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Air Canada rouge, a leisure airline

Old May 5, 2014, 8:21 pm
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Last edit by: Arcanum
Flights operated by Air Canada rouge

NOTE: Rouge Wifi information can be found here
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-c...l#post28448087

Dates in brackets indicate planned start of rouge service (either as a new route or replacing mainline service). ML placed before a date indicates the date that service is reverting to mainline.

All Airbus A319/A321 service is in the new Premium Rouge configuration with 2x2J seats. All other routes are Boeing 767-300ER aircraft in a 24J/258Y layout.

Airport codes in blue indicate that these routes are Boeing 767-300ER aircraft for all services.
Airport codes in red indicate that these routes are split between Boeing 767-300ER and Airbus services.
Airport codes in black indicate that these routes are Airbus aircraft for all services.

Routes are organized based on the established rouge bases of YYZ, YUL, YYC, and YVR

*Seasonal Summer Service

YYZ
Canada
YQT YQY YXX YLW YYG (02MAY-OCT) YDF YQB YQM (01MAY19) YFC (01JUL19)

USA
MCO TPA LAS FLL HNL SRQ RSW SAN PHX MIA PSP (14DEC16)

Mexico
CUN PVR SJD

Caribbean
KIN NAS LIR GND MBJ AZS CCC CUR HUX PUJ POP SKB SJO SXM LRM HOG SNU UVF VRA BGI (07JAN) POS (21DEC16)

Europe
ATH BCN EDI VCE MAN LIS PRG BUD GLA LGW

Central and South America
LIM BOG PTY

YUL
USA
LAS MCO FLL PBI TPA MIA

Mexico
CUN MEX PVR (18NOV16)

Caribbean
ZSA CCC HOG PUJ SNU PLS POP PAP NAS (17JAN) PTP

Europe
FCO ATH BCN NCE VCE

Central and South America
SJO (22DEC16)

Africa
CMN

YYC
Canada
YHZ* YHM (2016)

USA
LAS PHX (winter only - PHX AC Express in summer)

YVR
USA
LAS HNL OGG PHX PSP KOA SAN (02JUN)

Mexico
CUN PVR

Asia
KIX

Europe
DUB LGA KEF


What to Do If Your Flight Has Been Rouged According to the AC Rep "Air Canada Altitude": call AC Reservations, cancel and get a refund.
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Air Canada rouge, a leisure airline

Old Oct 29, 2014, 9:48 am
  #3886  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ontario, CAN
Posts: 5,813
Originally Posted by LittleYHZ
.92 was the target which the Q2 forecast was based on for dollars.
That's good to know. Could have sworn I read CEO comments it was .97 and remembered thinking that was mighty optimistic
Originally Posted by LittleYHZ
The chance that they'll be low is low, If they were not going to meet their forecasts for the quarter by an amount which was material they would have to issue a warning
Never thought the impact would be anywhere near material. Just thought the CAD movement would be more negative than positive fuel price impact
Originally Posted by LittleYHZ
But may disappoint a market which was waiting for a huge blockbuster surprise on the positive size.
I tried to time the Q2 earnings and overall industry trend with a large position of AC stock @ 9.79. That has failed thus far.
No doubt AC will report a record quarter next week but wonder if some of the recent changes around here are spurred by softening yield? If that is announced, the stock will likely be hammered.
Might be a square move, but I'm sticking with it for a while longer before cashing out
CloudsBelow is offline  
Old Oct 30, 2014, 10:23 am
  #3887  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: YYZ
Programs: Aeroplan
Posts: 7
Hello,

Any idea if it will be mainline AC 767s this season to SXM or Rouge 767s? I would imagine sooner than later the Rouge 767s will take over this route since it is a high leisure one.
AC77W is offline  
Old Oct 30, 2014, 2:33 pm
  #3888  
Formerly known as tireman77
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 5,385
Originally Posted by AC77W
Hello,

Any idea if it will be mainline AC 767s this season to SXM or Rouge 767s? I would imagine sooner than later the Rouge 767s will take over this route since it is a high leisure one.
Just did a dummy booking for January. Tuesdays and Saturdays Rouge 763. Not ML.
PLeblond is offline  
Old Oct 30, 2014, 2:37 pm
  #3889  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Never home.
Posts: 2,971
Originally Posted by AC77W
Hello,

Any idea if it will be mainline AC 767s this season to SXM or Rouge 767s? I would imagine sooner than later the Rouge 767s will take over this route since it is a high leisure one.
http://www.newswire.ca/en/story/1361...ands-to-hawaii

"As part of its Air Canada rouge winter schedule to Caribbean destinations, twice-weekly seasonal service from Toronto to St. Maarten, previously operated by Air Canada, will be converted to Air Canada rouge Boeing 767-300ER service effective December 20."
winnipegrev is offline  
Old Oct 30, 2014, 5:24 pm
  #3890  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
"Flights converted to Rouge"...

winnipegrev-

Interesting line in the May 27 press release

"Customers who have already booked travel to Hawaii directly through Air Canada on these routes converted to Air Canada rouge will be notified by email that their flight has been converted to Air Canada rouge."

