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Old Mar 28, 02, 12:15 am   #1
 
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What does "Low Cost Carrier" REALLY mean?

I've thought about this for a long time, but only recently decided to post it.

The question is, what exactly does AC mean when they say "Low Cost Carrier?" Do they mean cheaper airplanes? Well, they can't arbitrarily decide to pay half price for their new planes. That's probably not it.

Perhaps they mean to save money on maintenance. To AC's credit, I can't see them doing this.

Maybe they plan on buying low cost fuel. Ha ha... good one.

Maybe they'll cut back on in-flight services. But that't can't be but a small amount per passenger.

So what's left? Well, I'll tell you, if you haven't already figured it out. It's what WestJet has. Low cost employees, that's what.

So best as I can tell, when AC management talks of a "low cost carrier" what the really mean is a "low paid workforce."

And I can't imagine that'll be a good thing, especially in the long run.
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Old Mar 28, 02, 5:26 am   #2
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Good question.
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Old Mar 28, 02, 7:03 am   #3
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Ken:

Don't forget a lower quality pretzel (that is no longer free).

THe other difference with low cost carrier is the turn around time at the gate. Westjet is 20 - 30 minutes, AC is 45 - 60. The longer the planes are in the sky, the more revenue they earn.
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Old Mar 28, 02, 7:13 am   #4
 
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Okay, so why can West Jet turn a plane around in 30 minutes while it takes AC 45 minutes?
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Old Mar 28, 02, 8:08 am   #5
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...perhaps an AC employee could field this question.
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Old Mar 28, 02, 9:03 am   #6
 
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2"> Okay, so why can West Jet turn a plane around in 30 minutes while it takes AC 45 minutes? </font>
Perhaps because the FA's and pilots help out when necessary to groom the plane and shorten the turnaround? Perhaps because the ground crew feels good about their job, their role in the company and the company they work for? Perhaps because WestJet actually knows what the phrase "employee morale" means?

Can you seriously imagine a $300K/year AC pilot hauling garbage out from the seat pockets? They'd probably assign that to the former CA pilots - make that a new duty since they'll never become a captain given their seniority decisions!
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Old Mar 28, 02, 9:23 am   #7
 
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What about things like landing fee's.....do they not vary for different times of the day..?

The staff is younger, so less expensive to run them is obvious, I wonder how many sick days per head at Tango against AC.

Is tango caught up with the debt burden of AC.?

No services means less staff..again reduced labor cost.

I'm only throughing these out as I have no Idea to the answers, but good question Ken...
Is this what you think off when your waxing the Cat.?


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Old Mar 28, 02, 10:08 am   #8
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by NeverAtHome:
Perhaps because the FA's and pilots help out when necessary to groom the plane and shorten the turnaround? Perhaps because the ground crew feels good about their job, their role in the company and the company they work for? Perhaps because WestJet actually knows what the phrase "employee morale" means?

Can you seriously imagine a $300K/year AC pilot hauling garbage out from the seat pockets? They'd probably assign that to the former CA pilots - make that a new duty since they'll never become a captain given their seniority decisions!
</font>
Its also spelled "NO UNION AT WESTJET" therefore no shop steward to tell you what you can or cannot do;Tango will be stuck with the unions,however.
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Old Mar 28, 02, 10:35 am   #9
 
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Remember Tango is an AC mainline BRAND with all of AC's overhead, union contracts etc, not a separate company. Nevertheless AC is saying that Tango flights have 75% of the cost of a full mainline flight (I'm guessing this is on a per pax basis and most of that comes from cramming more pax per plane).

ZIP (god help me, now that's a stoopid name) will be a separate company with pesumably a non-union workforce.
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Old Mar 28, 02, 10:40 am   #10
 
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I don't remember ever seeing any AC staff standing around doing nothing when a flight comes in or leaves, so I don't think it is a union thing forcing people to stand around and wait. (Besides, remember Southwest? They also turn their planes around quickly.) The pilots are busy preparing for the flight, and the cabins aren't cleaned during short stops, anyway.

So what is AC doing that West Jet isn't?
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Old Mar 28, 02, 11:10 am   #11
 
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Lower costs can be realized from having the exact same plane for all flights; reducing parts inventory, mechanics for all types of planes no matter whether their type is in need of maintenance or not, etc. Economies of Scale do work.

It also means no meals which can add up to no need for kitchen "chefs", no extra people to serve and to repair the plane's "kitchen", etc.
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Old Mar 28, 02, 12:03 pm   #12
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There is really only one effective variable in going to a Low Cost operation. That is the number of seats onboard the aircraft and thus what is your per-seat-cost.

Take as a rough example that 1/3 of a carriers expenses are fuel, 1/3 is labour and 1/3 other overheads and variables. If you were able to do away with either fuel or labour completely then for the same number of seats you could reduce your costs by 1/3. The other way [and only real way to do it] is to put more seats into the aircraft. Tango's decrease in CASM has come from increasing the Y seats [the only seats that are selling] from 108 to 159.

All other shorthaul LCC's operate under the same rules. Others such as JetBlue gain advantage by operating longer stage lengths which lowers CASM by spreading the same costs per segment over segments which gain higher gross revenue.

The LCC operator still needs to exercise control over all aspects of the budget and squeeze what they can from labour, services, utilization, and other expenditures, but unless you have sufficient seats to spread the costs over, you are lost.
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Old Apr 2, 02, 12:56 pm   #13
 
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Fewer empty seats -- returned last night on WJ585 (YYC-YQT-YHM) on a 140 seat 737-700. They loaded 142 pax (2 CONs/deadheads/?? in jumpseats on flightdeck) for the YQT-YHM leg.

I'm told FAs must bring their work clothes when they fly free. Only 3 FAs scheduled, once 121st passenger boards, the fourth FA suits up, frees up a seat for paying passenger and saves calling in someone on short-notice, and gets paid regular hours, rather than overtime.

Faster turnaround -- they pleaded with the smokers to stay on board to expedite turnaround time (less favourable winds put us about 9 minutes late arriving in Thunder Bay). We were set to go within 14 minutes of arrival (although we waited another 5 for pushback).

The FAs made it sound like a big deal that everyone helped out (set a record, according to them) and thanked all the pax for helping them get back on time.

When's the last time an AC staffer thanked you for anything?
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Old Apr 2, 02, 1:00 pm   #14
 
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by SleepCounter:
When's the last time an AC staffer thanked you for anything?</font>
Last night.
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Old Apr 2, 02, 2:26 pm   #15
 
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by SleepCounter:
When's the last time an AC staffer thanked you for anything?</font>
I concur with Stu. The last time I was thanked by AC was three days ago - my most recent AC flight. The previous time I was thanked was the previous flight, and the time before that ... the previous flight to that ... and so on.

Not only was I thanked by AC staff (reservation agents, MLL staff, FA's, pilots) but at the end of each of these flights, a parade of passengers thanked the FAs (enthusiastically) for a pleasant flight, as they disembarked.

I've donned my flame-proof armour as it seems to have become bad form to post anything positive on this AC-bashing forum. But I'm just reporting what has happened.

(But the food is still inedible.)
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