them, that's the equivalent of the thank you letter. A tip is the equivalent of the airline giving you points. It's nice, but should never be expected imo.
As far as the potential litigation side of things, I think that's a horrible trend in society but it's a reality. There was a story in the Vancouver Province just the other day about a woman's $5000 purse getting snatched (cry me a river...) but that only 1 person in a crowded mall helped. That guy was rewarded with a punch in the face. Could've just as easily been stabbed, and for what? A status symbol? That situation for me is much more reactive, whereas even when I took a first aid class, basically the first lesson they teach is "I'M A FIRST AIDER, MAY I HELP YOU?" to get verbal consent...I understand the underlying principal but the practice is gross to me. If you're the Dr on board providing any kind of attention, I would also hope that you'd determine your limits very quickly, if there's some kind of supply truly needed, that you'd immediately tell them "hey look, he's not gonna die, but he NEEDS this...and you don't have it".
Sorry for the rant, but I say kudos for the work, and I'd hope more than the airline that the guy/gal you helped has searched you out to give you thanks. That is more meaningful to me than the points or even a thanks from the airline because you avoided and inconvenient diversion.
That said, I think once you've made the decision to be helpful, you've made the right decision and not to expect anything. If AC truly has a policy, then by all means, email/call, but if they don't I'd love a letter of thanks but I wouldn't expect it.
My other thought is think of the other side of this...when you get really good service from an FA, do you ALWAYS fill out that comment card (or whatever it is, I've heard of it, never done it). Because for them, that's the equivalent of the thank you letter. A tip is the equivalent of the airline giving you points. It's nice, but should never be expected imo.
As far as the potential litigation side of things, I think that's a horrible trend in society but it's a reality. There was a story in the Vancouver Province just the other day about a woman's $5000 purse getting snatched (cry me a river...) but that only 1 person in a crowded mall helped. That guy was rewarded with a punch in the face. Could've just as easily been stabbed, and for what? A status symbol? That situation for me is much more reactive, whereas even when I took a first aid class, basically the first lesson they teach is "I'M A FIRST AIDER, MAY I HELP YOU?" to get verbal consent...I understand the underlying principal but the practice is gross to me. If you're the Dr on board providing any kind of attention, I would also hope that you'd determine your limits very quickly, if there's some kind of supply truly needed, that you'd immediately tell them "hey look, he's not gonna die, but he NEEDS this...and you don't have it".
Sorry for the rant, but I say kudos for the work, and I'd hope more than the airline that the guy/gal you helped has searched you out to give you thanks. That is more meaningful to me than the points or even a thanks from the airline because you avoided and inconvenient diversion.
Jul 21, 2014, 12:36 pm
#37
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 1,291
Because if you have a heart attach or something else, and a doctor helps you, and you or your family decide to sue for whatever reason. A doctor does not have to help you.
I would be grateful myself, and would hope AC would provide some compensation to the doctor who helped.
I would be grateful myself, and would hope AC would provide some compensation to the doctor who helped.
Jul 21, 2014, 11:40 pm
#38
Join Date: Apr 2013
Programs: Yes, I belong.
Posts: 361
Jul 22, 2014, 12:25 am
#39
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Australia
Programs: QF LTS, Marriott LTP, ALL GOLD
Posts: 2,440
The world has gone mad.... If you expect something to be given to your for volunteering to help someone in need, perhaps make it clear before you offer assistance you expect some miles before assisting?
Jul 22, 2014, 3:55 pm
#40
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Hamilton
Programs: BA silver
Posts: 247
What happens if there is a medical emergency but there is no doctor or other expert on board? Who decides, and based on what rules, whether it's OK to fly on or not? Is there a legal obligation for AC to act in a certain way? I suppose there is policy on this. Anyone know it?
Jul 23, 2014, 12:32 am
#41
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Australia
Programs: QF LTS, Marriott LTP, ALL GOLD
Posts: 2,440
What happens if there is a medical emergency but there is no doctor or other expert on board? Who decides, and based on what rules, whether it's OK to fly on or not? Is there a legal obligation for AC to act in a certain way? I suppose there is policy on this. Anyone know it?
Jul 23, 2014, 1:20 am
#42
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Auckland NZ
Programs: NZ Gold Elite, AS, AC, QF
Posts: 748
I started reading this thread thinking "jerk should just honour his oath."
