Including SYD/MEL in mini-R-t-W?
Jun 23, 2010, 12:17 pm
#1
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Join Date: Dec 2009
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Including SYD/MEL in mini-R-t-W?
Details? I've read about it but I'm not sure how the MPM works.
For example, MPM YYC-SYD/MEL anybody? Thanks.
It would be awesome to do that.
jlisi984
For example, MPM YYC-SYD/MEL anybody? Thanks.
It would be awesome to do that.
jlisi984
Jun 23, 2010, 12:24 pm
#3
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Jun 23, 2010, 12:37 pm
#4
Join Date: Jun 2008
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Unfortunately I don't know the actual MPM values, sorry!
Jun 23, 2010, 12:44 pm
#5
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Hi Jan - yes it's possible. You'll see a couple examples in the valid rtw routings thread. I'm going Canada-Europe-Aus-Japan-Canada so the MPM might be impacted by the direction of travel, I dunno. If you're not worried about including Asia I think the MPM becomes much easier; including Japan was the only challenge I had in building mine.
Unfortunately I don't know the actual MPM values, sorry!
Unfortunately I don't know the actual MPM values, sorry!
Anybody with KVS please advise as to MPM - I'm curious how this works - is the turnaround Asia or Australia?
Jun 23, 2010, 12:50 pm
#6
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Toronto, ON
Programs: AC 75K
Posts: 6,358
A couple of points.
MPM is not the only way to validate an itinerary...published routings are also available. KVS/Expertflyer can help here too.
Point of turnaround is based on the farthest point from the origin.
For example, YYC-NRT-SIN-SYD-YVR-YYC: SIN is the point of turnaround as YYC-SIN is a farther distance then YYC-SYD.
Not saying this is a valid itinerary, just using it to illustrate how determining turnaround works.
MPM is not the only way to validate an itinerary...published routings are also available. KVS/Expertflyer can help here too.
Point of turnaround is based on the farthest point from the origin.
For example, YYC-NRT-SIN-SYD-YVR-YYC: SIN is the point of turnaround as YYC-SIN is a farther distance then YYC-SYD.
Not saying this is a valid itinerary, just using it to illustrate how determining turnaround works.
Jun 23, 2010, 12:53 pm
#7
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Toronto, ON
Programs: AC 75K
Posts: 6,358
For published routings, your turnaround is important.
In looking at the example I posted, I actually don't think this would be allowed as SIN-SYD-YVR-YYC I doubt would be a valid routing.
If you swapped SIN with BKK, that moves your point of turnaround changes to SYD, which then changes the valid routings.
In looking at the example I posted, I actually don't think this would be allowed as SIN-SYD-YVR-YYC I doubt would be a valid routing.
If you swapped SIN with BKK, that moves your point of turnaround changes to SYD, which then changes the valid routings.
Jun 23, 2010, 1:04 pm
#8
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Hi Jan - yes it's possible. You'll see a couple examples in the valid rtw routings thread. I'm going Canada-Europe-Aus-Japan-Canada so the MPM might be impacted by the direction of travel, I dunno. If you're not worried about including Asia I think the MPM becomes much easier; including Japan was the only challenge I had in building mine.
Unfortunately I don't know the actual MPM values, sorry!
Unfortunately I don't know the actual MPM values, sorry!
Jun 23, 2010, 1:21 pm
#9
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: c_9 (new FlyerTalk name)
Posts: 694
Here's mine:
YYZ-BOS-FRA-IST (stop)
IST-BKK-SYD (stop, and point of turnaround)
SYD-SIN-NRT (stop)
NRT-YYZ
I was told that the first half was fine, but SYD-NRT-YYZ was very tricky. It was over the MPM but the published routing made it workable I think. They wouldn't allow SIN and a transit in the US, but I'm hoping I can replace SIN with ICN and then do this: SYD-ICN-NRT-ORD-YYZ. I haven't called to validate that yet, but if it works that means I avoid fuel surcharges and get to try NH business over the Pacific which would be sweet.
YYZ-BOS-FRA-IST (stop)
IST-BKK-SYD (stop, and point of turnaround)
SYD-SIN-NRT (stop)
NRT-YYZ
I was told that the first half was fine, but SYD-NRT-YYZ was very tricky. It was over the MPM but the published routing made it workable I think. They wouldn't allow SIN and a transit in the US, but I'm hoping I can replace SIN with ICN and then do this: SYD-ICN-NRT-ORD-YYZ. I haven't called to validate that yet, but if it works that means I avoid fuel surcharges and get to try NH business over the Pacific which would be sweet.