We all know that there were/are many, many pax who booked trips on mainline and the flights were switched to Rouge AFTER they booked and paid and many claim they were never notified. (both on this forum and more so on the Skytrax page devoted to "all complaints Rouge all the time")

We do know that may of those regulars and those who bought FPs on the YVR/YYC -LAX/SFO routes got scrouged.

So, my question is:
Did AC really notify people that their flights were switched? If yes, as AC claims, then how were there so many who did not know (other than those on Skytrax who had TAs book their ticket and all involved were clueless, or those sad souls who do not live in Canada and had no way of knowing)?
24left is offline  
Old Oct 30, 2014, 5:51 pm
  #3891  
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: YYC
Posts: 4,035
Originally Posted by 24left
winnipegrev-

Interesting line in the May 27 press release

"Customers who have already booked travel to Hawaii directly through Air Canada on these routes converted to Air Canada rouge will be notified by email that their flight has been converted to Air Canada rouge."

We all know that there were/are many, many pax who booked trips on mainline and the flights were switched to Rouge AFTER they booked and paid and many claim they were never notified. (both on this forum and more so on the Skytrax page devoted to "all complaints Rouge all the time")

We do know that may of those regulars and those who bought FPs on the YVR/YYC -LAX/SFO routes got scrouged.

So, my question is:
Did AC really notify people that their flights were switched? If yes, as AC claims, then how were there so many who did not know (other than those on Skytrax who had TAs book their ticket and all involved were clueless, or those sad souls who do not live in Canada and had no way of knowing)?
I can vouch that AC did notify some people, I received such a notice. I expect the biggest segment not notified booked via an OTA, and that Expedia and the rest of them didn't pass on the information.
rehoult is offline  
Old Oct 31, 2014, 12:49 pm
  #3892  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: YYZ
Programs: Aeroplan
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by tireman77
Just did a dummy booking for January. Tuesdays and Saturdays Rouge 763. Not ML.
Originally Posted by winnipegrev
http://www.newswire.ca/en/story/1361...ands-to-hawaii

"As part of its Air Canada rouge winter schedule to Caribbean destinations, twice-weekly seasonal service from Toronto to St. Maarten, previously operated by Air Canada, will be converted to Air Canada rouge Boeing 767-300ER service effective December 20."
Awesome, thanks to the both of you!
AC77W is offline  
Old Nov 2, 2014, 2:55 am
  #3893  
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 53
From First to Worst: YVR-LAX Y rtn

Longtime lurker motivated to make my first post on the horrendous downgrade on this route from mainline to rouge. AC used to be my carrier of choice on this segment. I pay my own flight costs and often fly Y on short haul. The E190's were comfortable and the AVOD first rate. By contrast the rouge 319 was probably the least comfortable jet I have been on in many years. At 6 ft tall, my knees were jammed up against the seat ahead of me. The tightness of the pitch made it impossible to even slide my feet further underneath to relieve my cramped legs. Yes the crew had snappy hats but service was no better or worse than Air Canada. The constant references to stowing "gear" quickly became annoying. I was flying to LA , not trekking the Himalayas. The return flight suffered a 40 minute delay as they attempted to fix something on the aging aircraft.

No doubt AC is armed with some data showing LAX and SFO are leisure routes but I cannot recommend rouge service to LA over Westjet. WS seat pitch is far better. Message to AC: you are not competing with Sunwing or Transat on this route. You are competing with a scheduled Canadian carrier with a better product at basically the same price.
Resurrection is offline  
Old Nov 2, 2014, 3:15 am
  #3894  
 
Join Date: May 2013
Programs: Aeroplan, BONVOY GOLD
Posts: 313
Originally Posted by rehoult
I can vouch that AC did notify some people, I received such a notice. I expect the biggest segment not notified booked via an OTA, and that Expedia and the rest of them didn't pass on the information.
I booked via Aeroplan and was not notified, unless them changing my return flight by 3 days into the future counts as notification...
coleworld is offline  
Old Nov 2, 2014, 7:45 am
  #3895  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
Originally Posted by Resurrection
From First to Worst: YVR-LAX Y rtn

Longtime lurker motivated to make my first post on the horrendous downgrade on this route from mainline to rouge. AC used to be my carrier of choice on this segment. I pay my own flight costs and often fly Y on short haul. The E190's were comfortable and the AVOD first rate. By contrast the rouge 319 was probably the least comfortable jet I have been on in many years. At 6 ft tall, my knees were jammed up against the seat ahead of me. The tightness of the pitch made it impossible to even slide my feet further underneath to relieve my cramped legs. Yes the crew had snappy hats but service was no better or worse than Air Canada. The constant references to stowing "gear" quickly became annoying. I was flying to LA , not trekking the Himalayas. The return flight suffered a 40 minute delay as they attempted to fix something on the aging aircraft.