I no longer hold that perspective--very informative discussion! I suggest a polite letter to Air Canada with the details; it's possible the records were lost or misprocessed.
I no longer hold that perspective--very informative discussion! I suggest a polite letter to Air Canada with the details; it's possible the records were lost or misprocessed.
Sep 8, 2014, 9:37 pm
#43
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: NYC, YYZ
Programs: AC SE100K, SPG Gold, UA MP
Posts: 1,002
Finally got my letter of appreciation from Dr. Vincent Poirier, Senior Medical Advisor, Passenger & Cabin Health today, 3 months after the initial flight! 10,000 status miles is a nice gesture! But I already booked 2 MRs before getting this! Happy to requalify for SE next year by a comfortable margin now 
Sep 9, 2014, 8:07 am
#44
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ontario, CAN
Posts: 5,813
Anyone read about how the great CX rewarded a couple Canadians who tirelessly worked for 2 hours to save a passenger's life on YYZHKG? One of the 2 was upgraded to PE on their return flight. Wow, what a reward!
Can you imagine ... The ultimate airline Cathay Pacific upgraded one of the 2 passengers to Premium Economy while the other flew back home ni the Economy seat he paid for.
http://metronews.ca/news/toronto/114...acific-flight/
Believe they've since upped their offer due entirely to backlash and public outrage.
Can you imagine ... The ultimate airline Cathay Pacific upgraded one of the 2 passengers to Premium Economy while the other flew back home ni the Economy seat he paid for.
http://metronews.ca/news/toronto/114...acific-flight/
Believe they've since upped their offer due entirely to backlash and public outrage.
Sep 10, 2014, 6:02 pm
#45
Join Date: Dec 2013
Programs: AC SE 200K, SPG PLAT, HH DIAMOND
Posts: 232
This is an interesting read and I keep going back and forth on what is right here...my first thought was how can you demand compensation for helping someone in need, aren't we all human and want to help people in need? Then I started thinking about the time and the cost saved to the airline and that you should get some compensation but ultimately I come back to the fact that it is tacky to ask for compensation....did you do this for compensation, would you have helped without compensation? I think sending anything and asking for something is tacky, enjoy the fact that you helped save a life.
I'm not a doctor but I have first aid and I have never hesitated to help someone in need. I have helped people in distress in the past and never wanted anything in return. I assisted with a person having a seizure and waited for 20 minutes till paramedics arrived as the 25 yo security guard that responded first was unable to help or do anything but I never asked for anything.
On another occasion, I was on a flight from YQR-YYZ with a distraught Polish pax (I speak it fluently) and translated for the crew the whole time as he was missing his cnx to WAW due to a flight delay and then wanted to chat my ear off the whole flight (it was an old man and I couldn't say no) and then waited with him at YYZ until a Polish speaking rep came over. BTW - the crew moved him to the seat beside me in J class for the flight once they knew I spoke Polish and I didn't get to watch a movie and had to talk to him (he was in Y). I know it's not a medical emergency but he still invaded my space and flight and the crew used me to talk to him about everything, even saying "ask him if he wants some water.." so it's a skill that I have that no on else on the plane could do but I never thought I should get or asked for compensation. Just to be clear, I don't think I should get comp'd because a pax beside me talks to me but he was moved here by the crew and I was used as the interpreter. In the end he was a nice guy though.
I'm not a doctor but I have first aid and I have never hesitated to help someone in need. I have helped people in distress in the past and never wanted anything in return. I assisted with a person having a seizure and waited for 20 minutes till paramedics arrived as the 25 yo security guard that responded first was unable to help or do anything but I never asked for anything.
On another occasion, I was on a flight from YQR-YYZ with a distraught Polish pax (I speak it fluently) and translated for the crew the whole time as he was missing his cnx to WAW due to a flight delay and then wanted to chat my ear off the whole flight (it was an old man and I couldn't say no) and then waited with him at YYZ until a Polish speaking rep came over. BTW - the crew moved him to the seat beside me in J class for the flight once they knew I spoke Polish and I didn't get to watch a movie and had to talk to him (he was in Y). I know it's not a medical emergency but he still invaded my space and flight and the crew used me to talk to him about everything, even saying "ask him if he wants some water.." so it's a skill that I have that no on else on the plane could do but I never thought I should get or asked for compensation. Just to be clear, I don't think I should get comp'd because a pax beside me talks to me but he was moved here by the crew and I was used as the interpreter. In the end he was a nice guy though.