Jun 23, 2010, 3:54 pm
#10
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: c_9 (new FlyerTalk name)
Posts: 694
New notes to add on this. Called AE a couple times today to discuss different routing ideas.
Current valid routing is YYZ-BOS-FRA-IST-BKK-SYD-SIN-NRT-YYZ
I know that YYZ-BOS-FRA-IST-BKK-SYD is valid and has some room to maneuver, but the return is not as flexible.
Asked about SYD-ICN-NRT-YYZ (1300 miles shorter route): valid
Asked about SYD-ICN-NRT-ORD-YYZ (1000 miles shorter route): not valid
I was told SFO, LAX, ORD all invalid problem for my trip - no airline will allow it on a single ticket. So it's not just the MPM, sometimes you can have a low mileage but still an invalid routing, even when there's no backtracking.
Current valid routing is YYZ-BOS-FRA-IST-BKK-SYD-SIN-NRT-YYZ
I know that YYZ-BOS-FRA-IST-BKK-SYD is valid and has some room to maneuver, but the return is not as flexible.
Asked about SYD-ICN-NRT-YYZ (1300 miles shorter route): valid
Asked about SYD-ICN-NRT-ORD-YYZ (1000 miles shorter route): not valid
I was told SFO, LAX, ORD all invalid problem for my trip - no airline will allow it on a single ticket. So it's not just the MPM, sometimes you can have a low mileage but still an invalid routing, even when there's no backtracking.
Jun 23, 2010, 4:15 pm
#11
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Toronto, ON
Programs: AC 75K
Posts: 6,358
I know that YYZ-BOS-FRA-IST-BKK-SYD is valid and has some room to maneuver, but the return is not as flexible.
Asked about SYD-ICN-NRT-YYZ (1300 miles shorter route): valid
Asked about SYD-ICN-NRT-ORD-YYZ (1000 miles shorter route): not valid
I was told SFO, LAX, ORD all invalid problem for my trip - no airline will allow it on a single ticket. So it's not just the MPM, sometimes you can have a low mileage but still an invalid routing, even when there's no backtracking.
Asked about SYD-ICN-NRT-YYZ (1300 miles shorter route): valid
Asked about SYD-ICN-NRT-ORD-YYZ (1000 miles shorter route): not valid
I was told SFO, LAX, ORD all invalid problem for my trip - no airline will allow it on a single ticket. So it's not just the MPM, sometimes you can have a low mileage but still an invalid routing, even when there's no backtracking.
Jun 23, 2010, 6:49 pm
#12
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: c_9 (new FlyerTalk name)
Posts: 694
Yes, NRT is a stop. From there, only routing that works I've been told (when origin is Sydney) is SQ through LAX, but SQ only offers Y seats so no thanks!
Jun 24, 2010, 12:35 pm
#13
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 53
Starting next week I'll be doing the following mini rtw. I thought I was getting a good deal but based on some of the routings I've seen that include australia, Asia, and Europe, i could have done better!
YYZ-YVR-SYD stop open jaw
CNS-AKL stop
AKL- HNL stop
HNL-YVR-YYZ stop
YYZ-YVR-SYD stop open jaw
CNS-AKL stop
AKL- HNL stop
HNL-YVR-YYZ stop
Jun 24, 2010, 8:44 pm
#14
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: YEG
Posts: 3,925
Starting next week I'll be doing the following mini rtw. I thought I was getting a good deal but based on some of the routings I've seen that include australia, Asia, and Europe, i could have done better!
YYZ-YVR-SYD stop open jaw
CNS-AKL stop
AKL- HNL stop
HNL-YVR-YYZ stop
YYZ-YVR-SYD stop open jaw
CNS-AKL stop
AKL- HNL stop
HNL-YVR-YYZ stop
Some people also do routings to SE asia and Australia/New Zealand the "long" way by crossing the Atlantic both ways.
Jun 24, 2010, 9:08 pm
#15
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I don't think your routing would really count as a mini RTW (although it does look like a good trip). About a year ago Aeroplan changed its rules to allow you to cross either the Atlantic/Pacific on your outbound, and then cross the other ocean on your return. When you factor in that you can have 2 stopovers, this allows you to create a "mini" RTW.
Some people also do routings to SE asia and Australia/New Zealand the "long" way by crossing the Atlantic both ways.
Some people also do routings to SE asia and Australia/New Zealand the "long" way by crossing the Atlantic both ways.