No doubt AC is armed with some data showing LAX and SFO are leisure routes but I cannot recommend rouge service to LA over Westjet. WS seat pitch is far better. Message to AC: you are not competing with Sunwing or Transat on this route. You are competing with a scheduled Canadian carrier with a better product at basically the same price.

Welcome to FT

Somewhere earlier in this thread was a comment by one of the AC reps who used to participate here, that YVR and YYC to LAX and SFO were "rouged" for reasons that had nothing to do with "leisure" travel. (let's read it as economics)

Sadly, despite Rob Lowe's tweet earlier this year about his own Rouge experience, nothing has changed.

Other more "experienced" members here can give you all sorts of info as to the market conditions and AC thinking why this route was rouged.

Having rouged our way south last December, we feel your pain.

You can always post your trip experience here too
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-c...ck-thread.html
24left is offline  
Old Nov 2, 2014, 8:24 am
  #3896  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Canada
Programs: UA*1K MM
Posts: 23,274
Originally Posted by Resurrection
From First to Worst: YVR-LAX Y rtn

Longtime lurker motivated to make my first post on the horrendous downgrade on this route from mainline to rouge. AC used to be my carrier of choice on this segment. I pay my own flight costs and often fly Y on short haul. The E190's were comfortable and the AVOD first rate. By contrast the rouge 319 was probably the least comfortable jet I have been on in many years. At 6 ft tall, my knees were jammed up against the seat ahead of me. The tightness of the pitch made it impossible to even slide my feet further underneath to relieve my cramped legs. Yes the crew had snappy hats but service was no better or worse than Air Canada. The constant references to stowing "gear" quickly became annoying. I was flying to LA , not trekking the Himalayas. The return flight suffered a 40 minute delay as they attempted to fix something on the aging aircraft.

No doubt AC is armed with some data showing LAX and SFO are leisure routes but I cannot recommend rouge service to LA over Westjet. WS seat pitch is far better. Message to AC: you are not competing with Sunwing or Transat on this route. You are competing with a scheduled Canadian carrier with a better product at basically the same price.

Make sure to post your experience here:
http://www.airlinequality.com/Forum/air_canrge.htm

Currently Rouge with 2/10 rating is the worst rated airline in the world. Worse than Spirit or Ryanair.
And thats only because the worst rating you can give is 1/10.
rankourabu is offline  
Old Nov 2, 2014, 10:10 am
  #3897  
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: YYC
Posts: 4,035
Originally Posted by coleworld
I booked via Aeroplan and was not notified, unless them changing my return flight by 3 days into the future counts as notification...
In that case, Aeroplan is your travel agent and it's their responsibility to inform you.

Odd as it seems, AC and AP are completely separate companies and AC's roll would have stopped after informing AP of the change.
rehoult is offline  
Old Nov 2, 2014, 10:19 am
  #3898  
Suspended
 
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Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
Originally Posted by rehoult
In that case, Aeroplan is your travel agent and it's their responsibility to inform you.

Odd as it seems, AC and AP are completely separate companies and AC's roll would have stopped after informing AP of the change.

rehoult -

Indeed. Last week I read some of the late October posts and the 2 on Oct 28 from someone named R Pinkus stood out not because of the usual complaints about seats etc, but for what this person wrote about the FAs. Brutal. Apparently the Disney training didn't tell them not to do this - in form of pax.
24left is offline  
Old Nov 2, 2014, 10:22 am
  #3899  
Suspended
 
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Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
And just in case you missed the Rob Lowe tweet-fest about his rouge flight... also note the comments from AC's corporate spokesperson

http://www.ctvnews.ca/entertainment/...eets-1.1823565
24left is offline  
Old Nov 2, 2014, 11:14 am
  #3900  
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: The World
Programs: WS Platinum, Marriott Titanium, DL Gold, UA Silver
Posts: 1,460
Originally Posted by 24left
And just in case you missed the Rob Lowe tweet-fest about his rouge flight... also note the comments from AC's corporate spokesperson

http://www.ctvnews.ca/entertainment/...eets-1.1823565
Ahh yes, the quote from the AC spokesperson... just like their standard "we value your feedback" line whenever they receive any feedback -- then dig in their heels and ignore.

"We value customer feedback of all kinds and a chance to respond hopefully Rob Lowe -- and all of our customers -- will keep it coming"

They want feedback, and they've received a massive amount -- and a landslide after rouging mainline crossborder routes out of YVR and YYC. And what exactly have they done with that feedback? They've determined, and publicly stated a number of times, that he problem is that AC's customers are too stupid to understand the differences between mainline and Rouge. And that they need to communicate more about those differences.

What about the frequently-raised feedback that many average sized adults cannot fit in their seats without significant contorting and discomfort? Nope. All's good! In spite of all of the feedback on that point, AC has determined it's a communications and customer stupidity problem.

And what about the issue that taller adults (yet still within 'normal' height ranges) cannot fit at all in a standard Y seat on the 319 slaveships? Nope! No problem here! Feedback ignored! You silly customers just don't understand...
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